- Location
- UK
- Pronouns
- He/Him
How confident are you that you are on an island right now?
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
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- naruto rational rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard open voting
I don't look at this thread much for stress reasons, so I don't know if this has been discussed, or shown up in chapters, but an idea happened, so here:
Displacement Distributor Rune (DDR)
A rune that connects to a peripheral rune, and "transmits" that peripheral rune's effect, so that paired paper seals within the DDR's radius can be treated as if they were the peripheral rune for the purposes of effect activation, effect centre of origin, and effect directionality. If a rune is not multi-use, it burns out after use, as normal.
(For example, hook a DDR up to an Explosive Rune, and pair a paper seal to receive its signal. You can then walk to the edge of the DDR's radius, activate the paper seal, RUN LIKE HELL, and the paper seal will explode with the force of the Explosive Rune.)
Displacement Distributor Rune (DDR)
A rune that connects to a peripheral rune, and "transmits" that peripheral rune's effect, so that paired paper seals within the DDR's radius can be treated as if they were the peripheral rune for the purposes of effect activation, effect centre of origin, and effect directionality. If a rune is not multi-use, it burns out after use, as normal.
(For example, hook a DDR up to an Explosive Rune, and pair a paper seal to receive its signal. You can then walk to the edge of the DDR's radius, activate the paper seal, RUN LIKE HELL, and the paper seal will explode with the force of the Explosive Rune.)
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- Location
- Washington, USA
For those naturally skeptical of the "greatest living sealmaster" bit, and insufficiently motivated by pre-existing bounties, how about adding a bit of advance payment? Maybe, say, a conveniently storage-seal-sized 100kg gold ingot to each and every jonin, regardless of nationality, willing and able to have a summon clan boss (any conclave member is fine) witness them swearing this oath: to end the threat Akatsuki's lawless behavior poses to AMITY, or die trying.
Once the gold's been deposited in escrow, Akatsuki can't really shut that down without the entire seventh path trade network becoming collateral damage, which Kisame at least seems unlikely to be willing to accept. How many jonin are there in the world? How many of them have coped with worse jobs, for less money, and no effective backup?
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- Location
- UK
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Noburi thinks that Itachi is not currently at the Gōketsu compound. He could be elsewhere in Leaf on other business, or he could have gone home. Noburi's impression is that this was supposed to be a flying visit (literally), but he notes that Itachi might have changed his plans when circumstances turned out to be more complicated than he thought, in which case his response is unpredictable.
A compliant Hazō who is where Itachi thinks he is could be back in two weeks or less.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
We haven't tried talking to the island yet, so I can't say for sure.
We also haven't tried leaving the confines of the map, so I can't say for sure.
It's quite possible that its turtles all the way down.
Why do you care if Akatsuki has unrepentant mass murderers? Does that lead you to believe they are lying about trying to do uplift, that they will fumble and mess up their attempts to do uplift, or that they will do uplift but also commit mass murder on the side and you are deontologically opposed to that? Do you think Leaf ninja are not unrepentant mass murderers? Is the unrepentant part very important to you, which is why Team Uplift is much better? Do you think such internal Akatsuki policies will be relevant before Pain is revived, who could outfight the rest of Akatsuki? Or that Pain will submit to the majority vote of Akatsuki? If Pain revives and adds another vote to the not unrepentant mass murderer faction, is that not significant to you?
edit:
the below is a separate topic and not a response directed specificly to you.
we've been thinking just how to defeat akatsuki, but we might need to fight the other nations too if akatsuki calls leaf an AMITY violator after our initial attacks. especially if they promise lotsa goodies to villages that help out. if they get very desperate they could reveal the rift details and promise resurrections. if they do that even if we defeat akatsuki afterwards the other villages will conflict with us for control for the rift, in addition to the mundane battles that would happen in the aftermath of AMITY.
also. even if itachi finds out leaf was trying to oppose akatsuki we can throw ourselves on his mercy. since leaf hasn't actually attacked akatsuki yet, decent chance he won't nuke leaf and kill hazou. maybe he requires hazou's services on the rift as part of leaf's payment. sasuke is in leaf after all, and leaf is still his hometown. other parts of leaf's payment being imposing heavy cost on leaf as dissuasion, perhaps forcing naruto to step down as kage, but without loss of life. especially if we say to itachi this was a foolish decision solely by naruto and hazou, not the rest of leaf's advisors.
edit2: we can emphasize how flip floppy naruto was. emphasizing his naivety and youth
edit3: what if we ask itachi to kill us next to the rift as punishment! so we can work with them to open it on the other side. and if we open it than pain/akatsuki has debt for us helping.
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- Location
- Italy
If we want to try to stall/win diplomatically the last thing we should do is talk to Itachi. We don't have the Deceit nor the mindset to win. Invite him to a talk with Cannai, send a letter, let Mari talk to him. Even Tsunade is better than Hazou talking to Itachi, it would end in Itachi saying "tell me Leaf military position regarding the Rift" and not taking no for an answer.
We could survive it, but the odds are not in our favor.
We could survive it, but the odds are not in our favor.
Pinging also @Paperclipped @Velorien
Does Hazou think this the extent of the crossover bonus between Biosealing and Sealing? Primordial Sealing benefits from a crossover bonus to the base level and I am wondering if Biosealing benefits from the same.
I am unsure if Biosealing is more/less related to Sealing than PS is, but given that PS is said to be very different, I would expect that Biosealing is more similar to Sealing than PS is.
If we think it in terms of XP, say for our example Hazou has Sealing 60. PS benefits from a +1/3 bonus so you pay double cost up to 40 and then stop. For a total of 1640 XP invested.
Biosealing you pay for levels 1 to 60, single cost. So a total of 1830 XP. Notice how that's more XP investment for the same effect. So IMO it makes sense to say Biosealing is less related to Sealing than PS is if it lacks a crossover bonus.
If it does have a crossover bonus, I would say that Biosealing is straightforwardly more similar to Sealing than PS is to Sealing.
For the sake of my own curiosity, if it gets a crossover bonus such that you also buy it to 40 then stop, it would be 820 XP.
Why do we think Mari is low Essie? She was a Jounin that Yagura was ok with disposing of a few years ago. Since coming to Leaf she "retired" and hasn't had any sort of unstagnating combat encounter in years. FOOM helps of course, but she's almost certainly not in the Jiraiya camp of "s-rank on raw stats alone" and she doesn't have any S-rank "cheat code"-level trick either (e.g. Hidan's immortality, Konan's chakra-construct body, etc).
I have seen this opinion elsewhere in the thread though so it's possible there's something I'm missing (e.g. there's a WOG somewhere that S-rank = base combat stat at XX, and we think Mari is close to that because of YY).
Because Essie is described as jonin, but with hax so good they break the normal mechanics, and you're mistaken that Mari has none. Mari has genjutsu hax that break normal genjutsu rules, and had that at the start of the quest. I don't know where the Yagura bit comes from- Mari betrayed him willingly, and his objection to her was a matter of Mari's personality/loyalty to him, not her capabilities. She was also pretty good at Taijutsu and has had years to FOOM. Combat stagnancy is probably true but she should have at least one other domain regarding her main activities as a social spec, and she faced plenty of difficulties there so she should only be half stagnant. Additionally, she has Strength of the Storm now and that's a very nice boost to her combat stats, explicitly a S-rank jutsu. She should at least be on the same tier as Kakashi, Gai, and Zabuza.
Essie fights have been described to us in-universe as being about making your strengths overcome their weaknesses, so a fight of hax abilities rather than a new tier of bignumber. Mari's abilities give her a favorable matchup against Hidan (genjutsu weakness, melee-oriented fighter) and roughly even odds against Deidara (mobility advantage, dangerous offense, notable genjutsu resistance, weak to Lightning, less experienced overall than Mari, vulnerable to being punched on skywalkers).
tl;dr: She's an Essie because she has really good tricks on top of having been an elite jonin for a long while, and can reasonably fight other Essies and live.
EDIT: For the original context of what number I expect her genjutsu to put out, she was an ejonin genjutsu mistress at quest start and has spent years FOOMing since. I expect her genjutsu to be high 60s to mid 70s baseline, giving an AB of 7 or 8. At worst, 3-4 invokes (plus whatever buffs she has, to need fewer invokes) should be sufficient to hit triple digits, and given the low standards for Resolve I expect this to be enough for her to hit the vast majority of targets with significant whammies.
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Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I'd bet on Mari in Mari vs Hidan, especially if she was rocking our buffstack.
Hidan is actually the one Akatsuki member that we would be able to take as a Clan IMO assuming we prepped some counters to some bullshit and he couldn't just run the fuck away. Everyone else either bogs us down in AOE or starts one shotting us while doing backflips over explosions.
Hidan is actually the one Akatsuki member that we would be able to take as a Clan IMO assuming we prepped some counters to some bullshit and he couldn't just run the fuck away. Everyone else either bogs us down in AOE or starts one shotting us while doing backflips over explosions.
Her assesment of this as of Chapter 609 (it's before the jutsu from Oro, but still semi-recent), seems relevant:
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Take it with a grain of salt, since we are never getting a clear-cut assessment out of these characters when it comes to "Who could beat who in a fight" unless its hilariously overdetermined. Even Jiraiya, probably the most capable combatant in the setting, wasn't so quick to give straight answers out on this front.
Regardless of the battlefield, it's pretty much always some flavour of vague waffling. Sort of has to be that way regardless of the answer for meta-reasons (narrative or gameplay) too.
These do tend to highlight a list of things we might be able to actionably deal with from time to time though, so they're still quite useful from that end.
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I think putting our hopes on Mari winning a 1v1 is misplaced. We should just not fight Akatsuki in a scenario where we know they'll have more than 1 round to respond. Mari might be low Essie, or high jonin, or whatever other sub-rank. In actual combat that doesn't matter. Kurenai stalled Itachi for a few rounds, a chuunin seal took out Kakuzu in a moment of distraction. Naruto gets to do his Essie fighting philosophy because he's in a position of power. We... really aren't. Just nuke Akatsuki from orbit while we're sipping hot chocolate on the other side of the world.
I guess Cannai would be the most trustworthy person to deal with for Itachi. It's an uphill fight for Cannai to vouch for Hazou's word since he's already known as an oathbreaker to a lot of the 7th path and known to be a reckless/crazy treason bunny on the human path. Whatever agreement Itachi and Cannai figure out will probably involve compelling Hazou in some way or keeping him preoccupied. Furthermore, Cannai would take the angle of protecting his dumb summoner from getting himself and his clan killed.
- Location
- Can’t say. I know my momentum.
Well said. This is pretty much why I think we should stay far away from Itachi.
Hmm. This could be useful as a supplement/replacement for the letter idea. I think we'd want Cannai at minimum around for this.
And at this point I began to sweat nervously and fear for our lives.
And now my fears are assuaged. The QMs are merciful gods today.
Yup. We need to behave with Itachi as if we were planning on going to Leaf. From that perspective, these discussions about how to handle Itachi have been quite useful.
Wouldn't he have some kind of code for us if this were the case? I'd expect him to have a code for each contingency he made.
The point of the letters is to make sure he thinks we're coming back so that doesn't hurt the family before we can exfiltrate them.
Now that I think of it, doesn't Akatsuki also have skywalkers? Also, Itachi has to sleep at some point, so unless his partner is sitting right next to the compound (remember, none of the other Akatsuki have SC), we'll be able to get a bit of a head start.
They probably don't outrange the byakugan.
The partner won't have SC, and so would have to physically be in Leaf, which makes it slow to contact Itachi. So we'd have to outrun one non-Itachi Akatsuki while he's asleep.
Can we have the Sages check him for aftereffects of genjutsu? (I agree that an active genjutsu probably wouldn't carry to the seventh path, given what happens to chakra water.)
Eh, our Deceit being what it is, we should assume he'll recognize that Hazō's up to something and genjutsu him.
Yuno carries him.
I'd say we're not the center but we're close: we are clearly interested in the rift, which is the key to Pain, who is the center of his world.
In the meantime, the rest of the family is in danger, protected only by the fact that we're incommunicado and can't respond to threats. Also, Itachi can bring a bunch of crows to search for us.
Actually, regarding being incommunicado to be immune from threats, wouldn't expecting a threat be the same as Akatsuki actually threatening us? (I'm not sure I'm being clear, but that's my first try at explaining.)
0% confidence. Itachi put us in Tsukuyomi last time he saw us. We're doomed.
It's just that the last time they had enough power and tried to fix the world their approach was to attempt some kind of ritual that would fundamentally alter humanity without its consent.
Edit:
Sorry for the long post. I just caught up and had time to reply. Is it better in general to split long reply posts like these?
- Location
- United States
@eaglejarl @Velorien @Paperclipped
Assuming Hazō had a piece of substrate in his hand, how fast could he deliberately cause a runic failure?
Assuming Hazō had a piece of substrate in his hand, how fast could he deliberately cause a runic failure?
Yeah posts of that type replying to many disparate individual points should be avoided. It's known as spaghetti posting and can possibly attract mod attention under Rule 4 when done excessively.
- Location
- Book Fort
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Thank you. You're awesome, mega hugs. Sending all the vibes.
- Location
- Book Fort
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Itachi: "So what have you been working on, if not dimensionalism?"
Hazou: "Well, you've got the FCs, the ADRs, the RRBs, the TRs, the SPs, some CATEARS, and I've dabbled in FBotEM for Uplift... I've also decided that I should probably squeeze in FDRs, STARS, AoO, and the BFs somewhere into my schedule."
Itachi: "...I took four mental stress just hearing the names."
Hazou: "Well, you've got the FCs, the ADRs, the RRBs, the TRs, the SPs, some CATEARS, and I've dabbled in FBotEM for Uplift... I've also decided that I should probably squeeze in FDRs, STARS, AoO, and the BFs somewhere into my schedule."
Itachi: "...I took four mental stress just hearing the names."
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- Location
- UK
- Pronouns
- He/Him
HAZŌ: Actually, one of those was fake.
ITACHI: Tell me it was the CATEARS. Please tell me it was the CATEARS.
[Itachi falls to his knees as Hazō slowly shakes his head]
- Location
- UK
- Pronouns
- He/Him
How fast could he do it? Theoretically, at the same speed as a regular infusion. In practice, it would take at least fifty years, since wandering wits is only observed in the rare ninja who has reached an advanced age.
[ ] Plan Fragment: Bug Out (Redux)
Word Count: ???
Figured I'd toss this out early. Some form of it is likely to make it into my plan today.
Let me know if you think I'm missing anything!
Word Count: ???
- Sanity Check with Kagome and Kei
- Discuss Naruto's orders with Kagome and Kei -- we're going missing for real.
- We need to exfiltrate the rest of Uplift from Leaf
- Hazou's research speed is significantly slowed without access to Noburi.
- Naruto is incapable of standing up to Itachi, it's time to get Mari, Noburi, and Yuno out before Itachi starts torturing them.
- Hazou's best current plan is to send a letter to Naruto/Itachi telling them we're on our way back.
- At the same time however, secretly pass Mari encoded written orders to take Noburi and Yuno and GTFO of Leaf.
- This might be best accomplished by skywalking directly away from the Estate at night
- However, if Mari fears Itachi is constantly placing the Goketsu Estate under effective observation, it might be better to disguise themselves as civvies and escape that way.
- Or take a chakra beast extermination missions and slip away then.
- Mari is in command and has discretion based on the situation on the ground.
- Only once they're out of Leaf, and confident they weren't followed, they are to send Noburi to Toad for further instructions
- This might be best accomplished by skywalking directly away from the Estate at night
- Write our letters with Kei's assistance and send then via the next drop on the Seventh Path.
- Discuss the precautions (oaths, restricted locations, Boss permissions) we're going to need to take on the Seventh Path to remove that as an avenue of communication from Leaf.
- Begin setting them in motion as soon as the letter to Mari is sent.
- Kei, will Pantsaa make this easy for you?
Figured I'd toss this out early. Some form of it is likely to make it into my plan today.
Let me know if you think I'm missing anything!