Remove ads

Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

Reader mode
[X] Accept the seal
If you trust Orochimaru to send a Snake to help with the Dragons and Great Seal, does not make sense to betray trust for smaller gains before working together for the real prize.
 
Shrooms said:
I am voting no though. I don't think the benefit is that big for what the many risks are (for one thing, we still don't know what happens if a bioseal gets injured/the body stretches. Does Hazou just explode?) If we had a clearer idea of the effect and it was better than saving a few hours a day I'd be more inclined to agree
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If we had a clear assessment of risks I would also likely vote yes, but Oro was far too open ended on what sorts of things can go wrong and what the cause would be. If it was reasonable, I would say yes. But it's essentially unknown at this point.
 
We've gone up to the shady van and arranged a meeting with the candy man. It'd be impolite not to be on time, there is candy to be had.

[X] Action plan: accept the bioseal... to be put on a willing patient. As well as all pertaining documentation.

[X] faflec
 
FaintlySorcerous said:
might play into his Out stuff
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
How is not sleeping going to make hazou take mental damage from thinking of Out?
Velorien said:
Correct. Vote yes or no for what to tell Orochimaru, in the standard format.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
@Velorien
Can we vote in more comprehensive plans? Neither a flat yes or no sound optimal

Sir Stompy said:
Anybody voting yes on the seal slightly concerned that Hazou will not have the slightest knowledge of medical tools and terminology?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yes I am concerned
Twinnstars said:
Sacrifice lootbox xp to buy a one time stunt for this surgery? This is **macro action economy** muahahahaha
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think we need already have lvl10 before we can use oro medical loot box?

Oh if we get the surgery and it works out. That could open the doors to people seeing oro can give them helpful surgery. Crippled ninja might flock to Oro for augments. Glorious revolution. Although maybe still bottlenecked by people wealthy enough to pay for oro surgery. Maybe Oro will be flattered enough to charge them less? Well oro pays a lot for last gift programme. Maybe they could pay with surgeries?
 
Last edited:
Paperclipped said:
From the rules doc, under "QM had fun".
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It's odd how little that matches the actual updates you've written so far.

roobee said:
Can we vote in more comprehensive plans? Neither a flat yes or no sound optimal
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm fine with that. No promise that Orochimaru will be.

roobee said:
Yes I am concerned
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Note that you will be seeing Orochimaru at the sixth bell irrespective of your decision on the seal.
 
coldcutconvict said:
If you trust Orochimaru to send a Snake to help with the Dragons and Great Seal, does not make sense to betray trust for smaller gains before working together for the real prize.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It does make sense for him. If Oro doesn't think Hazou can meaningfully help him, then betraying Hazou is a zero-cost action. He doesn't need our help, if he wants to go to Arachnid, kill all the Dragons, and fix the Great Seal, he can do that by himself.

Oro would probably be wrong that Hazou doesn't have anything to offer. But he is a font of overwhelming arrogance. It would be in character for him to think that.
 
Sir Stompy said:
If Oro doesn't think Hazou can meaningfully help him, then betraying Hazou is a zero-cost action.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...


I feel as though your comment about Orochimaru goes against what EJ has said.

Edit: reworded.

eaglejarl said:
Give the man some credit, he's impatient and rude and antisocial, but he's not ignorant. Even in the decanonized version he preferred to negotiate instead of going nuclear and therefore destroying all hope of future positive interactions.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
Last edited:
Kiba said:
This isn't about trusting Orochimaru. This is about due diligence, especially since our body is on the line.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Only so much overlap between due diligence and mad science. Asking Orochimaru for Intro to Responsible Bioseal Nourishment and Hygiene is smart.
Sir Stompy said:
It does make sense for him. If Oro doesn't think Hazou can meaningfully help him, then betraying Hazou is a zero-cost action. He doesn't need our help, if he wants to go to Arachnid, kill all the Dragons, and fix the Great Seal, he can do that by himself.

Oro would probably be wrong that Hazou doesn't have anything to offer. But he is a font of overwhelming arrogance. It would be in character for him to think that.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Even Orochimaru cannot take on a Boss in their own territory. Without permission from the Arachnids he is out of luck.

[X] Get a tattoo.
Hana will be mad if we get our first Bioseal before our first tattoo.
 
The question of the bioseal comes down to a few things:
  1. What information do we feel like we have taken away from Orochimaru's description of the procedure? We know it would require invasive surgery and that misuse of the seal could result in some unpleasantness for us, potentially due to bloodline interactions.
  2. What information do we feel we still lack and what are the answers to those questions? I'd like to know what the potential side effects of the seal itself are, what the recovery time would look like, and what the social implications of being potentially-obviously biosealed would be. Will it scare civilians? Make other ninja think we're crazy? Cause Ino to dump us?
  3. How much do we trust that the procedure itself will go exactly to plan? Surgery is sometimes but not always straightforward. Moreover, if we don't come completely clean to Orochimaru re: our bloodline, there's the potential for complications and he'd be able to say 'Hazo concealed the nature of his bloodline, I had no way of knowing and I assumed he'd tell me anything relevant'. Tsunade might or might not go to war over that, but even if she does, we're stuck in our body.
  4. How much do we trust Orochimaru's judgement? Maybe he sees winding up with snake pupils as a mundane side effect that's not worth it to mention. Maybe he regards a 1-in-10 chance of being permanently crippled in some way as the price of doing business.
I do not feel comfortable just straight up saying yes without just a little bit of due diligence. We can ask these questions in non-insulting ways and go from there.

Self-promo, but I have a plan which tries to muddle some of this out below. Happy to make adjustments, especially for voters (@roobee and @@Iris-Iven-Ibis at present).
FaintlySorcerous said:
[X] The Bioseal: Tentative Agreement
  • Before leaving:
    • Can you elaborate on what would constitute 'misuse', and appropriate use?
    • What if any side effects would come along with the seal?
      • Would there be changes to our person, physically or mentally?
    • If it turned out that there were unfortunate interactions between the bioseal and our bloodline, could we simply not use the bioseal?
  • Talk with Noburi and the clan.
    • What happens when you're biosealed?
    • Would we look different? Would it be obvious that we had a bioseal?
    • Would we become a pariah if it came out?
    • Are we literally insane for considering this?
  • Get the seal if...
    • We aren't incurring significant penalties.
    • The seal would give us more than 10 hours/week on average (read: some meaningful mechanical impact).
    • Not using it if there are IN interactions is viable.
    • The clan agrees this is within the bounds of sanity.
  • If we don't get the seal...
    • Politely decline. We don't know enough about our bloodline or biosealing to make an informed decision. Thank you for allowing us time to consider our decision. We do hope to expand our knowledge in both areas and one day make another exchange for this seal.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
Last edited:
Oh, so we can do nuance? Grand.

[x] Action Plan: There Is as Yet Insufficient Data for a Meaningful Answer
Word count: 229
  • Meet with Orochimaru.
  • Ask your questions. Seek to do this before discussing the no-sleep seal, but subtly. If he brings up the seal before you can start asking questions, discuss it first.
  • Get the details on the seal. What constitutes "misuse"? How severe are the side-effects, and what specifically are they? Does the seal require maintenance? Is sleep rendered entirely unnecessary, or there are limitations?
  • If none of the caveats are obvious deal-breakers (like the need for monthly maintenance that only Oro can provide), mention your interest in gathering information on the Iron Nerve. Would he be able to do that, alongside the operation? And share his findings with you, of course.
    • If he's interested, great! You'd also like to involve Tsunade. We'd get more information with two experts on the task, right?
  • If he refuses Tsunade's oversight, decline. Surface justification: There's been some complications with your bloodline in the past, and Tsunade dealt with them. You don't doubt Orochimaru's expertise and ability to keep patients alive, but on reflection, you don't feel that it'd be safe without the oversight of the person familiar with your case specifically.
    • (Alternatively, improvise a justification based on how Oro refuses Tsunade's involvement. It has to sound shady somehow.)
  • If the interaction goes well, clarify that you weren't insincere. There is something refreshingly pleasant about how straightforward and streamlined negotiations with him are.
 
Last edited:
something something paranoia something something don't talk to Orochimaru

[X] The Bioseal: Tentative Agreement without Orochimaru
  • Talk with Noburi and the clan.
    • Beg, borrow, and steal to get Anko to the compound and involved in this discussion.
    • What happens when you're biosealed?
    • Would we look different? Would it be obvious that we had a bioseal?
    • Would we become a pariah if it came out?
    • Are we literally insane for considering this?
  • Get the seal if...
    • We aren't incurring significant penalties.
    • The seal would give us more than 10 hours/week on average (read: some meaningful mechanical impact).
    • Not using it if there are IN interactions is viable.
    • There's broad agreement this is within the bounds of sanity.
  • If we don't get the seal...
    • Politely decline. We don't know enough about our bloodline or biosealing to make an informed decision. Thank you for allowing us time to consider our decision. We do hope to expand our knowledge in both areas and one day make another exchange for this seal.
 
[ ] Action Plan: There Is as Yet Insufficient Data for a Meaningful Answer
[ ] The Bioseal: Tentative Agreement without Orochimaru
 
Last edited:
Noumero said:
Oh, so we can do nuance? Grand.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Clarification: there is nuance, and then there is:

I am writing an update this weekend which involves talking to Orochimaru about forbidden lore. This update will contain you talking to Orochimaru about forbidden lore. It will not contain anything other than you talking to Orochimaru, and if you wish to do things other than talking to Orochimaru, you should do so in a different update.
 
Guys trying to get more of an explanation from Oro isn't going to help. I'd much rather just decline

And to show how much I believe that trying for nuance is the wrong play
[X] Reject the seal
 
Last edited:
Velorien said:
I am writing an update this weekend which involves talking to Orochimaru about forbidden lore. This update will contain you talking to Orochimaru about forbidden lore. It will not contain anything other than you talking to Orochimaru, and if you wish to do things other than talking to Orochimaru, you should do so in a different update.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Aha. Would the following rewrite be fine?:

  • Meet with Orochimaru.
  • Ask your questions. Seek to do this before discussing the no-sleep seal, but subtly. If he brings up the seal before you can start asking questions, discuss it first.
  • Get the details on the seal. What constitutes "misuse"? How severe are the side-effects, and what specifically are they? Does the seal require maintenance? Is sleep rendered entirely unnecessary, or there are limitations?
  • If none of the caveats are obvious deal-breakers (like the need for monthly maintenance that only Oro can provide), mention your interest in gathering information on the Iron Nerve. Would he be able to do that, alongside the operation? And share his findings with you, of course.
    • If he's interested, great! You'd also like to involve Tsunade. We'd get more information with two experts on the task, right?
  • If he refuses Tsunade's oversight, decline. Surface justification: There's been some complications with your bloodline in the past, and Tsunade dealt with them. You don't doubt Orochimaru's expertise and ability to keep patients alive, but on reflection, you don't feel that it'd be safe without the oversight of the person familiar with your case specifically.
    • (Alternatively, improvise a justification based on how Oro refuses Tsunade's involvement. It has to sound shady somehow.)
  • If the interaction goes well, clarify that you weren't insincere. There is something refreshingly pleasant about how straightforward and streamlined negotiations with him are.
 
Last edited:
faflec said:
@eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail @Paperclipped What is Mari and Noburi's opinion of Hazou accepting the seal?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Mari: "No, no, no, Sage's fucking balls, no! After all the work we did to get you and Kei out from under his scalpel, you're going to jump right back in there?"


Noburi: "Not saying it's a terrible idea, but it is pretty insane. Though I guess that hasn't stopped you in the past.


Do they anticipate Orochimaru flubbing the seal deliberately, tacking on additional consequences like required maintenance which he will demand we pay for, or anything else along those lines?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Mari: "Ugh. You're right that the incentives don't line up for him to defect openly, but that doesn't mean he won't do it discreetly. At the very least, there's no way he doesn't investigate your bloodline while he has the chance, and if he realized I lied, that could be bad for both of us. Also, who knows what else he does to you. Remember Arikada's henchman, and how she put an exploding bioseal in his head? Sure, he's so powerful he literally doesn't need to think about you as a threat, but it's still basic ninja dilligence to take what power and control you can."


Noburi: "All of that, yeah. I don't think he'll just screw you over and tell you to suck eggs or pay up, but he doesn't care enough about you to not take advantage of you if he gets the chance. Also, seals wear out over time, right? Not knowing anything about sealing, I'd still bet that whatever bioseal he puts on you wears out, since the whole thing Kagome always screams about when it comes to biosealing is that your body isn't a stable medium. And he's right, your body is changing all the time."
 
Last edited:
Noumero said:
Aha. Would the following rewrite be fine?:

  • Meet with Orochimaru.
  • Ask your questions. Seek to do this before discussing the no-sleep seal, but subtly. If he brings up the seal before you can start asking questions, discuss it first.
  • Get the details on the seal. What constitutes "misuse"? How severe are the side-effects, and what specifically are they? Does the seal require maintenance? Is sleep rendered entirely unnecessary, or there are limitations?
  • If none of the caveats are obvious deal-breakers (like the need for monthly maintenance that only Oro can provide), mention your interest in gathering information on the Iron Nerve. Would he be able to do that, alongside the operation? And share his findings with you, of course.
    • If he's interested, great! You'd also like to involve Tsunade. We'd get more information with two experts on the task, right?
  • If he refuses Tsunade's oversight, decline. Surface justification: There's been some complications with your bloodline in the past, and Tsunade dealt with them. You don't doubt Orochimaru's expertise and ability to keep patients alive, but on reflection, you don't feel that it'd be safe without the oversight of the person familiar with your case specifically.
    • (Alternatively, improvise a justification based on how Oro refuses Tsunade's involvement. It has to sound shady somehow.)
  • If the interaction goes well, clarify that you weren't insincere. There is something refreshingly pleasant about how straightforward and streamlined negotiations with him are.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yes, that's fine.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top