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Paths of Civilization

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Academia Nut said:
No. On the one hand they are more work to rearrange the area, on the other they are relatively simple structurally.
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Doesn't this contradict the earlier answer about the aesthetics?
Academia Nut said:
Expanding the Great Hall or Gardens will require considerable renovation as they take up a lot of space, and the Great Hall especially needs to be continuous. Others you can just add on a new building where you can make room, for the most part anyway.
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Since the functionality of both of them are tied in with the aesthetics, won't that make them function worse?

Assuming that the latest WoG is the correct one, I'm going with the minimal Palace.
[X] [Loc] Valleyhome
[X] Shrine
[X] Library
[X] Library x2

This will also be good if we do decide to move to Trelli once we conquer them, as all of these are very useful on their own. This finishes in just 5-7 main actions, which is within 2 turns on Megaproject Support.
 
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Academia Nut said:
Pissing off Valleyhome?
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We do have a habit of buying into what the Valleyhome Oligarches believe rather than what's actually going on.
tryrar said:
So, what I'm getting then is that Redshore does have some advantages, but in the same time frame it would actually be better/just as advantagous conquering the Trelli and putting our capital THERE.
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Uh, same time frame is strongly contested.

Valleyhome as it is has a <1 week transit for the following provinces:
-Valleyhome
-Redhill
-Sacred Forest
-Redshore

Redshore as it is has a <1 week transit for the following provinces:
-Valleyhome
-Sacred Forest
-Northshore
-Southshore
-Black River
-Hatriver

Valleyhome is basically politically convenient, but logistics strongly favor Redshore, because it's far easier to administrate our settlements from there.
Valleyhome isn't even that good for lowlands because they lack river continuity, for that you want a capital below the Cataracts.
 
Hangwind said:
Well, why not do a compromise vote? Build a palace in Valleyhome, but only add on libraries, maybe three or four. That way, we get the immediate Admin benefit to get us out of the crisis, but we can move to Redshore when we need to, and still be getting returns on our investment here with a massive library.
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....dude, we've talked about this cake-and-eat-it stuff. Just don't.
 
veekie said:
We do have a habit of buying into what the Valleyhome Oligarches believe rather than what's actually going on.

Uh, same time frame is strongly contested.

Valleyhome as it is has a <1 week transit for the following provinces:
-Valleyhome
-Redhill
-Sacred Forest
-Redshore

Redshore as it is has a <1 week transit for the following provinces:
-Valleyhome
-Sacred Forest
-Northshore
-Southshore
-Black River
-Hatriver

Valleyhome is basically politically convenient, but logistics strongly favor Redshore, because it's far easier to administrate our settlements from there.
Valleyhome isn't even that good for lowlands because they lack river continuity, for that you want a capital below the Cataracts.
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AN specifically said we're close to solving that issue, so that's not much of a downside.
 
veekie said:
Western Wall and Hat Colony do not appreciate the long journey to Valleyhome, and this will only worsen as our ships get faster
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Fair point that the journey will shorten up, but I think a weeks travel time is likely the most minor of quibbles our outlying provinces have with us. I think they can deal with it so we don't have to uproot a millennia old capital and build a new city. The fact that Valleyhome is still the obvious choice for all of our advisors, subchiefs, and planners who are the ones who actually do the traveling should say something about it, no?

The real advantage for Redshore is the fact that it is on the ocean and has acted as a trade hub for centuries. If Valleyhome were much farther way than it is, or there had been any sort of movement of administrative duties towards Redshore in the past, I would agree with you.
 
DocMatoi said:
A cenote. Deep lake fed by an underground River. Should the quest make it to the modern day, it'll be popular with cave divers, those crazy bastards.
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*feels wounded*

@notgreat Personally, I'd rather stay on offensive next turn and just keep doing double main + expand econ. Maybe the turn after that we could switch and free up our main again.
 
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Hangwind said:
And your actual argument is...?
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It costs us a megaproject just to build it. Moving it to a different city would likely be non-trivial and come with deep political discord as the current capital strongly objects to the move. Building it in that way just so we can move it to a more nebulously convenient location(1 week isn't enough of a difference to fucking matter here) for nebulous future benefits at a nebulous time is a real fucking waste of an action.
 
Inserted tally with some combining of non-tagged and tagged votes
Adhoc vote count started by Therealtahu on Jul 9, 2017 at 6:18 PM, finished with 71933 posts and 75 votes.
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Susano said:
That, and infrastructurally convenient. If that's a word.
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Slightly. It already has a library and an aqueduct.

Not much else really. No docks, major warehouses are in Redshore, it doesn't actually have it's own Holy Site, it doesn't have it's own mines.

It does have the glassmakers, potters and masons, as well as alchemists.
What it REALLY has is that it's the place the Oligarches and Patricians have always been politicking from to begin with. It's a good place to switch to a Free City TBH
 
notgreat said:
Doesn't this contradict the earlier answer about the aesthetics?

Since the functionality of both of them are tied in with the aesthetics, won't that make them function worse?

Assuming that the latest WoG is the correct one, I'm going with the minimal Palace.
[X] [Loc] Valleyhome
[X] Shrine
[X] Library
[X] Library x2

This will also be good if we do decide to move to Trelli once we conquer them, as all of these are very useful on their own.
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That was about "aesthetic differences", so i think the point is more that if we expand the great hall *now*, it will have our current aesthetic sense and style (let's call it "Early Crisis Ymaryn Minimalism"), whereas if we expand it a few hundred years down the line, it will have a "Middle Ymaryn Spiritualist" style architectural and aesthetic design; that is, it'll change more, not that it'll be strictly better or worse
Also, finalizing my vote at:
[X] [Loc] Sacred Forest
[X] [Loc] Valleyhome
[X] [Annex] Shrine
[X] [Annex] Library
[X] [Annex] Library x2
[X] [Annex] Storehouse
 
maximillian said:
Byzantium*
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*Byzantion

Byzanz as the German name for it is also acceptable.

veekie said:
Slightly. It already has a library and an aqueduct.
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The aquaduct being the big thing, of course. Redshore is not a True City, and that's a problem.

What it REALLY has is that it's the place the Oligarches and Patricians have always been politicking from to begin with.
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That's a feature, not a bug. We want a balance of power between various faction at courts, not a king who is left alone to rule as he/she pleases.
 
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