If we tell Asuma about the rift site, isn't he going to ask is if that wasn't genjutsu? Rocking the boat seems like a bad idea right now.

(I forget if this was mentioned on Discord or in-thread. This isn't my realization - credit to the first lesson, whoever that was.)
 
@MadScientist

Proposed edits:
  1. Sanity check with Mari/Keiko.
  2. Isan Team:
    1. Hazou reports to Asuma. What does he want us to do with the banished ninja? Suggestions:
    2. Track Aida Rin and Mochiaki, and arrange for an ANBU capture team. Provide assistance if sensible. Do not take undue risk.
    3. Alternative possibility: use a "disguised as non leaf" operative to turn them into deniable assets for leaf.
  3. Hazou and Kagome:
    1. Find as much information as you can about rifts and dimensionalism. Consult with sealmasters. Read Jiraiya's notes, the Leaf Private Library, and anything else Asuma is willing to let Hazou access.
    2. Purchase copies of any seals that might behave at all differently at the rift (diagnostic seals if they have them, but just in general anything that might behave differently).
    3. Once Mari is back to manage the clan in Hazou's absence, and if Asuma gives the green light:
      1. Hazou and Kagome go on a field trip to the site of the afterlife rift to examine it -- both for furthering their understanding of dimensional sealing in preperation for the Great Seal, and for evaluating the site's suitability for assisting in necromancy.
      2. If Kagome thinks that we would need better tools to get meaningful information from this expedition, and those tools are within the pair's ability to research, then do so. This research could take place at Leaf, if Kagome sees immediate need to do that research, but might also or otherwise take place at the rift site, if he thinks that preliminary examination of the rift site would better enable the creation of tools to examine it in more detail.
      3. Before leaving, use Iron Nerve to create a detailed diagram of the Great Seal to leave with the Leaf Sealmasters.
      4. Bring Noburi and Yuno, both as bodyguards, and in case Noburi's chakra sense is helpful at all in examining the site.
      5. Potentially also bring Sasuke and/or a hired Hyuuga, in case their cheating eyeballs might be helpful in examining the site.

  1. Sanity check with Mari/Keiko.
  2. Isan Team:
    1. Hazou reports to Asuma. What do we do with the banished ninja? Suggestions:
    2. Track Rin and Mochiaki and arrange for an ANBU capture team. Provide assistance without taking undue risk.
    3. Alternately: use a "non-Leaf" (like "Yujin") operative to turn them into Leaf deniable assets.
  3. Hazou and Kagome:
    1. Exhaustively research rifts and dimensionalism. Consult with sealmasters. Read Jiraiya's notes, the Leaf Private Library, and anything else Asuma is willing to let Hazou access.
    2. Purchase copies of any seals that might behave at all differently at the O'uzu afterlife rift site (diagnostic seals if they exist, but generally anything that might behave differently).
    3. If we could make better tools to get meaningful information from the rift, research them.
      1. In Leaf if possible
      2. If examining the site would help, research new tools there.
    4. Before leaving, use Iron Nerve to create a detailed Great Seal diagram for the Leaf Sealmasters.
    5. Once Mari can manage the clan in Hazou's absence, and with Asuma's greenlight:
      1. Hazou and Kagome go to the rift to examine it. Why?
        1. Preparing for Great Seal-related dimensionalism
        2. Assessing the site's suitability for necromancy.
      2. Bring Noburi and Yuno as protection.
      3. Special senses to examine the site:
        1. Noburi's chakra sense.
        2. Bring Sasuke and/or a hired Hyuuga

I offer these words with no strings attached. Still, I would prefer if you would make some additions for my preferences:

  1. Sanity check with Mari/Keiko.
  2. Isan Team:
    1. Hazou reports to Asuma. What do we do with the banished ninja? Suggestions:
    2. Track Rin and Mochiaki and arrange for an ANBU capture team. Provide assistance without taking undue risk.
    3. Alternately: use a "non-Leaf" (like "Yujin") operative to turn them into Leaf deniable assets.
  3. Hazou and Kagome:
    1. Exhaustively research rifts and dimensionalism. Consult with sealmasters. Read Jiraiya's notes, the Leaf Private Library, and anything else Asuma is willing to let Hazou access.
    2. Purchase copies of any seals that might behave at all differently at the O'uzu afterlife rift site (diagnostic seals if they exist, but generally anything that might behave differently).
    3. If we could make better tools to get meaningful information from the rift, research them.
      1. In Leaf if possible
      2. If examining the site would help, research new tools there.
    4. Before leaving, use Iron Nerve to create a detailed Great Seal diagram for the Leaf Sealmasters.
    5. Once Mari can manage the clan in Hazou's absence, and with Asuma's greenlight:
      1. Hazou and Kagome go to the rift to examine it. Why?
        1. Preparing for Great Seal-related dimensionalism
        2. Assessing the site's suitability for necromancy.
      2. Bring Noburi, Yuno, and Mari (if willing)as protection.
        1. Noburi's chakra sense could also provide information.
      3. Cautionary measures
        1. With permission, approach and leave the rift site with skywalkers.
        2. Set up a defense perimeter while studying.
        3. Hazou/Noburi keeps the Keiko-rendezvous puppy summoned during all waking hours for reverse summoning.
        4. Stay less than a week.
        5. Ask Asuma to send an ANBU for protection.
Send an ANBU? We only get one dude if Asuma approves? Are you sure we don't want to use skywalkers all the way?
 
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If we tell Asuma about the rift site, isn't he going to ask is if that wasn't genjutsu? Rocking the boat seems like a bad idea right now.

(I forget if this was mentioned on Discord or in-thread. This isn't my realization - credit to the first lesson, whoever that was.)
I don't think we would contest that the events on that excursion happened -- we came back with the Porcupine Scroll after all. The genjutsu sham excuse was to explain Itachi talking about the letter.
 
I don't think we would contest that the events on that excursion happened -- we came back with the Porcupine Scroll after all. The genjutsu sham excuse was to explain Itachi talking about the letter.
Scenario 1: we did not tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Why, in your post-mission report, did you not communicate that a portal to another world was open? That was clearly relevant. Either you're incompetent, you're lying, or you withheld information. If you're incompetent, we have problems. If it's there and you didn't tell me, we have serious problems. If it's not there, then the scale does not go high enough because I was already not feeling great about how much trust I'm putting in you and this is a concrete and obvious lie. I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents to investigate and imprisoning you in the meantime because if you sour the betting pool you might destabilze Leaf's economy...again."

Scenario 2: we did tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Hold on - that was part of the genjutsu. Wasn't it? Hazou, that was genjutsu, right? I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents. If they find a rift, that means that you did actually commit treason and that I need to decide what to do with you."

I'm hoping that someone catches this and fact-checks it. I'm also hoping Asuma is so deliriously happy that Isan decided to make vulnerable two intelligence assets that we have delivered to him that he doesn't care.
 
Scenario 1: we did not tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Why, in your post-mission report, did you not communicate that a portal to another world was open? That was clearly relevant. Either you're incompetent, you're lying, or you withheld information. If you're incompetent, we have problems. If it's there and you didn't tell me, we have serious problems. If it's not there, then the scale does not go high enough because I was already not feeling great about how much trust I'm putting in you and this is a concrete and obvious lie. I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents to investigate and imprisoning you in the meantime because if you sour the betting pool you might destabilze Leaf's economy...again."

Scenario 2: we did tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Hold on - that was part of the genjutsu. Wasn't it? Hazou, that was genjutsu, right? I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents. If they find a rift, that means that you did actually commit treason and that I need to decide what to do with you."

I'm hoping that someone catches this and fact-checks it. I'm also hoping Asuma is so deliriously happy that Isan decided to make vulnerable two intelligence assets that we have delivered to him that he doesn't care.
We're not expecting an open rift at the location, it already closed long ago. We're still interested in the location because there used to be a rift to the afterlife there, and that might give us some sort of information we can leverage.

Moreover, given that Itachi and Hidan were there in either model (genjutsu or no), it's perfectly plausible for the rift event to have happened regardless of whether the genjutsu happened. The genjutsu effect we claim is not that the whole encounter was hallucinatory (we also did successfully get the Porcupine Scroll during this encounter) but rather that Itachi altered Hazou's memories to include sending him a message.

Moreover moreover, Asuma already knows we're a filthy stinking liar about the genjutsu. It's just that when he moved to execute us, enough people raised a ruckus in our favour that he was convinced killing us about it was more trouble than it was worth. What we fear is not that Asuma might be able to figure out that we lied, but rather that we might compromise our own story in a way that leaves Asuma no choice but to go ahead and execute us despite the ruckus. These may not seem like very different fears but, coupled with the more specific limitations of what our claim is I do not think we are in danger on that matter.
 
Scenario 1: we did not tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Why, in your post-mission report, did you not communicate that a portal to another world was open? That was clearly relevant. Either you're incompetent, you're lying, or you withheld information. If you're incompetent, we have problems. If it's there and you didn't tell me, we have serious problems. If it's not there, then the scale does not go high enough because I was already not feeling great about how much trust I'm putting in you and this is a concrete and obvious lie. I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents to investigate and imprisoning you in the meantime because if you sour the betting pool you might destabilze Leaf's economy...again."

Scenario 2: we did tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Hold on - that was part of the genjutsu. Wasn't it? Hazou, that was genjutsu, right? I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents. If they find a rift, that means that you did actually commit treason and that I need to decide what to do with you."

I'm hoping that someone catches this and fact-checks it. I'm also hoping Asuma is so deliriously happy that Isan decided to make vulnerable two intelligence assets that we have delivered to him that he doesn't care.
So as far as I can tell, we reported to Asuma in full and the genjutsu excuse is only to cover the apparent letter and premeditated state of the meeting.

Besides, Hazou would have been making Deceit checks at like 20 versus Asuma's socials. If it weren't for the fact that Hazou literally owned up to it at first. Asuma knows this is a lie just as much as we do, it's just important to pay lip-service to the legal fiction that allows us to walk free since that fiction has now become a part of Asuma's legitimacy as a Kage (as if we were indeed traitors and he didn't execute us, then he wouldn't be a good Kage).

@MadScientist How would you feel about a bullet point to prevent Foot-In-Mouth along the lines of "When briefing Asuma, make sure to acknowledge Itachi's genjutsu where relevant."?
 
Summoners don't need to bring their scroll with them to summon by the way. They leave theirs at a secure location if possible.

I don't know when this was mentioned since it's been a while and was about Keiko's scroll if I remember correctly.
 
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@eaglejarl @Velorien
Sorry if this is annoying/you're already discussing it, I just wanted to be sure you saw it since I edited in the @'s and I'm not sure that actually pings you...
No, it's fine. I appreciate you checking back on it.

but I was assuming those round up
They do.

Summoners don't need to bring their scroll with them to summon by the way. They leave theirs at a secure location if possible.

I don't know when this was mentioned since it's been a while and was about Keiko's scroll if I remember correctly.
Wait, is that right? I thought you had to have the scroll with you. @faflec ?


I am delighted to see necromancy plans being made again! Something that would help would be if someone could put together a post containing suggestions for things that might be useful here. It can be referenced from the plan instead of included, with the plan simply saying "bring whatever we think will help" and a link.
 
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Wait, is that right? I thought you had to have the scroll with you. @faflec ?

I remembered wrong, sorry about that. Dunno how those lines got crossed. =/

It must be kept on your person in order to perform summoning (which is why Jiraiya brought the Toad scroll to the Battle of the Gods). Otherwise it can be left anywhere (such as a secure part of the Gōketsu compound).

Edit: Keiko personally carries her scroll with her by default. You have not established whether she brings it into locations such as the public baths in case the answer is an emphatic yes.
 
Scenario 1: we did not tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Why, in your post-mission report, did you not communicate that a portal to another world was open? That was clearly relevant. Either you're incompetent, you're lying, or you withheld information. If you're incompetent, we have problems. If it's there and you didn't tell me, we have serious problems. If it's not there, then the scale does not go high enough because I was already not feeling great about how much trust I'm putting in you and this is a concrete and obvious lie. I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents to investigate and imprisoning you in the meantime because if you sour the betting pool you might destabilze Leaf's economy...again."

Scenario 2: we did tell Asuma about the rift.

Asuma: "Hold on - that was part of the genjutsu. Wasn't it? Hazou, that was genjutsu, right? I'm dispatching a pair of ANBU agents. If they find a rift, that means that you did actually commit treason and that I need to decide what to do with you."

I'm hoping that someone catches this and fact-checks it. I'm also hoping Asuma is so deliriously happy that Isan decided to make vulnerable two intelligence assets that we have delivered to him that he doesn't care.

So as far as I can tell, we reported to Asuma in full and the genjutsu excuse is only to cover the apparent letter and premeditated state of the meeting.

Besides, Hazou would have been making Deceit checks at like 20 versus Asuma's socials. If it weren't for the fact that Hazou literally owned up to it at first. Asuma knows this is a lie just as much as we do, it's just important to pay lip-service to the legal fiction that allows us to walk free since that fiction has now become a part of Asuma's legitimacy as a Kage (as if we were indeed traitors and he didn't execute us, then he wouldn't be a good Kage).

@MadScientist How would you feel about a bullet point to prevent Foot-In-Mouth along the lines of "When briefing Asuma, make sure to acknowledge Itachi's genjutsu where relevant."?

As I understand it, it's scenario 3: The "genjutsu" was Itachi implanting false memories of Hazou's actions from weeks prior into his head, but the rift absolutely happened and everyone saw it, and had nothing to do with what was supposedly a genjutsu. And yes, it was reported.
 
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I was about to write up another question and felt a bit spammy so I'm just going to relegate my questions here:

@eaglejarl @Velorien

1: Can we vote in training plans or should we wait until next cycle?
2: Who, if anyone, has been practicing the Akimichi Chakra Enhancement Technique? Based on a prior conversation I had with faflec, I am under the impression the only one mentioned explicitly in-story as practicing it is Noburi. Are the QMs tracking anyone else attempting to take up this stunt?
3: Should a pair of Skywalkers be removed from everyone's inventories? I'm not sure how long they were used for, but I assumed we would've went through at least one pair.
1) Wait until next cycle.
2) Noburi has been the only one practising.
3) You may assume you have restocked.
 
Update:

[x] Action Plan: Piercing the Veil
  1. Sanity check with Mari/Keiko.
  2. Isan Team:
    1. Hazou reports to Asuma. What does he want us to do with the banished ninja? Suggestions:
    2. Track Aida Rin and Mochiaki, and arrange for an ANBU capture team. Provide assistance if sensible. Do not take undue risk.
    3. Alternative possibility: use a "disguised as non leaf" operative to turn them into deniable assets for leaf.
  3. Hazou and Kagome:
    1. Find as much information as you can about rifts and dimensionalism. Consult with sealmasters. Read Jiraiya's notes, the Leaf Private Library, and anything else Asuma is willing to let Hazou access.
    2. Purchase copies of any seals that might behave at all differently at the rift (diagnostic seals if they have them, but just in general anything that might behave differently).
    3. Once Mari is back to manage the clan in Hazou's absence, and if Asuma gives the green light:
      1. Hazou and Kagome go on a field trip to the site of the afterlife rift to examine it -- both for furthering their understanding of dimensional sealing in preperation for the Great Seal, and for evaluating the site's suitability for assisting in necromancy.
      2. If Kagome thinks that we would need better tools to get meaningful information from this expedition, and those tools are within the pair's ability to research, then do so. This research could take place at Leaf, if Kagome sees immediate need to do that research, but might also or otherwise take place at the rift site, if he thinks that preliminary examination of the rift site would better enable the creation of tools to examine it in more detail.
      3. Before leaving, use Iron Nerve to create a detailed diagram of the Great Seal to leave with the Leaf Sealmasters.
      4. Bring Noburi and Yuno, both as bodyguards, and in case Noburi's chakra sense is helpful at all in examining the site.
      5. Potentially also bring Sasuke and/or a hired Hyuuga, in case their cheating eyeballs might be helpful in examining the site.
      6. Potentially also bring one or more ANBU as bodyguards, if Asuma agrees. There *is* two sealmasters and a summoning scroll on the team.
 
Updated to get under 300 words with help from Paper:

[x] Action Plan: Piercing the Veil
  1. Sanity check with Mari/Keiko.
  2. Isan Team:
    1. Hazou reports to Asuma. What does he want us to do? Suggestions:
    2. Track Rin and Mochiaki and arrange for an ANBU capture team. Provide assistance if sensible, without taking undue risk.
    3. Alternatively: use a "disguised as non leaf" operative to turn them into deniable assets for leaf.
  3. Hazou and Kagome:
    1. Exhaustively research rifts and dimensionalism. Consult with sealmasters. Read Jiraiya's notes, the Leaf Private Library, and anything else Asuma is willing to let Hazou access.
    2. Purchase copies of any seals that might behave at all differently at the site (diagnostic seals if possible, but generally anything that might behave differently).
    3. Once Mari is back to manage the clan in Hazou's absence, and if Asuma gives the green light:
      1. Hazou and Kagome go on a field trip to the site of the afterlife rift to examine it -- both for furthering their understanding of dimensional sealing in preperation for the Great Seal, and for evaluating the site's suitability for assisting in necromancy.
      2. If we could make better tools to get meaningful information from the rift, research them.
        1. In Leaf if possible.
        2. If examining the site would help, research new tools there.
      3. Before leaving, use Iron Nerve to create a detailed diagram of the Great Seal to leave with the Leaf Sealmasters.
      4. Bring Noburi and Yuno, both as bodyguards, and in case Noburi's chakra sense is helpful at all in examining the site.
      5. Potentially also bring Sasuke and/or a hired Hyuuga, in case their cheating eyeballs might be helpful in examining the site.
      6. Potentially also bring one or more ANBU as bodyguards, if Asuma agrees. There is two sealmasters and a summoning scroll on the team.
 
Note that the single most comprehensive library in existence is probably inside the Nara compound and which Keiko, but not even Asuma, has the authority to unilaterally grant Hazou full access to. They educate their young on neigh-heretical esoteric facts about the origins of their nation's founding philosophy from records which predate it by centuries. They literally invented the world's first printing press. They kinda like books.

That said, while not exactly necessary, it's probably a good idea to loop Shikamaru in on what is going on, what is being done about it, and why Hazou needs access to what is quite possibly the single most valuable resource on the entire planet. Seriously, earlier comments from him to Keiko while the team were still visiting as missing-nin could be read to suggest that even the two other clans in the closest and longest alliance in all of existence aren't automatically entitled to access, but he is generally reasonable, and "imminent multiversal omnicide" is pretty solid as far as petitions go.

Oh, and while probably not as comprehensive, the Nara's equivalents in Mist and Sand might have some records that their clan lacks.

Oh, and don't the pangolins have some legend about a grand shared library which should be accessible again and even a holy priority now that the Condors have been dealt with?

Oh, and then there are the snakes and slugs...

-and, given the last chapter, it might be a good idea to have somebody dig through the Inuzuka records for anything relevant before deciding how to handle the outcast loremaster.
Hopefully when H/K are consulting all resources, the Nara library comes to mind. We already talked with Shikamaru about necromancy - tl;dr he said "you're insane but you've done insane things before, come back when you've made progress and have tractable things for me". It didn't sound like he had any obvious way to help, but maybe omnicide will motivate him a little?

I think Great Library is made up at this point, no one but the Pangolins can corroborate it.
 
Adhoc vote count started by eaglejarl on Jul 3, 2021 at 1:03 PM, finished with 208 posts and 20 votes.

Voting is closed.
 
So, what's next for everyone's training? I know we're banking Hazou's XP in case he needs a skill for the Great Seal. For Keiko and Akane, is the next step SC 40 or Resolve 40? And Noburi has a plethora of options to pick from... He definitely needs more Athletics and Alertness, but how much of each? And I'd like to invest some in his medic stuff so that doesn't stagnate
 
@eaglejarl @Velorien
Does Water Whip count as a Melee Weapon for the purposes of the Shoryuken stunt?
docs.google.com

PLAYERS - Known Stunts

Stunts that are Fluffed as Jutsu Combat Styles Explosion Master Gentle Fist Roki Youthful Fist of the Mythological Beast That is Really Strong and Tough System Translation Notes Combination Stunts Two-advantage Combinations Three-advantage Combinations Disguise Related Stunts Improvised Disguis...
 
As I understand it, it's scenario 3: The "genjutsu" was Itachi implanting false memories of Hazou's actions from weeks prior into his head, but the rift absolutely happened and everyone saw it, and had nothing to do with what was supposedly a genjutsu. And yes, it was reported.
I always interpreted Asuma's line to us as we were dragged out of the Killbox as "You Accidentally Committed Treason Again But The Consequences Were Minimal And You Got A Politically Significant Portion Of The Village Advocating For You So I'll Overlook It This Time And Play Along With Your Ridiculous Story"
 
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