Yes, we had that back then. It was explicitly stated as:
No, that's legacies. Those are entirely separate from the baseline values associated with each government type. That's cultural experience for all of our people and not the bonus from hereditary specialization.

There's no roads even to their capitals.
That's just objectively wrong. Assuming by "roads" you mean the managed trails, then they're lacking roads to all their minor settlements and several of their major ones.

Also I'm assuming you meant Pioneering Spirit instead of LoO.
 
I can't agree with this; we might not have seen a disaster cost us a forest yet, but anything that can is likely to cause us a whole bunch of other problems that we don't want to amplify by cutting back on our iron production.
I meant that touching full capacity is fine, much as how touching Stability -1 or even -2 is fine. Staying at full capacity is just asking for a disaster, I agree.
 
[X] [Crow] Trickster
[X] [Fyth] Matron
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Extended Project - Saltern - Southshore Saltern


Holy shit you guys are killing me, I'm not even that late time wise (FFRK events cycle at 6PM and my Granblue crew's Strike time is also set at 6, plz kill me)

I really don't like Fertility, as before, because I think it risks cementing and associating a women's role as tied to making babies (Harvest is probably fine I guess, but I prefer Matron the most for associations of the woman being wise and telling the king not to do dumb shit)

Now that vineyard is passed my current drum to beat is back to Aqueduct in Sacred Forest but it can wait for a bit while conditions settle a bit more.
 
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Neat, answers to my did we notice the expand forest question. Second question, we planned for The Temple Mega-project, and The Library Mega-project immediately after. Did we plan to build the Place to the Stars Mega-Project as well or not? Because we could use that to better navigate the sea when the north star is found, and should lead to compasses at some point.
 
[X] [Crow] Teacher
[X] [Fyth] Harvest

[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Found Trading Post - Greenshore River Mouth
[X] [Secondary] Found Trading Post - Greenshore River Mouth x2


I think teacher is the best option
 
Neat, answers to my did we notice the expand forest question. Second question, we planned for The Temple Mega-project, and The Library Mega-project immediately after. Did we plan to build the Place to the Stars Mega-Project as well or not? Because we could use that to better navigate the sea when the north star is found, and should lead to compasses at some point.
No solid plan post library. There was disagreement last time; my preference for next megaproject is Dam. But some people want PttS or Palace.
 
Neat, answers to my did we notice the expand forest question. Second question, we planned for The Temple Mega-project, and The Library Mega-project immediately after. Did we plan to build the Place to the Stars Mega-Project as well or not? Because we could use that to better navigate the sea when the north star is found, and should lead to compasses at some point.
There's something of a morass of post-Library being Dam/The Games/PttS/The Palace. Personally I could go for either of Palace, Dam, or Ptts.
 
This should be some variety of fun.

Vote Tally : Original - Paths of Civilization | Page 1820 | Sufficient Velocity
##### NetTally 1.9.1
Task: Secondary
[37][Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[18][Secondary] Study Forests
[7][secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[6][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[6][Secondary] Improve Festival
[5][Secondary] Improve Annual Festival x2
[4][Secondary] Study Metal
[3][Secondary] Expand Snail Cultivation
[3][Secondary] Found Trading Post - Greenshore River Mouth
[3][Secondary] Found Trading Post - Greenshore River Mouth x2
[2][Secondary] Build Docks
[2][Secondary] Saltern - Southshore Saltern
[2][Secondary] Expand Vineyard
[1][secondary] Saltern - Southshore Saltern (0/6)
[1][Secondary] Expand Forests
[1][Secondary] Expand Vineyard x2
[1][Secondary] Extended Project - Saltern - Southshore Saltern

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Crow
[41][Crow] Spider-Eyed
[8][Crow] Teacher
[2][Crow] Spirder-Eyed
[1][Crow] Trickster

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Fyth
[22][Fyth] Fertility
[20][Fyth] Harvest
[10][Fyth] Matron
[3][Fyth] Mother

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Main
[48][Main] Great Temple
[1][Main] Improve Festival
Total No. of Voters: 56


So the leading vote groups are:

[Crow] Spider-Eyed
[Fyth] Fertility
[Main] Great Temple
[Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[Secondary] Study Forests


[Crow] Spider-Eyed
[Fyth] Harvest
[Main] Great Temple
[Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[Secondary] Improve Annual Festival


[Crow] Spider-Eyed
[Fyth] Harvest
[Main] Great Temple
[Secondary] Enforce Justice
[Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
 
I mean, i also think we didn't gain cap, i just think we still have the same cap; our system works more or less the same, just with different (in many peoples opinions worse) hereditary situation.
Thats fine. I'm just extremely leery of reenacting the Stallion Tribes situation because nobody thinks a solid road network is important to a major civilization. Ancient China and Ancient Rome waged war on the power of their economy, but their extensive roads actually made it possible to keep their gains from drifting apart.

There's a reason both empires built roads that lasted to the modern day, if by different methods(Rome's roads were very well suited to moving armies and stone around for their construction and fortification projects without wearing out).
Ugh, yeah. Did anyone notice that our current Expand Forest land is almost at full capacity? Should we take this action next turn, this turn, or never?
Current Forest situation:
-Valleyhome - Maxed out. New forests will eat farmland.
-Redshore - Maxed out. New forests will eat farmland.
-Stonepen - Too dry. New forests will be sparse because the terrain can't support more without bringing fresh water or eating into pastures.
-Northshore - Too dry. New forests will be sparse because the terrain can't support more without bringing fresh water or eating into vineyards.
-Southshore - Room for more?
-Redhill - Room for more?

We'd probably want to Survey before more forests, since once we grow them we won't be able to find the minerals.

Sell me on it. My goals are to Foster our religion as conducive to study and work, with a second primary goal of preventing the relegation of women to the household. Please explain to me, with some kind of source, how the naked lactation kink fantasy would help with either of those.
Okay, based on those priorities:
-Mother
--Poor Study. Emphasizes having more children.
--Okay(?) Work. Emphasizes getting more work done by the simplest method: more dudes.
--Worst Womens' Rights. Emphasizes role as childbearing.

-Matron
--Poor Study. Emphasizes Traditional knowledge and the natural conservatism of elders to new ideas.
--Neutral Work. Doesn't mention anything
--Best Womens' Rights. Emphasizes women as authority figure.

-Harvest
--Neutral Study. Doesn't care.
--Best Work. Emphasizes getting as much as you can out of the land as a divine duty. May or may not backfire, but we'd probably have options to slam brakes on later.
--Neutral Womens' Rights. The Woman Farmer is basic fact, and will continue to be because out on the farms it's just plain dumb to have half your population not work.

-Fertility
--Good Study. Follows on the same pattern set by Crow. Understand Nature's message and tend the land with care.
--Poor Work. Emphasizes the protection of the natural order, allowing for Ymaryn ideas of what is natural(this being Sacred Forest, the whole of visible 'nature' for a week's journey in any direction is artificially maintained). Will make lucrative but damaging farming practices contraindicated. May have long term payouts...or not.
--Neutral Womens' Rights. She's a force of nature, and everyone is aware of nature's wrath as drought, famine and disease...but the role is not very human.

That said given your phrasing I doubt you're interested in this, since you've already made up your mind.
 
--Neutral Womens' Rights. She's a force of nature, and everyone is aware of nature's wrath as drought, famine and disease...but the role is not very human.
I'd maybe have said this was partly negative to neutral. But that's just me. If the case is more like mine then it turns out that that and her force of nature characterization is a great platform to launch a rights movement for women, which I want now that I think about it like this. *shrug*
 
[X][Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X][Fyth] Fertility
[X][Main] Great Temple
[X][Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X][Secondary] Study Forests
 
[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Fertility
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival x2


Finally, FINALLY we can get double Main festivals. It is one-time opportunity and fuck yes I am taking it.
 
[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Fertility
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival x2


Finally, FINALLY we can get double Main festivals. It is one-time opportunity and fuck yes I am taking it.
Let's get super wasted now!

Heheheheheh. This image amuses me.
 
Sorry if the discussion has already changed shape during the pages I just skipped, but the arguments that fertility is best because it encompasses everything else, and thus is best because the broader, less specific and bloated a gods domain is the better, reeeeeaaaally reming me of amber age. And I already got tired of them back then... damn divine feature creep.
I also really dont like the idea of our chief female goddess being a naked gal focused around reproduction, especially if we could instead inject some way more positive gender stereotypes into our little wooddwarves.
That's the Mother.
Fertility is the Nature Goddess, not the Babymaker.

AN used misleading terminology again.
Veekie, we invented nondirttrack roads less than a century ago. OF COURSE most of our roads are dirt tracks.

And any citations for your claim they have no road to their capital? It sounds like bullcrap to me.
I have a rush project that has about 6 hours left so not going to dig up the archives that you could just page through the threadmarks for, but you can go see for yourself the timeline:
-Valleyhome established
-Redshore established
-Main Groomed Trails established between Valleyhome and Redshore
-Lower Valleyhome established
-Secondary Groomed Trails established between Lower Valleyhome and Valleyhome
-Sacred Forest established
-Megaproject Canal established through Sacred Forest to Valleyhome and Redshore
-Secondary Groomed Trails established between Sacred Forest and Stonepen
-Stonepen absorbed
-Main Groomed Trails established between Redshore and Northshore.
-Northshore absorbed
-Stallion Tribes established in wilderness
-Black River established in wilderness
-Southshore established in wilderness
-Redhill established in wilderness
-Western Wall established in wilderness
-Main Gravel Trails built using the quarry and mining rubble. Gravel material is only available in Sacred Forest, Redshore, Northshore and Redhill.

Does this look anything like we have any roads to the new provinces? There are no preexisting roads in any of the new provinces. We have not built any roads since then.

Noting that Groomed Trails are dramatically better than dirt tracks, even if they are still mostly dirt, they don't wash out seasonally and are reinforced against heavy wear and tear of travel.

Dirt tracks means that the roads change every year when the rains come.
 
[X] [Fyth] Harvest
[X] [secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice

One festival is pretty much guaranteed at this point, so might as well vote tacticaly
 
Ooh now that's a good idea. I didn't think of that. Since it looks like Trading Post isn't going due to the lack of a guaranteed Festival, I'll go with the guaranteed Golden Age instead. (edit: Technically not guaranteed, we need to not take a Stability hit this mid-turn. Still gives us a very strong chance though)

[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Harvest

[X][Main] Great Temple
[X][Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
I guess I'm not getting my policy change, I'll go with this and fertility.



[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Fertility

[X][Main] Great Temple
[X][Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice


Once again fertility is the best overarching aspect. It contains elements of the harvest, mother, and matron all in one. It combines spectacularly with Divine Stewards and our environmentalism.

Think about this, harvest is just the fertility of the land. Fertility contains this, the fertility of the forests and herds, and the fertility of the people.
 
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[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Harvest
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Saltern - Southshore Saltern

I'd just really like to get started on the Saltern. The provinces can almost certainly finish it for us, right? That'll take us to Dominant for trade. Whereas we don't know what we need to get to dominant in any other trade good.
 
So you're literally denying that 'do it later' is ever appropriate?

Guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that.
I deny trying to go perfect timing.
Perfect is the enemy of good. Waiting so long for the perfect opportunity causes you to to miss any
Sell me on it. My goals are to Foster our religion as conducive to study and work, with a second primary goal of preventing the relegation of women to the household. Please explain to me, with some kind of source, how the naked lactation kink fantasy would help with either of those.
Because you are strawmanning really hard there? I can't convince you if you already shut your mind against it.
 
[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Harvest
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Saltern - Southshore Saltern

I'd just really like to get started on the Saltern. The provinces can almost certainly finish it for us, right? That'll take us to Dominant for trade. Whereas we don't know what we need to get to dominant in any other trade good.

Sure we do. We just need to produce more of X.
 
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