Econ is a much more useful stat to have than martial, and it's a bigger drip, yes. I'd be happy enough with that.
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
That's not remotely the point. If you want to keep our current value 5 from the limit, you can do that too. If your total forests are 30, you can do
Do 28{25} -> 31{25} -> ... -> 46{25}->49{25}, and the only reason you aren't getting to 50{25} is because this is a constructed example and you are going up by exactly 3 each time. You are just using a "soft-cap" of 25 for your forests instead of your somewhat-harder cap of 30; just work off of the soft-cap and you are fine.
- Location
- Austria
I mean. For us, Econ is Martial, at least a third of Econ.
And it's the biggest drip, unless you count free Infrastructure projects....I mean, they are free, which in case of Block Housing or Ironworks means a lot of free stats...but they are not exactly stat incomes, so I am not sure whether they count.
Plus, again, they are liable to start chewing through our forest slots if we get any more Infrastructure which consumes a lot of fuel; like Level 2 Baths or Ironworks.
Of course; and if we have enough voting discipline to always work off the soft-cap, I am going to be happy enough* with the results.
*Full happiness is, of course, terraforming and foresting steppes partially because forests partially because fuck you nomads
'fraid not. It reduced our Econ City Upkeep by 2, but our City Upkeep refunds EE, so e lose out on that EE.
So yeah; it is just two econ, or half of a current Expand Economy action. Only 40% once the Ironworks come up and said action gets better.
Really, for now, we really want to put our passive policies on Infrastructure actions. We know that the free cities will dynamically move their policies around every turn in response to what they see is needed, which gives us some buffer, as player directed infrastructure policies are much better than free city ones, and so we don't want them deciding that infrastructure is an unmet priority.
- Location
- Austria
Wait, so Panem is defacto +1 EE/turn per city?
Plus narratively it does not make a lot of sense to me. EE refund is representation of people leaving farmland to go to the city. City Support simply means city feeds itself. How does having city feed itself cancel out people still leaving farmland to go into city?
Well, I'm not staking a claim there one way or another. My entire point was constrained to stating that we can use kilns to effective double our forest supply, not merely increase it by 50%. Currently, with 25 undoubled forests, we are going to be able to do another 8 or so Main Kiln actions, assuming demand keeps up.
Of course, we will almost certainly add more forests during that time (from forest policy if nothing else); and those too can get doubled...
Point is. I expect that we WILL need to worry about running out of Kiln space eventually - but not now, and not in the next century ingame, and maybe not in twice that either. In the meantime, we can safely take valuable actions like completing the Priest quest and building Roads and sorting out diplomacy and building our Palace Annexes up.
Romv
A Memory of TREES
Soooooooo ... theatres, got it.
Oooooh, Black Soil that's great too!
I like this line of thinking.
I mean, take a look at our income right now:Wait, so Panem is defacto +1 EE/turn per city?
Plus narratively it does not make a lot of sense to me. EE refund is representation of people leaving farmland to go to the city. City Support simply means city feeds itself. How does having city feed itself cancel out people still leaving farmland to go into city?
The -6 on Economy income is from city upkeep and Panem. The +6 is that being refunded.
I also don't understand how it works narratively, and I've said as much in the past as well. So I'm afraid I can't clear that up for you.
We don't need to Black Soil either. Just do an Expand Economy, and then have our econ go 18->28, overflowing 4 points into Wealth as we gleefully take our new value slot.
The main point is that we can't spend more than 4 points of econ this turn. If we did (e.g. by building Ironworks), we don't get to finish the priest quest this turn.
- Location
- Illinois
Well, I imagine it comes from population increases due to the importation of food from the colonies. Econ isn't just food, after all, it is also manpower to get things done.
Umi-san
Procrastinating.
- Location
- ꙮ
If we have 2 sustainable forests we're using out of 2 available, we can go down to virtual 1 (1/2 of 2) and then back up to virtual 2, using a factual 3. With 3 total usage we can go back down to 1.5, then back up to 2, getting another .5 for 3.5, + 2 - 3.5/2, + 2 - 3.75/2, + 2 - ...
Sure, we can use twice our baseline forests ignoring the granularity of forest usage.
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- Location
- Austria
Dam.
No, seriously, Dam is better than ever because it connects us to vassals and allows to way better trade with Harmurri. With channel I mean.
Plus we need more Econ now. It's not like it's shiny even: it gives us a lot of benefits for, what, 8-12 Econ commitment?
Sooo I'd like to say we should try to fit either Dam or Influence Thuner Horse into the next vote. Can we?
I mean.
One of Guild actions is obviously Kilns; another one is preferably the same.
You mean midturn? Or you mean on the next full turn?
Spending no more than 4 Econ on main turn is a tricky prospect, seeing as guild actions alone will most likely take 4. Means we either have to do Mills or something.
But we cannot really do the exact plan until we see the midturn, can we?
Yeah, I've looked at income when posting and noticed it. That's weird, honestly.
You know, using the cities to generate EE is narratively a bit screwy for me. Mechanically, it's wonderful.
But narratively it means a fuckton of second, third and so on sons being forced into effective poverty and ground up in the industrial machine that is a city.
Black Soil may not be as easy as just the passive effect of the cities, but it represents us actually expanding useable farmland and as you said, leads to terraforming.
Of course, it also has the downside of the Half Exile troubles getting worse, so we can't really use it without a lot more roads and a few strategic temples that make sure that the spirit of the system is kept. But the damn priests themselves are ironically blocking that from happening as we are scared of them actively interfering in the government.
And yet, we have an actual separate stat that tracks their governmental interference. And we really don't know what red Religious Authority for us even means. For all we know, it just means the priests are actively cracking down on disharmonious behavior and people have enough faith in them to follow along.
We need black soil for wealth generation to fulfill the patrician quest and to give EE so we don't overcrowd.
Romv
A Memory of TREES
Porcelain all the way! We shall rule the world like the Xoh of old: through the power of precious pottery!
Not!China will be grumbling bout how we already stolen porcelain from them before they could invent it.
No we don't? We refund up to our True City count (should be at least 5 by midturn) worth of Econ overflow per turn as EE. No need for any black soil.
I am saying that for this turn's action (i.e. the Reaction vote and anything else that might come up), we can't spend more than 4 econ. I'm not going to try spending 4 or less econ in a main turn; while it might be possible, it basically isn't happening barring really strong incentives.
Our Guild actions next turn are probably L2 Ironworks + Charcoal Kilns.
I want the Dam, but putting it next turn is probably bad timing. We get the free megaproject at that time, and I don't know how it would interact with a dam action. However, I would totally vote for a main Expand Forest, or even a double main if circumstances permit. What say you?
Mm.
I can understand not wanting to confuse the issue of a free megaproject.
And I'd certainly be up for expanding forests.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Is our LTE high enough for this to be reasonable?
I'm not sure what you mean. Our LTE is currently 27, but what does that have to do with the actions I proposed? Neither Ironworks nor Kilns use LTE, after all.
- Location
- United States
So, do we know of any ways to increase passive tech gain besides building Arsenal's?
Since it seems that the more ironworks we build, the more important tech will become.
The best tech increasing action, support artisans, also has a one for one exchange of tech and wealth, which we are starting to run rather low on as of late.
Is there any plan for increasing our tech gains in the future?
Since it seems that the more ironworks we build, the more important tech will become.
The best tech increasing action, support artisans, also has a one for one exchange of tech and wealth, which we are starting to run rather low on as of late.
Is there any plan for increasing our tech gains in the future?
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Its not... actually that bad of a problem right now, as it is very very easy to get +5 or so refund out of it. *scratches head*
+3 is easier and means we have time, so it hasn't really been considered that I've seen.