Not Moid, but I suggest we grill him for what information we can, handle him, and be ready to intervene when he tries shady stuff.
And expect the worst.
Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
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- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
And expect the worst.
- Location
- HELL
- Pronouns
- They/It
No. He isn't. Sadly, this ain't new.
Brace for impact. Prepare. Just because he will not stop and he has all the powers of persuasion and manipulation to ruin your day doesn't mean you can just let him. Make sure he doesn't exploit Madoka's martyr complex. Make sure he doesn't goad Sayaka into contracting. Offer other solutions. Etc.
TL;DR last as long as you can.
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My view of the Incubators is that they are antagonists only due to circumstance. Were it not for the fact that the Magical Girl/Witch system that they've put in place is the most efficient means of combating entropy, they wouldn't give the slightest care about Earth. If they were to discover some other, more efficient, means of gathering energy then they'd abandon the current system and never look back.
Now, since the odds of that happening in this Quest are so small as to make an electron feel fat, then the best thing to do with regards to Kyubey is the same as any other dangerous situation: take steps to minimize the risks, don't take unnecessary risks, be prepared for Bad Things.
You can't fight the hurricane, but you can weather it.
Now, since the odds of that happening in this Quest are so small as to make an electron feel fat, then the best thing to do with regards to Kyubey is the same as any other dangerous situation: take steps to minimize the risks, don't take unnecessary risks, be prepared for Bad Things.
You can't fight the hurricane, but you can weather it.
Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
All we need to do is figure out how to turn grief into a Jaeger.
celdak
[Maniacal laughter]
- Location
- Behind you.
Little problem, the hurricane was here before us, and will be most likely even after us...
Hyacinthium
Writing about sad cannibals as we speak.
- Location
- Bedroom
- Pronouns
- He/Him
No because he has no emotions and doesn't understand them.
Hmm so it seems like the options people have come up with boil down to: try to minimize the damage the incubators do to us by manipulation and hope they don't do anything more direct; or try to build a new system that gives the incubators what they want better than the current system.
Let's hope we can manage the second. Since the first is rather unambitious and not suitable for one at sufficient velocity type thinking.
Let's hope we can manage the second. Since the first is rather unambitious and not suitable for one at sufficient velocity type thinking.
- Location
- HELL
- Pronouns
- They/It
You're right. We should aim for great heights while forgetting that our cannon can't quite hit the moon, but can only hit someone's house which is about a block away.
And said house is our friend's.
And our friend just got cancer because the round was radioactive. And this was all your fault.
And this is the point where the metaphor breaks down.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
So we're down to ad hominems now and aren't actually engaging with arguments?
How? That's what the question is.
Choo Choo
THE GRIEF TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES
- Location
- Sweden -> California
- Pronouns
- She/her
Make a stupid suggestion...
Go. Re-watch the show. Don't worry, we'll wait. And when you come back, you can tell us all about how trustworthy Kyubey is again.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
Kyuubey is as trustworthy as a government or business. Which means, not very, but not zero either, so long as the right precautions are taken.
Choo Choo
THE GRIEF TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES
- Location
- Sweden -> California
- Pronouns
- She/her
See, this is what happens in every PMMM!Quest. "WE JUST NEED TO TAKE PRECAUTIONS. WE CAN OUTSMART THE KYUBEY. THERE IS NO WAY THIS COULD GO WRONG."
Cue things going wrong. It never works. I haven't read WitchQuest, but from my understanding it's pure crack and not serious at all. Fun crack that's worth checking out, but still crack.
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Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
Precautions include not antagonizing him unnecessarily. Which is what the PMMM Quests always seem to do. Because the assumption is that Kyuubey will inevitably dick us over, so Rochelle eats him and winds up on his vivisection table instead of going "okay, I'll hug the kyoko" and getting a pile of gold.
Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Always wash your hands after holding Kyuubey. Women who are nursing, pregnant, or may become pregnant should ask their doctor before using Kyuubey. If despair lasts for more than four hours, seek medical attention.
- Location
- HELL
- Pronouns
- They/It
Oh, don't be such a baby.
You want me to yell at you for being a fucking imbecile, then sure. I'll do that. Because your grasp of Incubator behavior is tenuous at best and fucking wrong at worst.
That's reaching so far and so long that it's like fucking rubber. I could hang things on it. Support a bridge. Probably raise a family with a house that's supported by how fucking far you're stretching here.
Don't assume things of the GM.
Dude, have you even seen the fucking show? Do you even have a minute grasp of how Incubators function or act?
Because if you've seen even a few episodes, you'd know that this isn't the fucking case.
I don't think your version is any less likely to end in radioactive flames though. Moderating the impact of Kyuubey's emotional manipulation is only going to work so long anyways before he breaks out more active attacks at which point you're screwed anyways.
Besides which the whole nature of quests is to aim for absurd goals. That's where most of the fun comes from. Setting an absurd goal and then trying to carry it out despite or perhaps more accurately because the odds being heavily against success.
For that matter, a happy ending for magical girls was achieved in the original PMMM. Why is it so unreasonable to try to achieve a different happy ending in this version?
The name of this forum is Sufficient Velocity. If our cannon can only reach our friend's house a block a way we use that cannon to build a bigger cannon repeatedly until we get one that can reach sufficient velocity.
We're not quite Madoka-tier of potential or ingenuity.
"Everyone in the vicinity of Mitakihara lives happily ever after and never witches" is absurd enough as is; we'd need a very specific set-up for anything more ambitious than that and I doubt incubators factor into such an impossible good end.
The only idea coming to mind is trying to set up shenanigans with someone who has a power-amplifying power&somehow making grief drainage automated...and even then it's a dubious idea.
Sufficient Velocity will be stellar when it comes to creative destruction but even with our powerset, I'm dubious about our ability to pull off more than limited salvation.
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- Location
- HELL
- Pronouns
- They/It
Sufficient Velocity is very good at making things go boom and very little else.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
He said outright that kind of thing would happen. I just noted it and thought it would be funny.
Dude, have you even seen the fucking show? Do you even have a minute grasp of how Incubators function or act?
Because if you've seen even a few episodes, you'd know that this isn't the fucking case.
The Incubators act in an "economically efficient" manner. They are closer to H. Econimicus than to humans. They are not empathetic in the least, nor are they more trustworthy than your average big business or government.
This doesn't mean they are always inevitably hostile. Kyuubey has been nothing but helpful to Mami, likewise he was never actively unhelpful to Kyoko. Homura opposed him, so he obstructed and acted against her.
Choo Choo
THE GRIEF TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES
- Location
- Sweden -> California
- Pronouns
- She/her
tankdrop24
Tread First into Hell
- Location
- The Center of the Universe: Toronto, Canada
- Pronouns
- He/Him
So, what I'm getting from this thread is that we should fire Kyubey out of a cannon at the moon, then sell what's left of him as drugs for pregnant women?
Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Manipulating her into getting herself killed probably counts.
- Location
- HELL
- Pronouns
- They/It
"Man I wonder what happened in Episode 9 hmm maybe it was something involving saying that there was a tiny chance of her getting Sayaka back and using that to his advantage naaaah just my imagination."
Seriously, guy?
Loops
...
Ok, ok. Here's some arguments then. This is getting really silly.
Incoming Gendo Mami.
True... He wants Sabrina to witch only as badly as any other meguca. He stays with Mami because she's a useful tool, a powerful magical girl who attracts others to become like her, while still totally in the dark about the true horror of the system. She's good cover, so he can play the stereotypical magical animal/familiar. She's lonely, so she seeks out girls to contract. And she's brittle, as a bonus. The second after she helps bring down Sayaka's witch it's murder-suicide time. Mami is not an example of incubator fair play.
He wanted Kyouko to come in and push her buttons with Sayaka's JUSTICE so she's not a good example either. And with Madoka he said outright "let me know if you're up for becoming the worst witch in the world to help me out kthksbai."
He'll be exactly as helpful as he needs to be to meet his own goals, no more no less. What possible intel are you hoping for that's worth Kyubey knowing the Sabrina knows things she shouldn't? And also, how would you phrase those questions in such a way as to not reveal metaknowledge?
Homura shot Kyubey to keep Madoka from contracting. She was chill enough with coobs to hang out with him and let him ride around on her post-Madokami. She told him a story that was backed up by nothing about a girl who never existed retroactively, and coobie sealed her soul gem as a trap so that he could conduct experiments on Madoka to make energy collection more efficient.
Yes, you're not taking Rebellion as evidence. But the fact remains that the incubators pre- and post-Madokami did not change one bit. They still seek energy to prevent entropy, they still contract little girls to fight horrible monsters. The monsters changed, the system did not. The end result of the system, the witch consequence for the meguca and everything after that, was taken by Madoka's wish, but that's all. Even using just the series as evidence.
TL;DR: Coobie a shit, avoid if possible, deal with sparingly and great care if not. He is on his own side.
Incoming Gendo Mami.
True... He wants Sabrina to witch only as badly as any other meguca. He stays with Mami because she's a useful tool, a powerful magical girl who attracts others to become like her, while still totally in the dark about the true horror of the system. She's good cover, so he can play the stereotypical magical animal/familiar. She's lonely, so she seeks out girls to contract. And she's brittle, as a bonus. The second after she helps bring down Sayaka's witch it's murder-suicide time. Mami is not an example of incubator fair play.
He wanted Kyouko to come in and push her buttons with Sayaka's JUSTICE so she's not a good example either. And with Madoka he said outright "let me know if you're up for becoming the worst witch in the world to help me out kthksbai."
He'll be exactly as helpful as he needs to be to meet his own goals, no more no less. What possible intel are you hoping for that's worth Kyubey knowing the Sabrina knows things she shouldn't? And also, how would you phrase those questions in such a way as to not reveal metaknowledge?
Homura shot Kyubey to keep Madoka from contracting. She was chill enough with coobs to hang out with him and let him ride around on her post-Madokami. She told him a story that was backed up by nothing about a girl who never existed retroactively, and coobie sealed her soul gem as a trap so that he could conduct experiments on Madoka to make energy collection more efficient.
Yes, you're not taking Rebellion as evidence. But the fact remains that the incubators pre- and post-Madokami did not change one bit. They still seek energy to prevent entropy, they still contract little girls to fight horrible monsters. The monsters changed, the system did not. The end result of the system, the witch consequence for the meguca and everything after that, was taken by Madoka's wish, but that's all. Even using just the series as evidence.
TL;DR: Coobie a shit, avoid if possible, deal with sparingly and great care if not. He is on his own side.