- Location
- Mists of Albion
Yes, because the Holy Roman Empire was such a model of efficiency and effectiveness when it came to government...
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
[X] Dedicate a place to spirits and ancestors
[X] How Big Men were chosen needed to be changed
[X] Her mother and her child were of the tribe, she could stay
[X] How Big Men were chosen needed to be changed
[X] Her mother and her child were of the tribe, she could stay
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Ashryn had something of a limited way of conceptualizing it, but he had the idea to bring the drive and organization of the warriors to other groups.
StellarMonarch
Myrmidon
- Location
- Québec
[X] Dedicate a place to spirits and ancestors
[X] How Big Men were chosen needed to be changed
[X] Her mother and her child were of the tribe, she could stay
I previously mentioned I wanted to do religious stuff and establishing a Diarchy would be interesting, but Political Science is better.
[X] How Big Men were chosen needed to be changed
[X] Her mother and her child were of the tribe, she could stay
I previously mentioned I wanted to do religious stuff and establishing a Diarchy would be interesting, but Political Science is better.
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I've noticed a couple minor spelling errors.
You probably mean "there could be no project better than to further improve the land"
I think it should be "well-watered"
Should be "Its own position"
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Powerofmind
In Madness Fallen
- Location
- United States
Sounds a bit like Valkyria Chronicles' Gallia. Most careers in the country use quality guilds to ensure a minimum standard from all practitioners; they literally couldn't open without a stamp of approval from the guilds.
I do like it, but religious legitimacy goes a long way towards blunting the upset caused by other projects for a long time.
- Location
- United States
I still think we should keep a close eye on her if she's staying in the tribe. Since she was so ruthless and cunning she might bide her time and raise her son so he can become the Big Man...someone so clever could work out a way to make her son appear the ideal candidate.
If we Introduce the Warrior to other walks of life it would make our citizens significantly more driven and organized not to mention harder to kidnap. It might also lead to more violence as a way to solve issues(both domestic and non).
If we take away power from the Big Man it could possibly mesh well with the above. If everyone is experienced in fighting it could help the Council make more informed decisions in terms of war. Having the Big Man be more of a manager of the city would marginalize any fuck ups while still maintaining our military edge with the above choice.
If we Introduce the Warrior to other walks of life it would make our citizens significantly more driven and organized not to mention harder to kidnap. It might also lead to more violence as a way to solve issues(both domestic and non).
If we take away power from the Big Man it could possibly mesh well with the above. If everyone is experienced in fighting it could help the Council make more informed decisions in terms of war. Having the Big Man be more of a manager of the city would marginalize any fuck ups while still maintaining our military edge with the above choice.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
And we are locked in at...
[X] Further expand the irrigation system
[X] How Big Men were chosen needed to be changed
[X] Her mother and her child were of the tribe, she could stay
Missed the chance for an awesome High Priestess, but ah well, such is things...
[X] Further expand the irrigation system
[X] How Big Men were chosen needed to be changed
[X] Her mother and her child were of the tribe, she could stay
Missed the chance for an awesome High Priestess, but ah well, such is things...
Powerofmind
In Madness Fallen
- Location
- United States
Combo religious partitions and politically empower the wife's position.
- Location
- United States
I was wondering if it would be possible to trade food to other tribes in exchange for training? Like having some of their skilled craftsman teach a few of our people to make tools and stuff.
The Judgement
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The most important members of the tribe were assembled, the sub-chiefs in a semi-circle facing the accused, and the elders in a broad circle around the entire proceedings, everything illuminated by a great fire that backlit the council. That several members of the council were still sporting wounds and that several others showed clear signs of discomfort at being there at all, having been quickly replaced to fill the holes made by the deaths of their predecessors, was not lost on the crowd. If the serene composure of the young woman on trial gave any indication of worry, it was beyond the ability of those in attendance to detect.
"Mytan, Daughter of The Crow and Hyruni, you stand accused of the malicious spreading of lies and provocation of the ire of Big Man Ashryn, resulting in the deaths of many and the suffering of the tribe. This council has summoned you here to announce to you our decision as to what to do with you," one of the sub-chiefs, clearly the front runner to become the replacement Big Man, announced.
Crow's Daughter, Mytan in her own tongue, nodded at that and said, "And your decision is?"
"Of causing death and strife, we find you culpable but not guilty," the man announced, causing Mytan's mask of composure to crack in confusion and for those who did not already know of the decision to begin to mutter among each other in confusion and outrage.
"This means...?" Mytan asked.
"You did it, but only in response to the destruction of your people, the deaths of your family, and what amounts to your abduction and forced marriage to Ashryn, who we ultimately chose to be our leader and did not stop when he acted against you and yours. Some have argued that your father started it with the abduction of your mother, but ultimately the response of our Big Man was grossly and unconscionably out of proportion to the crime. We find that, in retrospect, your actions were of lesser proportion to the crime against you, and ultimately while you may have inspired Ashryn to action, his actions remained his own. As such, we consider your justice against us served. You and your child are free to remain with us as a member of the tribe, or to seek your fortunes elsewhere," the man explained, to much further muttering among those assembled.
Seeing that this wasn't done yet, the man got up from where he was seated and said, "Here this! It was by the wisdom of the ancestors that we chose a new path when we were hungry rather than take out our anger on neighbours whose only crime was to till the soil! When the selfish among our neighbours attacked us, we sought out only the perpetrators, not their entire tribe! Should a tree fall upon a man gathering wood, you do not burn down the forest! It is our way that the problem be dealt with, not everything around it."
He did then turn towards Mytan once again and said with a glare, "Do know that you are now known for your serpent's tongue young woman, and any further trouble you cause is upon you. Our leader brought shame upon us all, but your revenge is served, and your justice is over. Am I understood?"
"Clearly," the clever young woman said with a nod.
"Warriors, escort her away, this business is for chiefs and elders only," the man replied, dismissing the one on trial.
Social Value Earned!
Eye for an Eye
Justice is to be served, but it must be discriminating and proportional. Retribution must follow, but it must also end once served.
Pros: Greater assurances of fair behaviour, regardless of position within the tribe
Cons: Justice must be served
The council decision about what to do about Big Men in the future was long and painful, particularly as it was pointed out that everyone had more or less gone along with Ashryn up until the end. Worse yet, it wasn't like he was bad at his job - he had continued the expansion of the irrigation network started by his forebearers and had shown continued reverence for the spirits and ancestors and the land itself. As a defender of the people, he had ultimately excelled, even if he himself had become the greatest threat to them in the end. It was not like he was someone who they all could have seen rotten meat from the start - it was, in the end, the things that had got him made Big Man in the first that that had lead to his downfall. The trouble was that coming to a decision about how to fix all of this was proving difficult.
Finally though, one man spoke up and said, "Was the problem with Ashryn not that he was a warrior at all, but rather that he was a warrior first? If one were to call upon a farmer whose only practice at fighting was to wrestle with his brothers and call upon him do the things a proper warrior does, would it be his fault if he failed, or rather more, if he tried to do his job as a farmer would do it? No, the problem here was that we chose Ashryn to lead, having not seen how he would lead, having not seen what the responsibility would do. In many ways he succeeded as we thought he would succeed, but ultimately the ability to put the good of the tribe above that of his own desires remained beyond him, did it not? We must train a man to be a chief, to be the Big Man, before he is to actually take the job."
"And what do you propose?" Another of the sub-chiefs asked.
"That we gather not to choose the next chief with the passing of the current one, but choose who will be next. We pick the heir to be the Big Man's assistant and successor, so that he will learn the skills he needs while there is still a man above him who can keep an eye on him, and see how his character develops. The heir can also be removed by the Big Man or the council if he proves unsatisfactory, without having to break tradition or resort to extraordinary means of removal," the man proposed.
While some of the cannier in attendance realized that in the next contest for who would be the Big Man the current speaker would be the second or third choice and thus his suggestion was not entirely selfless, he did have a good point. Getting to see the full character of the next Big Man when invested with more power than a clan head would be of considerable value, especially since they could either correct problems early or reverse the decision with fewer problems.
And so it was that the next Big Man would in part train his successor directly, a practice the clan heads also took up, useful as the population continued to grow as the amount of land that could be farmed steadily increased throughout the valleys and up the hills. While the madness of Foolish Ashryn had driven many neighbours away, and had created a rift with the remnants of other tribes, the well-protected wealth of the tribe still attracted the hungry and those looking to trade. One day, strangers came to the valley, frightfully exotic people whose very presence and appearance created a stir, for walking with them and hauling great bundles of goods piled upon their backs were terrible aurochs, the massive beasts trundling away peacefully at the sides of the traders.
Clad in fine cloth woven from unknown fibres, wearing the pelt of a lion, and bedecked with strands of polished, coloured stones and exotic shells, the head of this wandering tribe made the current Big Man feel distinctly under-dressed. Still, for all that this tribe who commanded the beasts was frightful in their manner of action and their Big Man seemed so rich, one could not help but notice the way his eyes flickered over the demeanour of the warriors or the sheer number of farmers in attendance to the meeting. While language was a bit of an issue, it was obvious that they were greatly interested in trade, and evidently had the means of moving very large amounts of goods large distances.
The question of course is what the people are most interested in...
Choose a deal...
[] Exotic luxuries
[] High quality materials
[] Strange curiosities
[] We want some of the animals
[] We want your friendship!
Despite this obvious sign of the prosperity of the people, the Big Man also had other tasks to see to...
Choose a Major Project
[] Dedicate Place to Spirits
[] Establish Annual Festival
[] Expand Settlement
[] Expand Warriors
[] Manage Forests
[] Organize Settlement
[] Retaining Walls
[] Trade Expeditions
"Mytan, Daughter of The Crow and Hyruni, you stand accused of the malicious spreading of lies and provocation of the ire of Big Man Ashryn, resulting in the deaths of many and the suffering of the tribe. This council has summoned you here to announce to you our decision as to what to do with you," one of the sub-chiefs, clearly the front runner to become the replacement Big Man, announced.
Crow's Daughter, Mytan in her own tongue, nodded at that and said, "And your decision is?"
"Of causing death and strife, we find you culpable but not guilty," the man announced, causing Mytan's mask of composure to crack in confusion and for those who did not already know of the decision to begin to mutter among each other in confusion and outrage.
"This means...?" Mytan asked.
"You did it, but only in response to the destruction of your people, the deaths of your family, and what amounts to your abduction and forced marriage to Ashryn, who we ultimately chose to be our leader and did not stop when he acted against you and yours. Some have argued that your father started it with the abduction of your mother, but ultimately the response of our Big Man was grossly and unconscionably out of proportion to the crime. We find that, in retrospect, your actions were of lesser proportion to the crime against you, and ultimately while you may have inspired Ashryn to action, his actions remained his own. As such, we consider your justice against us served. You and your child are free to remain with us as a member of the tribe, or to seek your fortunes elsewhere," the man explained, to much further muttering among those assembled.
Seeing that this wasn't done yet, the man got up from where he was seated and said, "Here this! It was by the wisdom of the ancestors that we chose a new path when we were hungry rather than take out our anger on neighbours whose only crime was to till the soil! When the selfish among our neighbours attacked us, we sought out only the perpetrators, not their entire tribe! Should a tree fall upon a man gathering wood, you do not burn down the forest! It is our way that the problem be dealt with, not everything around it."
He did then turn towards Mytan once again and said with a glare, "Do know that you are now known for your serpent's tongue young woman, and any further trouble you cause is upon you. Our leader brought shame upon us all, but your revenge is served, and your justice is over. Am I understood?"
"Clearly," the clever young woman said with a nod.
"Warriors, escort her away, this business is for chiefs and elders only," the man replied, dismissing the one on trial.
Social Value Earned!
Eye for an Eye
Justice is to be served, but it must be discriminating and proportional. Retribution must follow, but it must also end once served.
Pros: Greater assurances of fair behaviour, regardless of position within the tribe
Cons: Justice must be served
The council decision about what to do about Big Men in the future was long and painful, particularly as it was pointed out that everyone had more or less gone along with Ashryn up until the end. Worse yet, it wasn't like he was bad at his job - he had continued the expansion of the irrigation network started by his forebearers and had shown continued reverence for the spirits and ancestors and the land itself. As a defender of the people, he had ultimately excelled, even if he himself had become the greatest threat to them in the end. It was not like he was someone who they all could have seen rotten meat from the start - it was, in the end, the things that had got him made Big Man in the first that that had lead to his downfall. The trouble was that coming to a decision about how to fix all of this was proving difficult.
Finally though, one man spoke up and said, "Was the problem with Ashryn not that he was a warrior at all, but rather that he was a warrior first? If one were to call upon a farmer whose only practice at fighting was to wrestle with his brothers and call upon him do the things a proper warrior does, would it be his fault if he failed, or rather more, if he tried to do his job as a farmer would do it? No, the problem here was that we chose Ashryn to lead, having not seen how he would lead, having not seen what the responsibility would do. In many ways he succeeded as we thought he would succeed, but ultimately the ability to put the good of the tribe above that of his own desires remained beyond him, did it not? We must train a man to be a chief, to be the Big Man, before he is to actually take the job."
"And what do you propose?" Another of the sub-chiefs asked.
"That we gather not to choose the next chief with the passing of the current one, but choose who will be next. We pick the heir to be the Big Man's assistant and successor, so that he will learn the skills he needs while there is still a man above him who can keep an eye on him, and see how his character develops. The heir can also be removed by the Big Man or the council if he proves unsatisfactory, without having to break tradition or resort to extraordinary means of removal," the man proposed.
While some of the cannier in attendance realized that in the next contest for who would be the Big Man the current speaker would be the second or third choice and thus his suggestion was not entirely selfless, he did have a good point. Getting to see the full character of the next Big Man when invested with more power than a clan head would be of considerable value, especially since they could either correct problems early or reverse the decision with fewer problems.
And so it was that the next Big Man would in part train his successor directly, a practice the clan heads also took up, useful as the population continued to grow as the amount of land that could be farmed steadily increased throughout the valleys and up the hills. While the madness of Foolish Ashryn had driven many neighbours away, and had created a rift with the remnants of other tribes, the well-protected wealth of the tribe still attracted the hungry and those looking to trade. One day, strangers came to the valley, frightfully exotic people whose very presence and appearance created a stir, for walking with them and hauling great bundles of goods piled upon their backs were terrible aurochs, the massive beasts trundling away peacefully at the sides of the traders.
Clad in fine cloth woven from unknown fibres, wearing the pelt of a lion, and bedecked with strands of polished, coloured stones and exotic shells, the head of this wandering tribe made the current Big Man feel distinctly under-dressed. Still, for all that this tribe who commanded the beasts was frightful in their manner of action and their Big Man seemed so rich, one could not help but notice the way his eyes flickered over the demeanour of the warriors or the sheer number of farmers in attendance to the meeting. While language was a bit of an issue, it was obvious that they were greatly interested in trade, and evidently had the means of moving very large amounts of goods large distances.
The question of course is what the people are most interested in...
Choose a deal...
[] Exotic luxuries
[] High quality materials
[] Strange curiosities
[] We want some of the animals
[] We want your friendship!
Despite this obvious sign of the prosperity of the people, the Big Man also had other tasks to see to...
Dedicate Place to Spirits - The people have increasingly much to be thankful for, and while individual observations of respect for the supernatural continues, perhaps something more grand to represent the group as a whole is required
Establish Annual Festival - People already like to celebrate at certain times of the year, but with the level of control over food distribution a new and particularly lavish festival can be established
Expand Settlement - The community grows at the rate of births, but deliberately bringing more land under cultivation will lead to more food and thus more people faster than without intervention
Expand Warriors - More men can be inducted into the ranks of the warriors every year and not face major food shortfalls
Manage Forests - While still used by hunters to a degree, the nearby forests are now perhaps more important for providing firewood and building materials for the growing community
Organize Settlement - Because everyone contributes to the whole, the borders of fields could be reworked. Perhaps a similar principle can be applied to the buildings in which people dwell [Warning: Caretakers Malus] [Pre-King]
Retaining Walls - The irrigation system grows increasingly complex, and simple ditches and pits are inadequate. Sturdier construction is required... although people are uncertain of if it can be made sturdy enough [Caretakers] [Pre-King]
Trade Expeditions - Instead of simply storing surplus during the good times, carrying it to other tribes to trade for exotic items will improve the quality of life of the people
Establish Annual Festival - People already like to celebrate at certain times of the year, but with the level of control over food distribution a new and particularly lavish festival can be established
Expand Settlement - The community grows at the rate of births, but deliberately bringing more land under cultivation will lead to more food and thus more people faster than without intervention
Expand Warriors - More men can be inducted into the ranks of the warriors every year and not face major food shortfalls
Manage Forests - While still used by hunters to a degree, the nearby forests are now perhaps more important for providing firewood and building materials for the growing community
Organize Settlement - Because everyone contributes to the whole, the borders of fields could be reworked. Perhaps a similar principle can be applied to the buildings in which people dwell [Warning: Caretakers Malus] [Pre-King]
Retaining Walls - The irrigation system grows increasingly complex, and simple ditches and pits are inadequate. Sturdier construction is required... although people are uncertain of if it can be made sturdy enough [Caretakers] [Pre-King]
Trade Expeditions - Instead of simply storing surplus during the good times, carrying it to other tribes to trade for exotic items will improve the quality of life of the people
Choose a Major Project
[] Dedicate Place to Spirits
[] Establish Annual Festival
[] Expand Settlement
[] Expand Warriors
[] Manage Forests
[] Organize Settlement
[] Retaining Walls
[] Trade Expeditions
- Location
- USA
[] We want some of the animals
[] We want your friendship!
These two seem the most interesting, both are more developmental.
[] We want your friendship!
These two seem the most interesting, both are more developmental.
UbeOne
Daydreaming CPU
- Location
- Philippines
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Hammurabi style indeed.
[x] We want your friendship!
Goods are fleeting. Friendship is not.
[x] Manage Forests
We are caretakers of the land, after all.
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I'm inclined to think Trade Expeditions is a good idea. Brings in new ideas.
In terms of what we want from the strangers, I'd say the animals and strange curiosities is the best bet.
Funny you should say goods are fleeting and friendship is not, I'd say the reverse is true, at least when it comes to societies. Inventions can't be taken back, but most cultures will side with their strongest neighbor and throw each other under the bus at the drop of a hat.
In terms of what we want from the strangers, I'd say the animals and strange curiosities is the best bet.
Funny you should say goods are fleeting and friendship is not, I'd say the reverse is true, at least when it comes to societies. Inventions can't be taken back, but most cultures will side with their strongest neighbor and throw each other under the bus at the drop of a hat.
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Night_stalker
Slava Ukraini!
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] We want some of the animals
[X] Establish Annual Festival
[X] Establish Annual Festival
[X] We want some of the animals
[X] Trade Expeditions
[X] Trade Expeditions
StellarMonarch
Myrmidon
- Location
- Québec
[X] We want some of the animals
[X] Dedicate Place to Spirits
[X] Dedicate Place to Spirits