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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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I say we give him the heart. I imagine there's still plenty of other bits to use for the armor-- he was, after all, a pretty big guy.
 
@soulcake since the King of the Sky grows as he eats hearts, and his changes are reflected upon his progeny, can we choose to give him the Greedy One's Heart, and would we/he expect to change/grow from it?
 
[ ] Prod for Prod: Master Yorri is most certainly more learned and experienced than you are, but mayhaps you have something worth his time as well? The secrets of the Rune Metal Adamant, your discovery of flaming comets? [Cost: 1 action] Gain x3 Yorri prods

[ ] [Simple] Warded Aeries: The Griffons of the Skarrenraz Ankor suffered terribly defending the skies of your hold. The decade-long siege has seen many an oath of friendship sworn between your folk and theirs. An entire generation of "Clutchlings" as they are called, has been raised alongside your own youth safely within the halls of the Karak. Their nests are high above the world, but they are ill-suited to protecting them from that which can fly as well. Rectify this, at least for the roost in Kraka Drakk, and aid in Otrek's work to repay these odd but dependable allies. [Cost: 2 actions] Productivity Like No Other will proc.

[ ] [Simple] Weaponized Wings: You can't arm the Griffons of the Skarrenraz Ankor with Gromril, while lesser in population than the hold they make up for it in sheer bulk that needs to be protected. What you can do, however, is take part in King Otrek's efforts to arm them with Runic weaponry and good solid steel armour. It will mostly consist of you spending time fitting a few select Griffons, likely the eldest and most powerful given your position, with Rune weapons and maybe a suit of Gromril armour if they're important enough. [Cost: 1 action] Productivity Like No Other will proc.

[ ] [Difficult] A Princely Panoply Pt. 1: Otrek has come to you with a minor request, seeking your expertise in armouring the scions of the King of the Skies in fine Gromril armour capable of keeping the Griffon's legacy alive as a gift to be given. He who Thinks and He who Remembers have different philosophies over the kind of armour they want. The former wants to retain his speed and dexterity while the latter wishes to improve his already formidable endurance and toughness. a multi-work project. [Cost: 1 action] If a rune you want requires special ingredients that you don't have access to I will alert you. Choose 2.

Something like this as a plan seems good also griffin eat the heart
 
Think we should give kots the [Tier 5] The Greedy One's Heart as a gift for all that him and his people have done for us
 
One thing we might be able to ask Yorri about is the voidstone. He's explored a lot. He might know where more deposits are, or he might of encountered it before so we can grab more.
 
[] Plan tri2
-[ ] Refuse the Hearth: Allow the King of the Skies to consume it. Gain standing with the Skarrenraz Ankor and KoTS. ???
-[ ] Odd Places 5/10: Look on Master Yorri's map and try and discover one of his marked locations. The locations will certainly be odd, but whether they'll be useful will remain to be seen. x4
--[]Prod Yorri: Master Yorri probably knows a few things and secrets. Given he found these parts in the first place. [Cost: 1 prod] Gain +15 to Odd Places Roll x4
-[ ] Prod for Prod: Master Yorri is most certainly more learned and experienced than you are, but mayhaps you have something worth his time as well? The secrets of the Rune Metal Adamant, your discovery of flaming comets? [Cost: 1 action] Gain x3 Yorri prods

get 9/10 odd places, get 3 more prods for next turn to finish odd places and use 2 prods for something else

we might get something that will help us out with our future actions with that +15 boosting us
 
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Right so planning time:

[] Plan rebuilding
-[ ] Refuse the Hearth: Allow the King of the Skies to consume it. Gain standing with the Skarrenraz Ankor and KoTS. ???
-[ ] [Simple] Warded Aeries: The Griffons of the Skarrenraz Ankor suffered terribly defending the skies of your hold. The decade-long siege has seen many an oath of friendship sworn between your folk and theirs. An entire generation of "Clutchlings" as they are called, has been raised alongside your own youth safely within the halls of the Karak. Their nests are high above the world, but they are ill-suited to protecting them from that which can fly as well. Rectify this, at least for the roost in Kraka Drakk, and aid in Otrek's work to repay these odd but dependable allies. [Cost: 2 actions] Productivity Like No Other will proc. 2 Actions
[ ] Dragon Ogre Autopsy: You've found yourself with a bevy of corpses to study. Dragon Ogres aren't an unknown foe, but you've never been privy to the results of the few limited autopsies done in the long history of your people. [Cost: 6 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. 3 Actions
- [ ] Prod Yorri: See if your master has something in his noggin, he spent a decade fighting these things. [Cost: 1 prod] Gain 1d3 of progress.

Gets the aeries protected and clears one of our (extensive) research lists.

I figure we should focus on the stuff we can prod Yorri about while he's still here. Soulcake noted that he would be rolling to see if Yorri wanders off every turn.
One thing we might be able to ask Yorri about is the voidstone. He's explored a lot. He might know where more deposits are, or he might of encountered it before so we can grab more.
Not an option unfortunately. We can't prod him about the things.
 
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...I'm genuinely tempted to offer a trade. We keep Suneaters heart but in return we'll let him have the greedy ones heart. Supercharge the griffon regen with limitless energy.
The Greedy One's Heart is continual energy, Suneater's is more... lightning. Tbh, I'd rather have the Greedy Heart for us to use as a mat, as it can be applied more broadly to various needs, and is a better fit for what I want to use our T5 mats on - an item that can move vast, vast amounts of stone.

That said... @soulcake - the Giffons do not have a lot of change left to them - rather than some sort of item to KotS, would giving the Greedy Heart and the Suneater Heart both cause the Griffon species to get the benefits form the both?

I'd say, considering the fact the griffons are running low on how much they can change, that giving them a bit of unlimited regeneration, if it is possible, would be worth much more than armouring KotS would be imo.


I have similar feelings, though in my case it's more along the lines of 'offer him both hearts'. Never gonna happen, I know, but I'm genuinely curious about what it would do. I know the KotS says he can probably only have one more change, but if he eats both hearts back-to-back maybe it'd bypass that?

Imo, Even giving the Suneater Heart to KotS we still kinda owe him a boon, but if we give both hearts, then we could ask for a T5 mat next time he gets on as he would owe us, and in the mean time... the baby griffons would be much, much harder to kill.

A T5 mat in the future is worth more than having one now, when the trade off is baby griffons getting the ability to regenerate.
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Basically, depending on word of QM, I am also in favour of giving both hearts to KotS.

Faster for us and him than making some armour and giving one heart. Helps more griffons, too.
 
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So, here's my idea of what I would like to see from this turn. With Mastery Yorri here, and his evident mastery of the Rune of Walking, I would like to invest some actions into that research branch. I would also like to start working on KotS armor and getting to work with the Griffons better. As such... here is my plan that is a work in progress.

[] Work-in-progress
- [ ] Boon from the Sky: Write-in what you want from the King of the Skies. He can do a lot but be reasonable. In exchange, he expects a suit of armour. [Cost: Start Request, [Difficult] Plated Skies Pt. 1:]
--[] Five of his Feathers
-[ ] Odd Places 5/10: Look on Master Yorri's map and try and discover one of his marked locations. The locations will certainly be odd, but whether they'll be useful will remain to be seen. [Cost: 1 action] Roll for usefulness. 1 Action
--[] Prod Yorri: Master Yorri probably knows a few things and secrets. Given he found these parts in the first place. [Cost: 1 prod] Gain +15 to Odd Places Roll
-[ ] Diction Direction: Master Yorri's Rune of Translation is serviceable, but it's in a position that you can very clearly see areas for improvement. This would certainly be easier if you knew Master Yorri was right now, but you have the Rune and seven centuries under your belt, so it's not an insurmountable challenge for a Runelord. [Cost: (6 -4) =2 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. 1 Action
--[ ] Prod Yorri: He discovered the damn thing, maybe he has more insights?[Cost: 1 prod] Gain 1 Progress
-[ ] The Movement of things: The Rune of Waking or Animation as some would call it is a rare rune. How Master Yorri knows both the regular and Master Rune could be explained by either a harrowing adventure full of terror, beasties and treasure or by something as mundane as asking a friend, you could never be sure with the man. Still, this was a rune that, to your frustration, you haven't had much chance to tinker with. Maybe just a peak? [Cost: 8 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. 3 Actions
--[ ] Prod Yorri: Master Yorri, by his own account, has a good idea about how gronti and their ilk function.[Cost: 1 prod] Gain 1d2+1 Progress, can be taken multiple times. Two Times

With this, we will be able to complete the Diction direction in 1 action and complete the Movement of things in 3 actions, with some possible overflow. In addition, we can actually start the quest chain for KoTS armor. And also, since Master Yorri is here, find another odd place.
 
I figure we should focus on the stuff we can prod Yorri about while he's still here. Soulcake noted that he would be rolling to see if Yorri wanders off every turn.
Unless stated in the action, you can only prod once.
That said... @soulcake - the Giffons do not have a lot of change left to them - rather than some sort of item to KotS, would giving the Greedy Heart and the Suneater Heart both cause the Griffon species to get the benefits form the both?

I'd say, considering the fact the griffons are running low on how much they can change, that giving them a bit of unlimited regeneration, if it is possible, would be worth much more than armouring KotS would be imo.
You have no idea.
 
Can we please have Yorri help us with our research? We can literally do everything else the turn after but in this instance we have Yorri with us for this turn and he is likely going to leave next turn. We have so, so much research to do and we can finally start clearing those up while we have the chance.
Think we should give kots the [Tier 5] The Greedy One's Heart as a gift for all that him and his people have done for us
God no, we are already likely to give him the Suneaters heart and the Sky King himself stated that it's more than likely going to change him and his people to the point that nothing else would further his growth making it a waste.
 
I'm going to point out just how effective prodding Yorri is regarding the Master Rune of Walking. Each prod is worth 2 actions, at least. That's a fantastic time-saver
 
I'm going to point out just how effective prodding Yorri is regarding the Master Rune of Walking. Each prod is worth 2 actions, at least. That's a fantastic time-saver
Definitely think we should use at least one single action for waking animation for the Prod since at the least we get 2 actions worth which should proc for another making it one of the most efficient choices at the moment.
 
"What is it?" Otrek says, raising the object in his hand for the both of you to see.

"A ring/ring," you both reply, eyes wide.

It is no Runic masterpiece, no great ward or weapon of woe, but a band of simple, if finely engraved with beautifully stylized mountains, Oathgold inset with a small ruby.

Beautiful.
Now that's really awesome.

It doesn't need to be runed to be really touching. That's going to bouy Otrek's spirits a lot I think.

You wish Klorah well.

"Snorri!" Yorri calls from the bed next to you.

"Yes Master?" you reply.

"What's this about not using Troll Tongue on your apprentices?!" he rumbles.

You sigh, having dreaded this day.

The things you do for them.
Oh boi. Lol.

When a few dare ask for information, you are told that Grimnir's companions will not utter a word of what occured beyond the bare minimum. Grimnir went north, they followed, but were bid to return. Only Lord Mogrim followed his father onward, the rest of them unable to continue. From how the Huskarls tell it, these dwarfs feel shame on a level none could begin to comprehend for their failure.

Beyond that, they only leave the Temple of Grimnir to bring battle and wage war on the few daemonic hordes that dare assault Kraka Drakk. Venting their anger and rage at any that fall within the reach of their weapons.
Sounds like these are the first Slayers.

Poor bastards.
Over the coming days, Dwarfs throughout the hold take a moment to pay silent respects and honour Grimnir The Valiant for His final and greatest act. For there is no other reason, at least in their minds, as to why the shadows have been pushed back so thoroughly and why some sense of normalcy has returned to the land.

In your mind his final message repeats itself over and over.

Fight and live well ... die for something even better than that.

Leave it to Grimnir to set the greatest example of His own philosophy.
See ya on the other side Grimnir.

Plan wise since folks seem to be interested in seeing what happens to the King of the Skies and his flock I'll put down plans that have him eat the heart.

[] Plan To the Heart with Apprentices
-[] Refuse the Hearth: Allow the King of the Skies to consume it. Gain standing with the Skarrenraz Ankor and KoTS. ???
-[] Boon from the Sky: A bundle of your crest feathers. [Cost: Start Request, [Difficult] Plated Skies Pt. 1:]
-[] Apprentice Hunt: Go out and trawl through the local and regional populace to find a beardling or two worth your time. No stone unturned, no clan unchecked, no record unread, even the Foundling Wards! [Cost: 1 Action] Apprentice Vote after Turn Results. 1 action.
-[] Dragon Ogre Autopsy: You've found yourself with a bevy of corpses to study. Dragon Ogres aren't an unknown foe, but you've never been privy to the results of the few limited autopsies done in the long history of your people. [Cost: 6 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. 2 Actions.
--[] Destructive Research: You have very many corpses. Being a bit more invasive in your understanding will mean more work gets done, but will cost you. [Cost: 3 Shaggoth Corpses, 9 Dragon Ogre Corpses] Gain 2 Progress, can be taken multiple times. Take Twice.
-[] C-c-combo Tester!: Write-in format for a Rune Combo you want Snorri to test. Format is as follows: [Placeholder Combo Name] Equipment type: [Rune 1, Rune 2, Rune 3] [Cost: 1 action] If a rune you want requires special ingredients that you don't have access to I will alert you. 2 actions.
--[] Valaya's Care, Banner: Master Rune of Valaya, Rune of Healing, Rune of Fortitude.
--[] Valaya's Sanctuary, Banner: Master Rune of Valaya, Rune of Healing, Rune of Sanctuary.

So the idea behind this plan is to give the KoTS the Heart of Kholek both for dramatic irony since Kholek failed in eating the King of the Skies own heart and to set up the King of the Skies armor request. The purpose of asking for the feathers is that honestly I think he's effectively paid for the armor so this is to satisfy pride and give us a selection of feathers to use when making Master Runes of Grimnir either for the King of the Skies with his weapons, or weapons or Banners for dwarves of Kraka Drakk.

Further on we have the Dragon Ogre autopsy so that we can hopefully either use them for the King of the Skies' armor or the Healing Banner I decided to go for a couple pages back and to also just find out what they're useful for generally. I expect many to come hunting for Kraka Drakk when it gets particularly stormy. We have absolute shittons of Dragon Ogre Corpses, 15 Shaggoths and 45 Dragon Ogres. We have a looooooooot to spend so might as well. Finally we go hunting for more wonderful apprentices and test out two different combo possibilities for the Banner.

In terms of combo testing I only want to do one for two reasons: I am pretty confident that Valaya's Sanctuary will create a combo, and for my second reason if I find a combo out of any of the three I suggested I'm going straight for it and discarding the other options. I don't want to spend two turns testing combos. If it fails, we'll we're kinda shit out of luck then. Ain't many runes to do with healing.

[] Plan To the Heart With No Apprentices
-[] Refuse the Hearth: Allow the King of the Skies to consume it. Gain standing with the Skarrenraz Ankor and KoTS. ???
-[] Boon from the Sky: A bundle of your crest feathers. [Cost: Start Request, [Difficult] Plated Skies Pt. 1:]
-[] [Simple] Weaponized Wings: You can't arm the Griffons of the Skarrenraz Ankor with Gromril, while lesser in population than the hold they make up for it in sheer bulk that needs to be protected. What you can do, however, is take part in King Otrek's efforts to arm them with Runic weaponry and good solid steel armour. It will mostly consist of you spending time fitting a few select Griffons, likely the eldest and most powerful given your position, with Rune weapons and maybe a suit of Gromril armour if they're important enough. [Cost: 1 action] Productivity Like No Other will proc. 1 Action.
-[] Dragon Ogre Autopsy: You've found yourself with a bevy of corpses to study. Dragon Ogres aren't an unknown foe, but you've never been privy to the results of the few limited autopsies done in the long history of your people. [Cost: 6 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. 2 Actions.
--[] Destructive Research: You have very many corpses. Being a bit more invasive in your understanding will mean more work gets done, but will cost you. [Cost: 3 Shaggoth Corpses, 9 Dragon Ogre Corpses] Gain 2 Progress, can be taken multiple times. Take Twice.
--[] Prod Yorri: See if your master has something in his noggin, he spent a decade fighting these things. [Cost: 1 prod] Gain 1d3 of progress. 1 Prod.
-[] C-c-combo Tester!: Write-in format for a Rune Combo you want Snorri to test. Format is as follows: [Placeholder Combo Name] Equipment type: [Rune 1, Rune 2, Rune 3] [Cost: 1 action] If a rune you want requires special ingredients that you don't have access to I will alert you. 2 actions.
--[] Valaya's Care, Banner: Master Rune of Valaya, Rune of Healing, Rune of Fortitude.
--[] Valaya's Sanctuary, Banner: Master Rune of Valaya, Rune of Healing, Rune of Sanctuary.

This one is as above but has Yorri prods for Yorri interaction and no apprentice hunting so we can give the Griffons weapons and armor.

[] Plan Deck of Many Things
-[] Refuse the Hearth: Allow the King of the Skies to consume it. Gain standing with the Skarrenraz Ankor and KoTS. ???
-[] Boon from the Sky: A bundle of your crest feathers. [Cost: Start Request, [Difficult] Plated Skies Pt. 1:]
-[] The Movement of things: The Rune of Waking or Animation as some would call it is a rare rune. How Master Yorri knows both the regular and Master Rune could be explained by either a harrowing adventure full of terror, beasties and treasure or by something as mundane as asking a friend, you could never be sure with the man. Still, this was a rune that, to your frustration, you haven't had much chance to tinker with. Maybe just a peak? [Cost: 8 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. 2 Action.
--[] Prod Yorri: Master Yorri, by his own account, has a good idea about how gronti and their ilk function.[Cost: 1 prod] Gain 1d2+1 Progress, can be taken multiple times. 3 Prods.
-[] Dragon Ogre Autopsy: You've found yourself with a bevy of corpses to study. Dragon Ogres aren't an unknown foe, but you've never been privy to the results of the few limited autopsies done in the long history of your people. [Cost: 6 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. 1 Actions.
--[] Destructive Research: You have very many corpses. Being a bit more invasive in your understanding will mean more work gets done, but will cost you. [Cost: 3 Shaggoth Corpses, 9 Dragon Ogre Corpses] Gain 2 Progress, can be taken multiple times. Take Twice.
--[] Prod Yorri: See if your master has something in his noggin, he spent a decade fighting these things. [Cost: 1 prod] Gain 1d3 of progress. 1 Prod.
-[] C-c-combo Tester!: Write-in format for a Rune Combo you want Snorri to test. Format is as follows: [Placeholder Combo Name] Equipment type: [Rune 1, Rune 2, Rune 3] [Cost: 1 action] If a rune you want requires special ingredients that you don't have access to I will alert you. 2 actions.
--[] Master of Storms, Armor: Master Rune of Steel, Rune of Lightning, Rune of Cold
--[] Valaya's Sanctuary, Banner: Master Rune of Valaya, Rune of Healing, Rune of Sanctuary.

This one is a variation on the To the Heart plan line, with the intent here to be leveraging Yorri as much as possible. With the arrangement of prods on Yorri and actions for Movement of Things we get at minimum, 2 Progress from our Actions, and 6 progress from prodding Yorri. That will complete it in one go. I'm doing something similar for the Dragon Ogre Autopsy, 4 progress from using Destructive Research, 1 progress from our own actions, and 1 progress minimum from Yorri.

That gets all of our research done, feeds the heart to the King of the Skies, takes up the boon with things useful to both him and us, and does combo testing on two different things. For the King's Armor combo I'm going with the idea of "Master of the North Wind, imbue lightning and cold into this steely Armor." with the idea that Steel is both conductive for electricity and heat.

E: Oh we can only use Prods once. Hmm. Oh actually all my plans are fine.
 
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