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I suspect @RandomOTP made that plan considering pyramids but not stagnancy.
Yeah, the old, original post predated stagnancy, iirc (I think it was made back when you, technically, had to unlock the next AB).

We've mostly been following with it, though, and it's a living document (the most recent edits factor in Hazou learning Lightning Element, which Strength of the Storm makes worth learning).

If he still has to take a major combat mission every 1k XP, the free XP from notes may not be worth the extra risk from combat missions.

We're about to be Missing Nin, with Hunter Nin and the Color Cabal hot on our trail... I believe that combat unlocks aren't going to be rare.
 
This is my build plan tracker. For the most part, it covers our build progression by AB growth (leveling stats by the 10s), since that's all thats relevant for pyramid validity.

The first handful of steps are pretty widely agreed upon.
Alternatively, here's the build-plan that a couple of us cooked up on discord. Most of the credit goes to the glorious @ProperAttorney, King of the Spreadsheets. Long may he reign!

The Dodgey Option
  1. Calligraphy 45 -> 47 [93 XP]
  2. Technique Hacker [250 XP]
  3. TH 0 -> 10 [110 XP]
  4. Alertness 36 -> 39 [114 XP]
  5. Athletics 37 -> 39 [77 XP]
  6. Taijutsu 40 -> 47 [308 XP]
  7. Deceit 26 -> 30 [114 XP]
  8. Runecraft 11 -> 20 [288 XP] ✅
  9. Athletics 39 -> 49 [445 XP]
  10. Lightning Element [500 XP]
  11. SotS 0 -> 30 [465 XP]
  12. Pangolin Flash 0 -> 20 [105 XP]
  13. Lightning + RRB [100 XP]
  14. Chakdar + PF [100 XP]
  15. Taijutsu 47 -> 49 [97 XP]
TOTAL: 3116 XP
effAth 87 effTai 93 effAlt 49


Plus, we'll be spending banked TH notes XP throughout.

 
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Reversible area-denial strategies: A rune that leaps the contents of the area forward in time (wasn't there a seal recently that does this?), a rune freezes or slows time in the area, a rune that creates an SEP field around the area, a rune that floods the area with regenerating goop making moving impossible, etc. These (aside from the first) are probably less reliable than moving it, and come with their own flaws (if they know Runes exist, they can look for it and try to blow it up, though that might risk runic sealing failure and they're probably smarter than that?), but are much more achievable with PS alone and thus, actually possible in the 7-month timeline!
These aren't bad ideas per se. Unfortunately we're up against an S-rank sealmaster + the cheating Sharingan, so I expect them to see through any stealth and to find weak points in the magic behind any AoE defense effect. Then they'll hit the weak points with Itachi's multiple exotic effects and break our defenses.
If we were fighting anyone else I'd be agreeing with you though.

EDIT: @_The_Bomb, can't we spend the banked TH notes XP earlier in that plan ?
 
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Okay, so for these two builds - RandomOTP's pyramid and this one - if you are an advocate of the build and have time, could you answer my earlier question:

"If Akatsuki rolls well and we're in the 7-month timeline, what's your median expectation for Hazou if he follows your build plan? How many months into that timeline does he get PS 51 online, and how long after that do the first gamechanging runes appear? [If relevant: how does he beat Akatsuki if not with Runes?]"

Is most of the thread in the camp of "if Akatsuki's timeline is 7 months, we're okay with giving up and letting them win?"
 
Is most of the thread in the camp of "if Akatsuki's timeline is 7 months, we're okay with giving up and letting them win?"
I'd appreciate it if you weren't so quick to broadly equivocate "things that are not your viewpoint" with "giving up and letting them win".
 
If Sasori is winning the rift in 7 months our only option is to introduce the fleshy bits inside his puppet to 30000000000000 roentgens of ionizing radiation.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Hazou is is unlikely to ever find out what Sasori's timeline is before Pain actually returns. Since you're operating under uncertainty, are you guys simply saying that you want to, right now, plan to kill Sasori in <7 months rather than deny the rift in 7-12? That seems it would be more logistically difficult than creating a pretty-good area denial rune for the Rift region.

Sasori is probably in Rain, guarded by Konan and an entire Hidden Village, whereas the Rift is stationary, probably only defended by a few Rain jounin, and farther from their center of power. The easiest path seems to be blowing up all of Hidden Rain, though you'd still have to confirm Sasori's presence beforehand (how?), and make sure the effect is destructive enough to actually kill an S-ranker over the entire radius.

These aren't bad ideas per se. Unfortunately we're up against an S-rank sealmaster + the cheating Sharingan, so I expect them to see through any stealth and to find weak points in the magic behind any AoE defense effect. Then they'll hit the weak points with Itachi's multiple exotic effects and break our defenses.

I don't think any of those would work against the first option, though. If the rift and everything else in that radius is just transported 5 years into the future, everyone who wants to interact with it is shit out of luck. We haven't seen any Boss with control over time as Conjura has space, which makes sense since that Boss would be unequivocal master of the Seventh Path.

Which isn't to say that the Time Leap rune is possible or practical, just that area-denial, reversible runes probably do exist and let us deny the rift without TH.

I'd appreciate it if you weren't so quick to broadly equivocate "things that are not your viewpoint" with "giving up and letting them win".

I'm not... it was in direct reference to Sir Stompy's earlier post "If [their timeline is 7 months] I expect to lose either way."
 
What do Isan and Kakuzu have to do with each other?
"Hello all," the Eighth Hokage said, dwarfed by the breadth of his conical hat. "I have bad news. It's not urgent, but it's still important. I'll keep it simple. Our ally, the hidden village of Isan, has been destroyed."

Gasps and exhalations went around the Clan Council's table. Hazō quickly decided to put on a troubled frown as he resisted the urge to check how Nara was reacting.

"Shortly after the murder of Lord Seventh, we sent messengers to Isan. They were unable to find the village based on our known landmarks and returned home after a week. We sent out another team to search for Isan, this time equipped with hundreds of skywalkers. The first team had noticed an oddly clear site on the mountainside, and the new team eventually realized that it had to be Isan's former location. The buildings were completely gone, though their foundations remained. The village's trees had all been knocked down and, in many cases, blown up. The area of dead trees seemed to originate from downhill of the village, as if the village had been engulfed in a giant cone-shaped ninjutsu by someone casting it from below. This is what convinced me that the village had actually been destroyed, since it's possible that they all decided to up and leave to the eastern continent or something.

"We searched for more evidence of who or what destroyed them, but didn't find much. There is one thing we noticed that was unusual – we didn't find any caches of seals or ninjutsu. We think that whoever did this also stole all of Isan's techniques once they'd finished casting their genocidal technique.

"In terms of who has the power to do this, this is well beyond any known jinchūriki's ninjutsu in scope. Really, I have to assume it was Akatsuki for some unknown reason. None of Deidara's explosions at Nagi Island were large enough to manage this… but who knows what new techniques he could have developed in the last two years.

"Regardless, we have no evidence to make any accusations. I intend to send a messenger to inform AMITY about our findings tomorrow morning and let the chips fall where they may. I don't think we have anything to gain from trying to cover this up, and everyone will find out about it anyway when Isan fails to show up at the next Chūnin Exams. If anyone has objections, now would be the time to speak."

"If this was indeed Akatsuki's actions," Lady Amori said, "would they raze Leaf for daring to speak up?"

"They cannot expect us to never say a word about the death of our close allies," said Lord Akimichi. "If it was indeed them, and they want their secret kept, I do not think they would hesitate to blackmail us into silence with their village-killing ninjutsu."

"We're well aware of the nature of Akatsuki's tyranny," Naruto said. "But we don't have any evidence against them here besides the sheer scale of the destruction. I assume they're going to take charge of the investigation, and that means there will never be any evidence against them. Still, I intend to try to use this to swing the villages against Akatsuki. Honestly, the combined forces of the Elemental Nations probably isn't enough to take them down, but incremental pushes like this will help us build the alliance we need to eventually get out from under Akatsuki's thumb."

"A whole village," Lady Minami said. "Our allies. An entire culture. Wiped out by some monsters with more power than sense."

Hazō carefully didn't react.

Naruto shook his head sadly. "Whatever happened to them, I don't think they're coming back anytime soon. Anyway, thank you for your time. I mostly wanted to keep you informed and get any opinions you had. As always, you can find one of me if you have anything you want to add in terms of navigating this correctly. We're going to be weakened by the loss of an ally, but I'm confident this is something we can survive. You may carry on with your days now. Dismissed."
 
I'm not... it was in direct reference to Sir Stompy's earlier post "If [their timeline is 7 months] I expect to lose either way."
This is a misrepresentation of my point. So no wonder it was misunderstood. I do not favor giving up under any circumstances.

IMO since we can't sufficiently win if their timeline is so short - and I do not view empowering Orochimaru as winning here - it makes sense to assume we are in a good timeline and focus on that. If we lose, we lose. I don't see the point in hedging our bets here.

We go all in on winning the whole thing.
 
Is most of the thread in the camp of "if Akatsuki's timeline is 7 months, we're okay with giving up and letting them win?"

I'd appreciate it if you weren't so quick to broadly equivocate "things that are not your viewpoint" with "giving up and letting them win".

This is a misrepresentation of my point.

Rihaku, I'm quickly growing tired of this rhetorical browbeating thing that you're doing.

Please be more careful with your word choice.
 
I do not favor giving up under any circumstances.

IMO since we can't sufficiently win if their timeline is so short - and I do not view empowering Orochimaru as winning here - it makes sense to assume we are in a good timeline and focus on that. If we lose, we lose. I don't see the point in hedging our bets here.

We go all in on winning the whole thing.

Okay, CCT:

By "giving up in the 7-month timeline" I mean the same thing as you did in your first post, "act as if the 7-month timeline is already lost and focus on the 12-month timeline." I just wanted to understand if that was the broad consensus of the thread.

I did not mean to imply that you were "giving up the fight" in a broad sense and apologize if offense was given there.

I don't want to act as if the 7-month timeline is already lost and am willing to compromise with other actors to do so. We can agree to disagree about this; everyone has different red lines.
 
Since you're operating under uncertainty, are you guys simply saying that you want to, right now, plan to kill Sasori in <7 months rather than deny the rift in 7-12?
For clarity: I have already been making and proposing plans for Essie-killing weapons and how we can reasonably get Hazo to discover them for a while now. I would very much like to have the option available to kill specific Akatsuki members as necessary, mostly unrelated to my opinions on training. To that extent, yes.

I do think that we need to be prepared for the possibility of an uncomfortably short timeline, and I think that powerful gamma emitters creating brief but intense pulses of gamma radiation to sterilize the target area is both feasible with what components we have, a reasonable tech for Hazo to discover, and a good way to kill many members of Akatsuki with minimal collateral damage besides whatever fauna/flora happens to be near where they're standing since pulses of gamma are well attested and widely used IRL to sterilize things without long-term issues.

Edit: To bring this back to PS and other training plans, I don't think raising PS is yet helpful to this desperation Essie-killer plan. I do think that basic combat competence would be very helpful in getting into position to snipe a hostile Essie and get away with it.
 
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but Hazou is is unlikely to ever find out what Sasori's timeline is before Pain actually returns. Since you're operating under uncertainty, are you guys simply saying that you want to, right now, plan to kill Sasori in <7 months rather than deny the rift in 7-12? That seems it would be more logistically difficult than creating a pretty-good area denial rune for the Rift region.

Sasori is probably in Rain, guarded by Konan and an entire Hidden Village, whereas the Rift is stationary, probably only defended by a few Rain jounin, and farther from their center of power. The easiest path seems to be blowing up all of Hidden Rain, though you'd still have to confirm Sasori's presence beforehand (how?), and make sure the effect is destructive enough to actually kill an S-ranker over the entire radius.



I don't think any of those would work against the first option, though. If the rift and everything else in that radius is just transported 5 years into the future, everyone who wants to interact with it is shit out of luck. We haven't seen any Boss with control over time as Conjura has space, which makes sense since that Boss would be unequivocal master of the Seventh Path.

Which isn't to say that the Time Leap rune is possible or practical, just that area-denial, reversible runes probably do exist and let us deny the rift without TH.



I'm not... it was in direct reference to Sir Stompy's earlier post "If [their timeline is 7 months] I expect to lose either way."
The 7-12 month timelines are super rough estimates. We've got more slack than we should due to the incredibly success here at the dergwer, and in a couple months Hazō will be zipping around with a Hiraishin equivalent - throwing all of our current estimates off.

Don't worry, the table will be flipped.

Keep calm and Vote In Research
 
This will neither help us in a relevant way nor is something that anyone in the community thinks is achievable in the next two months, aside from Twinnstars.
I'm open to the possibility but I'd like to see more concrete QM replies or IC prep day results. I do think it's a little tangential to the most pressing bit of eliminating Sasori quickly enough, though.
 
I personally think it's gonna end up being the case that the we are missing some vital piece of information that means that death is actually permanent and the rift thing is an unrelated sealing failure and the vision was just the QM's fucking with us because they were running out of ideas for how to give us a challenge before we foom to goodhood and make the setting irrelevant.
 
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