Anyone thinking about wrecking the DP's golden age so they are forced to wage war in order to expand (and not die)?

It'll be pretty easy, actually...we just need to muscle in on their monopolies and trigger their trait.

If we do it enough times (probably 2 since AN said the con was pretty nasty), they'll drop stability and lose their golden age. And since they lost it because of their stability being shit, they'll be in an awkward position if they have to make stability hitting decisions. For them, it'll be a choice between building martial, waging war, or building stability.
They only have one monopoly: Fine Pottery
We're a couple of centuries behind them, our last Pottery improvement was Ash Glazing...from a Xohyssiri refugee.

The Xohyssiri also have extremely cheap Grand Sacrifice due to Moloch Calls. A Grand Sacrifice of 300 children is massive and everyone will be sure the spirits are placated...but 300 kids won't even be a visible blip on their population cost.
They're functionally running an Econ 0 Secondary Grand Sacrifice.

But I don't really see the point, given their traits, the moment the Thunder Horse OR the Highlanders gain dominance, they're going to crush the Xohyssiri because their traits are offensive to every single neighbor.

And if the Thunder Horse lose enough Prestige beating on the Highlanders, the Xohyssiri are going to break away.

You can see their strategy actually if you think about it:
-Discover Center of Trade through dominance of Pottery. Obtain +1 Diplomacy per turn.
-Trigger Golden Age through overflowing Diplomacy and Art
-Obtain Step Farms from Ymaryn to improve their Expand Economy rate.
-Pump overflow and keep churning the Econ slots they have frantically into even more Art Patronage to overflow even more.
-Once Mysticism overflow starts pouring into Economy, crank it all into Expand Army. Trigger Martial overflow deliberately once all stats are maxed.
-FREEDOM
So, our problem with Northshore and other provinces is that there are vast interior space that we can't forest, because there's no water, which means that the place will stay dry because we don have forests which act to bring more water in.

The solution to this problem would be to build an aqueduct so that we can forest the area, but it seems to be only limited to cities.
Not strictly true. Water going into a city still comes out, if not directly usable by people, it's perfectly usable(and in fact superior due to the nutrient rich iron age sewage water) by bocages.

Which would buy a few Forest expansion slots I think? Aqueducts do generate 4
 
Not strictly true. Water going into a city still comes out, if not directly usable by people, it's perfectly usable(and in fact superior due to the nutrient rich iron age sewage water) by bocages.

Which would buy a few Forest expansion slots I think? Aqueducts do generate 4
It's still limited to cities. The forest from the econ expansion slots is a good point, however, and would likely mean that the city itself is forested enough to propagate the water inland.

Requires us to do a Main forest immediately, however, in order to stop normal Econ Expansions from consuming the slots.
 
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In the mood to take a crack at the divine aspect combo list. Off the top of my head the gist is:
-Teacher Crow is all about explain the know to people.
[Crow] Teacher X[Fyth] Mother
Teaches parenting skills. Bound to screw up the Clan system by taking up some of their duties.
[Crow] Teacher X [Fyth] Matron
Wise person training center. Adult learning center for those unable to do their old jobs. Probably retraining cripples that survived war into shamans and the like.
[Crow] Teacher X [Fyth] Harvest
Agricultural College.
[Crow] Teacher X [Fyth] Fertility
Animal husbandry. Karma Sutra. If this society was ancient Greece those temples that young females stayed at until someone bought their virginity, picked a god to channel and then attempt to father a demi-god.

-Trickster Crow is all about messing with people for their own good... or just teaching spy units.
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Mother
'That is my youngest son... We train him wrong as a joke.' Experiments in child instruction.
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Matron
'Channeling Yoda they are'. 'Teaching you to track down and remove stupidity through embarrassment we do'. 'Much fun we have at your expense while we make you learn'. 'Told you not to lick that we did'.
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Harvest
You thought you planted grain... but it was me, Tubers!
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Fertility
'After all that alcohol at the festival its time for the besting pool in everyone's favorite game... Guess the dad! Betting pool is available in the lobby.', '...and that is why we have 800 new breeds of dog and so many hybrid crops'.

Devourer Crow is all about dealing with Death.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Mother
Temple to Child/Infant Mortality. Shamans declare war on lack of health and survival of the really young.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Matron
Death Counseling focus. Grieving Focus. Philosophies of aging.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Harvest
Feast and Famine. The Good Times and the Bad Times.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Fertility
Cycle of Life. Death and Birth.

Spider-Eyed Crow is about learning the rules of existence.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Mother
Centralized education of the young. Studies on how kids learn and how to improve the methods of learning.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Matron
Aimed at teaching those going towards elder status. Makes with the shaman science and testing and learning.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Harvest
Experimental agriculture, botany, and researching hybrids and improved crops systematically.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Fertility
Animal husbandry studies. NSFW studies. Probably a lot of systematic studies on what does and doesn't work ritual wise.
 
It's still limited to cities.
So we grow forests around the cities first.

Forests are terraforming agents. Once they exist for long enough they can convey water in the underlayer.
In the mood to take a crack at the divine aspect combo list. Off the top of my head the gist is:
-Teacher Crow is all about explain the know to people.
[Crow] Teacher X[Fyth] Mother
Teaches parenting skills. Bound to screw up the Clan system by taking up some of their duties.
[Crow] Teacher X [Fyth] Matron
Wise person training center. Adult learning center for those unable to do their old jobs. Probably retraining cripples that survived war into shamans and the like.
[Crow] Teacher X [Fyth] Harvest
Agricultural College.
[Crow] Teacher X [Fyth] Fertility
Animal husbandry. Karma Sutra. If this society was ancient Greece those temples that young females stayed at until someone bought their virginity, picked a god to channel and then attempt to father a demi-god.

-Trickster Crow is all about messing with people for their own good... or just teaching spy units.
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Mother
'That is my youngest son... We train him wrong as a joke.' Experiments in child instruction.
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Matron
'Channeling Yoda they are'. 'Teaching you to track down and remove stupidity through embarrassment we do'. 'Much fun we have at your expense while we make you learn'. 'Told you not to lick that we did'.
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Harvest
You thought you planted grain... but it was me, Tubers!
[Crow] Trickster X [Fyth] Fertility
'After all that alcohol at the festival its time for the besting pool in everyone's favorite game... Guess the dad! Betting pool is available in the lobby.', '...and that is why we have 800 new breeds of dog and so many hybrid crops'.

Devourer Crow is all about dealing with Death.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Mother
Temple to Child/Infant Mortality. Shamans declare war on lack of health and survival of the really young.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Matron
Death Counseling focus. Grieving Focus. Philosophies of aging.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Harvest
Feast and Famine. The Good Times and the Bad Times.
[Crow] Devourer X [Fyth] Fertility
Cycle of Life. Death and Birth.

Spider-Eyed Crow is about learning the rules of existence.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Mother
Centralized education of the young. Studies on how kids learn and how to improve the methods of learning.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Matron
Aimed at teaching those going towards elder status. Makes with the shaman science and testing and learning.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Harvest
Experimental agriculture, botany, and researching hybrids and improved crops systematically.
[Crow] Spider-Eyed X [Fyth] Fertility
Animal husbandry studies. NSFW studies. Probably a lot of systematic studies on what does and doesn't work ritual wise.
Amusing, except Mother is specifically the one about birthing children(always pregnant or breastfeeding). Matron is the one about raising them.

Fertility is the generalized fertility of everything. People, fields, cows, fish, trees. If it's alive it's fertile.
If it's not alive, give it to the Crows.
They like corpses. They also like shiny rocks.
 
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Amusing, except Mother is specifically the one about birthing children(always pregnant or breastfeeding). Matron is the one about raising them.
Because that isn't schizophrenic at all. Your saying that Mother means only until they give birth then its Matron... then your saying that spawning the children is a separate aspect.

Even if it is like that once formalization of temples kicks in it'll drift towards Fertility handling the pre-birth aspect, Mother handling the infant to adult range, and Matron being about being the older female lead. Cultural drift is going to shift that way as things get formalized and its not just your personal vision that matters.
Fertility is the generalized fertility of everything. People, fields, cows, fish, trees. If it's alive it's fertile.
If it's not alive, give it to the Crows.
That only works logically, when the penalty for being sterile is death. The penalty for menopause is death. I've seen post menopausal elder so the above is wrong.
Spider Eyed Crow and Fythagyna and The Boon.
To be honest the hand thing extending from Crow looks like its handing her a sideways nautilus.
 
[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Fertility
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
 
Guys, Guys, Guys
...and ladyguys

Why not simple have both ?

It has been shown by previous Votes that we can choose more then one option if both get the same among of Votes & the choosen options aren't at odds with each other

Therefore I say we bury this whole discussion about Fertility vs. Harvest and simple use tactical voting to get both & thus choose the harmonious hybrid option

Also tally
Adhoc vote count started by sidestory on Jun 2, 2017 at 2:45 AM, finished with 45884 posts and 69 votes.
 
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Guys, Guys, Guys
...and ladyguys

Why not simple have both ?

It has been shown by previous Votes that we can choose more then one option if both get the same among of Votes & the choosen options aren't at odds with each other

Therefore I say we buy this whole discussion about Fertility vs. Harvest and simple use tactical voting to get both & thus choose the harmonious hybrid option

Also tally
Inb4 the thread explodes.

NO.

 
Ugh. Basically no reason to not grab a Golden Age right now when it's available and we're in a perfect state to take advantage of it. And instead we Study Forest.
Study Forest is an action I've wanted to take for a long time, but compared to getting a Golden Age... One innovation roll in something we really do need and has a backlog of innovations vs. an innovation roll every turn plus a free econ every turn.

The only reason against it (Enforce Justice) is if you think that
1) we need a massive number of new trails immediately
2) we'll be able to spend many actions making those trails
3) Our new government which explicitly mentions being a good mix is just as bad at Centralization cap as the older one which mostly said how decentralized it was.
4) That we won't raise our Centralization cap further from getting it into Gold (had happened several times) and the Golden Age won't spend it like it does all our other Golden stats

Eh, I guess I shouldn't be surprised when the thread does inefficient actions.

As to the Fyth vote... Sure, whatever. Let's hope our people find it amusing again.
 
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Oh hey lookie I made a arty.


Spider Eyed Crow and Fythagyna and The Boon.

@McLuvin this is your fault. I'm so happy though, this came out okay and not a stinking pile of doo-doo!

Also not my final design of Spider-Eye Crow. That is gonna take a while. In case you note any similarities, his posture is based on No-Face from Spirited Away.
It's lovely!

Good job mate
 
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Ugh. Basically no reason to not grab a Golden Age right now when it's available and we're in a perfect state to take advantage of it. And instead we Study Forest.
Study Forest is an action I've wanted to take for a long time, but compared to getting a Golden Age... One innovation roll in something we really do need and has a backlog of innovations vs. an innovation roll every turn plus a free econ every turn.

The only reason against it is if you think that
1) we need a massive number of new trails immediately
2) we'll be able to spend many actions making those trails
3) Our new government which explicitly mentions being a good mix is just as bad at Centralization cap as the older one which mostly said how decentralized it was.
4) That we won't raise our Centralization cap further from getting it into Gold (had happened several times) and the Golden Age won't spend it like it does all our other Golden stats

Eh, I guess I shouldn't be surprised when the thread does inefficient actions.

As to the Fyth vote... Sure, whatever. Let's hope our people find it amusing again.
Well for the Fyth thing I'm staying where I am cause I like it here.

1) and 2) are mostly viable, though I doubt the timeframe on 1). 3) and 4) are after I've thought about it, a matter of personal speculation and subjectivity. I agree with you and think our cap has changed in some positive form but not much I can do to convince people otherwise.

Hopefully the Forest option finds something worthwhile and we can grab a PG next turn.


It's lovely!

Good job mate
Aww thanky. *hugs*

I don't draw, except for some really long ago doodles which no longer exist, and have no formal training so you can consider this my first piece of real art period. Gonna be working on bits here and there which may crop up in the thread. Crow's mask needs a lot of work. It actually came out well as a prototype to help me cement it's basic format and polygons in my head but I have specific bird species I am drawing from that I need to work on and fuse together. The beak is the tricky bit. His hands to a lesser degree and I have no clue for his over all body shape and style. I need to go stare at pictures of Transformed Vicar Amelia.


*Shaman riots in the streets.

New king: i hate my job.
Basically my thinking on it. Plus I don't think AN would let it fly at all.
 
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I'm keeping this
*snatches it, scuttles away*
Ooh boy, go ahead little magpie. I made this weeks ago. I have many more where it came from.
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on Jun 2, 2017 at 3:13 AM, finished with 45897 posts and 72 votes.
 
Ugh. Basically no reason to not grab a Golden Age right now when it's available and we're in a perfect state to take advantage of it. And instead we Study Forest.
Study Forest is an action I've wanted to take for a long time, but compared to getting a Golden Age... One innovation roll in something we really do need and has a backlog of innovations vs. an innovation roll every turn plus a free econ every turn.
Hmm, fair enough. I'm really very tempted to push towards more income via dominating salt, dye, and wine in the immediate future, but qualitative improvements are also important.

But I do want to push trade ASAP. Being connected to the rest of the region is the best early human disaster detection system possible, on top of being very profitable.

[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Matron
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
 
Guys, Guys, Guys
...and ladyguys

Why not simple have both ?

It has been shown by previous Votes that we can choose more then one option if both get the same among of Votes & the choosen options aren't at odds with each other

Therefore I say we bury this whole discussion about Fertility vs. Harvest and simple use tactical voting to get both & thus choose the harmonious hybrid option

Also tally
[X] [Fyth] Harvest

Tactical hybrid option vote
You realize AN is only going to give us so much leeway here.

Don't abuse the leeway he gave us for the last vote. You'll ruin it for everyone. Vote the way you want to vote. Don't make a whole day of discussion about which damn option is tied.
 
[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Harvest
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] [Secondary] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Saltern - Southshore Saltern
 
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Ummm...since we're building the Temple and the Library pretty much back to back, it'll be likely that we drop below overflow on one of our stats...which will lose us the golden age.
 
*Shaman riots in the streets.

New king: i hate my job.

Well though luck then, the spirits don't care

Basically my thinking on it. Plus I don't think AN would let it fly at all.

Why shouldn't he, it's a mechanic of the game & we already have multi-Aspect gods in Form of Crow

All it would do IC is encouragIng the creation of a hybrid Form like the spider Eyed crow form we have to unify all aspects of Crow
 
[X] [Crow] Spider-Eyed
[X] [Fyth] Harvest
[X] [Main] Great Temple
[X] Improve Annual Festival
[X] [Secondary] Saltern - Southshore Saltern
Can you stick a [Secondary] tag in front of your Festival vote? It borks the Tallier if you don't. Please and thank you. :)

Ummm...since we're building the Temple and the Library pretty much back to back, it'll be likely that we drop below overflow on one of our stats...which will lose us the golden age.
No?

It's hitting 0 and below Stab for sure but overflow loss was never confirmed. Also with the amount of possible overflow it is feasible to out run the megaproject costs.
 
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