Well, after all those AN posts I think we can assume that a war against the Trelli + Mercenaries + Tin Tribes is a serious possibility. So, it will probably come down to how well the RB can perform. If we roll really well the potential Trelli threat might be dealt with for decades. If we roll badly the RB, the WTP and Greenshore might just be lost to blockades and starvation.
The latter also giving them ironworking, and with all the consequences of failing Divine Stewards and Lord's Loyalty causing serious instability, while all our immediate neighbors are wanting to carve a piece out of us and steal our ironworking technology.
 
And now I'm one of the most vocal pro-Bosporus expansion people in the thread :V

But nah, all I'm really looking for here is to force the Trelli into quiescence so we can shift our focus back to the Lowlands and the ST without them obstructing trade for a while. Basically, try and beat on the Trelli before they dominate the Not!Aegean and start getting even more ambitious.


And frankly, if we play our cards right- we're not going to be fighting the descending Trelli alone- we're buying just as much Tin as the Trelli if not more at that point from the Tin Tribes and we can supply them copper at a bargain for domestic bronze production- all along a route nigh impossible for the Trelli to interdict (GS to New TP). Combine that with generally further improving the wealth of the region and possibly sharing some innovations and there are good odds we can at least get some local tribal auxiliaries to back us up. Especially because if we do get driven out of the TP, their access to a lot of luxuries like; glass, dye, fine pottery, gems, and wine actually diminishes. Slaves are something they can probably acquire more of on their own with enough bronze- there's plenty of people in land in the Not!Danubian basin, but we can establish ourselves as their lifeline to luxury goods that the noble mine owners are going to want.

We are not going to be alone? What gives? Trelli can pretty much intercept any our bribe and sell it as their to the natives.

While, yes, we likely could kill them if we fueled it by our entire civ and were willing to suck up the inevitable losses due to them Ruling The Waves, we cannot do so without abandoning some of our other projects, be it Lowlands, cultural unity or something else we have cooking. Which is why I was asking about Lowlands: we do not have resources to do everything we have in cards. I am unsure whether we can do everything we have now, and overtaking not!Danubian basin while taking the not!Byzantium on is certainly going to require a lot of investment in appropriate Boats, Trade Missions, Support Subordinates and the like to work. We kiind of can do it, but it is easily megaproject-tier project, not fire-and-forget placing Trade Post.

EDIT: Oh, yes, and I almsot forgot - we have neighbours with grudges who will notice us sending dudes and stuff far from home. And climate change is over with. So we will eventually have to choose between hastily drawing troops back to defend out iron mines in Redhills/Lowland vassal or defending new trade post.
 
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Well, after all those AN posts I think we can assume that a war against the Trelli + Mercenaries + Tin Tribes is a serious possibility. So, it will probably come down to how well the RB can perform. If we roll really well the potential Trelli threat might be dealt with for decades. If we roll badly the RB, the WTP and Greenshore might just be lost to blockades and starvation.
Umm, one of ANs posts literally said the Trelli don't really hate us or care about us. The posts specifically said that if there was a war it would be hard.
 
May I refer you to the update, pointing out that the reason the Trelli are making pirates is because they figure, Why give anything in exchange when you can just take everything? If they think their mercs can take our trading post by force, they likely will try.
His entire point is that we can buy off their mercs. They send their loyal ones off to the Saffron Isles.

it was discovered that the Trelli had also figured out that you could pay warriors very well to fight very hard for you, and had turned this into a way to massively recruit from the tribes around them.

The more loyal warriors were farmed out to the rich kingdoms of the Saffron Isles
 
[X] [Exp] Found Far Northern Trade Post
[X] [Exp] Found Trelli Trade Post, East
[X] [Exp] Do nothing here
[X] [Diplo] Tie everything further together (Main New Trails)
[X] [Int] Build palace (Extra megaproject action)
 
[X] [Exp] Found Trelli Trade Post, West
[X] [Diplo] Tie everything further together (Main New Trails)
[X] [Int] Party! (Main Improve Festival)
 
so which would they attack us with

Also, if we make the Trade Post - East can we just like.. convert it to a colony ASAP?
:lol
Welp no just no we are not making the western trade post.
Adhoc vote count started by SpeckofStardust on Jul 14, 2017 at 5:44 PM, finished with 76006 posts and 102 votes.
 
By the way @veekie, have you considered that if the Trelli take serious offense and launch a large-scale assault to protect their tin supply, we risk losing the Red Banner?
 
History sheet updated. I also went through and added Econ Expansion from before it was a stat on all the turn AN provided it.

Which allows me to provide a graph of LTE and Econ through history. Econ expansion slots are the area between the two lines; when they touch, we get overcrowding.

Edit: My X-axis is fucked. Lemme fix.
Alright, here's a fixed version. That one had equidistant data points, but early on my datapoints were anything but:

Again, the space between these is Econ Expansion slots. Too big, and we lose True Cities. Zero, and we get overcrowding.
 
Rome is famed because of Western Rome-wank, but, like, China was bigger and stronger for quite a lot of time (let's ignore Warring States okay).
But guess who won?

Anyways... I guess I'll change what I recommend to Trell Trade Post - East & Northern Trade Post which provides the great benefit of a) more technology suitable for dealing with unusual climates, b) new trade goods so the Trell will maybe figure continuing trade rather than piracy is more worthwhile than getting their flow cut off, c) trees, d) bigger boats. All for the low cost of RB being dedicated for 3 turns, which will force us to make a new Merc Company, probably.
 
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