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Paths of Civilization

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10ebbor10 said:
Any chance I could get people to support expanding the Palace? Palace bonusses are powerfull, and quite effective.

Building Palace Stables would be need for example.
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I am all for another Greater Hall annex + Academy because narratively it should be a sorta center of culture and learning where every noble of our lands sends their sons to mingle aka passive Influence Subordinates, in a way.
veekie said:
Econ + Econ Expansion total is less than 24, preventing us from meeting the priest quest without Mills or New Settlements.
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Got it, Mills for days.

DocMatoi said:
welcome to PoCQ, where we have incomplete information and the dam doesn't get built.
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HeWhoAdds said:
I'm sure we'll get started on the Dam any day now! :V
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As soon as we get a Spiritual Slot from priests. If not for this, I'd go for Dam this turn.
Ookay, let's do this.

[X] [Crisis] Bring them back in with the fighting (Change Tinriver from Trading Post to Colony, will claim additional territory when fighting pirates, -1 Legitimacy)
[X] [Main] Build Mills
[X] [Secondary] Build Mills
[X] [Secondary] Block Housing - Redshore
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Pirate Clans
[X] [Secondary] Proclaim Glory

[X] [Guild] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
[X] [Guild] Efficient Charcoal Kilns x2

Econ diff: +4 (Mills) + 3 (Mills) - 3 (Housing) - 1 (PG) - 2 (Kilns) - 2 (Kilns) = -1;
Econ: 10 (+4) [-6+5] -> 13 [-6+5] -> 12 (?)

Wealth diff: -4 (Mills) - 3 (Mills) - 2 (Kilns) - 2 (Kilns) = -7;
Wealth: 16-7 = 9

Tech diff: -1 (Mills) - 1 (Mills) - 3 (Housing) - 1 (Kilns) - 1 (Kilns) = -5
Tech: 24 (+2) [+1-1] -> 21 [+1-1] -> 21

Culture diff: - 3 (PG) = -3
Culture: 24[+4] -> 21[+4] -> 24 and 1 overflow

Stability: 0 -> +1 (PG)
Legitimacy 3 +1 (PG) -1 (Crisis) -> 3


How, exactly, can we do Priests' quest? I can replace Housing with something Econ-procuding....
 
Reminder: we can extend the duration of a quest by one turn with Support Faction.

Support Faction - Use influence to increase the power of a faction.
S: -4 Culture, +1 Faction Power, +1 Time to current quest

I understand that we don't want to just increase faction power willy nilly, but it may be useful next turn. Spiritual Values are pretty nice.
 
ctulhuslp said:
I am all for another Greater Hall annex + Academy because narratively it should be a sorta center of culture and learning where every noble of our lands sends their sons to mingle aka passive Influence Subordinates, in a way.


Got it, Mills for days.





As soon as we get a Spiritual Slot from priests. If not for this, I'd go for Dam this turn.
Ookay, let's do this.

[X] [Crisis] Bring them back in with the fighting (Change Tinriver from Trading Post to Colony, will claim additional territory when fighting pirates, -1 Legitimacy)
[X] [Main] Build Mills
[X] [Secondary] Build Mills
[X] [Secondary] Block Housing - Redshore
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Pirate Clans
[X] [Secondary] Proclaim Glory

[X] [Guild] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
[X] [Guild] Efficient Charcoal Kilns x2

Econ diff: +4 (Mills) + 3 (Mills) - 3 (Housing) - 1 (PG) - 2 (Kilns) - 2 (Kilns) = -1;
Econ: 10 (+4) [-6+5] -> 13 [-6+5] -> 12 (?)

Wealth diff: -4 (Mills) - 3 (Mills) - 2 (Kilns) - 2 (Kilns) = -7;
Wealth: 16-7 = 9

Tech diff: -1 (Mills) - 1 (Mills) - 3 (Housing) - 1 (Kilns) - 1 (Kilns) = -5
Tech: 24 (+2) [+1-1] -> 21 [+1-1] -> 21

Culture diff: - 3 (PG) = -3
Culture: 24[+4] -> 21[+4] -> 24 and 1 overflow

Stability: 0 -> +1 (PG)
Legitimacy 3 +1 (PG) -1 (Crisis) -> 3


How, exactly, can we do Priests' quest? I can replace Housing with something Econ-procuding....
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Ehh we kinda don't need to focus on it right this very turn, because we are at 24 LTE still (The Refugees already did their Expansion damage as far as I am aware), so a single mill gets us in a good LTE range so we don't have to go down to 0 Econ.

But really we only need it in any one turn to do two mains of Expand Econ and then have the provinces do the other, or not spend Econ too hard for two turns.
 
BungieONI said:
Ehh we kinda don't need to focus on it right this very turn, because we are at 24 LTE still (The Refugees already did their Expansion damage as far as I am aware), so a single mill gets us in a good LTE range so we don't have to go down to 0 Econ.

But really we only need it in any one turn to do two mains of Expand Econ and then have the provinces do the other, or not spend Econ too hard for two turns.
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Can we complete the Dam within 3 turns and hope it gives Econ payout? :V
I mean, initially my plan had Main Great Dam, but I really want Spiritual value slot, so.

Plus we can PSN Main Expand Econ too if we get a choice; especially if we build Kilns and are thus not obligated to go for Forests instead.
Sooo....can we actually pull of starting Dam right now and still fullfill Priests quest?
 
10ebbor10 said:
Yeah, I'm a tad warry of increasing Priest power. They already have independent infrastructure, and have plenty of opportunity for trouble.
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Understandable, but it's an option on the table. If we get to the final turn and nothing has fallen from the sky to make it work, we can salvage the situation if we want. Power 3 isn't that scary.
 
veekie said:
We got 2 main turns after this one to meet the target. Mills and post ironwork expand econ
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Okay, let's do this[2].


[X] [Crisis] Bring them back in with the fighting (Change Tinriver from Trading Post to Colony, will claim additional territory when fighting pirates, -1 Legitimacy)
[X] [Main] Great Dam
[X] [Secondary] Build Mills
[X] [Secondary] Block Housing - Redshore
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Pirate Clans
[X] [Secondary] Proclaim Glory

[X] [Guild] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
[X] [Guild] Efficient Charcoal Kilns x2

Econ diff: - 2 (Dam) + 3 (Mills) - 3 (Housing) - 1 (PG) - 2 (Kilns) - 2 (Kilns) = -7;
Econ: 10 (+4) [-6+5] -> 7 [-6+5] -> 6 (?)

Wealth diff: - 3 (Mills) - 2 (Kilns) - 2 (Kilns) = -7;
Wealth: 16-7 = 9

Tech diff: - 1 (Mills) - 3 (Housing) - 1 (Kilns) - 1 (Kilns) = -6
Tech: 24 (+2) [+1-1] -> 20 [+1-1] -> 20

Culture diff: - 3 (PG) = -3
Culture: 24[+4] -> 21[+4] -> 24 and 1 overflow

Stability: 0 +1 (PG) -> +1
Legitimacy 3 +1 (PG) -1 (Crisis) -> 3

Sustainable Forests: 24/27.5 - 3 (Kilns) - 3 (Kilns) -> 18/27.5

Enough Forests for Ironworks and whatever else we may want.
Also, god my math was off.
Also, 6 Econ is kinda bad, even if provinces do Expand Econs and we do PSN Expand Econ. I think?

Baseline Expand is +4 Econ; with Steelblooded it is what, +6? Means that if provinces do one Expand and we go PSN Expand, we get 12 Econ to the total of 18 Econ. Seems fine to me, even with the midturn Econ expenses on Myranyn reforms and whatever.
And w/o Rule of Gold provinces are unlikely to go full idiot and starve us.

EDIT: And yes, I think either Dam or Influence Subordinate are mandatory. We are kinda dawdling a bit too much wrt out vassals, and it's not good at all.
 
Astrological Prediction: Investing today improves the reward tomorrow (58)

Just a thought but maybe this prediction refers to maxing out the Myranyn Reforms. not sure we want to do this but what do people think of maybe doing some of the more popular reform options we passed up and then doing the Raise Army at the midterm?

Myranyn Reforms
[] [HS] Prototype Deployment Organization (2xSec Blackmouth Colossal Walls, Reforms advance)
[] [HS] Increase Iron production to make things cheaper (Redshore Ironworks [-3 Econ, -3 Tech, 2 Sustainable Forest used, Expand Econ additional +1 Econ, -1 EE, -1 Tech] + Sec Survey, Reforms advance)
[] [HS] Center Command on the Cities (Blackmouth becomes a Free City, Reforms advance)
[] [HS] Introduce an elite core (Sec More Spiritbonded + Sec Expand Econ, Reforms advance)

[] [HS] Continue raising troops (Main Raise Army, Reforms advance)

All the ones i like
 
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Manget said:
Astrological Prediction: Investing today improves the reward tomorrow (58)

Just a thought but maybe this prediction refers to maxing out the Harmysyn Reforms. not sure we want to do this but what do people think of maybe doing some of the more popular reform options we passed up and then doing the Raise Army at the midterm?

Harmysyn Reforms
[] [HS] Prototype Deployment Organization (2xSec Blackmouth Colossal Walls, Reforms advance)
[] [HS] Increase Iron production to make things cheaper (Redshore Ironworks [-3 Econ, -3 Tech, 2 Sustainable Forest used, Expand Econ additional +1 Econ, -1 EE, -1 Tech] + Sec Survey, Reforms advance)
[] [HS] Center Command on the Cities (Blackmouth becomes a Free City, Reforms advance)
[] [HS] Introduce an elite core (Sec More Spiritbonded + Sec Expand Econ, Reforms advance)

[] [HS] Continue raising troops (Main Raise Army, Reforms advance)
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I think it's about the Dam or about Spiritual Value slot. Both are things which take investment to pay off but boy do they pay off once they are done.
I think.
But then again, I want both of those, so I am a bit biased. :V
 
ctulhuslp said:
Can we complete the Dam within 3 turns and hope it gives Econ payout? :V
I mean, initially my plan had Main Great Dam, but I really want Spiritual value slot, so.

Plus we can PSN Main Expand Econ too if we get a choice; especially if we build Kilns and are thus not obligated to go for Forests instead.
Sooo....can we actually pull of starting Dam right now and still fullfill Priests quest?
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Iunno, and I don't want to do the math.

However I was looking at the faction quests and fulfilling the Yeomen quest might be a good way to get the final boost of Econ we may need.

Aside from that the Priest quest and Guild quest end at the same time. The Guild quest has a definite number of action slots required to complete (4. 3 if we do a Main for the Level 2 Ironworks) or in other terms a total of 4 Secondaries. Also they are infrastructure so our policy might start building either of Block Housing or Ironworks in Redshore, if we end up taking one but miss the other(likely to be Block Housing).

The Priest quest has a fluctuating amount of actions, though I assume we only have to end up at max econ by the time the mid turn update actually hits, i.e after the first stat check but before the second, to complete.

So kinda a toss up which is more difficult in actions. We also have a lot of flexibility in trying to support them or not *shrug*.

Personally my current focus is on finishing as much of the Myranyn reforms before Myranyn himself dies. (If we go for Sec Survey + Sec Ironworks - Redshore like in my vote we can finish it next update. And this also works toward the Guild Quest so I am partial to getting that done first)


ctulhuslp said:
Enough Forests for Ironworks and whatever else we may want.
Also, god my math was off.
Also, 6 Econ is kinda bad, even if provinces do Expand Econs and we do PSN Expand Econ. I think?

Baseline Expand is +4 Econ; with Steelblooded it is what, +6? Means that if provinces do one Expand and we go PSN Expand, we get 12 Econ to the total of 18 Econ. Seems fine to me, even with the midturn Econ expenses on Myranyn reforms and whatever.
And w/o Rule of Gold provinces are unlikely to go full idiot and starve us.

EDIT: And yes, I think either Dam or Influence Subordinate are mandatory. We are kinda dawdling a bit too much wrt out vassals, and it's not good at all.
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6 Econ from our stuff isn't good but Provinces and Main PSN ECON give us another 16 so we actually get all the way to 22 Econ in the main turn after this.

Baseline Expand Econ Secondary is +2 Econ, Ironblooded made it +3, Steelblooded makes it +4, so a Main is +8.
 
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HeWhoAdds said:
This is now a Catcher in the Rye thread :V
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Stupid phone.:oops:

Andres110 said:
A golden age gives us a megaproject track and lets us spend stats to massively improve our civilisation.
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Yes. And all the time, we will avoid using Influence because it will end the golden age. Golden Ages are shiny, but we have to settle down the lowlands before we can go for it. Once the Thunder Twins are Vassal-Colonies, then we can try to go for a Golden Age. Beforehand, it just ties our hands too much.
 
BungieONI said:
Iunno, and I don't want to do the math.

However I was looking at the faction quests and fulfilling the Yeomen quest might be a good way to get the final boost of Econ we may need.

Aside from that the Priest quest and Guild quest end at the same time. The Guild quest has a definite number of action slots required to complete (4. 3 if we do a Main for the Level 2 Ironworks) or in other terms a total of 4 Secondaries. Also they are infrastructure so our policy might start building either of Block Housing or Ironworks in Redshore, if we end up taking one but miss the other(likely to be Block Housing).

The Priest quest has a fluctuating amount of actions, though I assume we only have to end up at max econ by the time the mid turn update actually hits, i.e after the first stat check but before the second, to complete.

So kinda a toss up which is more difficult in actions. We also have a lot of flexibility in trying to support them or not *shrug*.

Personally my current focus is on finishing as much of the Myranyn reforms before Myranyn himself dies. (If we go for Sec Survey + Sec Ironworks - Redshore like in my vote we can finish it next update. And this also works toward the Guild Quest so I am partial to getting that done first)



6 Econ from our stuff isn't good but Provinces and Main PSN ECON give us another 16 so we actually get all the way to 22 Econ in the main turn after this.

Baseline Expand Econ Secondary is +2 Econ, Ironblooded made it +3, Steelblooded makes it +4, so a Main is +8.
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Huh. You do have a point. Internal reorg requires 9 Secondaries tho, not sure if it's a worthwhile path:
Academia Nut said:
New Settlement - There are a few new sites that could have new settlements placed on them: northern Blackriver (+3, moderate mineral, 0/6 province), northern boundary hills (+1, good mineral, 2/6 province), internal reorg (+3, 1/10 places available)
* S: -1 Econ, +1 Econ and Mysticism end of turn, increases number Econ Expansion depending on environment, +1 Province progress
* M: +1 Econ and Mysticism, increases Econ Expansion, +2 Province progress
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I mean, that's 4 Main New Settlements, which also bring us closer to finishing Priests quests, and provincial actions can help, but...
 
The investment line I think most likely refers to Kilns, because fuel consumption is going to skyrocket in the coming turns.

It doesn't take a prophecy to realize that once our cities come back they're ALL going to want baths. That'd be 4 more charcoals used I think. And then we're going to need a second bath for Redshore to wash the Block Housing.

BungieONI said:
. (If we go for Sec Survey + Sec Ironworks - Redshore like in my vote we can finish it next update. And this also works toward the Guild Quest so I am partial to getting that done first)
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We don't need to. Sec Survey costs nothing, progresses an event chain and progresses a faction quest, so given this turn's expenses the provinces are almost certainly going to do it.
 
Stability first. We know Freehills had copied currency , the straits are open again, the Trelli have at least one company left and we're sucking the gold out of Freehills, while doubling the urban population of Redshore.

Ready our butts, Liquidity Crisis Strikes Back within 3 turns.

Legitimacy and Stability want to be as near max as we can make it without failing quests.
 
BungieONI said:
Well on the internal reorg thing the provinces could do some of it if we leave them some Econ. And as far as I know they have been doing it.
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Meh, provinces better go on with econ and settlements. I am fine with Balanced for now, although honestly, Expansion Policy may be called for.

veekie said:
Stability first. We know Freehills had copied currency , the straits are open again, the Trelli have at least one company left and we're sucking the gold out of Freehills, while doubling the urban population of Redshore.

Ready our butts, Liquidity Crisis Strikes Back within 3 turns.

Legitimacy and Stability want to be as near max as we can make it without failing quests.
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Oh. Yes, that's a thing.
Double down on surveys while we can?

edit: Come to think of it, PSN has a Survey option too. We can PSN Survey instead of Expand Econ if provinces do not do a survey.
And we desperately need domestic gold mine at this point anyway. Relying on foreign precious metal for coinage is horrifically bad idea long-term anyway.
 
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[X] [Crisis] Bring them back in with the fighting (Change Tinriver from Trading Post to Colony, will claim additional territory when fighting pirates, -1 Legitimacy)
[X] [Main] Proclaim Glory
[X] [Secondary] Build Roads
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Pirate Clans
[X] [Secondary] Block Housing - Redshore
[X] [Secondary] Ironworks - Redshore
[X] [Guild] More Warships
[X] [Guild] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
 
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