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Paths of Civilization

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Varano said:
[Main] War Mission
[Secondary] Expand Fishing
[Secondary] Expand Pastures

Deal with the food issues (not enough protein and econ needing a a boost) in one go and main attention is on the war mission?
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Econ 3 is pretty respectable, and will get a boost after war because of new fertile land. Why not make sure we win the war?
 
Guys, if we are going to spend a turn doing a trade mission, we should spend it sending people out to find the Nomad's source of gold, We should also get some textiles too.
I.E one turn for trade and something else, and a second trade to expand pastures, fishery and finish the goddamn step farms.
A third turn setting up a new settlement, studying and expanding the forests OR having a military focus would also be good
 
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Motoko said:
Guys, if we are going to spend a turn doing a trade mission, we should spend it sending people out to find the Nomad's source of gold, We should also get some textiles too.
I.E one turn for trade and something else, and a second trade to expand pastures, fishery and finish the goddamn step farms.
A third turn setting up a new settlement, studying and expanding the forests OR having a military focus would also be good
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It's better to use ships to find the gold rather than sending our traders into lands infested with bloodthirsty nomads.
 
Kiba said:
It's better to use ships to find the gold rather than sending our traders into lands infested with bloodthirsty nomads.
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I thought we had mention of something coming from the west of the nomads (IDK what the exact mention was, but I for some reason remember a mention of gold somewhere in there)
 
[Main] Expand Pastures
[Secondary] War Mission
[Secondary] Build War Carts

War carts to support the war, pastures for the double synergy of more horses for the carts, and more protein for the warriors.
 
ctulhuslp said:
Econ 3 is pretty respectable, and will get a boost after war because of new fertile land. Why not make sure we win the war?
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I agree wholeheartedly with this sentiment.
Total war is one of the only ways to properly assure the defeat of your foe. It's only sensible that we take a short term hit to ensure a long term gain.
 
ctulhuslp said:
And New Trails will probably give a bit of econ boost, actually, so there is that too.
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Actually, if you look back to the explanation of our stats trading is outright said to be a diplo boost. As such, it's pretty definitively a measure of Econ>Diplo.
Academia Nut said:
Sort of, but a good way of thinking of things is that I am basing things on the social policy system from Civ VI, but somewhat differently.

Also, since you have seen a bit more of it:

Econ generally represents the productivity of the people, which in this case primarily refers to food production and population growth. During this era, Economy is consumed to produce Diplomacy and Military points, as well as things like Art and Mysticism. Some Econ actions also cause a short term dip followed by a later increase, and some produce non-numerical effects like raising walls that can prevent attacks from people who don't have siege engines or the will to sit out your food supplies.

Diplomacy is a collection of trade ties, general trustworthiness, and the production of luxuries (which also feeds into Art). It can be earned by doing things that make people like you, and gets consumed in diplomatic outreach and things like annexing other groups (represented by external ties becoming internal ones, so they aren't as useful for making contact with others).

Martial is a combination of resources for making war and institutional knowledge, and it tends to get expended in fighting, but depending on the intensity of the conflict can stay stable or increase as new veterans are produced faster than old ones are killed.

These are also influenced by technology and social systems, so someone with Econ 0 might be more absolutely prosperous than someone at Econ 5 who is at a lower tech level, but they also have less wiggle room in their systems to allow for shocks before they start having to re-asses how they do things.

As time goes on, how the stats interact with each other will change. As system become more interconnected and bulk trade more important, some of the aspects of Diplomacy such as luxury production will get moved to Econ.
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Keep in mind Econ is almost explicitly food at this point. New trails should give us the needed diplo in both score and actual connections to take the river valley more easily along with putting heavy influence on the WC and start integrating them. Which is why I really want it either this following turn or next.

Edit: *econ is mostly food and manpower
 
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[Main] Expand Pastures
[Secondary] War Mission
[Secondary] Build War Carts

Seems like the best synergy next turn.

After that turn, I think we should expand fishing, throw a festival, and maybe expand snail cultivation. The snails would serve as preparation for us meeting the north-western civ that has gold and/or metal working so we can impress them and trade for stuffs.

The festival is just to boost our culture and our stability. Since the war is gonna be a large destabilizer for a losing party, we'll most likely trigger our LO trait so I want that positive stability to take care of that. There also might be weather shenanigans in the future, since we haven't had a serious drought/flood happen in awhile...and i'm getting suspicious of mother nature. There's also the fact that positive stability improves productivity of our people, so I think its a good thing to do while we have a great economy going.

Thoughts?
 
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The chiefs are restless
  • Threadmarks
    • Highly irritated at the way the chiefs are flaunting his authority and not reporting their productivity and the mouths they are feeding correctly, the High Chief heads off to address the chiefs and attempt to get them to cut that out. It works, until he moves on to the next village and they start defying him once he is out of sight, now out of spite as well as greed. Then he attempts to replace their advisers with his own choices so that they can watch the other chiefs and their grain counters like hawks... only that disrupts the activities those advisers were already up to and breeds further resentment. Finally, in fury and disgust he tries to get warriors to force them back into line, only for the chiefs to get their own warriors to glare at these new handlers. Finally, at the next meeting of the chiefs, as one the subordinate chiefs vote to replace the current heir with someone more willing to listen to what they have to say. Sure, he's more of a warrior than an administrator, but with the upcoming conflict with the Dead Priests, his skills will be in greater demand, and the fact that he will have to rely on the other chiefs for guidance in even picking which advisers are best is another layer of bonus.

    The squabbling and power plays of the chiefs with each other does filter out to the rest of the People, who are left ill at ease. If the men and women who are meant to guide them bicker so, what other ill fortunes might be in store?

    Choose an option
    [] Make High Chief position hereditary (Changes government type to Ancient Monarchy, +1 Stability)
    [] Allow greater autonomy (Government type changes to Confederated Oligarchy, +1 Stability)
    [] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)

    However, with talk of the upcoming conflict with the Dead Priests in conjunction with the Western Confederacy, there is a definite excitement in the air, especially as communication with the Spirit Talkers has brought forth a new idea: the idea of conflict for the sake of the spirits. This had already been known to a degree, but communication with them brought in more details regarding the sophistication of their thoughts.

    Sacred War (LoO Linked) (Spiritual)
    Those who are in violation of the laws of nature and the spirits must be punished, lest disaster fall upon all.
    Pros: Bonuses to fighting foes with conflicting spiritual beliefs
    Cons: Can become locked into fighting with foes with conflicting spiritual beliefs

    Black Soil - Production is now regular and huge amounts of trash are turned to black soil every year, but there's always room for more production [Shapers] [King]
    Build Wall - Long experience with retaining walls has lead to the idea of a settlement wall for protection (Coastal village and northern settlements completed)
    Build War Carts - The new, smaller design of the war wagons are significantly more effective than the larger, slower, less maneuverable design. A few are already switching over, but more of these could be most useful on open plains
    Establish Annual Festival - A yearly harvest festival brings entertainment and stability by reminding people of the good things in life, and there are other important times that can be marked in the year, so can the same success be repeated?
    Expand Farms - The people have brought an enormous amount of land under cultivation in the valley, but there is more available in more marginal areas, and in the forests around the fishing village
    Expand Fishing - There are managed cultivation zones along the shore, and dedicating more people to the tasks can increase the yields of fish and luxuries brought in
    Expand Forests - The People have knowledge of how to regrow and repair forests, which extends to bringing them to places they have never been, with considerable effort
    Expand Pasture - While the traders mostly just take their animals where there is good grazing, specific areas can be set aside around the settlements that can be made ideal for the protected grazing of herds
    Expand Places to Spirits - The current places dedicated to the spirits and wisdom are nice, but they could be bigger and grander, especially after seeing the Spirit Talkers...
    Expand Snail Cultivation - While now more reliably grown and harvested, the snail domestication has only managed to hold environmental changes at bay rather than increase production. More investment would increase cultivation
    Expand Warriors - More men can be inducted into the ranks of the warriors every year and not face major food shortfalls
    New Settlement - The land is not particularly good for farming in between the valley and the sea, but there are places where a settlement could be set up, serving as a stop over point along the journey between the two settlements, especially now that the forests in between are ripe for grooming
    New Trails - The People are well tied together, but improved trails to the groups that are traded without could ease the flow of goods and ideas
    Restoration of Harmony - The people are uncertain, and into that uncertainty bad behaviour can flow. Send in the warriors to reassure people and root out corruption and dissent, restoring the proper function of the People. [Harmony+Sacred War] Kicker: Can increase Stability more than normal
    Sacred Warriors - It has been demonstrated that by invoking the power of the spirits, warriors can gain great power. What abilities might the spirits of field and forest be able to teach those who practice war?
    Step-Farms - Step farms have been established and have grown across the valley, but there are still plenty of hills to resculpt [Shapers][King]
    Study Forests - The holy site within the sacred forest is the repository of lore on the forests and the things within them, but could the shamans learn more?
    Trade Mission - Sending a major caravan to another large group can bring new opportunities and find out more about the outside world
    War Mission - You can send raiding parties against groups that have declared themselves hostile.

    Mega-Projects - Mega-Projects can require many generations to complete, take an unknown amount of time to do so, and drain Econ while active, but can produce massive benefits once complete. Once chosen, the occupy the Main Focus slot until either completed or stopped early. Early stopping once started does not refund any of the investments and increases social strife. To reduce confusion, mega-projects are not listed as part of the voting project list and must be "written-in".
    Grand Canal - The hills between the valley and the sea are rough and the rivers there fast and wild. In one man's dream there is the vision of an artificial river cut through the land, tame and managed [Shapers][King]
    Great Dam - The river can run wild and dangerous when the rains come strong, but could it not be controlled by the same principles by which the water on the hills is channelled and contained, merely on a larger scale? [Shapers][King]
    Choose up to one [Main] and two [Secondary] Focuses. If War Mission - Dead Priests is not selected as a Main action, it will automatically be taken as a Secondary. To spend both Secondaries on War Mission - Dead Priests use an x2 addition to the vote to demonstrate that the option is to be taken twice. To back out of the war mission, add a "[] Back out of mission" vote, which will cost Diplomacy points

    [] Black Soil
    [] Build Wall
    [] Build War Carts
    [] Establish Annual Festival
    [] Expand Farms
    [] Expand Fishing
    [] Expand Forests
    [] Expand Pasture
    [] Expand Places to Spirits
    [] Expand Snail Cultivation
    [] Expand Warriors
    [] New Settlement
    [] New Trails
    [] Restoration of Harmony
    [] Sacred Warriors
    [] Step-Farms
    [] Study Forests
    [] Trade Mission
    -Target Options: Spirit Talkers, Western Confederation, Northern Nomads, Into the Wild
    [] War Mission
    -Target Options: Dead Priests, Northern Nomads

    Villages for projects: Valley, lower valley, coastal, northern hills, waterfall
    Holy sites: Waterfall, sacred forest
     
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  • Threadmarks
    • [X] Make High Chief position hereditary (Changes government type to Ancient Monarchy, +1 Stability)
    [X] [Main] War Mission: Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] Expand Fishing
    [X] [Secondary] Expand Pastures

    economy strong for the war!
     
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    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)
    [X] [Main] Expand Pastures
    [X] [Secondary] War Mission - Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] Build War Carts
     
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    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)
    [X][Main] Restoration of Harmony
    [X][Secondary] War Secondary - Dead Priests
    [X][Secondary] Build War Carts

    Drats.
     
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    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)
    [X] [Main] War Mission: Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] New Trails
    [X] [Secondary] Expand Pastures
     
    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)
    [X] [Main] War Mission: Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] New Trails
    [X] [Secondary] Expand Pastures
     
    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)

    I want to keep our meritocratic semi-democracy, darn it.

    [X] [Main] War Mission - Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] Restoration of Harmony
    [X] [Secondary] Sacred Warriors

    Since I'm not fixing the stability by changing government, I'm doing a Restoration of Harmony to deal with the stability problem. Sacred Warriors sounds like it might be very useful for both actions due to our new Sacred War trait.
     
    If we do nothing, should we not restore harmony? Lowered stability is a bad thing, eh?

    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)
    [X] [Main] Restoration of Harmony
    [X] [Secondary] War Mission: Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] Sacred Warriors

    We war hippies now.
     
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    Damn it. Spiritual war isn't very nice at all.

    All well, when we get locked into war with others, we'll have to cause instability to evolve the trait and improve it.
     
    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)
    [X] [Main] War Mission: Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] Restoration of Harmony
    [X] [Secondary] Sacred Warriors
     
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    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)
    [X] [Main] War Mission: Dead Priests
    [X] [Secondary] New Trails
    [X] Restoration of Harmony
    fuck the chiefs with an rusty spoon...​
     
    [X] Do nothing (Other options for stability increase in main phase)

    [X] [Main] Sacred Warriors
    [X] [Secondary] Restoration of Harmony
    [X] [Secondary] War Mission: Dead Priests

    Hey, AN, haven't we already established Annual Festivals?
     
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