Paths of Civilization

Golden Eyed King · Jul 23, 2017

So i think the law then the games then the Dam

Hyacinthium · Jul 23, 2017

All this servant talk while I play FGO...

Servant Rulwyna l when?

notgreat · Jul 23, 2017

Unless The Law changes the way The Law's doubling applies (which is quite plausible) I want to stay on Megaproject Support as long as we can. Here's the options:

The Games - (2-3? action commitment, -2 Mysticism and Culture per action, 2 Econ total commitment) [Elites]
Grand Docks - (4-6? action commitment, -2 Econ per action, requires 2 Forest slots)
Great Dam - (4-6? action commitment, -2 Econ per action)
Place to the Stars - (5-8? action commitment, -2 Econ and -2 Mysticism per action, 0/6 Mysticism commitment)

Analysis:
Games- Needs more Culture after our Proclaim Glory this turn
Docks- Needs 1 more forest slot (main action, or we do a secondary and our provinces do a secondary as well)
Dam- Will likely need to spend some of the LTE it gives if we want to keep our cities, gives us a stability point so a good choice if we drop down
PttS- We want at least a 2-chain on Study Stars, preferably a 4-chain.

So all of the megaprojects require a little bit of additional work, but they're all fairly cheap additional requirements.

Kiba said:
Do we need to make boats to reap the full benefit of making hemp?

We just need to have boats at all (not be a land-locked nation).

Kiba · Jul 23, 2017

Grand Dock required only a total of two forest slots? Cheaper than I thought.

Umi-san · Jul 23, 2017

[X] [Main] The Law (Iron Age)
[X] [Secondary] More Boats
[X] [Secondary] Plant Hemp
[X] [Free] Found Colony - Change Greenshore Trading Post to a Colony
[X] [Free] Change Passive Policy - Defense (+1 significant walls/turn)

Want catamarans finished. Do not see the point in PG when we won't have two stats at max (16) for a while. Boat + Hemp synergy seems sensible, especially in combination with the switch to a Colony.

N.B. Prior to the games we may want to make Warrior's Rest a temple and hold it there. It's not the most accessible for our coastal territories but it's fairly central. I imagine this would result in a slight uptick in militarization, however, and thus we may want to consider alternate options. Then again, with the ability to retrain, that may not matter the most.

TheDanishLord · Jul 23, 2017

Got me thinking about the nomad fears of the thread

Killer_Whale · Jul 23, 2017

notgreat said:
Analysis:

Dam is actually a decent option for getting a Golden age after finishing the law.

notgreat · Jul 23, 2017

Umi-san said:
Want catamarans finished. Do not see the point in PG when we won't have two stats at max (16) for a while. Boat + Hemp synergy seems sensible, especially in combination with the switch to a Colony.

~~Only need to be golden (14), not max.~~ We've got the stats.
edit: Whoops, it is max. We still have the stats though, since the stability needs to stay maxed while the stats just need to touch them.

Killer_Whale said:
Dam is actually a decent option for getting a Golden age after finishing the law.

Dam takes 2 turns to complete (possibly 3). It's a long project. Also who knows how much Stability we'll spend doing overambitious Law reform, refugees (MW?), and other such things. If things go well we'll PG now and get the Golden Age. If they don't... well, who knows where we'll be.

pbluekan · Jul 23, 2017

notgreat said:
Unless The Law changes the way The Law's doubling applies (which is quite plausible) I want to stay on Megaproject Support as long as we can. Here's the options:

The Games - (2-3? action commitment, -2 Mysticism and Culture per action, 2 Econ total commitment) [Elites]
Grand Docks - (4-6? action commitment, -2 Econ per action, requires 2 Forest slots)
Great Dam - (4-6? action commitment, -2 Econ per action)
Place to the Stars - (5-8? action commitment, -2 Econ and -2 Mysticism per action, 0/6 Mysticism commitment)

Analysis:
Games- Needs more Culture after our Proclaim Glory this turn
Docks- Needs 1 more forest slot (main action, or we do a secondary and our provinces do a secondary as well)
Dam- Will likely need to spend some of the LTE it gives if we want to keep our cities, gives us a stability point so a good choice if we drop down
PttS- We want at least a 2-chain on Study Stars, preferably a 4-chain.

So all of the megaprojects require a little bit of additional work, but they're all fairly cheap additional requirements.

We just need to have boats at all (not be a land-locked nation).

Kiba said:
Grand Dock required only a total of two forest slots? Cheaper than I thought.

I would be up for the docks provided we did a Main Expand Forest with it. I would rather, however, get on with all the shit we need to actually do. Namely stallion integration, redshore aqueduct, and txolla influence. Integrating the tribes needs to happen. Moving on with megaprojects is all well and good, but there is a lot we need to get done before things spiral out of control again, and if nothing else, the stallions are the biggest.

When we are done with the law the next turn, IMO, should look like this:

[Main] Integrate March - Stallion Tribes
[Sec] Found Mercenary Company - Stallion Tribes
[Sec] Whatever the hell you want.

Abby Normal · Jul 23, 2017

Analysis and Diffcheckers -- "Playing Around"

Diff Checker (Civ Sheet)
Diff Checker (Civ Sheet BBCode)
Diff Checker (Actions)

Academia Nut said:
General
Diplomacy 11 [+2]
Economy 15 [-1+6]
-Sustainable Forests 10/11
-Econ Expansion 14 [+1-6]
Martial 10 {15}
Wealth 8 [+5-1]

Diplo 8 -> 11

8 + [1-?] (Salt Gift) + [1-2] (Trade Mission) = 11
So rolled 1 on one of them, 2 on the other. Not bad, but not great either

Econ 16 -> 15

16 - 1 (Festival) - 1 (Proclaim Glory) = 14 + 1 (???) = 15
Hmm...

Econ Expansion 12 -> 14

12 + 1 (Festival) + 1 (Proclaim Glory) = 14

Wealth 16 -> 8

16 - 2 (Festival) - 2 (Trade Mission) - 5 (Salt Gift) = 9 - 1 (??) = 8
Hmm...

Academia Nut said:
Cultural
Culture 6
Mysticism 11 [+1]
Tech 7
Prestige 55

And art has split into culture and tech!
Let's figure the art change first:
12 - 3 (Proclaim Glory) + 2 (Festival) + [1-?] Salt gift = [12-?]
Since we ended up with 13 total stats, i guess we gained 2 from salt gift, and then things split (otherwise we'd have less tech, since none of those actions deal with tech now)

Mysticism 3 -> 11

3 + 6 (Refund) + 1 (Settlement) + 1 (Salt Gift) = 11

Prestige 53 -> 55

53 + 2 (Salt Gift) = 55
Salt gift continues to be great for prestige

Academia Nut said:
Stability
Stability 2 (hopeful)
Legitimacy 3 (max)

Stability -1 -> 2:
-1 + 1 (Festival) + 1 (PG) + [0-2] (RO) = 2
So RO rolled average

Academia Nut said:
Writing (Mixed Logo-/Phonographic)

Early Writing -> Writing, because the Census requires new words and stuff

Academia Nut said:
Artistry
Comedy & Drama
Epic Poetry

New social concepts!

Academia Nut said:
Entertainment
Specialists
Theatre

"Non-caste semi-specialists" -> Specialists
And theatre is new

Academia Nut said:
Best of the Best
Whether in war or in art, the People want only the best, damn the costs
Pros: Increase Martial gain from raising elite units, bonus Art and Mysticism for certain actions
Cons: Increased potential Martial loss in fighting, increased social stratification, increased costs

@Academia Nut minor thing, but this still says art, instead of culture and/or tech

Academia Nut said:
It was not every day that Rahullinar, the Lightning Wolf, was told that a delegation the size of a small tribe wished to speak with him. It was even less often that farmers from the south composed that delegation and had many wagons full of goods loaded up as part of the delegation.

And so we see just how ridiculous our trade + salt gift stuff is now.

Academia Nut said:
A leader of the delegation also rode out upon his chariot, but he was also flanked by warriors directly upon horses clad in rattling scales of silver.

Huh...i can't tell if this is supposed to mean we actually have decorative silver horse armor for trade missions, or that the nomads just don't recognize iron...

Academia Nut said:
The southerners then began to bring forth an eye bulging and mind boggling procession of bags of precious metals, gems, dyes, spices, incense, glass and what had to be several ox's weight in salt.

And so our trade dominance shows itself...

Academia Nut said:
"Friends?"

"Uhhhh... yeah, I think we can probably work something out..." Rahullinar sort of mumbled

XD

Academia Nut said:
It was, however, at the feast in the night that Rahullinar decided on what to do about these people, and that was to leave them alone. Not because they honoured and respected him, or because they had dangerous weapons, but because of their stories! Once the wine got out they got to telling one of their great stories, and some of them were so into it that they began to take up the roles of the characters and act them out. There were obviously religious ceremonies where something like this might happen, but these were more human tales that they were acting out the various parts. The grand drama of the Fall of Xohyr was especially fascinating, giving keen insight into the thoughts of the southerners. As they tied themselves to the land, so too did they tie up their emotions, but when let free they were like horses enraged at the bit unhitched. They should free themselves from such things, but they would also make decent friends and allies, and troublesome enemies.

Oooh--AN went into more detail on this in a WoG, and i like the lessons the People took away from the Fall of Xohyr. Also interesting that we call it the Fall, and Txolla calls it the Sack...

Academia Nut said:
"Sure we can't tempt you to take your tribes in a different direction?"

"I go where I wish, although I shall leave your people in peace."

"Well, I suppose we cannot ask for anything more at this time."

...Damn

Academia Nut said:
Rahullinar knew that they wished him to take his tribes to the far east and avoid the lands of the south-west, but he knew that the mountains were rich in plunder and the lands beyond were excellent pasturage. He also knew that they got some of the tribute they had given him from the rich mountains, which was both why they wanted him to go elsewhere for his loot and glory, and why he wanted to go in the first place!

Yeah, that's going to be a problem

Academia Nut said:
For the King of the People, the news that the nomads north had been somewhat mollified with tribute, but had obvious intentions on the Metal Workers and the territory around them, was of course a mixed bag. Fortunately, efforts closer to home to pacify the population had been more successful. A combination of efforts had improved the happiness of the People and increased their confidence in the idea that the king and crown were there to support them. Murders were definitely down, although some of that might be because people were starting to move out of the cities and into the new farms south of the cataracts. With just a bit of effort the soil there could be turned to rich, well watered farmland while not being so terribly far from the center of things like in the Western Wall or Gulvalley.

Hmm, thats good at least.

Academia Nut said:
Most interesting though was that, in improving the festivals while also proclaiming the glory of the crown and the People, several of the groups had begun dramatically retelling the epics of old in new and exciting ways, acting them out somewhat like religious plays, but significantly more elaborately and intimately, and that had produced some rather interesting effects. As the plays grew more elaborate, there were now calls for more dedicated places to perform these plays from.

Entertaining!

And our festivals have finally crit and given us awesome new social tech

Academia Nut said:
Art Patronage - Wealth of the first and second kind can be used to create wealth of the third kind to the benefit of all
*S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, +3 Culture, +1 Tech, +1 Prestige, potential innovations
*M: -1 Econ, -4 Wealth, +5 Culture, +1 Tech, +1 Prestige, higher chance of innovations

4/6 Art -> (3 Culture, 1 Tech)/(5 Culture/1 Tech)

Academia Nut said:
Build Chariots - The vehicle of the elite, chariots are the most effective way of waging war the People know.
*S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, +4 Martial, +1 Culture
*M: -2 Econ, -5 Wealth, +8 Martial, +2 Culture, +1 Prestige

Art gain replaced with culture, from decorated chariots

Academia Nut said:
Build Glassworks - A new material discovered recently, new luxuries and trade goods could be made from relatively cheap materials
*S: -1 Econ, -2 Tech, 1 Sustainable Forest used, +2 Wealth, +2 Culture, chance of new innovations
*M: -2 Econ, -2 Tech, 1 Sustainable Forest used, +2 Wealth, +4 Culture, increased chance of new innovations

This got way more expensive, but also gives more stuff. -2 Tech cost added, but went from 2 Art/(1 wealth, 3 art) to (2 wealth 2 culture)/(2 wealth 4 culture).

Academia Nut said:
Build Mills - By harnessing the power of flowing water, work can be done, freeing up considerable amounts of labour
*S: -2 Wealth, -1 Tech, +3 Econ, potential for innovation
*M: -3 Wealth, - 1 Tech, +4 Econ, increased potential for innovation

One wealth cost less for both levels, in exchange for 1 tech each. Best of the Best doesn't seem to apply to make the main the same cost as the secondary anymore.

Academia Nut said:
Build Theatre - Having a place for the presentation of plays should be a great way to propagate the People's culture and entertain the masses
*S: -1 Econ, -1 Wealth, -1 Culture, +4 Culture end of turn, other effects
*M: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, -1 Culture, +4 Culture end of turn, +2 Culture next turn, other effects

New action! Very much something we want... if nothing else because WW or ST will build one otherwise...

Academia Nut said:
Build Watchtowers - Stone and brick towers for warriors to sit in and scan the horizon for trouble, these towers can help stave off raids and improve response against attacks. (30% coverage)
*S: -1 Econ, +5% coverage
*M: -1 Econ, +10% coverage

We lost 10% coverage on watchtowers from integrating Gulvalley, we should fix that...

Academia Nut said:
Patronage (+1 Cutlure/turn)

@Academia Nut minor typo here.

Academia Nut said:
xpand Economy - Encourage the growth of food producing activities such as farming, pastures, or fishing, depending on where focus is placed
*S: +3 Econ, -3 Econ Expansion, potential additional effects
*14 Econ Expansion available (max 12 to keep Sacred Forest True City; max 17 for Valleyhome)

Doesn't list the EE needed to regain Sacred Forest, which would be good to know...

Academia Nut said:
Expand Snail Cultivation - While now more reliably grown and harvested, the snail domestication has only managed to hold environmental changes at bay rather than increase production. More investment would increase cultivation
* S: -1 Econ, +1 Wealth, +1 Culture, potential additional effects
* M: -3 Econ, +3 Wealth, +1 Culture, increased chance of additional effects

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
Expand Vineyard - There is a location in Blackriver that is judged an ideal place to grow the small fruits that are favoured for making a particularly potent drink
*S: -1 Econ, -1 Econ Expansion, +1 Wealth, +1 Culture
*M: -3 Econ, -2 Econ Expansion, +4 Wealth, +1 Culture

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
Influence Subordinate - By transferring specialists and teachers to subordinates they can be nudged into behaving more to the liking of the core provinces
*S: -2 Diplo, Transfer 2 Econ, Wealth, Culture, Tech, and Mysticism; influences subordinate culture
*M: -3 Diplo, Transfer 3 Econ, Wealth, Culture, Tech, and Mysticism; significantly influences subordinate culture, +1 Loyalty

Uggh, even more expensive now...

Academia Nut said:
Improve Annual Festival - A festival for every season, but their expansion can help put the People at ease and teach good practices.
* S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, +1 Stability, +2 Culture, chance for additional effects
* M: -2 Econ, -2 Wealth, +1 Stability, +4 Culture, chance for additional effects
* Max Stability: Legitimacy - 1

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
More Blackbirds - Elite scouts and woodsmen, the Blackbirds are a potent force, if not exactly mainline fighters. More of them could prove useful
* S: -1 Econ, -1 Mysticism, -1 Wealth, +2 Martial, +1 Culture, many more Blackbirds, additional effects
More Carrion Eaters - Keepers of sacred and profane knowledge, the Carrion Eaters thread a dangerous path but bring valuable knowledge for treating wounds and inspiring courage, greatly bolstering the morale of warriors by ensuring them that their companions are not doomed if they fall. More could prove useful.
*S: -1 Econ, -1 Mysticism, -1 Wealth, +2 Martial, +1 Culture, many more Carrion Eaters, additional effects

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
More Boats - The things are expensive but oh so useful, so having more of them will increase your capacity for trade, travel, and fishing
*S: -2 Econ, -1 Wealth, +1 Tech; +1 Econ end of turn, +1 Econ, +1 Econ Expansion and Diplo next turn, additional effects
*M: -2 Econ, -1 Wealth, +1 Tech; +1 Econ, Econ Expansion, and Diplo end of turn, additional effects
* used 8 times

Art -> Tech, as Best of teh Best pushes our boat builders to figure out new construction tricks, not just new decorations.

Academia Nut said:
New Settlement - There are a few new sites that could have new settlements placed on them: northern Blackriver (+3, moderate mineral, 0/6 province), far north-eastern Redhills (+1, good mineral, 0/6 province), south along the great river (+6, poor mineral, 1/4 province), south-western hills (+2, moderate mineral, 1/4 province)
* S: -1 Econ, +1 Econ and Mysticism end of turn, increases number Econ Expansion depending on environment, +1 Province progress
* M: +1 Econ and Mysticism, increases Econ Expansion, +2 Province progress

New expansion opportunities off of the Cataracts settlement.

Academia Nut said:
New Trails - There are many settlements with only marginal trails, so more could be useful. 2/3 to next Centralization cap increase (4/14)
* S: -1 Econ, +1 Centralization, +1 Diplo, other effects
* M: -2 Econ, +2 Centralization, +2 Diplo, other effects

Huh...I think that means we've already gained 4 centralization cap from trails? And can gain up to 14... @Academia Nut can you confirm that thats what that means?

Academia Nut said:
Plant Hemp - This sturdy plant has been planted in limited quantities before, but you now have cultivars that can take well to being planted in large areas and could use it for
*S: -2 Econ, -2 Econ Expansion, +1 Tech, +1 Mysticism, +2 Diplo if have boats, +1 Econ next turn
*M: -3 Econ, -3 Econ Expansion, +2 Tech, +1 Mysticism, +3 Diplo if have boats, +1 Econ next turn, other effects

New action! i think AN said we should have had this a while ago? Still, looks pretty nice, sad that the secondary doesn't have effects to it...

Academia Nut said:
Proclaim Glory - By using art the King can promote people to trust his decisions; modified by Diplomacy skill
* S: -3 Culture, -1 Econ, +1 Legitimacy, +1 Stability, potential +1 Prestige
*M: -6 Culture, -2 Econ, +1 Legitimacy, +2 Stability, +1 Prestige
* Max Stability: Legitimacy

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
Raise Army - More men can be inducted into the ranks of the warriors every year and not face major food shortfalls
* S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, +3 Martial, +1 Culture, potential additional effects
*M: -3 Econ, -4 Wealth, +7 Martial, +1 Culture, potential additional effects
*2M: -4 Econ, -5 Wealth, +Culture Art, founds Martial 10 Mercenary Company

Art -> Culture
@Academia Nut typo on the 2M Version.

Academia Nut said:
Retraining - When there are more warriors than the People know what to do with, it may be a good idea to find them something else to do
*S: -3 Martial, -1 Econ Expansion, +1 Econ, Culture, and Tech
*M: -5 Martial, -2 Econ Expansion, +2 Econ, Culture, and Tech

!!! New action via census, which looks amazing!

Academia Nut said:
Salt Gift - With the saltern, the People have access to tremendous amounts of salt, which can be used to awe outsiders
*S: -5 Wealth, random amount of Diplomacy, Culture, and Prestige generated (min. 1 of each) and the possibility of Mysticism generation
*M: -8 Wealth, random amount of Diplomacy, Culture, Mysticism, and Prestige generated (min. 1 of each)

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
Study Alchemy - Materials can be made to transform their form through special treatment. What wonders can be discovered in this process?
*S: -2 Mysticism, -2 Wealth, +1 Tech, potential new discoveries
*M: -4 Mysticism, -3 Wealth, -1 Econ, +1 Tech, increased chance of new discoveries

Alchemy now gives Tech in a straight up buff

Academia Nut said:
Study Metal - Iron and copper, gold and silver, what other secrets are hidden in metal and stone?
* S: -1 Econ, -1 Wealth, -1 Mysticism, +1 Tech, small chance of new insights
* M: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, -1 Mysticism, improved chance of new insights

Metal gives tech for a secondary, and only costs 1 mysticism in teh main, in a straight up buff. Odd that it doesn't give tech as the main... @Academia Nut is that intentional?

Academia Nut said:
Support Artisans - With the growing importance of skilled artisans to the maintenance of society, additional support may sometimes be needed
*S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, +3 Tech, +1 Culture, potential innovations
*M: -1 Econ, -4 Wealth, +5 Tech, +1 Culture, higher chance of innovations

New action, seems pretty important to me.

Academia Nut said:
Saltern - Northshore Saltern Expansion (0/3), Southshore Saltern Expansion (0/3). Each {S} committed consumes 3 Econ and 3 Tech for 3 Progress. Completion gives additional Wealth and every 2 salterns or expansions increases the per turn Wealth by +1

Art -> Tech

Academia Nut said:
Governor's Palace - Every palace lowers Min. Centralization by 1 and can decrease communication issues with distant provinces, but can also serve as the core of a breakaway state in a civil war. Each {S} costs 3 Econ and 3 Culture and produces 3 Progress

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
Library - Any location with a temple and/or True City status can have a library, with each {S} committed consuming 3 Tech and 3 Mysticism for 3 progress. Completion grants Mysticism, every 2 libraries past the first increases the Mysticism refund by 1. Sacred Forest (0/3)

Art -> Tech, which seems odd...i'd have expected Culture for this.

Academia Nut said:
Palace Annex - Can construct additional palace annexes, with each {S} committed consuming 2 Econ and 2 Culture for a new annex (7/11)

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
Special: Working on new boat design, building more will accelerate progress
Special: Free use of setting Passive Policy to set new slot

Boats still in progress, and free policy opportunity.

Academia Nut said:
The Games - Physical competition and prowess are becoming a popular pass time and way for warriors and militia to train. Could a special festival be founded to celebrate this? (2-3? action commitment, -2 Mysticism and Culture per action, 2 Econ total commitment) [Elites]

Art -> Culture

Academia Nut said:
The Law (Iron Age) - With new technologies, innovations, and social structures, old laws require a thorough redo in order to align with modern expectations (3-4? action commitment, -2 Mysticism and -2 Tech per action)

Now have fluff and details for this

Academia Nut said:
Place to the Stars - The shamans have noticed deeper patterns among the stars than they ever imagined, and setting up long term memories of where things should be could be intensely useful, if also labour intensive to get sufficiently durable markers in place (5-8? action commitment, -2 Econ and -2 Mysticism per action, 0/6 Mysticism commitment)

Also have specifics on the "some mysticism commitment" for PttS

Academia Nut said:
Temple - Progress listed below, each {S} committed consumes 3 Econ and 3 Art for 3 Progress. Completion increases Religious Authority

@Academia Nut temples still say art.

Umi-san · Jul 23, 2017

notgreat said:
Only need to be golden (14), not max. We've got the stats.

sauce?

Academia Nut said:
Golden Age Started!
Requirements Discovered: At least two stats maxed out, maximum stability
Benefits: +1 Prestige for first Golden Age, +1 Econ Expansion/turn, special sudden advancements possible
Ends with: 0 or lower stability, ???

Academia Nut said:
It's being worked on, but it could take a while without further support. They're trying to figure out a key component to make the design work, but its not entirely obvious.

@Academia Nut What happened to Resettlement? <3

Quest · Jul 23, 2017

pbluekan said:
[Sec] Whatever the hell you want.

Switch policy defense to prep for Iron Nomads?

Glassware · Jul 23, 2017

pbluekan said:
I would be up for the docks provided we did a Main Expand Forest with it. I would rather, however, get on with all the shit we need to actually do. Namely stallion integration, redshore aqueduct, and txolla influence. Integrating the tribes needs to happen. Moving on with megaprojects is all well and good, but there is a lot we need to get done before things spiral out of control again, and if nothing else, the stallions are the biggest.

When we are done with the law the next turn, IMO, should look like this:

[Main] Integrate March - Stallion Tribes
[Sec] Found Mercenary Company - Stallion Tribes
[Sec] Whatever the hell you want.

Doing the integration as a main only gets it done half a turn quicker, so I don't think we should use the main unless we're in a big hurry, whereas we can keep the megaproject rush going by doing the dam instead and integrating with a secondary.

Abby Normal · Jul 23, 2017

notgreat said:
Only need to be golden (14), not max. We've got the stats.

It's max:

Academia Nut said:
If you can get to Stab 3 here, if you can make it to the mid-turn at Stab 3 and two max stats, a golden age will trigger.

Umi-san · Jul 23, 2017

pbluekan said:
[Sec] Found Mercenary Company - Stallion Tribes

have you considered {M} Retraining? It's nicer narratively. Though I suppose that making an ST MC would provide an outlet for their martial culture and a source of income for their families.

zeusthemoose · Jul 23, 2017

[X][Main] The Law (Iron Age)
[X][Secondary] Proclaim Glory
[X][Secondary] Plant Hemp
[X][Free] Change Passive Policy - Defence (+1 significant walls/turn)
[X][Free] Found Colony - Change Greenshore Trading Post to a Colony

pbluekan · Jul 23, 2017

Umi-san said:
have you considered {M} Retraining? It's nicer narratively. Though I suppose that making an ST MC would provide an outlet for their martial culture and a source of income for their families.

Mostly I don't just want to get rid of the martial permanently. We need another Merc company anyway and this is a convenient way to get one, even if the nomads are being all mild. That NTP still needs one, and I don't just want the martial to vanish for when we do need it.

Umi-san · Jul 23, 2017

pbluekan said:
Mostly I don't just want to get rid of the martial permanently. We need another Merc company anyway and this is a convenient way to get one, even if the nomads are being all mild. That NTP still needs one, and I don't just want the martial to vanish for when we do need it.

Considering that skirmishes with the Trell have already started, I understand and now support your position.

~~Considering that skirmishes with the Trell have already started, would you be interested in More Boats?~~ You are.

pbluekan · Jul 23, 2017

Umi-san said:
have you considered {M} Retraining? It's nicer narratively. Though I suppose that making an ST MC would provide an outlet for their martial culture and a source of income for their families.

On that note, though I wouldn't be against doing a retraining afterwards to get rid of any more excess martial.

Glassware said:
Doing the integration as a main only gets it done half a turn quicker, so I don't think we should use the main unless we're in a big hurry, whereas we can keep the megaproject rush going by doing the dam instead and integrating with a secondary.

So..
[Main] Dam
[Sec] Integrate March - Stallion Tribes
[Sec] Establish Mercenary Company - Stallion Tibes - Paid

Edit: Just in case anyone is gonna go off their rocker, this is after the law is finished.

Quest · Jul 23, 2017

[X][Main] The Law (Iron Age)
[X][Secondary] Proclaim Glory
[X][Secondary] Plant Hemp
[X][Free] Change Passive Policy - Defence (+1 significant walls/turn)
[X][Free] Found Colony - Change Greenshore Trading Post to a Colony

Killer_Whale · Jul 23, 2017

Abby Normal said:
Metal gives tech for a secondary, and only costs 1 mysticism in teh main, in a straight up buff. Odd that it doesn't give tech as the main... @Academia Nut is that intentional?

I think it might generate +1 tech, and then spend it to increase the innovation chance.

Kiba · Jul 23, 2017

[X][Main] The Law (Iron Age)
[X][Secondary] Proclaim Glory
[X][Secondary] Plant Hemp
[X][Free] Change Passive Policy - Defence (+1 significant walls/turn)
[X][Free] Found Colony - Change Greenshore Trading Post to a Colony

BungieONI · Jul 23, 2017

Cool analysis Abby! Only got a few comments.

Abby Normal said:
Doesn't list the EE needed to regain Sacred Forest, which would be good to know...

AN has said that technically Sacred Forest hasn't popped yet so if we can get below 12 we can keep it going with only a hiccup, and secondary poppies is enough for that.

Abby Normal said:
Huh...I think that means we've already gained 4 centralization cap from trails? And can gain up to 14... @Academia Nut can you confirm that thats what that means?

I think what this means(brought up by someone I can't remember) is that that is the number of trails actions we need to do before we are fully trailed up like we were long ago.

Abby Normal said:
One wealth cost less for both levels, in exchange for 1 tech each. Best of the Best doesn't seem to apply to make the main the same cost as the secondary anymore.

I think this as a main is extra bullshit now since it is creating 1 Econ out of basically nothing.

Umi-san · Jul 23, 2017

Yo, ppl voting for PG, why??
a) we won't hit a Golden Age any time soon.
b) More Boats gives us catamarans so we'll finally be on even footing w/ the Trell & it synergizes well w/ Hemp.

BungieONI · Jul 23, 2017

Umi-san said:
Yo, ppl voting for PG, why??
a) we won't hit a Golden Age any time soon.
b) More Boats gives us catamarans so we'll finally be on even footing w/ the Trell & it synergizes well w/ Hemp.

Extra stability so the Law and Tax can't fuck us as hard.

Paths of Civilization

Writing about sad cannibals as we speak.

Procrastinating.

Viking Warlord

Somethin's Fucky ...

High Clerk of the Ymaryn

Procrastinating.

The Great One

High Clerk of the Ymaryn

Procrastinating.

Somethin's Fucky ...

Procrastinating.

Somethin's Fucky ...

The Great One

Seven gremlins in a trench coat

Procrastinating.

Seven gremlins in a trench coat