Oh, sure - and all it costs is a Main action and TEN WEALTH to generate 5 points of Tech. To fill up the 10 Tech a turn we would be bleeding under your proposed policies, we would need to take two Main actions, and spend twenty Wealth. Even if you set aside the sheer extravagance of spending 20 Wealth, and the near-impossibility of finding 2 free Mains in our schedule, this would eat up our entire Wealth cap for the turn, leaving us with the inability to do any other Wealth actions at all.

This is not a viable solution by any measure.
You mean aside from the huge number of Expand Econ actions we no longer have to make room for every turn? This is what I mean by transitioning to a tech based civ. Actions that would have previously been spent on econ are then used on tech instead. Never mind the fact that Support Artisans can be taken as a Guild action while Expand Econ cannot and thus is more flexible.

You're still ignoring the fact that the future is not now. We currently would bankrupt if we had three IW3 fall out of the sky, but that's not how this goes. As I mentioned, we're 75% of the way to paying for 20 wealth on their own marketplaces, with plenty more sources after that, even before you get to the fact that this action is very likely to be affected. Combined with the likely stat cap increase, 20 wealth is not always going to be the crippling burden it is now. We're not getting two more level 3 cities in a single turn, or any time soon for that matter.

Sure. If and when AN waves his magical GM wand and says that Ironworks stop having the mechanical problems that they have now (i.e. ruining the Expand Econ action), then we will be able to move Ironworks from the "liability" to the "asset" column in terms of mechanics. Until then, it is undeniable fact that they destabilize our stats mechanically, and there is no way to spin things that changes this.

This is silly. Unrevealed mechanics and effects are not "waving his magical GM wand." IW3 literally has an "other stuff happens" effect right on the tin. This is not "spin" and does not change the fact that your conclusion of ironworks being fundamentally bad is rocky at best. AN has basically said "ironworks are really useful and people want them" every time they come up. Just because we cannot explicitly see why that is does not change that, and AN has made it clear that we have to try things without knowing the exact outcomes sometimes.

It is far more likely to be that we simply don't know the whole story, rather than "ironworks are bad, don't build them."
 
Maybe cultural innovation would improve the "everyone thinks we're weird" thing.
Not likely. We have perpendicular cultural values to the era standard. They'd always think we're weird.

-Personal Stewards of Nature - Obsessive about the land. Neighbors who acquire it lose it rapidly due to the difficulty of holding said land over the long term, and furthermore the environmentalism angle makes breaking into and expanding metalworking much harder than it has to be.

-Greater Justice - This is a rare value to retain because it goes against individual impulses. Not impossible, but outside of a communalist society the pursuit of Justice for the many rather than Privilege for the few is rare.

-Pride in Acceptance - Xenophilia. Anyone with this who's not also King of the Hill would rapidly have their traits eroded and replaced with foreign ones. And also accepting refugees when everything's fucked is how you break yourself as a country. Natural disasters are bad enough without martyrdom.

-Joyous Symphony - This one isn't THAT weird, but it requires continuity of state to be preserved. Anyone who suffers a social fracture(which is common), tends to lose it, because in the wake of civilization collapse strongman rule is the norm.

-Honorable Death - Somewhat uncommon, but with all the warrior cultures out there, not unknown.

-Philosopher Kings - Like Pride in Acceptance, this is a naturally deselected value. Most people prefer stability to a trait which threatens stability at random intervals.

-Purity - Ironically this trait actually makes us more understandable to people. Cleanliness is a common social value in an era where disease is a massive problem and xenophobia is a survival instinct.

Our Honor values meanwhile are shockingly normal.

I don't really know what culture even is... Our art is pretty cool... we could probably invest in theater more but I'm worried that it would result in our people watching plays instead of working their gardens.
If this statement is made unironically, then that kind of highlights the exact problem with our ability to push cultural values out there. For a communalist society, we don't really communicate.
We can just set up steles with illustrative pictures at various popular stopping points in the Steppes.

Men on Chariots look at Stele. Men on chariots ride to the forest. Men on Chariots get perforated by arrows launched by forest. Dead Charioteers rot on the ground.

Men on Chariots look at Stele. Men on chariots ride to the forest. Men on Chariots get perforated by arrows launched by forest. Dead Charioteers rot on the ground.

Men on Horses look at Stele. Men on horses ride to the forest. Men on horses get perforated by arrows launched by forest. Dead riders rot on the ground.

Men on horses look at stele. A red arrow points to the empty space next to the picture, where the war is usually depicted. The Ymaryn words 'You are Here' are written on it.
"Meh, we can take them"
OTOH, we've only just now discovered paper. Sure, we have clay and stuff to write down stuff, but our writing output is probably not that significant and 90% administration.
We had vellum for thousands of years.
I believe that if we put religious authority tolerance into narrative form, it would be how powerful the priests can get without having an adverse effect on our society. Things like zealotry, bigotry, fundamentalism, and narrow-mindedness are cancer to the intellectual powerhouse our country is in its current form, and the preventative measures, as well as the excision of those cancers are the general awareness and theological capability of our citizens. If we do not wish to become another Highland Kingdom, but still wish to continue benefiting from a powerful and well founded belief system, we need our citizens to be educated.
Thats about right, the Academy and the Palaces come from two different angles:
-Palaces makes the priests views more integrated with the establishment elite view, increasing state oversight on their activities and vice versa. This means both sides can exert subtle pressure before it has to get ugly with divergent opinions.

-Academies increases the public's ability to question and examine, which in turn forces the priesthood to engage more deeply with society and remain in touch with customs and trends(this would help avoid where you get ivory tower priests speaking out against the latest new thingy).
The very article you linked to makes it rather clear that evolution is denied not so much by religion itself but by evangelical protestants and minorities- the proportion for 'white mainline protestants' who give credence to the theory of evolution is in fact higher than 'unaffiliated' who presumably are not very religious. This indicates that evolution-denial is not really a religious issue as it is a cultural one.

And yeah, that puts aside that the fact that most religions including Catholicism have no issue reconciling their religious doctrine with the evidence of evolution.

I don't mind quoting Isaac Asimov on this one: "There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."

Anti-intellectualism is a phenomenon that often uses religion to justify itself, but it is typically a cultural phenomenon moreso than it is a religious one.
Mixed complicated situation. The priesthood are culture guardians. Ergo, they will naturally act to resist developments which potentially goes counter to tradition, myth and cultural values.

Observe how our environmentalism trait triggered social friction when we developed cavalry out of concern for animal cruelty, and how it triggered social friction when we delved into metalworking and it risked scarring the land.

These are both advances made POSSIBLE by our priesthood to begin with.
True, but I don't think we can afford wooden rails either. Something like that probably has a cost in Sustainable Forest slots and we're not terribly rich in those. The wood necessary to build rails has to be high quality; straight, heavy duty, etc. and that's not easy to find. Plus, wood left on the ground (even if it's laid on a bed of stone) rots extremely quickly or has termites get into it. It would be an ongoing expense in order to maintain it. We'd need some way to treat the wood to make it more durable to make this a lot more feasible.
Rails are not nearly as costly as you seem to think. Early rails were used for bulk, heavy goods usage, you can expect them to see uses in the docks and harbors, the ironworks, quarries and mines, where the sheer efficiency and labor savings are more than worth the continuous replacement.

The cost of producing rails is more to do with the cost and availability of metal. Even for wood rails, the replacement rate is still much less wood than is used for housing, shipping or even furniture.
Yeah that's about right. It was what I could find. /shrug. I would assume religious tolerance is a part of religious authority tolerance. Because for example: We have a really high religious authority and our priests are large and in charge, but they have a lot of religious intolerance(i.e they hate other religions) and so our society starts having stability issues because of them going on witch hunts. (This could be us hitting red RA). Increasing education so other people and other priests can bring forth arguments to talk down these ideas sounds like a pretty good explanation of increasing religious tolerance(thus gaining +1 RA cap) as these more moderate folks balance out the more extreme.

Hmmm. Okay. That makes sense.
Religious tolerance is more to do with social and religious values. We're Syncretic, so we're highly accepting, whereas by contrast Monotheistic would be more rejecting of other belief systems. Pride in Acceptance pushes for accepting, while Purity pushes for rejecting.

Symphony and Justice produces conditional acceptance, they both value differing faiths which make no trouble and improve the lives of the people, but they strongly reject any faith which causes friction in other ways.
New vassal! Loyalty makes sense given we just took it, but i'm surprised the dependency didn't start at 5 given it's army was destroyed and it was mostly just pastures i think...
We replaced the army with our Martial investment, and the Forhuch had spent several turns repairing the stuff the Pure burned.
Was "Bolt Thrower"
Wooo, better siege and heavy ranged weapons :) Presumably some of the innovations on crossbows carried over to their larger cousins given time, since i dont think they'd be too useful in the nomad fights...
Much more than you'd think. Effective horse drawn ballistas like historical Alexander used are a functional(if not really effective) counter for horse archers because a ballista can always outrange an archer.

Which is a pretty big difference from "I can hit you, but you can't hit back". The range advantage helps mitigate the mobility lack, and REALLY helps for hardpoint defense.

Nomads are glory mad, but theres no glory is being shot dead from far away.
Note that level 3 will give another "stack" of the level 1 and 2 effects, not just the level 3. So with the policies building the lv 3 aqueduct we'll have:
+1 E/-1 EE/-1 T To every Expand Economy action
+2 Econ/-1 Tech to agriculture policies
+2 Econ Upkeep offset, -1 tech for city support
+1 tech/turn
*Mystery action cost changes, presumably/hopefully reductions*
With luck, those certain action costs will include reducing wealth costs for some things, but probably it'll "just" be reducing tech or econ costs.
Quite interesting, that.
Very useful; iirc the winning plan literally only uses build mills for the guild actions :p Basically, with all the farmers and urban poor out at war, the artisans have to be willing to be levied by the state to build mills to keep people fed, or to survey in search of wealth to keep the war machine going. Gymnasiums are a little weirder, but i guess aside from their help with secondary martial limit, they narratively involve training commanders.
Gymnasiums are basically barracks I think, in their next iteration.

As for the mills...no idea how that works out narratively, and AN is apparently deliberately keeping it a mystery.
Ouch D= Sounds like the harmurri rolled poorly and/or the HK rolled well :( Really wish they'd held together better...though i guess the double trigger of nomads, that we rolled no stab loss on, was nice to get given our econ situation :p
Narratively it sounds like a critfail on defense, causing their king to be caught in the way of murder.
Interesting. So still not technically at war with highlanders...though if we let them collapse the harmurri we can expect them to attack us.
Also noting that the Harmurri would make the ideal staging ground for invading Txolla.

Here's the problem with your analysis when it comes to ironworks. You've looked at the numbers and seen that there are stat problems related to it. There's two conclusions we can reach from this:

1) There's something we're missing
2) Ironworks are bad and we should avoid them

The problem with the second option is that it runs completely counter to history. It requires reality to say, you know what, we'd be better off not having more iron and steel. It's not worth the investment.

I mean, it's not like we didn't experience the exact same thing with:
-Panem
-Level 1 Ironworks
-Level 2 Ironworks
-Level 3 Ironworks
-Libraries
-Roads
-High level cities
-Governor Palaces
-City Support
-Influence vs Support subordinate
-Temples
-And now Academies

There are hidden factors which are deliberately kept hidden until we go and do it. Mathematical efficiency only leads to short term optima, which is important if we're say, nearly starving, but not nearly as important for long term success.
 
I believe the solution to our Tech woes is the Academy as that is where our artisans can get trained.

If we want the Tech Passive to make a similar dramatic upgraded as Agriculture and City Support did with Ironworks we will have to grid our teeth and build a few. Because we are currently trying to do the proto-industrial revolution without an organized education system to train the personel. You can whine all you want about inefficiency.

Modern society should look at education is inefficient as well, by that reasoning. Schools only cost money, after all. None of the students pay for attending. What reason could there possibly be to invest billions into education?

Staying on easy Expand Econ is a local optimum. Build Academies and libraries to break out of it.

And quite frankly, a large, skilled workforce is going to be our new great advantage over competitors. It's something they can't just blindly copy or steal. It's something where our high labor costs and contempt for slavery is an asset.

So I call bullshit on inefficiency. It's a larger project than most, but for once we can actually be fairly sure about the benefits as that is what happend IRL.
 
As for the mills...no idea how that works out narratively, and AN is apparently deliberately keeping it a mystery.
It works out pretty easily, I think - our guild economy was born out of artisans supplying the army during the first Epic Age. However, the new Levy army needs new things to supply them, namely, large amounts of food, with the usual suppliers all fighting. Well, artisans are not going to go out there and farm, that's low class manual work, so what should they do? Helpfully, we have those things that take care of a lot of that manual work, so artisans build them, even if it's not something they would usually do.
 
On the subject of tech costs, can we please take another Arsenal Annex?
  • Arsenal x3 (+1 Safe Martial, +1 Tech/turn)
I think there's a decent chance of this giving us a tech drip for every palace at 4x. Once we get more provinces, we can add stables/fortification/whatever, but this seems like a very cheap, quick way to help with this.
 
On the subject of tech costs, can we please take another Arsenal Annex?
  • Arsenal x3 (+1 Safe Martial, +1 Tech/turn)
I think there's a decent chance of this giving us a tech drip for every palace at 4x. Once we get more provinces, we can add stables/fortification/whatever, but this seems like a very cheap, quick way to help with this.
Later. I want at least 2 of each before that, so right now I would like Garden x2. Afterwards, after we integrate Txolla, we will have 5 more slots to work with, I want Stables x2 and Fortifications..ugh, at least x1.
After that, another Arsenal would be nice.
 
Later. I want at least 2 of each before that, so right now I would like Garden x2. Afterwards, after we integrate Txolla, we will have 5 more slots to work with, I want Stables x2 and Fortifications..ugh, at least x1.
After that, another Arsenal would be nice.
Why would that be more important than tech costs? All of those things would certainly be nice to have, but if tech costs are projected to be a concern for people, why would we build it last?
 
Why would that be more important than tech costs? All of those things would certainly be nice to have, but if tech costs are projected to be a concern for people, why would we build it last?

Because we have no guarantee it will affect tech costs; mechanical effects of later upgrades do not necessarily follow from earlier ones.

If you want to deal with Tech, Governors Palace in Gulvalley is a better thing to look at, because it will guarantee Tech refund.


As for why I want Gardens...well, synergy effects and setting example to follow for regional palaces wrt trees in palaces.
 
The Timeline Megaproject is complete. Choose quest reward!

[J] Evolve Thread Social Value.
[J] Start Work on the Spreadsheet Megaproject.
[J] Free Expand Free Time for the next ten updates.
[J] Gain a new clerk.

Now, seriously, we have a timeline in which all the chapters are summarized to the best of our ability. It had not been proofread, so you will be in for a painful read. The timeline also provide us with fairly precisely dating, at least in term of which events belong to which century. No more constant manual counting, because the records are kept to the best of our abilities.

Interesting statistic is that we have 1300 years of generational turn, not including the early turns which could be anywhere from seven hundred to one thousand years. So ~2000 years is about the age of our civilization.
 
Because we have no guarantee it will affect tech costs; mechanical effects of later upgrades do not necessarily follow from earlier ones.

If you want to deal with Tech, Governors Palace in Gulvalley is a better thing to look at, because it will guarantee Tech refund.


As for why I want Gardens...well, synergy effects and setting example to follow for regional palaces wrt trees in palaces.

Every Annex is a gamble, so I don't see how that changes things in regards to what we build next. We're only able to speculate on the effects of the others with even less to go on. Unless your desire is strictly that the Palaces have trees in them, with mechanical effects being an unimportant factor.

Another GP will indeed be nice and something we definitely want to get around to, but it'll only translate to a single tech/turn for costs due to the way they only refund once.

Refunds are great. If we had the option to choose between 1 refund or 1 drip, then we'd take the refund every time. Pound for pound, they just perform better. Unfortunately, that's not reality, since we have to invest far more for refunds than we do drips typically. While the synergy bonus grants 0.5 tech refund, the Arsenal bonus (if it is in fact a tech drip) would probably be 1 tech drip, which makes it much more effective for paying for ironworks effects. Combining a little bit of both is even better, effectively negating 1.5 tech/turn per GP.

Now, if you want to get other Annexes simply because you want them more, then I can't really argue with that as your priorities are different. But I still think the Arsenal could potentially help help us head off a problem before it gets here for very little investment, and that seems more valuable than the others to me.
 
Did AN ever tell us what Memory of Spirits was doing this turn?
Being forgotten!
I'm incapable of un/ironic statements.
Then it just highlights exactly how we're overlooking the importance of cultural tools to push our values and protect our values.
It works out pretty easily, I think - our guild economy was born out of artisans supplying the army during the first Epic Age. However, the new Levy army needs new things to supply them, namely, large amounts of food, with the usual suppliers all fighting. Well, artisans are not going to go out there and farm, that's low class manual work, so what should they do? Helpfully, we have those things that take care of a lot of that manual work, so artisans build them, even if it's not something they would usually do.

I mean, why Mills are normally not Guild, but are Guild during Levy
 
Combined with the likely stat cap increase
There has been zero indication of a stat cap increase. This is just wishful thinking.

You mean aside from the huge number of Expand Econ actions we no longer have to make room for every turn? This is what I mean by transitioning to a tech based civ. Actions that would have previously been spent on econ are then used on tech instead. Never mind the fact that Support Artisans can be taken as a Guild action while Expand Econ cannot and thus is more flexible.
We could at least to Expand Econ as a PSN and a Balanced action, both of which have been our main source of the action so far. Not so for Support Artisans!

As for guild actions... sure, that would lessen the burden somewhat, yes. Only, I'm fairly confident that one of the changes the update DOES make is take away player control of Guild actions. They are going to be faction actions like any other; our economic system just means that the Guild gains extra actions from sources that would normally not be available.

As I mentioned, we're 75% of the way to paying for 20 wealth on their own marketplaces, with plenty more sources after that
Much of that income will go to pay expenses - e.g mercenaries (which eat up a good third of all your market income even with three lvl3 cities each with lvl3 Ironworks). Most of the rest will likely to pay for our new wealth expenses.

But even if you set those facts aside, the fact that you have the resources to do a thing doesn't mean said thing is worth said resources.

Your proposed solution is at best problem solving via excessive application of resources. Better than dying, certainly, but still very much not an acceptable state of affairs.

This is silly. Unrevealed mechanics and effects are not "waving his magical GM wand." IW3 literally has an "other stuff happens" effect right on the tin. This is not "spin" and does not change the fact that your conclusion of ironworks being fundamentally bad is rocky at best. AN has basically said "ironworks are really useful and people want them" every time they come up. Just because we cannot explicitly see why that is does not change that, and AN has made it clear that we have to try things without knowing the exact outcomes sometimes.
If someone puts vomit-scented incense on your desk, it smells horrible right now - and this is true every if, for whatever reason, you might suspect that the candle will transition to smelling like something else in the future. It remains true even if if happens to soothe your cough or whatnot.

In the same way, the current Lvl1 mechanical effect of Ironworks is unambiguously terrible for us, and will CONTINUE to be absolutely terrible up until the effect is modified somehow. This is true regardless of how useful AN might say it is narratively, and it is true regardless of whether he plans to change the action in the future.

Now. You can say that you are pushing to build Ironworks anyways - perhaps for the supposed narrative effect, perhaps for the higher level benefits, or perhaps for the chance that the Ironworks will stop being terrible.if we just bear with it enough times.

Fine. Believe that if you want. But I can confidently tell you that the current Lvl1 Ironworks mechanics are terrible and will continue to be terrible up until AN changes that with a significant modification to the system somewhere.
 
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Modern society should look at education is inefficient as well, by that reasoning. Schools only cost money, after all. None of the students pay for attending. What reason could there possibly be to invest billions into education?
Education pays off quite handily IRL when you think on the scale of decades. Sure, students don't pay for attending, but if your schools are doing anything at all then in the future those students will be more productive and less likely to turn to crime, both of which are significant societal benefits.

So really, if Academies worked like modern education, you should expect each academy to provide mechanical benefits, albeit ones that might be delayed a turn (~20 years).

You can whine all you want about inefficiency.
So I call bullshit on inefficiency.
Has anyone called Academies inefficient with regards to dealing with tech problems? I must have missed it.
 
I mean, why Mills are normally not Guild, but are Guild during Levy
Because Guilds don't normally build mills, but do build them during Levy? Mills are very suburban infrastructure, after all, and don't really benefit from uniting. Maybe if we do a lot of mills during Levy, it'll change.
 
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If someone puts vomit-scented incense on your desk, it smells horrible right now - and this is true every if, for whatever reason, you might suspect that the candle will transition to smelling like something else in the future. It remains true even if if happens to soothe your cough or whatnot.

In the same way, the current Lvl1 mechanical effect of Ironworks is unambiguously terrible for us, and will CONTINUE to be absolutely terrible up until the effect is modified somehow. This is true regardless of how useful AN might say it is narratively, and it is true regardless of whether he plans to change the action in the future.

Now. You can say that you are pushing to build Ironworks anyways - perhaps for the supposed narrative effect, perhaps for the higher level benefits, or perhaps for the chance that the Ironworks will stop being terrible.if we just bear with it enough times.

Fine. Believe that if you want. But I can confidently tell you that the current Lvl1 Ironworks mechanics are terrible and will continue to be terrible up until AN changes that with a significant modification to the system somewhere.

Than stop tunnel visioning on mechanics.
 
But even if you set those facts aside, the fact that you have the resources to do a thing doesn't mean said thing is worth said resources.

Your proposed solution is at best problem solving via excessive application of resources. Better than dying, certainly, but still very much not an acceptable state of affairs.

You're still stuck thinking about things purely as they are right now. Support Artisans could become a React action if we need it, the effectiveness of the action could be increased via IW3, we could reduce the wealth cost of actions via mechanization of menial tasks, we could retain control of our guild actions due to it remaining the basis of our economic system, tech drips could become more common, etc.

As for whether or not its worth it, even if all we did was start taking Support Artisans in place of Expand Econ, that would be worth it due to insane amounts of innovation rolls.

If someone puts vomit-scented incense on your desk, it smells horrible right now - and this is true every if, for whatever reason, you might suspect that the candle will transition to smelling like something else in the future. It remains true even if if happens to soothe your cough or whatnot.

In the same way, the current Lvl1 effect of Ironworks is unambiguously terrible for us, and will CONTINUE to be absolutely terrible up until the effect is modified somehow. This is true regardless of how useful AN might say it is narratively, and it is true regardless of whether he plans to change the action in the future.

Now. You can say that you are pushing to build Ironworks anyways - perhaps for the supposed narrative effect, perhaps for the higher level benefits, or perhaps for the chance that the Ironworks will stop being terrible.if we just bear with it enough times.

Fine. Believe that if you want. But I can confidently tell you that the current Lvl1 Ironworks mechanics are terrible and will continue to be terrible up until AN changes that with a significant modification to the system somewhere.

From what I can tell, you're still ignoring a fundamental part of this quest. That being that we do not get to operate from a perfectly omniscient position that allows us to see the exact results of our actions. You see anything unknown as broken and in need of modification, which is just not how it rolls most of the time. We're simply operating from a position of limited knowledge as is intended. Calculating stat effects and efficient actions is great for not starving or something, but looking at what math we are allowed to see and basing the entire trajectory of the civ off it, while deliberately ignoring non math based information which comes to the exact opposite conclusion is irrational.

There's no believing that ironworks are good, or that actions often have hidden effects. AN has explicitly told us these things, and history reflects this. Looking at the immediately distasteful effects of IW1 for Expand Economy and ignoring everything else doesn't really change that, nor was it really what I was talking about, so I don't see how confident you are on that point as very convincing. I specifically mentioned how the current mechanics trend us away from relying on Expand Economy and why I think that's working as intended. I don't see one action, or group of actions, overtaking another as broken or in need of modification.

I genuinely mean no offense, but I really think you need to get out of this mindset of current math = everything, and if it's not good its broken and needs modification. AN has already chastised us for constantly focusing on local optima, and frankly it comes of as a little disrespectful as it implies AN somehow didn't see the effects of his own mechanics instead of knowing something we don't. No one is saying we should completely drop using math to plan things, but using math we know is missing a whole host of hidden factors to justify avoiding something we've been told is beneficial, or know is beneficial from a historical standpoint, goes way too far.
 
Education pays off quite handily IRL when you think on the scale of decades. Sure, students don't pay for attending, but if your schools are doing anything at all then in the future those students will be more productive and less likely to turn to crime, both of which are significant societal benefits.

So really, if Academies worked like modern education, you should expect each academy to provide mechanical benefits, albeit ones that might be delayed a turn (~20 years).

Excellent point. Let's build Academies then.

Has anyone called Academies inefficient with regards to dealing with tech problems? I must have missed it.

Academies themselves, no. But the Tech drip from passives. And the Ironworks demonstrated that infrastructure can improve those passives tremendously. I expect Academies to give Tech Passive a boost the same way Ironworks gave Agriculture and City Support a boost.

Similarly, I expect more concrete to boost both Defence and Infrastructure Passives as those suddenly get both good tools and an easy to use material.

The Culture Drip is likely to need a few more theatres to come into it's own. We'll probably get a Coliseum/Hippodrome style Megaproject first once the Games reach a certain size and we need to house all those spectators. And while no games are on, other cultural events can take place.

Mysticism is likely going to be affected by Observatories and higher level Temples.


The point is, the Passives need infrastructure to back them up and reach their full potential.

If we look at modern civilization and use the mechanics of the quest, then a nation has a boatload of Passives while the central government has comparatively few actions. But it works because the Passives take care of most stuff on their own already. So I'm absolutely in favour of relegating our food production to the Passives and use our more limited player actions to do other things.
 
Than stop tunnel visioning on mechanics.
Kinda hard to do that while he explicitly talks about mechanical effect Ironworks have, not even whether or not we should build them. And that effect is pretty terrible, though I guess we could just build enough to punch through overflow.

While talking about tech crunch, I think it's another problem we need to run into to fix. It, in the end, represents skilled labor, and if Guilds run into not having enough of it (i.e. having to cannibalize other stats for Tech), I'd wager they will try to find some solution, like technical schools.
 
^^
Thats how the modern schooling system arose in part. You needed mass, low level education to staff the factories of the industrial revolution
Because Guilds don't normally build mills, but do build them during Levy? Mills are very suburban infrastructure, after all, and don't really benefit from uniting. Maybe if we do a lot of mills during Levy, it'll change.
Hmm, true enough, Mills are definitely a very cottage industry thing compared to the generally urban Guild actions. So the Levy forcing them to take up suburban and rural milling development could kickstart local cottage industries for the purposes to processing raw materials.
 
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Kinda hard to do that while he explicitly talks about mechanical effect Ironworks have, not even whether or not we should build them. And that effect is pretty terrible, though I guess we could just build enough to punch through overflow.

While talking about tech crunch, I think it's another problem we need to run into to fix. It, in the end, represents skilled labor, and if Guilds run into not having enough of it (i.e. having to cannibalize other stats for Tech), I'd wager they will try to find some solution, like technical schools.

Nah, that's the problem: talking about mechanical effects of Ironworks misses that we do not even know all said effects due to narrative effects with mechanical consequences.
 
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