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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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GW kinda tends to forget about the implications of anything of the Tomb Kings that isn't vampires and mr rattlemebones eating Shysh. Between Nehekara, Albion, and now Cathay, the state of the human race's past outside of a small Sigmar-centric circle is real murky, relative to one another.

T4 Ancient Greedy Troll Heart is more than likely going to our capstone gronti.
We do have an ordinary Ancient Troll Heart too though, which I didn't realise we had until just checking now actually. Sounds good to me.
Actually, two of those make sense. Albion as the test lab, Nehekarra as the first proto-human empire after they escaped and wandered around, the one with Cathay however, is the real problem. Not only does it go against established lore, but it also does it by going into the most obscure of lore possible, that being the one with the original Nagash "Constant Drachenfels", the whole lore behind its creation and the way it stands, is absolutely retarded. Not just because of how OP the Dragon emperor is, not only does this raise into question as to why their sentinels can no longer work as before, not only did the Dragon emperor go have all of this amazing power, which was displayed nowhere in the End Times, or any other time in at all in the timeline, but he has just been wasting in his damn city for thousands of years. The writing that SEGA made for Cathay is absolutely awful, and it show's a deep lack of understanding in its place in the timeline but smells a lot like kissing up to a certain regime so that it can sell well there, like what they tried with Three kingdoms. The rest save a few points, I'm mollified with, but the origins, in particular, is NOT what I came to love in the setting.

Edit: Wen't to read up on how they may have changed the timeline with them, and apparently they decided to change hen and how Grand Cathay was formed, since before when it was first made, it was said to be made to before the grand incursion, now they decided to make it different to -1800 IC, which I should add, makes another lore problem because The Ogres that were driven out of their land and made a slave race to the great maw thanks to Grand Cathay, was something that happened over 900 years earlier. I ask myself how can one bungle up a storyline of Fantasy-China, and I get this.
 
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Actually, two of those make sense. Albion as the test lab, Nehekarra as the first proto-human empire after they escaped and wandered around, the one with Cathay however, is the real problem. Not only does it go against established lore, but it also does it by going into the most obscure of lore possible, that being the one with the original Nagash "Constant Drachenfels", the whole lore behind its creation and the way it stands, is absolutely retarded. Not just because of how OP the Dragon emperor is, not only does this raise into question as to why their sentinels can no longer work as before, not only did the Dragon emperor go have all of this amazing power, which was displayed nowhere in the End Times, or any other time in at all in the timeline, but he has just been wasting in his damn city for thousands of years. The writing that SEGA made for Cathay is absolutely awful, and it show's a deep lack of understanding in its place in the timeline but smells a lot like kissing up to a certain regime so that it can sell well there, like what they tried with Three kingdoms. The rest save a few points, I'm mollified with, but the origins, in particular, is NOT what I came to love in the setting.
For Albion, it's implied that it was where the various races of this world were first created iirc.

But the reason the Albion humans exist is their ancestors impressed the Old Ones even when humanity was at its infancy and the Old Ones took the select tribes and taught them directly.

Which is why the old humans of Albion could set up the Ogham Stone network as a surge protector for the Great Vortex when the Elves were struggling with setting up the pieces for the Great Vortex.
 
Yeah? It's why I said Albion was the test lab. And once the great incursion happened, the humans that weren't on Albion broke loose, and most gravitated to Nehekraha, the rest became scattered bands in several places till millennia later that they formed into proper nations.
 
I've got to ask. If Magic going through Snorri is fine, but its bad when it goes through his body or soul. What part of Snorri can magic go through that isn't bad?

Going by Blizzardwing's descriptions of what a runesmith's soul looks like, it's safe for the magic to flow through the 'veins of ore', or channels, that permeate the soul of a runesmith (compared to the solid stone of a regular dwarf). It's when magic breaks out of those channels and into the rest of the stone-like dwarfy stuff that you get serious problems, which is what happened during the storm, and why she said that things looked seriously damaged in the aftermath.
 
[Canon] An Elephant Never Forgets, Mammoth Friend(s?) for Snerra
Anyway, have some M A M M O T H.

I haven't written anything in years so excuse the clunkiness.



A simple expedition, Snerra thought. That's what this was supposed to be – gathering reagents from the potent beasties that had become all riled up in the wake of the war and the storm. And yet, even as they ventured into the valleys and woods beyond Drakk, there was something in the air that set her on edge, beyond the norm of these chaotic times. Her sniffer wasn't nearly as honed as Master Snorri's, no, but the fear, the distress on the wind were palpable to even her, and she could swear she could hear something odd in the far distance.

As she and her companions rounded a turn in the mountain pass, it became clear exactly why.

A lone mammoth- nai, a mammothling, yet to even sprout its first tusks, lay half buried under scree; a landslide, clearly, from the beast-trail high above the valley. The poor thing was the source of the distress that she'd sensed, trumpeting in fear and pain that some part of her recognised could only be cries for its mother. Beyond stalked a warband of Fimir, laughing and jowling in their hideous tongue at the distressed cries of an imminent meal with no means of escape. They were growing bold, clearly, to send warbands and scouts so far into Dawi territory, a worrying sign, with the war in the west intensifying by the day.

"My lady, your orders? Should we turn back?"

Their party hadn't yet been noticed given the languid postures of their foes and the cruel laughter echoing through the valley, and ever was the thought of her safety upon her companions' minds. But to turn tail and leave? To let such injustice take place?

Unacceptable.

Rolling her shoulders with a small pop and hefting her runestaff, Snerra hopped down from the wagon and strode forwards into view, her companions readying their weapons as her intent became clear. These Fimm needed a lesson in just whose lands these were.

"Beerguard, to me! KHAZUKAN KAZAKIT HA!"
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Her ever-dutiful companions had set to work in properly disposing of the corpses and their foul, shattered artifice, allowing Snerra to turn her attention own towards the mammothling. Its cries of distress had reduced to panicked whimpers at the sight of the slaughter that had taken place.

"Hush, little one," Snerra said in whispered tones, caressing the soft hair upon its brow. "It'll be alright. We'll get you out of there, don't you fret."

The child calmed a tad at her ministrations, even as she pored over the debris to determine the best way to extract it from the rubble. It aught to be simple enough, by her estimation, save for the mid-sized boulder that had its right foreleg pinned at a rather alarming angle – a delicate touch would be needed to remove that without causing undue pain.

"Hroki, dear?" she said to the nearest Beerguard.

"Yes, my lady?"

"Fetch the others and tell them to bring the mattocks and braces." She gestured to the trapped mammoth and the landslide that had trapped it. "This little one is coming home with us,"

Hroki gave a sharp salute in affirmative, well used to the odd whims of the Runelord he was sworn to. In short order the industrious longbeards of the Beerguard had devised a plan to extract the unfortunate creature from the rubble, carrying it back to the wagon aloft a quickly fashioned stretcher.

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As the little mammoth slept, swaddled in blankets by the hearth under the influence of pain-numbing herbs and tonics, Snerra ruminated on the choice before her over a mug of hot ale. The mammothling's leg was indeed mangled beyond repair, and would have to be amputated to prevent infection and the spread of gangrene to the rest of the body. That much was evident – the conundrum was what came after the fact.

To bestow dwarven artifice, particularly runework, upon a non-dwarf was always controversial. Up here in the Far North, with the example of her master and the Ancestors themselves to follow, it was far less unprecedented, but still certainly bold and likely to draw comment from her peers and elders.

And yet, it was undeniable that before her lay a child, no more than a year old, confused and hurt and alone, the look in its eyes hardly any different to when she'd had to console little Siggrun when she'd broken her wrist, all those years ago. A child that would have had a full life ahead of it, had it not been snatched away by a twist of fate and the whims of a mountainside. Could she in good conscience consign it to a… a half-life, to return it to its herd where it would no doubt fall victim to some other predator in short order, when it was well within her power to make things right?

Come what may, when she put it like that, the choice was clear. She was a Runelord now, student of the Gift-Giver and chosen by Thungni himself. Whatever fallout there might be, she would weather it with a smile knowing full well that she had done the right thing.

The prosthetic would have to be a simple, robust thing, capable of surviving in the harsh outlands beyond the mountains with no maintenance and lacking in moving parts that could foul or freeze in the worst of conditions. Were it a dwarf, the solution would be simple – Forged Limb was truly a wonderful rune, providing fluid, jointless movement that was as natural to use as the limb it replaced. It could likely even be adapted to non-dawi forms with some small effort, though pride and good sense alike would not allow her to bumble around in the dark when the child need help now.

No, a temporary solution was needed, for anything more permanent would be outgrown by the child in short order, as mammoths were wont to do. A tricky problem, a tricky problem indeed.

Draining the rest of her ale, Snerra pulled out a ream of parchment and one of those newfangled 'pens' she'd had imported from Zhufbar. She'd spent enough time lollygagging! This prosthetic wouldn't design itself, and let it never be said that Snerra Magnasdottir lacked for creativity!

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The weeks passed, the amputation and recovery having proceeded smoothly under the enigmatic gaze of Master Yorri, before he'd promptly disappeared to do… whatever odd thing happened to take his fancy. The whims of her master's master were as inscrutable as ever, and she knew better than to ask how or why he'd become such an accomplished veterinarian.

By far the most intricate portion of the design was the connecting mechanism, an array of azrilwut pieces connected by cables of gromril wire, maintaining its form by precise application of tension and compression alone, with no moving parts that might become fouled in the wilds. She'd constructed the array such that it would gradually unfurl with the application of internal pressure as the child's leg grew, whilst still maintaining sufficient tightness that it wouldn't slip off, no matter the situation. The 'leg' portion itself was a thing of utter simplicity: strips of azrilwut, hardy and strong, treated and bent in a manner akin to the limbs of a crossbow, inscribed with Runes of Speed, Strollaz and Repair, the last of which she'd never thought to find a use for outside of children's toys. It was, all in all, a novel application of the principles of Morgrim and Thungni, and one she was rather proud of.

When at last the rangers and Brana scouts came back with reports of sightings an elder Mammoth combing the mountain valleys, singing what could only be described an elegy of mourning that 'stirred the Wind of Amethyst', she knew their time together was up.

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The hike back to the pass where they'd first met was a lengthy one, but it gave ample time for the child to get used to the prosthetic on more challenging terrain. When they at last turned the corner of the pass for the second time in as many months (after much stopping and starting to give time to reset), what lay beyond drew a small gasp from the Runelord.

At the very end other end, just beyond the treeline of the forest beyond stood a truly gargantuan example of the species, magnificent even, with deep purple eyes could swear were staring right into her soul.. Even at this distance, she felt as though she were under the scrutiny of an Elder many times her own age. The child's mother, no doubt. He would be in good hands- trunks?

She let out a soft chuckle, and bent over slightly to look the mammothling in the eyes.

"When you are grown, tall and proud, return here, and we'll see if I can't give you a leg worthy of the name. In the meantime, between your temporary replacement and this torc, any dwarf ranger in these mountains shall know of you, and will provide aid to you and your kin should you seek it."

The torc around the small mammoth's neck flared to life, the flickering of its runelight hesitant, shy, even.

"Azulaf, brynek," The youngling said, resting his brow gently upon Snerra's chest. The Khazalid was fumbling and clunky - more a reflection of its youth than the translation runes on the torc - but it was an expression of thanks nonetheless.

What a polite child.

"I only did what ought to be done. Now go, little one, and be strong." With a final pat, she ushered him away, watching on with a fond smile as he made his way back to his mother. The child's stride was hesitant at first, before easing into a bumbling, enthusiastic gallop, trumpeting all the while in joy.

They would meet again, of this Snerra was sure.
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The ancient eyes of the Gravekeeper gazed through landscape and memory, even as one ear listened dutifully to the eager recounting of the child she'd thought lost. The small shining one, who stilled the Winds even as they danced in the wake of the Storm, and her mountain home; these she would commit to the Tales of Wandering, recorded forevermore through word and song.

After all, an elephant never forgets.



 
I can see her use it as mount and build a Rune Anvil(doom anvil?) as Armor/Saddle attop it ,when he/she is older.

Edit: it could become a new tradition where you get a mammoth mount and bling it up in armor, banner, bolt throwers and anvil thing.
Or a gronti, where a journeyman build the first as iron/steel skeleton and stone as flesh and a Master the skeleton out gromril and the flesh out of iron/steel (the richer one pure gromril or bettter)
 
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Oh wait that's a canon tag. That means the mammoths are also sapient. Slightly less insane dwarf cavalry is (eventually) a go. The elves are going to be happy when they find out another intelligent species is living up in the north.
 
Actually, two of those make sense. Albion as the test lab, Nehekarra as the first proto-human empire after they escaped and wandered around, the one with Cathay however, is the real problem. Not only does it go against established lore, but it also does it by going into the most obscure of lore possible, that being the one with the original Nagash "Constant Drachenfels", the whole lore behind its creation and the way it stands, is absolutely retarded. Not just because of how OP the Dragon emperor is, not only does this raise into question as to why their sentinels can no longer work as before, not only did the Dragon emperor go have all of this amazing power, which was displayed nowhere in the End Times, or any other time in at all in the timeline, but he has just been wasting in his damn city for thousands of years. The writing that SEGA made for Cathay is absolutely awful, and it show's a deep lack of understanding in its place in the timeline but smells a lot like kissing up to a certain regime so that it can sell well there, like what they tried with Three kingdoms. The rest save a few points, I'm mollified with, but the origins, in particular, is NOT what I came to love in the setting.

Edit: Wen't to read up on how they may have changed the timeline with them, and apparently they decided to change hen and how Grand Cathay was formed, since before when it was first made, it was said to be made to before the grand incursion, now they decided to make it different to -1800 IC, which I should add, makes another lore problem because The Ogres that were driven out of their land and made a slave race to the great maw thanks to Grand Cathay, was something that happened over 900 years earlier. I ask myself how can one bungle up a storyline of Fantasy-China, and I get this.
First off I recall that a lot of players were actually asking for more content on Cathay since many found it interesting and full of potential. So Cathay actually getting some characterization and lore freshed is just what a ton of players were already asking for.

Second the Dragon Emperor being as powerful as he is doesn't really seem that big a deal as you are making it out to be considering that we do see a number of canon beings being absurdly powerful. One such example is Kholek's dad who IIRC is the size of a mountain. Then of course we have the Dwarf ancestor gods who have been shown to pull some ridiculous feats while being even younger then the Dragon Emperor and his wife.

Third it's Warhammer, a lot of things they do have some inconsistency or another. Warhammer 40K is as bad if not worse with several things.
 
I have no problem with more Cathay, That's fine. But I would in fact appreciate some consistency, especially by other people that aren't GW or Black Library (it's a toss between super accurate or what it needs for a good story), as for the second thing, Khalgos the black is as big as a mountain range because he is the literal Father, of all Dragon-ogres. He is asleep, because the Chaos Gods, do not want the game to end, the whole fight between them and all the factions of Malus is because they are playing with their food. To them, fighting us is a breath of fresh air and fun to them. You can only kill so many nurglings before the cheering gets annoying, so to make it easier for them to win without making it no longer fun, it's to make it so that the rest of the world has a chance. Hence, why the end times are so significant, it means that they are bored of fighting the same races and people, and so now are giving them everything to conquer the world and win the Great game. Similarly, every major thing anyone in canon has made, has for one reason or another had to leave (Like the Ancestor Gods), or happened and been lost, like the steam tank technology, or is now being used in cannon but it's near the end times. It's a balancing act of making no one faction too strong, and overpowering the rest, without a good reason. And inconsistency or no, there needs to be something to hold a story together, otherwise what one reads is what anybody at a board meeting can come up with, which is what we got for the End times, and I do not want that ever again.
 
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The rune of the ancestor of the King of heaven. Created by Dolgi Bolgison. It looks like it was carved by the claws of a griffin. It softens magic, rises above the wind and the storm, gives animal power. Excuse me for the mistakes I write through an auto-translator. Can someone correct
 
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Нет, вы на самом деле не использовали автокоррекцию. Извините, если я был оскорбительным, это вышло неправильно, когда я набрал его.
 
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Руна предка Царя небес. Создано Долги Болгисон. Извините, если не правильно пишу через автопереводчик.
Google Translate Says: Rune of the ancestor of the King of heaven. Created by Debt Bolgison. Sorry if I'm not writing correctly through an auto-translator.
Нет, вы на самом деле не использовали автокоррекцию. Извините, если я был оскорбительным, это вышло неправильно, когда я набрал его.
Google Translate Says: No, you didn't actually use auto-correction. Sorry if I was being offensive, it came out wrong when I typed it.
 
So, how much has the quest changed things so far? I'm aware of how important the death of suneater was, and that the rune college is going to break canon over its knee, but i don't know much about the golden age lore.
 
So, how much has the quest changed things so far? I'm aware of how important the death of suneater was, and that the rune college is going to break canon over its knee, but i don't know much about the golden age lore.
canon was shot and buried in a undisclosed location when the hashut rolls happened
Mammoths are part of the Elephantidae family - all mammoths are elephants, but not all elephants are mammoths :p
true but would a mammoth know that it part of the elephant family and refer to itself in such a way? (unless it was passed down through the gravekeeper from the distant past when they met and each other and put 2 and 2 together)
 
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So, how much has the quest changed things so far? I'm aware of how important the death of suneater was, and that the rune college is going to break canon over its knee, but i don't know much about the golden age lore.
Hashut is dead and in pieces, so the Dawi Zharr are all but extinct. And given how tough Dawi are against corruption, it won't be easy for the cultists to gather recruits, especially in the North which has the Brana to sense that sort of thing.
With the North and the East still part of Karaz Ankor, the Dawi are in a better position than even the height of their Golden Age, and the diplomatic relations with the Elgi has already become fairly regular, especially with the Brana helping smooth over any rough patches. The war with the Fimir might end up being the catalyst for even closer relations, especially if Malekith shows up to help. He'd be earlier than in canon, but there are a lot of possible reasons for that. And, say what you will about him, but he's impressive both as a mage and as a general. He'd be a big help against the Fimir.
 
Yeah in no particular order so far:
-Underway made it to the north.
-North and East are not cut off
-Brana exist
-Hashut got ganked by Gazul, chaos dwarfs went from being a faction to being infiltrator cultists
-Karag Dum is abandoned, they moved to Kraka Grom, one of Hashut's shards is permakilled and knowledge of Chaos dwarfs is known
-The underway is already fortified because Grimnir got grumpy before the incursion
-Karaz Ankor is way stronger at this time than it was in canon, they're going to need less elven help clearing their territory out
-The runiversity will probably derail losing runesmithing knowledge
-Gromril chain is mass produceable now, more protected armies
-The first elven settlement is in the north
-First dwarfen naval tradition is shaping up to be in the North
-Dwarfen expansion seems to be increasing rather than stopping with the loss of the north/east in canon

Some more speculative stuff:
-Brana are acting as cultural mediators between dwarfs/elfs
-Malekith's time in the Old World is probably going to be different unless a lot of monsters show up out of somewhere
 
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To the rumor of the dragon. Can Snorri make fire breathing mechanical. (Insert a flamethrower in place of the lungs and a supply of napalm instead of the stomach.) This way you can save space for the rune. Snorri, as an alchemist, can improve the fire mixture over time. Excuse me for being illiterate, I write through an auto-translator.
 
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