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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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_The_Bomb said:
As the person who lobbied to include the line about privacy seals in the plan, I can assure you that they were meant to be included. I'm quite frustrated that you stealthily cut them from the list I prepared, especially after saying this upfront. It feels deceptive, especially since it was the reason why I didn't check over the list later
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Then read my posts instead of assuming they're correct. 🗿

It took me a solid half-hour to put all those quotes in context. IIRC I did not include every quote you put in there cuz some were redundant.

I did not know you had strong personal attachment to some random seals that only Tsunade/Naruto/Oro can open and since the QMs have limited spoons for seal design and they seemed rather difficult to do I decided not to include them to shorten the scope of the post.

If I had known that you cared, I would have included them, so please do your due diligence and check my work if you care about the results.

_The_Bomb said:
Would you mind elaborating on your math for this? These are three seals that would have taken a total of 4 shadow clone blocks each. Of which we had eight each day, based on the math you did
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Prime did the prep days.
 
[x] Training Plan (Noburi): Clean Water Saves Lives, Well Rounded Water Ends Them
Medical Ninjutsu 48 -> 49 (-46 notes XP, -3 regular XP)
Elemental Apprentice Stunt (Water) (-25 XP)
Water Dragon Bullet 30 -> 35 (-82.XP)
Hozuki's Mantle 20 -> 25 (-57.5 XP)
(Notes XP 46 -> 0 Banked; (3 + 25 + 82.5 + 57.5 = 168), 186 - 168 = 18 XP Remaining


My rationale is that we want to be able to grab the journeyman elemental stunt before too long, and we're a decent way there right now. WDB being able to be cast at effective level 50 is pretty cool if need it soon, and this gets you to WDB 45 right now. Though I am uncertain, since water whip is range 0, does the Hozuki's Mantle bonus still apply to it?
I'm open to modifications, the main thing is that we get Elemental Apprentice, the almost-free mednin level, an work towards rounding out his other combat skills for Journeyman before too long.

But, just in case people want a close alternative that almost gives us another 50 attack stat...

[x] Training Plan (Noburi): Clean Water Saves Lives, Scale Water Makes Them Harder
Medical Ninjutsu 48 -> 49 (-46 notes XP, -3 regular XP)
Elemental Apprentice Stunt (Water) (-25 XP)
Water Dragon Bullet 30 -> 39 (-157.5 XP)
(Notes XP 46 -> 0; 186 - 185.5 = 0.5 XP regular remaining)
 
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I'm fine with that too.

[x] Training Plan (Noburi): Clean Water Saves Lives, Scale Water Makes Them Harder
It is one level away from Ele Journeyman and then we can raise WW to 60 afterwards and WDB to 45 and have Noburi enjoy proper Jounin-tier offense. Or really WW 64, WDB 48, more likely, for Effective WDB 64 without bringing it to 50 tier.

He could really use a Water Element buff to scale with WDB, too.
 
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RandomOTP said:
[x] Training Plan (Noburi): Combat Capstone Movement and Ninjutsu Empowermet
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I'm definitely not opposed to this as a training plan but I want to ask if there isn't an argument for trying to push up athletics or alertness first before leveling water whip?

[x] Training Plan (Noburi): Combat Capstone Movement and Ninjutsu Empowerment

[x] Training Plan (Kei): Donning an Essie's Cloak
 
ProperAttorney said:
I don't know, the duration on the capstone seal is only 24 hours. Does that timeline make sense for when Jirayia would have made the seals?
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Probably not, but I assume that must be an error in the seal mechanics or a lack of info on further seals in the chain IMO.

Like, it is literally the same seal AFAICT, its just those lasted suspiciously long somehow compared to the version in the trove
 
Oneiros said:
I'm definitely not opposed to this as a training plan but I want to ask if there isn't an argument for trying to push up athletics or alertness first before leveling water whip?
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An Ath push makes sense too yeah, though he is also about to get an Ath bonus from RRB

I think either way is probably fine. I do want WW60 sooner than Alt though tbh, to start beating jonin its gonna need to come up to nearly 60 itself, I think that can wait til after we can dodge and hit jonin
 
[X] Training Plan (Noburi): Learning These Before Oro Dies
Chakra Scalpels 0->1: -30 XP
Pain Induction 0->1: -1 XP
Pain Suppresion 0->1: -1 XP
Total: -32 XP
 
So, problem y'all. There's not enough chakra in Leaf for what Orochimaru is talking about. There just isn't enough to fill up 20 orochimaru clones, let alone 20 tsunade clones. Edit: fact checked myself, bad mental math here. It very optimistically could work, but ehhhhh

He thinks that Naruto will only let us drain a significant bulk of the ninja populace on a strategic level, which means surely our capability can go up significantly from what we have.

We can't. We were running into significant issues before needing to source enough chakra to sustain like 4 oros.

Dude never did the math because we didn't treat it like a problem.

Seriously! Dudes capacity is at minimum (40*50)= 2000 chakra! A normal jōnin couldn't have more than CR 69, which would be 690 chakra! That's four jōnin *per fighting fitness oro*.

Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

In a stable state, Leaf has 1,200, 250, and 50 of each tier respectively. Leaf has been absolutely bodied and has a severely reduced military capacity, at least under half. We'll just cut it in half to stay optimistic. Putting genin at 15 Cr and chūnin at 30, which is Haz's and commented to be somewhere between chūnin and jōnin. Trying to stay optimistic.

1,200 × 10 × 15 × .5 = 90,000 chakra

250 × 10 × 30 × .5 = 37,500 chakra

50 × 10 × 69 × .5 = 17,250 chakra

Required chakra for Oro clones: 40,000
Required chakra for Tsunade: ?????

Okay, so we might have the chakra to pull this off, with our most optimistic calculations- who knows how much chakra tsunade will need. The bulk of this comes from genin, who die en-mass in wars so Leaf can have more useful chūnin.... we've had some peace time but I dunno if it's enough. Oro thinks this is trivial because we treat it like it's trivial, but its not. It already causes us problems. This won't work.
 
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Twinnstars said:
So, problem y'all. There's not enough chakra in Leaf for what Orochimaru is talking about. There just isn't enough to fill up 20 orochimaru clones, let alone 20 tsunade clones. Edit: fact checked myself, bad mental math here. It very optimistically could work, but ehhhhh

He thinks that Naruto will only let us drain a significant bulk of the ninja populace on a strategic level, which means surely our capability can go up significantly from what we have.

We can't. We were running into significant issues before needing to source enough chakra to sustain like 4 oros.

Dude never did the math because we didn't treat it like a problem.

Seriously! Dudes capacity is at minimum (40*50)= 2000 chakra! A normal jōnin couldn't have more than CR 69, which would be 690 chakra! That's four jōnin *per fighting fitness oro*.

Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

In a stable state, Leaf has 1,200, 250, and 50 of each tier respectively. Leaf has been absolutely bodied and has a severely reduced military capacity, at least under half. We'll just cut it in half to stay optimistic. Putting genin at 15 Cr and chūnin at 30, which is Haz's and commented to be somewhere between chūnin and jōnin. Trying to stay optimistic.

1,200 × 10 × 15 × .5 = 90,000 chakra

250 × 10 × 30 × .5 = 37,500 chakra

50 × 10 × 69 × .5 = 17,250 chakra

Required chakra for Oro clones: 40,000
Required chakra for Tsunade: ?????

Okay, so we might have the chakra to pull this off, with our most optimistic calculations- who knows how much chakra tsunade will need. The bulk of this comes from genin, who die en-mass in wars so Leaf can have more useful chūnin.... we've had some peace time but I dunno if it's enough. Oro thinks this is trivial because we treat it like it's trivial, but its not. It already causes us problems. This won't work.
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Chakra regenerates quite quickly mind you - and S-rank clones probably last a whole day. There is time to drain each ninja for sognificantly more than 100% of their CP - maybe as much as 200%.

Then there is also the Nine-Tails, though we have no idea how it compares or if it can be drained. Plus, the clones realistically dont need to be at 100% CP to reach full capability.

Furthermore, are you sure about these ninja numbers? Do we have up to date demographics?
 
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Crunbum said:
Chakra regenerates quite quickly mind you - and S-rank clones probably last a whole day. There is time to drain each ninja at least twice.

Furthermore, are you sure about these ninja numbers? Do we have up to date demographics?
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These are by far the most optimistic numbers we could use. They are accurate and canonical as you could read in the link for leafs stable state. We're significantly below leafs stable state.
 
eaglejarl said:
He ordered a war crime during WWIV when he told Ino and Akane to burn down that city in Earth. HDK whether there were valid strategic reasons for that but certainly no such reason is obvious.
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My understanding of this decision was that Leaf (so Asuma and Shikamaru + whoever else) targeted the village because it was used as a rest & relaxation location for medium to high ranking Rock ninja. I figure the logic was to increase discontent among the Rock forces and signal to the Rock leadership that if they wanted the war to continue then they were going to be suffering too.
 
Also uh.. I will note that the S-rankers are limiting themselves to 20 Clones, which means they each have 750 CP at least and it sounds like they have much more than that... if they can make 40, thats 1250 CP minimum, for example.
 
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Twinnstars said:
These are by far the most optimistic numbers we could use. They are accurate and canonical as you could read in the link for leafs stable state. We're significantly below leafs stable state.
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Except you cut the "stable state" numbers in half in your calculations and if the clones last long enough to drain twice, thats a total of 4x more available chakra than you calculated for as the actual "most optimistic number", with probably some yet untapped sources on top.
 
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