Double suicide technique allows us to do non-lethal incapacitations in case we need to interrogate the enemy later (or don't wish to kill them for some other reason).
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
- Start date
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- Tags
- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard open voting
Double suicide technique allows us to do non-lethal incapacitations in case we need to interrogate the enemy later (or don't wish to kill them for some other reason).
- Location
- Yes.
Mystical Palm Technique
Basic medical ninjutsu (i.e., Mystical Palm Technique) allows us to overload chakra systems and also gives us the benefit of being able to heal ourselves/others. Just take the body with you and interrogate them later. If you want an on-the-spot interrogation stab them in the gut and heal them enough to keep them alive while still keeping them down. It'll cost more in terms of chakra usage but is faster (as said) and gives us healing which is doubly useful as missing-nin.
The only reason we would want to take Double suicide technique is to extract a person from the middle of a hostile enemy force without alerting anyone. And those kinds of missions (Search & Rescue) are NOT the kind of missions we will want to take as missing-nin, period.
Basic medical ninjutsu (i.e., Mystical Palm Technique) allows us to overload chakra systems and also gives us the benefit of being able to heal ourselves/others. Just take the body with you and interrogate them later. If you want an on-the-spot interrogation stab them in the gut and heal them enough to keep them alive while still keeping them down. It'll cost more in terms of chakra usage but is faster (as said) and gives us healing which is doubly useful as missing-nin.
The only reason we would want to take Double suicide technique is to extract a person from the middle of a hostile enemy force without alerting anyone. And those kinds of missions (Search & Rescue) are NOT the kind of missions we will want to take as missing-nin, period.
Corvus Black
The Inestimable
- Location
- England
We may be missing-nin, but we are a group of missing-nin, remember. A group of mostly genin and chunin at that, so it might be worth learning it if one of the group gets captured and we want to be a team player/hero.
My only objection to mystical palm technique is that we'll have to sink a lot of points into the medical ninjutsu skill (and probably the medical knowledge skill as well) to be able to use it to any great effect.
Also, double suicide technique is useful for interrogation purposes.
ClawClawBite
Mad Engineering!
- Location
- Seattle, WA
I like the internal chakra sensitivity bloodline idea. What synergizes best with it? Medical nin does. What else? Best element (I think there is general interest in wind, earth and lighting, but not really water or fire)? I think body boosts likely work well with tanj specialist as opposed to elemental specialist.
- Location
- Somewhere, probably Earth
Now that everyone's awake, I'd like to reiterate my old Ice Medic template.
Now that everyone's awake, I'd like to reiterate my old Ice Medic template. Ice as a medical tool could have a number of interesting applications, and being a medic would make us invaluable to the group of misfits at large, thus keeping us from getting lynched out of hand by notably unstable ninja.
Now that everyone's awake, I'd like to reiterate my old Ice Medic template. Ice as a medical tool could have a number of interesting applications, and being a medic would make us invaluable to the group of misfits at large, thus keeping us from getting lynched out of hand by notably unstable ninja.
Unless you have a sharingan, genjutsu is utterly useless for interrogation because if you know you're in a genjutsu you can break out of it easily. Genjutsu is great for many things, but interrogation isn't one of them.
Maybe Rin was just really stupid?
Honestly, given what we know about genjutsu, there's no reason why that should have been a problem for her.
Jackercracks
In a British accent
- Location
- England
Keep in mind that you will be playing against competent opponents at the higher levels of hierarchy. These people did not get to the top by being idiots. For example, the first question the Kage who sent you to die will ask is "Where was the battleground, there were chuunin and jounin in that force, there should be scorched earth and exploded trees." followed by "Where are the bodies.", "Do they look like the records we have of our ninja?" and "Why wasn't the enemy force weakened when my force engaged." and leading on to "Did our AWOL force leave a trail that lead towards the enemy at all?". Theoretically you may attempt any plan, of course.
Fuedal japan with some tech-seeming things being done by seals. No mass production.
- Location
- Yes.
Yet here we are.
Seriously though, the Chunin with a chakra-control-focused specialty (medic-jutsu) should have no reason to worry about genjutsu if it was so easy to break out of.
Ah well.
On a side note, do you think we should develop a secondary focus on sealing? Seals are pretty flexible in their usage and can become really useful if we survive to become powerful ninja.
Seriously though, the Chunin with a chakra-control-focused specialty (medic-jutsu) should have no reason to worry about genjutsu if it was so easy to break out of.
Ah well.
On a side note, do you think we should develop a secondary focus on sealing? Seals are pretty flexible in their usage and can become really useful if we survive to become powerful ninja.
By tech-seeming things, what are we talking about exactly?
Could we, for instance, be reasonably sure we can get a hold of a flashlight (wooden/metal rod with light-emitting seal on one end)? Or airmask (airtight mask with 2 storage seals, one that gives out fresh air, and one that stores stale air as we use it)?
That kind of thing?
Higher level?
Lower level?
- Location
- Somewhere, probably Earth
Seals can be devastating if someone actually goes through that preparation. Sealing tailed beasts, teleportation and summoning seal shenanigans, and being able to manufacture explosive tags are all useful things. It might go well with Medical nin, since both rely on the person staying away from the front lines if at all possible, but I'm worried about dividing the high amount of technical expertise they both require among them.
I think we should focus on earth for now, and pick up peripheral/non-survival focussed techniques as we go. Sealing will be very useful later, but right now escape and defence should be our priority.
Jackercracks
In a British accent
- Location
- England
Well the thing is that people with sealing expertise are rare, and tend to focus towards military applications and supplying the military of their village. Sealing is capable of such feats, but you're more or less down to luck as to what tech you might be able to find. Mostly, again, on the corpses of other ninja because any civilian with something so valuable might well 'misplace' it the first time a ninja sees them using it. Missing-nin seal crafters are doubly rare, because why would they go missing nin? They have the option the just retire and sit in the village painting explosives and making neat things while helping their country, making a decent wage and maybe selling some designs on the side to approved buyers. As such, I wouldn't rely on being able to find any one specific thing.
Starter, Medic and Sealmaster templates (because I'm having fun here):
Starter:
Intelligence 1
Wits 1
Resolve 1
Strength 1
Dexterity 1
Stamina 1
Presence 1
Manipulation 1
Composure 1
Capacity 1
Control 1
Regeneration 1
Taijutsu (no special style) 2
Weapons (kunai and shuriken) 2
Intimidation 0
Resisting Intimidation 0
Seduction / Fast-Talk 0
Resisting Seduction / Fast-Talk 0
Sealcraft 0
Technique Modification/Development 0
Awareness 2
Tactical Movement 0
Stealth 2
Working with traps, locks, etc. 0
Medical Knowledge (poisons, antidotes, medicines, anatomy) 0
Medical Ninjutsu 0
Wall-climbing, Chakra Adhesion 0
Water-walking 0
Dispelling 0
Summoning (requires contract) 0
Transformation 1
Clone 1
Substitution 1
Element 2
72 non-skill points and 15 skill points left.
Medic:
Intelligence 1
Wits 1
Resolve 1
Strength 1
Dexterity 1
Stamina 1
Presence 1
Manipulation 1
Composure 1
Capacity 1
Control 1
Regeneration 1
Taijutsu (no special style) 2
Weapons (kunai and shuriken) 2
Intimidation 0
Resisting Intimidation 1 (1)
Seduction / Fast-Talk 1 (2)
Resisting Seduction / Fast-Talk 1 (3)
Sealcraft 0
Technique Modification/Development 0
Awareness 2
Tactical Movement 1 (4)
Stealth 2
Working with traps, locks, etc. 0
Medical Knowledge (poisons, antidotes, medicines, anatomy) 2 (7)
Medical Ninjutsu 2 (10)
Wall-climbing, Chakra Adhesion 1 (11)
Water-walking 1 (12)
Dispelling 1 (13)
Summoning (requires contract) 0
Transformation 1
Clone 1
Substitution 1
Element (probably earth) 2
Mystical Palms 1 (14)
Chakra Scalpels 1 (15)
72 non-skill points left.
Sealmaster:
(I'm assuming for the purposes of this that seals cost skill points like techniques, rather than being all under the banner of sealcrafting.)
Intelligence 1
Wits 1
Resolve 1
Strength 1
Dexterity 1
Stamina 1
Presence 1
Manipulation 1
Composure 1
Capacity 1
Control 1
Regeneration 1
Taijutsu (no special style) 2
Weapons (kunai and shuriken) 2
Intimidation 0
Resisting Intimidation 1 (1)
Seduction / Fast-Talk 0
Resisting Seduction / Fast-Talk 1 (2)
Sealcraft 2 (5)
Technique Modification/Development 1 (6)
Awareness 2
Tactical Movement 2 (9)
Stealth 2
Working with traps, locks, etc. 1 (10)
Medical Knowledge (poisons, antidotes, medicines, anatomy) 0
Medical Ninjutsu 0
Wall-climbing, Chakra Adhesion 1 (11)
Water-walking 1 (12)
Dispelling 1 (13)
Summoning (requires contract) 0
Transformation 1
Clone 1
Substitution 1
Element (probably earth, unless we can use water techniques to strip blood from our body and use it as ink and arrange it into a seal mid-fight, but that seems like it might have some considerable downsides) 2
Explosive seal 1 (14)
Storage seal 1 (15)
72 non-skill points left.
Starter:
Intelligence 1
Wits 1
Resolve 1
Strength 1
Dexterity 1
Stamina 1
Presence 1
Manipulation 1
Composure 1
Capacity 1
Control 1
Regeneration 1
Taijutsu (no special style) 2
Weapons (kunai and shuriken) 2
Intimidation 0
Resisting Intimidation 0
Seduction / Fast-Talk 0
Resisting Seduction / Fast-Talk 0
Sealcraft 0
Technique Modification/Development 0
Awareness 2
Tactical Movement 0
Stealth 2
Working with traps, locks, etc. 0
Medical Knowledge (poisons, antidotes, medicines, anatomy) 0
Medical Ninjutsu 0
Wall-climbing, Chakra Adhesion 0
Water-walking 0
Dispelling 0
Summoning (requires contract) 0
Transformation 1
Clone 1
Substitution 1
Element 2
72 non-skill points and 15 skill points left.
Medic:
Intelligence 1
Wits 1
Resolve 1
Strength 1
Dexterity 1
Stamina 1
Presence 1
Manipulation 1
Composure 1
Capacity 1
Control 1
Regeneration 1
Taijutsu (no special style) 2
Weapons (kunai and shuriken) 2
Intimidation 0
Resisting Intimidation 1 (1)
Seduction / Fast-Talk 1 (2)
Resisting Seduction / Fast-Talk 1 (3)
Sealcraft 0
Technique Modification/Development 0
Awareness 2
Tactical Movement 1 (4)
Stealth 2
Working with traps, locks, etc. 0
Medical Knowledge (poisons, antidotes, medicines, anatomy) 2 (7)
Medical Ninjutsu 2 (10)
Wall-climbing, Chakra Adhesion 1 (11)
Water-walking 1 (12)
Dispelling 1 (13)
Summoning (requires contract) 0
Transformation 1
Clone 1
Substitution 1
Element (probably earth) 2
Mystical Palms 1 (14)
Chakra Scalpels 1 (15)
72 non-skill points left.
Sealmaster:
(I'm assuming for the purposes of this that seals cost skill points like techniques, rather than being all under the banner of sealcrafting.)
Intelligence 1
Wits 1
Resolve 1
Strength 1
Dexterity 1
Stamina 1
Presence 1
Manipulation 1
Composure 1
Capacity 1
Control 1
Regeneration 1
Taijutsu (no special style) 2
Weapons (kunai and shuriken) 2
Intimidation 0
Resisting Intimidation 1 (1)
Seduction / Fast-Talk 0
Resisting Seduction / Fast-Talk 1 (2)
Sealcraft 2 (5)
Technique Modification/Development 1 (6)
Awareness 2
Tactical Movement 2 (9)
Stealth 2
Working with traps, locks, etc. 1 (10)
Medical Knowledge (poisons, antidotes, medicines, anatomy) 0
Medical Ninjutsu 0
Wall-climbing, Chakra Adhesion 1 (11)
Water-walking 1 (12)
Dispelling 1 (13)
Summoning (requires contract) 0
Transformation 1
Clone 1
Substitution 1
Element (probably earth, unless we can use water techniques to strip blood from our body and use it as ink and arrange it into a seal mid-fight, but that seems like it might have some considerable downsides) 2
Explosive seal 1 (14)
Storage seal 1 (15)
72 non-skill points left.
Last edited:
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Two comments:
First, as I type this it's 10:10am for me. Voting closes at 9am my time tomorrow, so you have about 23 hours remaining.
Second: Several pages ago someone (I didn't record the post, my apologies) was speculating on dice rolling and how much extra dice matter. The formula they used had one mistake in it, though, which may have led to invalid assumptions.
The correct formula is:
You: 4 Taijutsu
Opponent: 4 Taijutsu
Every d100 is assumed to roll 50.5
Now if we assume you have 4 dice and the opponent has 3:
Same thing, but you have 4 dice and the opponent has 2:
Same thing, but you have 10 dice and the opponent has 8:
0 means that you squeaked out a success.
20 means a good success,
50 means a critical success.
At low levels, one extra die is the difference between barely succeeding and succeeding well, while two dice means crushing superiority. That flattens out as you go up in skill, but in the beginning an extra skill point is a major advantage.
First, as I type this it's 10:10am for me. Voting closes at 9am my time tomorrow, so you have about 23 hours remaining.
Second: Several pages ago someone (I didn't record the post, my apologies) was speculating on dice rolling and how much extra dice matter. The formula they used had one mistake in it, though, which may have led to invalid assumptions.
The correct formula is:
- (Nd100 - Od100) / (N + O)**0.65
You: 4 Taijutsu
Opponent: 4 Taijutsu
Every d100 is assumed to roll 50.5
Code:
(4d100 - 4d100) / (4+4)**0.65 = (202 - 202) / 8**0.65 = 0Now if we assume you have 4 dice and the opponent has 3:
Code:
(4d100 - 3d100) / (4+3)**0.65 = (202 - 151.5) / 7**0.65 = 50.5 / 3.54 = 14Same thing, but you have 4 dice and the opponent has 2:
Code:
(4d100 - 2d100) / (4+2)**0.65 = 31Same thing, but you have 10 dice and the opponent has 8:
Code:
(10d100 - 8d100) / (10+8)**0.65 = 150 means that you squeaked out a success.
20 means a good success,
50 means a critical success.
At low levels, one extra die is the difference between barely succeeding and succeeding well, while two dice means crushing superiority. That flattens out as you go up in skill, but in the beginning an extra skill point is a major advantage.
Last edited:
Rihaku
The Internet
GMs, about what is the mechanical limit for benefits derived from a bloodline? 30 XP is enough to raise our primary combat skill about +3-4d, including Attribute pre-req purchases, if we just banked it. Would half that, a +2d bonus to a single skill be reasonable? If even that is too strong, what about +1d to two skills?
If benefits are not equivalent to even +1d over two Skills, a less than 30% value for our XP, we should not take a bloodline and instead just bank the XP to spend on Skills during our next training point.
In general, we should avoid bloodlines that -
A) require XP to meaningfully use, especially if that use is less versatile than, or could be duplicated by, superhuman speed, strength, and toughness (Taijutsu Skill).
B) require chakra to use, because even substitution takes 25% of our chakra at maxed Capacity
C) lack a real and meaningful immediate impact on our viability in combat or survival
Our ideal bloodline is passive, contributes a concrete mechanical bonus, and does not require XP to use. If a Taijutsu specialist and a bloodline user both have 6 dice in the relevant ability, then the only difference when they clash is that the bloodline user has wasted 30 XP and failed to benefit from the effective 3 XP discount of specializing in Taijutsu.
Also, could a GM explain the benefits of attacking from Stealth versus openly attacking?
If benefits are not equivalent to even +1d over two Skills, a less than 30% value for our XP, we should not take a bloodline and instead just bank the XP to spend on Skills during our next training point.
In general, we should avoid bloodlines that -
A) require XP to meaningfully use, especially if that use is less versatile than, or could be duplicated by, superhuman speed, strength, and toughness (Taijutsu Skill).
B) require chakra to use, because even substitution takes 25% of our chakra at maxed Capacity
C) lack a real and meaningful immediate impact on our viability in combat or survival
Our ideal bloodline is passive, contributes a concrete mechanical bonus, and does not require XP to use. If a Taijutsu specialist and a bloodline user both have 6 dice in the relevant ability, then the only difference when they clash is that the bloodline user has wasted 30 XP and failed to benefit from the effective 3 XP discount of specializing in Taijutsu.
Also, could a GM explain the benefits of attacking from Stealth versus openly attacking?
- Location
- Norway
I think people have been a bit too quick to rule out water ninjutsu as a valid tactic. Storage scrolls are a thing, and depending on how well they work we could transport around a lakes worth of water for whenever we get in trouble. Which would help a lot, I imagine. A dual focus on water ninjutsu and sealing could lead to us do things like store techniques for later and releasing them in combat, both (presumably) not using as much chakra and adding to our available ammunition.
Though I guess just sealing a small hill and pretending to use an Earth technique might be a valid tactic as well.
Actually, GMs, how much can storage seals contain? Can momentum and stuff be adjusted by a suffiently advanced Fuuinjutsu specialist? How much starting Sealcraft do we need to know how to make storage seals? How much to adjust them?
Though I guess just sealing a small hill and pretending to use an Earth technique might be a valid tactic as well.
Actually, GMs, how much can storage seals contain? Can momentum and stuff be adjusted by a suffiently advanced Fuuinjutsu specialist? How much starting Sealcraft do we need to know how to make storage seals? How much to adjust them?
- Location
- how about no
So it looks like we can't unscrew the pooch then. Damn shame. And that means we lost three precious weeks of potential actions too, ugh.
Well, with the skills system, do we even need to explain our actions in order to execute them? Or is it just simply stack as many points into manipulation as you can, cross your fingers, and hope for a nat20? Now if we do need exposition...
We could say that after the commander got brutally assassinated we hightailed it out of there and are on the run from, what we estimate to be, an enemy group of assassination specialists (to explain the lack of destruction from the last three weeks in addition to why we didn't make it to the objective). For those last three weeks we would say we have been sprinting to escape after one of the jonin was killed instantly by an unknown technique while his body was left seemingly untouched. Then we could have some chunin and jonin tear up the landscape we are currently at to fake a battle, maybe contribute some blood to make it more realistic, and send a frantic series of messages describing our rapidly worsening situation. We could say that the enemy used some new technique(s) similar to The Flying Thunder God Technique (TFTGT) and are actively cleaning up the trail so we would have less of a chance of reinforcements finding us. The last messages we send would say that we are desperately trying to find a way to combat the technique and our speculation on why the enemy takes the bodies from each fight from both factions (because Edo Tensei has been around since the 2nd Hokage made it). The reason for our former village's ninjas finding our commander's body would be that they wanted our bodies relatively unharmed for some nefarious purpose. Hell, we don't even need to report the correct direction we are now headed (after faking the battle scene, if that step is even necessary); we could send messages irregularly claiming that we suspect the enemy has begun to somehow intercept our messages (ups the spook factor). All we have to do as the PC is tell the jonin our idea and some suggestions on how to make it work. After all, one of them is our sensei. As jonin they know how to report to the Kage and what would make it more believable; that's the beauty of manipulation, using others' strengths to your (occasionally mutual) advantage. I can go into more detail or potential dialogue/messages if need be.
My point is we could spin a tale about some game-changer the enemy has that demands the Kage's attention on the off-chance that we aren't going AWOL and we really do want to complete our mission. TFTGT won a war in canon, and while our PC doesn't know that, a Kage would recognize the significance of such a technique and act defensively. The best case scenario becomes a group of problematic ninjas going missing whereas there is now a possibility this territory dispute could end your village. Does a Kage really want to send out hunter-nin while a war could really start to heat up? At the very least I hope this could buy us some more time.
- Location
- ✳
Seals require pretty narrow focus to get any good at. If you go for it, you'd have to dedicate significant amount of time and effort for a character to get to a level of "seal a technique and carry it around". Sure, you could eventually carry a lake or a hill with you, but you'd have to find a master-level teacher willing to teach a missing-nin his secrets, survive the learning process, and then find the time to design a seal that does what you want it to. Whether it's an optimal strategy or not is for you to decide.