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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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So... the only named woman around us that we're NOT getting flowers is Keiko? At this point it's almost like we're intentionally excluding her.
 
Dictator4Hire said:
Um.

Why exactly did y'all include even more complexity to the voting system just for flowers?
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So that the Action Plans could say "follow the flower plan" instead of having a different action plan for every kind of flower?

Radvic said:
Ok. So, we're getting Mari and Ino flowers, but not Akane (since we never explicitly chose flowers). Weird and likely to cause drama, but unlikely to result in mind scans. I am less concerned now.
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The second place plan was for flame-of-the-forest, so I assume that's what Hazou will go with unless stopped.

Kylinger said:
So... the only named woman around us that we're NOT getting flowers is Keiko? At this point it's almost like we're intentionally excluding her.
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Yeah, but we're getting Ino and Mari flowers as a lighthearted prank? I don't think Keiko would want to be included.
 
So wait, did we just get mindscanned because we messed up buying flowers?

We really need to get out of Leaf and pick a fight with one of the hidden villages or something. This peaceful stuff is going to get us killed.

EDIT: Did I ever mention how much I hate gift votes? Because I do.
 
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Radvic said:
Pretty much no matter how detailed we make an action plan, there will be things which aren't explicitly mentioned, which come up in the writing. I assume as a QM it is difficult to extrapolate from huge beasts of action plans which are incredibly detailed in some sections what players intend in other sections with little said. This idea was the original reason I started including "goals" in action plans. It is also a large part of why I am currently trying to trim down action plans: making it more clear in situations like these what our intensions would be by reducing the amount we write on random things.

That said, you make a correct observation. I just think a better solution for both players and QMs is to make smaller, more compact, understandable, and goal oriented action plans, not massive detailed behemoths. But I might be wrong, and it's not like the action plan I wrote for this update was particularly short.
*shrug*
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How about a more formalized way of organizing action plans from now one? Like so:

Action Plan Snippet
  1. What we (the hivemind) want the team to do (e.g. Hazou gives flowers to Akane)
    1. How we are having Hazou implement it (e.g. use the flowers we have in our inventory when we get to her hospital room)
      1. Why we are doing it this particular way. (e.g. the hivemind/Hazou wants to cheer her up)
Now to make this work the last line of specifications, the "why" section, will be Hazou's justification for doing a certain action. In the event that such an action gets vetoed by the team (or something somewhere goes awry) Hazou can still express his motivations for what he wanted to do, why he wanted to do it in that specific way, and why he wanted to do it in the first place.

Having some structure and standardization should make everyone's lives easier. After the next update I'll see if I can make an actual plan to show what I have in mind in practice, but no promises.
 
Allow me to summarise.

You are getting Akane Butea Monosperma in order to express how you feel about her (but the plans don't specify what that is, and the flower has no meaning in flower language).

You are getting Ino flowers based on Mari's recommendation in order to mess with her.

You are getting Mari flowers based on Ino's recommendation in order to mess with her.

Have I understood this correctly?

FYI, tomorrow's update may get delayed, and if it does, I'm blaming the flowers.
 
Velorien said:
You are getting Akane Butea Monosperma in order to express how you feel about her (but the plans don't specify what that is, and the flower has no meaning in flower language).
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The following seem to capture the thread's view on what we're trying to express to Akane, as well as what we're telling Ino and Mari to optimize their suggestions for.

As for the Butea Monosperma not having a meaning, I just figured we'd tell Akane what we're trying to express with the flowers rather than trying to encode it in flower language.

Langevin said:
Also, I agree with whoever suggested flame of the forest--they're really nice. More precise flower-language would be cute too, though. (Wiki says the main association with them is desire ('cuz flames), but they're also related to springtime (of youuth), and trapped fire, which both feel fairly appropriate. And who says desire has to be romantic?)

[X] Flower plan: Flame-of-the-forest
[X] Flower plan: ask Ino for advice
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gbear605 said:
- Try to lead them to flowers that indicate caring, but definitely not sexual desire.
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Jello_Raptor said:
Attempt to guide her towards things that are youthful, powerful, related to fire, and indicate caring, but not sexual desire.
  • Don't use things that rule out future sexual desire. We're just kids, there's time for that stuff later if we're both into it.
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Edit: Also it's probably worth calling the flowers "flame of the forest" in the update, rather than the scientific name. It makes the symbolism we want to evoke much more obvious, and it's not like I expect the MfD verse to have something analogous to taxonomic studies.
 
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Dictator4Hire said:
How about a more formalized way of organizing action plans from now one? Like so:

Action Plan Snippet
  1. What we (the hivemind) want the team to do (e.g. Hazou gives flowers to Akane)
    1. How we are having Hazou implement it (e.g. use the flowers we have in our inventory when we get to her hospital room)
      1. Why we are doing it this particular way. (e.g. the hivemind/Hazou wants to cheer her up)
Now to make this work the last line of specifications, the "why" section, will be Hazou's justification for doing a certain action. In the event that such an action gets vetoed by the team (or something somewhere goes awry) Hazou can still express his motivations for what he wanted to do, why he wanted to do it in that specific way, and why he wanted to do it in the first place.

Having some structure and standardization should make everyone's lives easier. After the next update I'll see if I can make an actual plan to show what I have in mind in practice, but no promises.
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Seems like a decent idea. If I write an action plan next update (unknown atm), I'll attempt to use this structure.

Velorien said:
Have I understood this correctly?
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I think? I'd second @Jello_Raptor's summary of the reasoning behind the Flame-of-the-forest flowers, but I fully understand and support you if you write it some other way. Because we weren't exactly clear in that vote and strange things happened.
 
Kylinger said:
So... the only named woman around us that we're NOT getting flowers is Keiko? At this point it's almost like we're intentionally excluding her.
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Do you think either Nobby or Keiko would appreciate that?

We should probably get Kagome flowers at some point though.

Mashed up colored petals of various sorts would probably be better than strawberry jam for any multiple storage seal experiments, since the jam only comes in one color. Flower petal paste has the same safety properties but its many colors can allow us to differentiate between multiple storage buffers.
 
Velorien said:
Allow me to summarise.
You are getting Akane Butea Monosperma in order to express how you feel about her (but the plans don't specify what that is, and the flower has no meaning in flower language).

You are getting Ino flowers based on Mari's recommendation in order to mess with her.

You are getting Mari flowers based on Ino's recommendation in order to mess with her.

Have I understood this correctly?

FYI, tomorrow's update may get delayed, and if it does, I'm blaming the flowers.
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Re: Akane, I did write this thing, which at least one person (Radvic?) agreed with-
Langevin said:
If we give her flame-of-the-forest: mini-speech about how flames can be strong and beautiful even when confined, how spring always follows winter, etc. (Basically, 'We're all so lucky to have felt the warmth of your inner flame, and we'll feel that way no matter what. Don't let the hospital blues get you down. We'll figure out what you can do while you're stuck here, and when you get out you'll be better than ever.')
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re: Ino and Mari, yeah. Keep in mind that Jello_Raptor's plan involved "beating them at their own game", i.e. teasing and messing with people about *very clearly jokey* relationship stuff ("ooh, tying her up? kinky~") , while not playing on actual fault lines/stress (Mari didn't bring up Noburi/Keiko stuff in response to Hazou/Keiko jokes).

And, not to be too paranoid, but I want to emphasize that both this and (I believe) the last overall action plan prioritized all of "survive", "maintain team stability", "stay on minders' good side", and "don't cause incidents" above the "building rapport" stuff that this falls under.
 
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Velorien said:
You are getting Ino flowers based on Mari's recommendation in order to mess with her.

You are getting Mari flowers based on Ino's recommendation in order to mess with her.

Have I understood this correctly?

FYI, tomorrow's update may get delayed, and if it does, I'm blaming the flowers.
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Just to be clear, this is pretty much exactly how I intended it. Albeit with the addendum that "mess with" is meant in the same sense as for a harmless prank. A tiny joke at their expense rather than ours, for once.
 
Traiden said:
Petty revenge is still a revenge.
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It is worth noting that we are taking revenge by getting them flowers. At its worst they still end up with pretty flowers and story to laugh about.

Edit: A non-trivial part of this is because playing along changes the context of the harem jokes. Instead of it reading like they're laughing at a completely passive boy with a foot in his mouth, they'll be laughing with someone who gets the joke, plays along, and tries to respond in kind. We become complicit in the humour, rather than just the object of it.

Edit 2: Like, I don't have any actual issue with the harem jokes. They just seem unidirectional and lacking the reciprocation that signals that it's counter-signaling rather than just normal signaling.

Edit 3: Good lord that last sentence was weird to read.
 
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Jello_Raptor said:
It is worth noting that we are taking revenge by getting them flowers. At its worst they still end up with pretty flowers and story to laugh about.

Edit: A non-trivial part of this is because playing along changes the context of the harem jokes. Instead of it reading like they're laughing at a completely passive boy with a foot in his mouth, they'll be laughing with someone who gets the joke, plays along, and tries to respond in kind. We become complicit in the humour, rather than just the object of it.

Edit 2: Like, I don't have any actual issue with the harem jokes. They just seem unidirectional and lacking the reciprocation that signals that it's counter-signaling rather than just normal signaling.

Edit 3: Good lord that last sentence was weird to read.
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Don't worry. Once we get them acclimatized to the idea of a harem, proposing we make one won't seem as outlandish. Slowly but surely Hazou will "recruit" as many suitable spouses as we can manage.
 
Unless you're Naruto, harems are not stable until you have a stable base. We shouldn't really start on a harem until we a) make Hidden Heaven, or b) learn the Tajuu Kage Bunshin no Jutsu and the Harem no Jutsu.
 
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