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Dragon Ball: After the End

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PoptartProdigy said:
Every saiyan on Garenhuld: ...WHY DIDN'T WE THINK OF THAT?!
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Because you need a machine that can equal the sum total output of an entire moon, something that in GT a genius like Bulma could only make as small as a large vehicle with a large ray gun bolted onto it.

PoptartProdigy said:
As for more esoteric solutions, it's possible that magic could do it, but you're not sure how.
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What about hypnosis? When asked about why Goku wasn't turning into a Great Ape despite Man-Wolf turning into a man at the sight of Krillin's bald head, Roshi explained that it's because he didn't hypnotise Goku like he did Man-Wolf.

Lailoken said:
Kamehameha tends to be a long, slow, and a concentrated yet ki-limited attack.
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It can be quick, like when Goku used it against Beerus.
 
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Cytokinesis said:
This is the last post I'm going to make on the issue unless it blows up on us, because I had no chance to comment all day.


Well, here's to hoping we get some good dice rolls this year.

I sure hope all you people who voted for slacking don't have to experience what it's like to play XCOM as a consequence, because anyone who has should know that taking a "small chance" even once can lead to disastrous results.

Also learning that "Slacking" means not doing homework just makes my pound my head into the desk even more. Practicing, i.e. homework, is one of the main methods people learn things. Most people learn jack from sitting in on lectures. It requires a persistent framework of active learning to cement things into memory, and the very capability to do so effectively has to be learned.

If we roll well, maybe we won't suffer immediate consequences but I absolutely expect this to bite us in the ass in terms of actions later on. Barring maybe a 100, which could represent not ever having anything come up that would interrupt us in studying. But betting on getting a 100 is a terrible effing bet, and can only ever look like a good idea (to people who don't get statistics) retroactively if it succeeds.

And all that is assuming we're fine and dandy in regards to everything else that could go wrong because of it, and that's nowhere near certain.
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If we maintain our grades, then we are clearly still learning enough in class to understand the material, because those are from exams. That's why grades exist, as an indicator of how well you understand the material. If we pass the fairly easy roll, then no, there are no negative consequences.

But seriously, the scouts arrive this year - we have more important things to worry about now.
 
Cytokinesis said:
This is the last post I'm going to make on the issue unless it blows up on us, because I had no chance to comment all day.


Well, here's to hoping we get some good dice rolls this year.

I sure hope all you people who voted for slacking don't have to experience what it's like to play XCOM as a consequence, because anyone who has should know that taking a "small chance" even once can lead to disastrous results.

Also learning that "Slacking" means not doing homework just makes my pound my head into the desk even more. Practicing, i.e. homework, is one of the main methods people learn things. Most people learn jack from sitting in on lectures. It requires a persistent framework of active learning to cement things into memory, and the very capability to do so effectively has to be learned.

If we roll well, maybe we won't suffer immediate consequences but I absolutely expect this to bite us in the ass in terms of actions later on. Barring maybe a 100, which could represent not ever having anything come up that would interrupt us in studying. But betting on getting a 100 is a terrible effing bet, and can only ever look like a good idea (to people who don't get statistics) retroactively if it succeeds.

And all that is assuming we're fine and dandy in regards to everything else that could go wrong because of it, and that's nowhere near certain.
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Considering the alien invasion this year, they'll probably be understanding, and elementary homework is pointless busywork handed out to placate parents.
 
Meh

My next year plan will have 3 points in school and two points training Goku Style with daddy dearest
 
Deathbybunnies said:
If we maintain our grades, then we are clearly still learning enough in class to understand the material, because those are from exams. That's why grades exist, as an indicator of how well you understand the material. If we pass the fairly easy roll, then no, there are no negative consequences.

But seriously, the scouts arrive this year - we have more important things to worry about now.
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We passed the roll last time, yet it was very clear in the narrative that people noticed. Poptart explicitly said we could be facing consequences, especially in terms of making it harder to study or get good grades in the future. I don't recall him saying that passing the roll would eliminate these consequences, just the immediate one of actually dropping grades.

And really, as a person whose job actually involves teaching and the pedagogy of teaching, grades mean very little. They are an indicator, sure, but they're only a partial one and there are a lot of other aspects to learning that they don't account for.

And your argument would be a lot more potent if your plan was actually optimized to doing the things you said, rather than having several extraneous actions that could have been sacrificed to reduce (natural 1s will be bad either way, probably) or possibly even eliminate the risk altogether.
Lailoken said:
Considering the alien invasion this year, they'll probably be understanding, and elementary homework is pointless busywork handed out to placate parents.
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Oh, a tabloid which can be super selective in which studies it is relying on and incredibly reductive to the actual research, whatever shall I do.

Would you like me to start quoting academic papers that actually deal with this subject?

Your source is also only superficially correct, and I instantly spotted why ( as a person who actually reads academic literature as part of their job)
By the time kids reach high school, homework provides academic benefit, but only in moderation. More than two hours per night is the limit.
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The entire article ignores this line in favor of saying homework at elementary school level doesn't matter, neglecting the actual act of learning how to learn in the first place.

As people get older, they can handle more information and more time spent learning. Your brain, your body, it optimizes to what you do with it.

Part of this is just a maturing brain, but part of it is getting accustomed to learning in a certain manner in the first place. Learning how to learn at math doesn't necessarily teach you proper methods to learn literature, except in roundabout ways or in terms of developing persistence.
 
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Andres110 said:
What about hypnosis? When asked about why Goku wasn't turning into a Great Ape despite Man-Wolf turning into a man at the sight of Krillin's bald head, Roshi explained that it's because he didn't hypnotise Goku like he did Man-Wolf.
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I remembered that, yeah. It's one possibility, but I'll have to think about implementing it. Dragon Ball did a lot of silliness that was dropped in later parts of the franchise.
 
Sucal said:
Meh

My next year plan will have 3 points in school and two points training Goku Style with daddy dearest
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Surely you mean marvel mummy? She has Elite teaching and while not as good as dad in Goku style, she is at least competent and would give faster progress at the lower levels.
 
Aranfan said:
But Goku Style makes certain things permanently harder to train. Tenshinhan Style doesn't.
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If that's the reasoning, we should do Jaffur Style instead. It doesn't have any weaknesses bar perhaps having high skill requirements. It also doesn't require us to reduce our lifespan in order to use the most powerful attacks, something that I have a big issue with.
 
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Aranfan said:
I would.
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Here's a few. This is not my area of expertise (I'm focused more on college education), but these are some of the first few results and all offer good explanations for this effect. Note: these aren't the actual title, just some useful (and reductionist, but if you want to get the full story read the paper) conclusions.

Homework as Time Management training in elementary school

The problem is not homework, it's bad homework

Homework is good overall, though admittedly a small correlation after controlling for other factors (which also determine who actually does the homework too so it's a bit of a wash). More so in America than in "Excessive amounts of studying anyway" Asia.

Parents helping makes student's grades worse.
 
Cytokinesis said:
We passed the roll last time, yet it was very clear in the narrative that people noticed. Poptart explicitly said we could be facing consequences, especially in terms of making it harder to study or get good grades in the future. I don't recall him saying that passing the roll would eliminate these consequences, just the immediate one of actually dropping grades.

And really, as a person whose job actually involves teaching and the pedagogy of teaching, grades mean very little. They are an indicator, sure, but they're only a partial one and there are a lot of other aspects to learning that they don't account for.

And your argument would be a lot more potent if your plan was actually optimized to doing the things you said, rather than having several extraneous actions that could have been sacrificed to reduce (natural 1s will be bad either way, probably) or possibly even eliminate the risk altogether.

Oh, a tabloid which can be super selective in which studies it is relying on and incredibly reductive to the actual research, whatever shall I do.

Would you like me to start quoting academic papers that actually deal with this subject?

Your source is also only superficially correct, and I instantly spotted why ( as a person who actually reads academic literature as part of their job)

The entire article ignores this line in favor of saying homework at elementary school level doesn't matter, neglecting the actual act of learning how to learn in the first place.

As people get older, they can handle more information and more time spent learning. Your brain, your body, it optimizes to what you do with it.

Part of this is just a maturing brain, but part of it is getting accustomed to learning in a certain manner in the first place. Learning how to learn at math doesn't necessarily teach you proper methods to learn literature, except in roundabout ways or in terms of developing persistence.
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An article which quotes the chairman of the department of psychology and neuroscience at Duke University, editor-in-chief of the APA's Handbook of Research Methods in Psychology, author of "Reporting Research in Psychology: How to Meet the New Standards for Journal Articles", winner of the 2007 Outstanding Review of Research Award from the American Educational Research Association, winner of the American Educational Research Association's Award for Interpretive Scholarship for his article "Speaking Power to Truth: Reflections of an Educational Researcher after Four Years of School Board Service", former member of National Academy of Sciences' Committee on the Use of Social Science Knowledge in Public Policy, and former editor of the top-five multidisciplinary psychology journal "Psychological Bulletin" as-

"There is no evidence that any amount of homework improves the academic performance of elementary students."​

-because I was on mobile and grabbing the first search result was sufficient.

My academic bona fides are well established on this forum and I'm not going to waste hours throwing citations at each other just to prove I can. The fact is that this game doesn't have a "how to learn" skill to level up and the character has done just fine independently self-directing towards researching things as varied as a comprehensive review of every combat style ever known and memorizing obscenely complicated peerage histories and networks. The -minor- concern is how much of the actual information she picks up, and for those purposes elementary homework is useless.
 
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Andres110 said:
Because you need a machine that can equal the sum total output of an entire moon, something that in GT a genius like Bulma could only make as small as a large vehicle with a large ray gun bolted onto it.
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Actually, you don't. You just need a machine that can equal the amount the Saiyans absorb through their eyes.

Also, who wants to bet this becomes noticeable/breaks the Masquerade on Garenhuld? I'm putting 5 on noticeable!
 
@PoptartProdigy

Just an idea, but once a turn can you write up an interlude that doesn't have anything to do with the updates? It can be used to give screentime to people who are important parts of Kakara's life but rarely if ever show up in the updates, like our mother.

Another option is to use the interludes to give us an opportunity to develop Kakara via scenarios that happen outside of the year updates. Example: A bully hits Maya for teh lulz. After helping Maya and making sure she's ok, we then have to choose whether we want to take a calm, measured response, a heated response with lots of yelling, or the appropriate response.

Is turning Super Saiyan 2 safe if we do it in a pure Saiyan masque? Our power level would be cut to 60%, so our power level as a Super Saiyan 2 would be 1.35 billion which is less than our Golden Ape.

What does Berra think about Dandeer's excommunication and our involvement in it?

As an additional baseline for "weird stuff ki can do that REALLY doesn't have to be magic-exclusive" beyond Multiform and Four Witches, look at the Power Ball. It does actual science stuff using ki.
 
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Aranfan said:
In all honesty, I hope we roll nothing but 100s, and that your plan works out fine.

I just have anxiety and shit. My meds start to wear off at night.
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Ah, yes, there have been time that I have been tempted to install a carotid shunt.

For what it's worth, if I had realized that there was a chance of the scouts arriving this year I would have probably demanded putting the entire seal program on hold in favor of preparation, including style training.



Andres110 said:
@PoptartProdigy

Just an idea, but once a turn can you write up an interlude that doesn't have anything to do with the updates? It can be used to give screentime to people who are important parts of Kakara's life but rarely if ever show up in the updates, like our mother.

Another option is to use the interludes to give us an opportunity to develop Kakara via scenarios that happen outside of the year updates. Example: A bully hits Maya for teh lulz. After helping Maya and making sure she's ok, we then have to choose whether we want to take a calm, measured response, a heated response with lots of yelling, or the appropriate response.

Is turning Super Saiyan 2 safe if we do it in a pure Saiyan masque? Our power level would be cut to 60%, so our power level as a Super Saiyan 2 would be 1.35 billion which is less than our Golden Ape.

What does Berra think about Dandeer's excommunication and our involvement in it?

As an additional baseline for "weird stuff ki can do that REALLY doesn't have to be magic-exclusive" beyond Multiform and Four Witches, look at the Power Ball. It does actual science stuff using ki.
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I'm actually more interested in doing outright magic with ki. We know that ki can supercharge spells, and Jaffur is a Super-Saiyan warlock. There's a good chance that at full power he'd be able to finally construct wards which could at least briefly contain an SSJ2 transformation. At that point we could safely allow the entire population to ascend to Super-Saiyan while still maintaining a monopoly on force.
 
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