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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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MrCogmor said:
I am not sure how this is better than the current system. It seems like it is more effective at keeping ninja out of the civilian market than the MC and involves more paperwork.
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It keeps ninja out of some markets, woodcutting for example, and makes it far easier for them to enter others. If a good is easily aquired by civilians (like wood) then ninja will be driven out. If a good is difficult for civilans to aquire (like ice) then the cheap civilian goods will be all bought up quickly, followed by anyone who couldn't buy the civilian goods before they were sold out - and still want some - buying ninja goods. In the MC system when the civilian ice runs out those who arrived late go without.

And it wouldn't need more paperwork. Ninjas would pay taxes anyway, and writing down larger numbers in their ledgers does not bloat the bureaucracy.
 
Cariyaga said:
Oh, I was mostly joking. There isn't the infrastructure and bureaucracy in place to transition gracefully into that. We can look into that general area, though.
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My idea was basically a specific form of work insurance. All ninja businesses have an additional tax which goes towards a large pool. If a civillian suffers an income reduction as a result of ninja dominating their market then they file a claim and get compensated by Leaf from the pool (If their claim is legitimate) . It assumes records of business transactions are already kept for tax purposes and Leaf doesn't just have a land value tax.
 
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Hm. What if ninja couldn't lower their prices below the civilian-equivalent pre-taxes, that way they couldn't force civilians out of business?

e: TBH we could probably throw Kei at the tax problem and she'd figure it out in a day.
 
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This plan was based of a earlier plan submitted by someone else. I do not no what the etiquette for that is and would be happy to try to merge.

[X] Action Plan: Prometheus
  • [Licenses] Get licenses for the team.
  • [Crazyness is Unproductive] Get therapy.
  • [Sealing is Magic] Create and distribute useful seals to build good will and lay path for seal based wealth/uplift.
  • [Build your opponent a golden bridge to retreat across] Investigate the best ways to get the merchant council on our side quickly.
  • [Birthday Planning] Plan Mari's birthday with team.
  • [Roll Out] Get a profitable mission.
[Licenses]
  • Get Kagome his sealmaster license.
  • Get Hazou his seal master license.
  • Get Noburi his mednin license, if he wants to.
    • Working in the hospital may force him to take this anyway.
  • Get permission to sell explosive tags and storage seals to the armed forces (different rules for war critical supplies)?
[Crazyness is Unproductive]
  • Continue previous conversation and change answer to "Lets get therapy". Get rest of team on board as well (pitch as solidarity with Kagame?).
[Sealing is Magic]
  • Collaborate with with Kagame to create a civilian usable storage seal (if paired telegraph seal is possible, do that instead and give to Jiraiya for spy/war coordination)
  • If civilian storage seal works out, make 100 and give them to the merchant council as "samples" for them to find applications and use in the approval process.
  • Have Hazou and Kagame spend a day crafting storage seals. Each will have the symbol of our clan on it (hurrah, marshal plan). Offload getting them approved and distributed to the armed forces to the Nara (build political capital). They would understand the utility and are certainly clever enough to make sure they get used.
  • Ask Keiko for help to look through Konoha's sealing resources/Jiraiya's library to be able to later ask Leaf's sealing tech tree and be able to answer questions like "does Leaf have a casino seal with notes that would be easier to learn?"
[Birthday Planning]
  • Get the team together over a couple of days to coordinate present and party plans.
    • Talk to Mari in private -- he knows there's no way to keep her party a secret from her, but he thought it might be fun for her to plan her own counter-party surprise the rest of the team with. Maybe a bunch of pranks to put together?
[Build your opponent a golden bridge to retreat across.]
  • The merchant council is the sole thing preventing us from making lots of money using previous ideas. We shall win them over.
    • Ask Inoue to investigate the Merchant Council. What does the social power landscape look like? What are the biggest power blocks? What do they want? How could they be persuaded that our seals would further those interests? What seals would be of most interest to the blocs with the most influence?
    • Whenever we propose a seal based venture, we shall act through a civilian based partner. That will make it difficult for them to make the argument that we are hurting the civilian economy.
    • Approach all ice merchants in Konoha (shouldn't be that many) and negotiate supplying them with ice. They would all get the same prices (discounted based on the amount they sell) and get an additional discount based on them championing it to the merchant council (faster the licensing is pushed through is closed, the better the deal they get.
[Roll Out]
  • Unless one of the other things nets money immediately: Get a simple mission, balancing between danger, how short the mission is, and pay.
  • Ask Jiraiya how much money we need to be safely out of the hole, and what his recommended missions for fixing that are.

(Separate):
[X] Training Plan Hazou: Hedging
Roki 12 [33]
Strength 9 [51]
Stamina 9 [69]
Dexterity 12 [93]
Save 33 XP

Hazou also trains in using his macerators in combat and begins to learn Kagome's style.

This gets Hazou an additional 6 dice in combat against enemies that he can pull off Roki against, 3 otherwise.

[X] Training Plan Akane: Hedging
Wits 7 [14]
Awareness 20 [53]
Strength 11 [75]
Save 0, take one XP from conditioning total

Akane also continues training in Kagome's style, and works to incorporate macerators into it for a less-lethal method that's slightly more friendly-safe.

Akane's weak in awareness, I tossed the excess in Strength -- this will improve her performance against Ninjutsu/Weapons specialists of her approximate level by +3 dice

[X] Training Plan Noburi: Hedging
Syrup Trap 18 [46.5]
Dexterity 8 [62.5]
Tac Move 24 [131.5]
Save 13 XP

Finally getting around to bumping Noburi's Syrup Trap up. He and [glances at literally everyone having some means of aoe] literally anyone pair up together well.

[X] Training Plan Keiko: Hedging
Vacuum Step 15 [42]
Pangolin's Reach 13 [82.5]
Save 3.5 XP
 
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I'd quite like it if the next chapter followed immediately onto the last one along the lines of...

eaglejarl said:
Noburi grunted acknowledgement and finished his sandwich before speaking again. "You ever think about talking to her?" he asked very casually, looking off at a cloud formation that was moving in their direction.

"No."

"Yeah, me neither."
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Hazou blinked and looked up. "Actually, can I change my answer?"
 
I had therapy in the Prometheus plan but cut it because I wanted it to be relatively focused. I've put it back in and removed Victory Before Battle to keep length reasonable. So....

Added.
 
I don't really want to try for missions until and unless our ideas for moneymaking don't work out.

What's the point of going on missions when we can instead mass-produce guns for the civilian populace? :D
 
Cariyaga said:
I don't really want to try for missions until and unless our ideas for moneymaking don't work out.

What's the point of going on missions when we can instead mass-produce guns for the civilian populace? :D
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We need food on the table, essentially. Those licenses, if we put the screws on the civilians, are still likely to take months and high startup costs.
 
huhYeahGoodPoint said:
We need food on the table, essentially. Those licenses, if we put the screws on the civilians, are still likely to take months and high startup costs.
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If we come up with a way to arm civilians I seriously doubt Jiraiya would let it take that long.

Even that being the case, we've still got several days left in our post-mission cooldown period.
 
Cariyaga said:
If we come up with a way to arm civilians I seriously doubt Jiraiya would let it take that long.

Even that being the case, we've still got several days left in our post-mission cooldown period.
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LBF wands with macerators let us do that already, with Air Domes providing a pretty effective defense, but those are gated to Kagome and Jiraiya, and we don't see them immediately putting the screws on the civilians to accept the goddamn seals already, for pretty good reason (sealing failures).
 
huhYeahGoodPoint said:
LBF wands with macerators let us do that already, with Air Domes providing a pretty effective defense, but those are gated to Kagome and Jiraiya, and we don't see them immediately putting the screws on the civilians to accept the goddamn seals already, for pretty good reason (sealing failures).
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As far as I'm aware, there are no sealing failures that those would cause as long as they're used properly.

Seals, in general, as far as I'm aware, and so long as they're properly used, do not cause sealing failures. (And there's a technically-correct sentence my English teacher would kill me for.) It is infusing seals (which, Kagome and Jiraiya aren't gonna fail) and researching them that causes sealing failures.
 
Basic idea is to get civilians onboard by giving the access to well known/familiar ninja tech, then open floodgates once we have a good handle on the mc sitaution.

However, if we can brainstorm a good and safe way to arm civilians, I would be up to add it. Bare in mind ninja reaction. might be good to start slow (meant for anti-chakra beast).
 
Cariyaga said:
As far as I'm aware, there are no sealing failures that those would cause as long as they're used properly.

Seals, in general, as far as I'm aware, and so long as they're properly used, do not cause sealing failures. (And there's a technically-correct sentence my English teacher would kill me for.) It is infusing seals (which, Kagome and Jiraiya aren't gonna fail) and researching them that causes sealing failures.
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Doesn't matter; the Merchant Council will take one look at all these seals and go "show me that safety license buddy", because otherwise you set the precedent that seals which can be used for civilian purposes can be rammed through the approval purposes from questionably sane sealmasters - is that something you particularly want?
 
charlesrwest said:
  • Collaborate with with Kagame to create a civilian usable storage seal (if paired telegraph seal is possible, do that instead and give to Jiraiya for spy/war coordination)
  • If civilian storage seal works out, make 100 and give them to the merchant council as "samples" for them to find applications and use in the approval process.
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I will note in light of the corrected LBF we can just give out LBF seals and say they activate any seal in the Konoha seal library, including storage seals.

@eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail A straight wooden staff is enough to keep the LBF aligned, right?
 
huhYeahGoodPoint said:
Doesn't matter; the Merchant Council will take one look at all these seals and go "show me that safety license buddy", because otherwise you set the precedent that seals which can be used for civilian purposes can be rammed through the approval purposes from questionably sane sealmasters - is that something you particularly want?
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"Do you really think that I, Jiraiya, world-renowned sealmaster, and your Hokage, would support any measures that would not be perfectly safe, so long as they were used properly?"

Frankly, all we need to do is piggyback off of him. We can produce the Lesser Barrier Formation seals with Iron Nerve and toss bundles at him when he gets home to infuse. Hell, for all the MC knows, it can be our idea, but his craftsmanship. It is, basically.

I expect, if push came to shove, Jiraiya could burn a little capital and a few favors to get his LBF and Storage Seals pushed through the MC.
 
charlesrwest said:
This plan was based of a earlier plan submitted by someone else. I do not no what the etiquette for that is and would be happy to try to merge.

[X] Action Plan: Prometheus
  • [Licenses] Get licenses for the team.
  • [Crazyness is Unproductive] Get therapy.
  • [Sealing is Magic] Create and distribute useful seals to build good will and lay path for seal based wealth/uplift.
  • [Build your opponent a golden bridge to retreat across] Investigate the best ways to get the merchant council on our side quickly.
  • [Birthday Planning] Plan Mari's birthday with team.
  • [Roll Out] Get a profitable mission.
[Licenses]
  • Get Kagome his sealmaster license.
  • Get Hazou his seal master license.
  • Get Noburi his mednin license, if he wants to.
    • Working in the hospital may force him to take this anyway.
  • Get permission to sell explosive tags and storage seals to the armed forces (different rules for war critical supplies)?
[Crazyness is Unproductive]
  • Continue previous conversation and change answer to "Lets get therapy". Get rest of team on board as well (pitch as solidarity with Kagame?).
[Sealing is Magic]
  • Collaborate with with Kagame to create a civilian usable storage seal (if paired telegraph seal is possible, do that instead and give to Jiraiya for spy/war coordination)
    • Lesser Barrier Formation constructions would function just fine for this, particularly if they remain functional when moved, so long as the seals remain aligned relative to each other.

  • If civilian storage seal works out, make 100 and give them to the merchant council as "samples" for them to find applications and use in the approval process.

  • Have Hazou and Kagame spend a day crafting storage seals. Each will have the symbol of our clan on it (hurrah, marshal plan). Offload getting them approved and distributed to the armed forces to the Nara (build political capital). They would understand the utility and are certainly clever enough to make sure they get used.
[Birthday Planning]
  • Get the team together over a couple of days to coordinate present and party plans.
    • Keep the party a "secret", but don't try too hard to actually hide it.
  • Talk to Mari in private -- he knows there's no way to keep her party a secret from her, but he thought it might be fun for her to plan her own counter-party surprise the rest of the team with. Maybe a bunch of pranks to put together?
[Build your opponent a golden bridge to retreat across.]
  • The merchant council is the sole thing preventing us from making lots of money using previous ideas. We shall win them over.
    • Ask Inoue to investigate the Merchant Council. What does the social power landscape look like? What are the biggest power blocks? What do they want? How could they be persuaded that our seals would further those interests? What seals would be of most interest to the blocs with the most influence?
    • Whenever we propose a seal based venture, we shall act through a civilian based partner. That will make it difficult for them to make the argument that we are hurting the civilian economy.
    • Approach all ice merchants in Konoha (shouldn't be that many) and negotiate supplying them with ice. They would all get the same prices (discounted based on the amount they sell) and get an additional discount based on them championing it to the merchant council (faster the licensing is pushed through is closed, the better the deal they get.
[Roll Out]



    • Get a simple mission, balancing between danger, how short the mission is, and pay.
    • Ask Jiraiya how much money we need to be safely out of the hole, and what his recommended missions for fixing that are.
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Changes I'd make in blue.

We also need to figure out what research we'll do. Frankly, I think we need more time, because what we do and what we research depends on answers to questions like "can LBF be moved so long as the seals remain stationary relative to teach other"?

e: Also I swear to god if we go out on another mission before integrating Macerators into our fighting style (and probably Akane's) I'm going to stab someone (specifically myself, with this headphone jack).
 
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Cariyaga said:
"Do you really think that I, Jiraiya, world-renowned sealmaster, and your Hokage, would support any measures that would not be perfectly safe, so long as they were used properly?"

Frankly, all we need to do is piggyback off of him. We can produce the Lesser Barrier Formation seals with Iron Nerve and toss bundles at him when he gets home to infuse. Hell, for all the MC knows, it can be our idea, but his craftsmanship. It is, basically.

I expect, if push came to shove, Jiraiya could burn a little capital and a few favors to get his LBF and Storage Seals pushed through the MC.
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Uh, yeah, we're gonna need to grovel at Kagome for this to happen - he still doesn't trust Jiraiya, and if Jiraiya wants to make it he has to research it, assuming that Jiraiya doesn't have an LBF analogue.
 
Happy to make the birthday party change. Will make the Lesser Barrier Formation change if we can get moderator confirmation that they would work fine for that (making standard storage seals work for civilians). Would we need a Lesser Barrier Formation per storage seal? If so, integration might be a good idea.
 
charlesrwest said:
Happy to make the birthday party change. Will make the Lesser Barrier Formation change if we can get moderator confirmation that they would work fine for that (making standard storage seals work for civilians). Would we need a Lesser Barrier Formation per storage seal? If so, integration might be a good idea.
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If the LBF wands work, no, we could just have one wand handle multiple storage seals, since they all have about twelve activation cycles (sealing is one activation cycle, unsealing is another).
 
charlesrwest said:
Happy to make the birthday party change. Will make the Lesser Barrier Formation change if we can get moderator confirmation that they would work fine for that (making standard storage seals work for civilians). Would we need a Lesser Barrier Formation per storage seal? If so, integration might be a good idea.
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Lesser Barrier Formation is a two-seal combo that functions approximately 12 times on any seal before it needs replaced.

My idea (by which I mean, inspired by others' rather thoroughly :p) for LBF Wands is a hollowed-out wooden rod with slots to slide LBF into and then another slot for the seal to be activated, whether it's a storage seal, macerator, etc. Ideally, we'd have a mechanism by which macerators could be quickly replaced for use mid-combat against chakra beasts.
 
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Speaking of increasing combat effectiveness, it might be worth asking Kagame to share directional explosive seals with Jiraiya to improve his combat effectiveness. As he is the only S class ninja we are on good terms with, boosting his combat effectiveness should be relatively high priority.

On a more general note, have we explored having clones with explosive notes doing kamikaze attacks on the baddies?

Also, do we have any idea how hard it would be to extend the number of activation cycles for LBF? That is much lower than the cycles for storage seals, as far as I know.
 
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charlesrwest said:
Speaking of increasing combat effectiveness, it might be worth asking Kagame to share directional explosive seals with Jiraiya to improve his combat effectiveness. As he is the only S class ninja we are on good terms with, boosting his combat effectiveness should be relatively high priority.
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I believe he already provided Jiraiya with them, though he's not willing to allow Jiraiya to research them himself.
charlesrwest said:
On a more general note, have we explored having clones with explosive notes doing kamikaze attacks on the baddies?
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It's a good idea, but difficult to pull off effectively -- it requires the enemies be in range of the clones, and clones don't generally have good enough stats to make the Tac Move or Deception rolls necessary to do so. It'd be possible against a melee combatant, though.
 
charlesrwest said:
Also, do we have any idea how hard it would be to extend the number of activation cycles for LBF? That is much lower than the cycles for storage seals, as far as I know.
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We could, but planned obsolescence is a fantastic way to make us all filthy rich.

edit: obviously once we're no longer strapped for cash we can research the higher activation cycle LBFs, but you know, profit.
 
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