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Paths of Civilization

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Citino said:
We'll have to see how to handle this in the future. We could subsidize the miners by having the kingdom buy out their ore, to be stored in case of emergency.
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Seems like we should mostly give up on mining locally. Focus more on metalwork. Of course have an ore reserve in case our neighbors try and pay games.
 
065tdsa said:
While iron ore is most of our mines, there's plenty other mines so even in the worst case mining expertise is always going to be in demand. Also, while our miners might be in trouble, their ironworks infrastructure is basically doomed for the time being, which is very bad for them.
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It's honestly not that bad of a situation. Trade ties, especially ones like this, reduce the likelihood of the nations going to war, because each of them depend on the others to provide a piece of the production chain.

As long as we keep at least some iron mines open, we're fine even if there is disruption in trade, and this also serves to keep us competitive in the iron trade.
fictionfan said:
Seems like we should mostly give up on mining locally. Focus more on metalwork. Of course have an ore reserve in case our neighbors try and pay games.
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We need to have some iron mines, just in case of trade disruption. It's similar to how modern nations will subsidize farmers even if they are producing a surplus. Iron and food are necessary items for our society, so a country will make sure they have enough supply of their own to survive trade disruptions long enough to either remove the disruption or to build up the infrastructure to solve the supply issues.
 
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Citino said:
It's honestly not that bad of a situation. Trade ties, especially ones like this, reduce the likelihood of the nations going to war, because each of them depend on the others to provide a piece of the production chain.

As long as we keep at least some iron mines open, we're fine even if there is disruption in trade, and this also serves to keep us competitive in the iron trade.

We need to have some iron mines, just in case of trade disruption.
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We probably will, if only because I expect shipping enough ore to sate the Ymaryn's ravenous thirst for iron from over seas to be basically impossible in this era.
 
Janadus said:
We've got 80+ Martial already. The extra six Martial on top of that just isn't worth as much as re-rolling the Trader quest for something hopefully less expensive. The last thing we want to deal with right now is the consequences of a failed quest, and since we don't want to spend the Wealth or the action on More Warships, we should just take a different quest.

If we were planning to go for More Warships next turn, Extra Turn would be good, but we're not so it isn't.

I should also note that if we don't like the Trader Quest we get from Re-roll, because we will have Supported twice now, we can let them fail it. If we go for Extra Turn, on the other hand, we'd burn our free fail on the current quest and be forced to deal with the next one.
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Thing is, we want to spend action on Warships. Or, at least, I do - 1 Naval is pretty uncomfortable place to be.
 
BungieONI said:
I voted for it since I want the patrician yeoman support, which the other two do not provide. And I want to actually complete the navy quest.
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While I can understand wanting to complete the Navy quest, is a +1 Navy reward really a priority right now?

Rather than repeating my arguments, I'll just quote my previous post in case you missed it.

8bitBob said:
I want to discuss the trader vote.

Currently, the winning vote is:

[] [Traders] Support Faction for an extra turn (Patricians will switch support to Yeomen immediately)

I don't understand why people prefer this. The main advantage it grants is more martial, which, as a reminder of our current martial:

Martial 9/37 {85/39} Levy Overmax: Pay for it later

We currently have very little need for more temp martial. According to AN, having more won't be that detrimental, but that doesn't change the fact that we straight up don't need more martial at the moment.

The other advantage to this vote is that it allows us more time to complete the current Trader quest. Frankly, the quest is nice, but it's not mission critical to gain single extra point of Navy when all of our current problem are in the steppes or lowlands. We could better spend this wealth on a Support Sacred Order, or any number of other things like letting wealth overflow into Econ and preventing our cities from popping, which would tank our wealth income as markets go offline.

That leads me to our other option:

[] [Traders] Support Faction for a new faction quest (Patricians will not switch support immediately)

According to the update, the Traders are no longer pissed. I am assuming that means they will no longer generate a spite quest and are no longer suppressing our innovations. This gives us a chance to generate a new, more situation appropriate Trader quest from a happy faction at temp power of 8, while also greatly improving our chance of innovating warfare technologies. With a genius martial, this could easily lead to great leaps in tactics and warfare, or perhaps supporting a wartime economy.

This seems much more potentially valuable to me at the moment than 6 temp martial and a potential +1 free Navy (if we have the time for it) for boats we aren't using right now.
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065tdsa said:
While iron ore is most of our mines, there's plenty other mines so even in the worst case mining expertise is always going to be in demand. Also, while our miners might be in trouble, their ironworks infrastructure is basically doomed for the time being
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Citino said:
It's honestly not that bad of a situation. Trade ties, especially ones like this, reduce the likelihood of the nations going to war, because each of them depend on the others to provide a piece of the production chain.
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Not to mention - all other things being equal, less mines in our land means that if we ever want to open such mines in the future, we've got more natural resources to dig up.
 
[X] [Hero] The War Chief is an Avatar of War (Genius Martial, at least semi-stable Diplo and Admin)
[X] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[X] [Traders] No
[X] [Traders] Support Faction for a new faction quest (Patricians will not switch support immediately)
[X] [React] Sec Proclaim Glory
[X] [Kick] No further kick
 
[X] [Hero] The War Chief is an Avatar of War (Genius Martial, at least semi-stable Diplo and Admin)
[X] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[X] [Traders] Support Faction for an extra turn (Patricians will switch support to Yeomen immediately)
[X] [React] Sec Proclaim Glory
[X] [Kick] No further kick
 
065tdsa said:
We probably will, if only because I expect shipping enough ore to sate the Ymaryn's ravenous thirst for iron from over seas to be basically impossible in this era.
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Yeah, though we do have the problem of this new trade boom making it more attractive for our neighbors to step up their slaving game. So that'll be fun.

On the other hand, it also makes the Freehills and SY very interested in working with us. The Freehills can expand south, into the Not!Med, while the SY can expand west into Europe, while we can expand either north or east. So with the benefits of working together so clear, and with us stepping up steel and iron production to feed their armies, we can probably expect the west to stay mostly pretty peaceful.
 
Janadus said:
We've got 80+ Martial already. The extra six Martial on top of that just isn't worth as much as re-rolling the Trader quest for something hopefully less expensive. The last thing we want to deal with right now is the consequences of a failed quest, and since we don't want to spend the Wealth or the action on More Warships, we should just take a different quest.

If we were planning to go for More Warships next turn, Extra Turn would be good, but we're not so it isn't.

I should also note that if we don't like the Trader Quest we get from Re-roll, because we will have Supported twice now, we can let them fail it. If we go for Extra Turn, on the other hand, we'd burn our free fail on the current quest and be forced to deal with the next one.
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You say we, but I want to. Looking to the future, I want a naval presence of around 4 so that we don't have to worry as much about hostilities on the sea. And this option gives us even more martial to help ensure we get to the win and can push through to the point that we can get the naval.

Also, in either case if we let the quest fail, the free negation is used and we are forced to deal with the next quest. Unless you mean something different, because you are not being very clear with this part.
 
[X] [Hero] The War Chief is an Avatar of War (Genius Martial, at least semi-stable Diplo and Admin)
[X] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[X] [Traders] Support Faction for a new faction quest (Patricians will not switch support immediately)
[X] [React] Sec Proclaim Glory
 
[X] [Traders] Support Faction for a new faction quest (Patricians will not switch support immediately)
[X] [React] Sec Proclaim Glory
 
BungieONI said:
You say we, but I want to. Looking to the future, I want a naval presence of around 4 so that we don't have to worry as much about hostilities on the sea. And this option gives us even more martial to help ensure we get to the win and can push through to the point that we can get the naval.

Also, in either case if we let the quest fail, the free negation is used and we are forced to deal with the next quest. Unless you mean something different, because you are not being very clear with this part.
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If we support the Traders again, we can roll for a new quest right away.
 
BungieONI said:
Also, in either case if we let the quest fail, the free negation is used and we are forced to deal with the next quest. Unless you mean something different, because you are not being very clear with this part.
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Are you sure? There's no failure consequence, so would it still consume the negation even if there's nothing to negate?
 
8bitBob said:
While I can understand wanting to complete the Navy quest, is a +1 Navy reward really a priority right now?
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Right, right now it's not a priority, nor is it something we can actually do. However I am trying to keep the future in mind after this war and set us up to get things I want done then, completed.

Citino said:
If we support the Traders again, we can roll for a new quest right away.
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I want this one. :p
 
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Academia Nut said:
The northern nomads are Martial 5, LC 5.
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Of course they are. So the Forhuch were the one group that we just weren't prepped to fight, the one group that we even went so far as to spam gifts, trade missions and megaprojects so we wouldn't have to fight them.

And then they decide to fight us anyways.

Dammit.

I hope the previous Forhuch King's advisors are feeling at least as annoyed about this guy's decision as we are.
 
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[X] [Hero] The War Chief is an Avatar of War (Genius Martial, at least semi-stable Diplo and Admin)
[X] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[X] [Traders] Support Faction for a new faction quest (Patricians will not switch support immediately)
[X] [React] Sec Proclaim Glory
 
Citino said:
I hope the previous Forhuch King's advisors are feeling at least as annoyed about this guy's decision as we are.
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Well considering that he is the eldest surviving son, and the youngest son, of the Forhuch Khan we first met I have a feeling there was quite a bit of a mess in the family house.

Those elder sons had to die somehow, after all.
 
Citino said:
On the other hand, it also makes the Freehills and SY very interested in working with us. The Freehills can expand south, into the Not!Med, while the SY can expand west into Europe, while we can expand either north or east. So with the benefits of working together so clear, and with us stepping up steel and iron production to feed their armies, we can probably expect the west to stay mostly pretty peaceful.
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A Triple Entente so to speak?
 
Nobody's got Medium Cav yet, right? Or at least not in any meaningful quantity? The fact that AN keeps specifying Light cav is probably just for accuracy's sake, but still, worrisome.
 
Academia Nut said:
Although there probably is an Iron Age Bismarck who is very annoyed right now.
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I will take solace in the fact that there is an Iron Age Bismark somewhere that is raging at the stupidity of the king at attacking, when trading would have gotten him a shitload of wealth, power and prosperity.

Iron Age Bismark: WHY?! WHY THE YMARYN?! LITERALLY ANYONE ELSE? SURE, OK, A NICE WAR IS GOOD AND ALL, BUT WHY THEM?!
 
So, important things.

I require an omake from the perspective of our Vassal, ThunderHorse at the moment. Bonus points if the player base is all tsundere towards us.

If we manage to make it to fighting the HK and sweep in to save the day, I require an omake from the Harm too! Preferably from the viewpoint of someone playing the game like a Europa Universalis type set up and seeing we're coming in to save the day with an 80+ stack of martial.

These reactions. I need them. Please?
 
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