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Paths of Civilization

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Umi-san said:
1. overly aggressive
2. copper helps
3. i wanna see what the overflow from The Garden (if any) looks like.
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1. But we absolutely need to block other civs from building our wonders first.
2. Copper can obsolete the Dam, depending on circumstances. Megaprojects are only mega because they're stupid hard to do with what we have on hand.
3. BUT SYNERGY!
 
veekie said:
-Law interference - The Highland Kingdom is currently codifying its laws. A trade mission here carrying tablets of our laws will allow them to accelerate the progress of the project at the cost of incorporating ideas from our culture into their first written law. This is an extremely powerful cultural influence vector and the best way to sneak one of our traits into their culture in place of the Law upgrade. ETA 4 turns, but each turn they will have more of it codified, which means less likely that our ideas will be embedded in their legal code.
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Um. Why in hell would they accept any of our laws? When we were making the law, we would definitely not accept such a gift, neither will they.
Like, Xohyssiri gifted us the tablets of their anatomical knowledge...it did not influence us at all, it just gave us the tech.
 
[X] [Kick] The Garden
[X] [Main] New Settlement - Southern Shores
[X] [Secondary] Trade Mission - Western Thunder Horse/Thunder Speakers
[X] [Secondary] Trade Mission - Highland Kingdom
 
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ctulhuslp said:
Um. Why in hell would they accept any of our laws? When we were making the law, we would definitely not accept such a gift, neither will they.
Like, Xohyssiri gifted us the tablets of their anatomical knowledge...it did not influence us at all, it just gave us the tech.
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Its their choice to accept it, but consider if, during a megaproject, you got the option to cut turns off the process in exchange for values from your longest lived curred neighbors.

They don't have kickers to use. Its a temptation.
Hell, even just the particular legal language being borrowed is great.
 
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veekie said:
Its their choice to accept it, but consider if, during a megaproject, you got the option to cut turns off the process in exchange for values from your longest lived curred neighbors.

They don't have kickers to use. Its a temptation.
Hell, even just the particular legal language being borrowed is great.
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No, no, it is not a temptation at all. Even while we were at crisis, we still would not accept any deal that could compromise our values not in the way we'd like. They are not in crisis, they are at peace, they have probably heroic leader and decent stability, they have no reason at all to hurry and every reason to take it slowly and steadily.
They have no reason at all to accept changes to their values and language for maybe shaving off a turn from a megaproject they will still finish in ~4 turns.
 
From their perspectice its a free language upgrade event. Ymaryn written language is much better at administration and legalese because we've been doing it for a long time. Saves time inventing words.

Heck, WE eagerly took in their values back when they were the WC. And they copied our values just as enthusiatically.

Just saying, we know The Law gives a trait evolution at the end. By showing them our laws, we likely put our traits in their option list.
 
veekie said:
From their perspectice its a free language upgrade event. Ymaryn written language is much better at administration and legalese because we've been doing it for a long time. Saves time inventing words.

Heck, WE eagerly took in their values back when they were the WC. And they copied our values just as enthusiatically.

Just saying, we know The Law gives a trait evolution at the end. By showing them our laws, we likely put our traits in their option list.
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That was back when we (and, presumably, they) had free value slots to get values. And they probably have good enough language to write the law already, else it would not be an option. And transitioning to another language is unlikely to shorten the project which has already begun. :V

By the way, we still have 1 Honour value slot left. We should limit contacts with nomads and the like until we fill it with something good. :V
 
ctulhuslp said:
That was back when we (and, presumably, they) had free value slots to get values. And they probably have good enough language to write the law already, else it would not be an option. And transitioning to another language is unlikely to shorten the project which has already begun. :V
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Their entire pantheon is 80% borrowed. I don't see the resistance to foreign ideas you seem to assume.

And not transitioning. Absorbing loan words that do a job they are looking for
By the way, we still have 1 Honour value slot left. We should limit contacts with nomads and the like until we fill it with something good. :V
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Not how it works. The CA slot is filled, so Honor value can only be filled by our actions. The recent megaproject rush might give us something at the end of Gardens.
 
Why are people assuming war in the lowlands is a bad thing? It fuels our refugee reactor which also lets us steal tech. Especially now that we're at high enough stability to safely tank devouring entire economies (8+)
 
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Food for thought: High-level equilibrium trap, explains how China stagnate and actually regressed technology.

Let explore how it might apply to the Ymaryn.

1) Cheap labor - We don't have slaves, and even half-exiles must be paid. This makes the cost of labor more expensive, doubly so since we farm on hills. Since the settlement of plains, this is somewhat "alleviated". It is somewhat unclear if this leads to greater incentive for technological breakthrough or less.

2) Well-developed trade network (internally)- We are well on our way to developing canals and roads to centralize the Ymaryn. This is a good thing, since it increases commerce and internal communication within the polity. Although, it can also become a trap, since there are less incentive to develop technological solution to shifting goods and resolving famine. We also developed an extensive trade network from the outside, allowing opportunities for adoption of technology and science.

3) Shift from Taoism to Confucianism in Religion and Values - We have a value called harmony. This is great for unifying a people, but could also prevent disharmonious but innovative ideas from surfacing. This is alleviated through constant infusion of immigrants from other civilizations.

4) Decline of Serfdom - Our people are not serf, but maybe not really all that motivated to innovate either. However, the incentive is moved to the chiefs, who would like bigger productivity output so that they could become king/governor.
 
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mastigos said:
Why are people assuming war in the lowlands is a bad thing? It fuels our refugee reactor which also lets us steal tech
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Its a bad thing if you are trying to steal tech from PAST the lowlands. Theres nobody in refugee range with good tech anymore. We need to reach past the lowlands, and the route is only open while the lull lasts

The lowlands can burn, but not before we trade link our way to the eastern lowlands via Thunder Speakers and salt gift the secret of brass out of them.
 
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[X] [Main] New Settlement - Southern Shores
[X] [Secondary] Copper Mine
[X] [Secondary] Copper Mine X2
[X] [Kick] The Garden
Adhoc vote count started by Chrestomanci on May 9, 2017 at 8:23 AM, finished with 30318 posts and 66 votes.
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lioli said:
And while I'm still saddened at the loss of Sacred War and the Restore Harmony action it gave us, I'm pleased that we lost that trait. We have Cosmopolitan Acceptance counteracting our dislike of human sacrifice, but indubitably we'll be forced into a war if we still have Sacred War.
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We should have a Sacred War, against the 4 Horsemen.

We've pretty much beaten Famine already, and gave Pestilence a bloody nose. 2 more to go. :p
 
Main] New Settlement - Southern Shores
[X] [Secondary] Copper Mine
[X] [Secondary] Copper Mine X2
[X] [Kick] The Garden

What I said I wanted to do before, no reason to change that I can see. Knowledge of brass is just not nearly as important as actually getting copper. It should make everything easier.
 
[X] [Kick] The Garden
[X] [Main] New Settlement - Southern Shores
[X] [Secondary] Trade Mission - Western Thunder Horse/Thunder Speakers
[X] [Secondary] Trade Mission - Highland Kingdom
 
One thing I haven't seen anyone mention is that settling Southshore very well might give us a border with the Southern Hill People/at the very least make trading with them much simpler. Combine that with serving as a base for our trading boats to venture further south then there's potentially room to attest we can circumvent a lot of the low lands shenanigans.
 
[X][Main] New Settlement - Southern Shores
[X][Secondary] Trade Mission - Highland Kingdom
[X][Secondary] Trade Mission - Thunder Horses
[X][Kick] The Garden
 
veekie said:
Is a Trade Policy capable of a Salt Gift?
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Ehhh... maybe. I will think about it.

hylas240 said:
Also, for clarification...does the Salt Gifting distribute salt to all our neighbors or do we have to choose?
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If you don't choose, it will be distributed evenly, but you can specify neighbours to go to if you want.

ctulhuslp said:
what are the effects of green Stability?
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Keep it at that level and see.

Kiba said:
Aqueducts apparently only taken a few years at most to construct for the city of Rome. So it isn't certainly a megaproject. I suspect we'll have an easier time constructing an aqueduct and plumbing system for new cities than we do for renovating old cities.
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Well, when you're using stone tools and don't have access to the more sophisticated engineering of the Romans, and have never done it before, its really takes a while. Plus its not just an aqueduct.

Omegahugger said:
I, too, approve of adopting the divine poison yandere.
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I have some questions Academia Nut:
  1. I remember you mentioning earlier that a point of Diplo, Econ or Martial can represent a differing amount depending on technology. How does the 'strength' (for lack of a better word) of our Diplo, Econ and Martial points compare to our neighbours (including our March if they're different to us)?
  2. What stability restoring actions do our neighbours have available?
  3. Does building more boats help our sailing missions?
  4. For that matter what policy does Sailing Mission fall under (if any)?
 
[X] [Kick] The Garden
[X] [Main] New Settlement - Southern Shores
[X] [Secondary] Trade Mission - Western Thunder Horse/Thunder Speakers
[X] [Secondary] Trade Mission - Highland Kingdom

Still catching up but I feel maining copper next turn would be for the best.
 
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