Starfleet Design Bureau

We're probably going to have to go back and forth on shiny stuff and new industry. Unless we want to use swarm tactics(which I mean is an option that no one in Alpha Quad Trek normally uses). Or we build both with less ships, but better ones. No way we can focus on just making high tech ships as we are so far behind, it wouldn't work.

And from what we have seen, no way this group says no to better tech, so we will flop back and forth every few votes
 
Also, this is just our second Investments vote, so it feels a bit early to be declaring that we're going "endless industrial expansion" IMHO...
The second only investment vote, we've had ALOT of votes for exchanging technology or scale for industry before this.

We're probably going to have to go back and forth on shiny stuff and new industry. Unless we want to use swarm tactics(which I mean is an option that no one in Alpha Quad Trek normally uses). Or we build both with less ships, but better ones. No way we can focus on just making high tech ships as we are so far behind, it wouldn't work.

And from what we have seen, no way this group says no to better tech, so we will flop back and forth every few votes

1 out of 4 doesn't exactly sound like flip-flopping.
 
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[X] Atomic Torpedoes (Prototype)

Star Trek ship numbers are always insanely, impossibly low for the implications of the setting. It's just a genre thing at this point.

It's funny to think that if only a few hundred thousand people ever get to join the navy out of a population of hundreds of billions of people... are the Klingons actually a warrior race? Only a tiny rounding error actually got to fight in any war.

Just imagining the Vulcans watching humans start loading nukes onto all their ships.

Vulcan: Do you not remember how terribly these weapons damaged your homeworld?
Human: We do... and that's precisely why we're taking them with us away from our homeworld.
 
It sounds like the atomics use the same tubes as our current ones, so doing a retrofit should be relatively trivial.

As such:
[X] Tycho City Expansion (+8 Industry)
 
Vulcan: Do you not remember how terribly these weapons damaged your homeworld?
Human: We do... and that's precisely why we're taking them with us away from our homeworld.

Any starship is a WMD by definition. The antimatter powering them. The reactionless impulse drives. The drive plume of a reaction drive. The ability to toss rocks at things that are unshielded. The ability to accelerate large amounts of matter using any of a dozen systems on a ship. In a tactical scenario though, without an atmosphere to propegate heat or a shockwave, though, against targets with potentially unknown types of shielding, you need what would be overkill in other contexts.
 
How big an upgrade are Atomic Torpedoes and how do they stack up to the phase cannons?
Things are a little subjective without many numbers, but here's a Youtube clip of the phase cannons.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uI-3bmLNNkY
The mountain is equivalent in size to Mount McKinley. Compare that to nuclear weapons.

I would like to note that energy shielding and starship hulls are more resistant to damage than an unshielded mountain. It seems like constructed objects have some sort of damage mitigation built in.
 
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[X] Tycho City Expansion (+8 Industry)

I see that Atomics are winning. However, I would like to point out that they will be eclipsed pretty soon by anti-matter torpedoes. Which were already placed in the Enterprise in the beginning of season 3. So, we would be pushing forward with a technology that should be replaced quickly. Even if it were not, the technology becomes adopted and available within 4 years without our intervention. So...we are really not getting much benefit.

On the other hand, Industry is HUGE. We are still just starting and things compound. But, it is expected that the NX class will be a huge industry cost- even subsidized. And we will want to backwards compatible the all of our other ships. We need a LOT of industry if we want to build ships while refitting older ships to new technology. And the Protoype probable needs more industry.

So, yes, +8 is important. In addition, as we are '49 right now and we will probably not be building the NX until '52, that is 3 years. +8 becomes +12.8 by then. Which is a 19-20% increase to our available industry (14.4 Free +8.64 increase + 20+24= 67.04 Available).

In other words: we are currently voting between getting a prototype option (that would cost more industry) on the NX that will soon be matched or surpassed without our intervention or a 19-20% industrial increase that can snowball even more.

I am voting for the 19-20% industry increase.
 
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The fact the Atomics seem to be backwards compatible with the Spatial launchers is a nice avenue to revamp our Stingrays that deserves exploring sooner than later. Especially if this lets us introduce any needed modifications to our Stingrays currently in production (something that happens all the time in naval production), reducing the costs of later refits with Warp 5 drives.
 
Things are a little subjective without many numbers, but here's a Youtube clip of the phase cannons.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uI-3bmLNNkY
Compare that to nuclear weapons.

I would like to note that energy shielding and starship hulls are more resistant to damage than an unshielded mountain. It seems like constructed objects have some sort of damage mitigation built in.


They fried their power systems doing that. Not sustainable in a fight.
 
Vulcan: Do you not remember how terribly these weapons damaged your homeworld?
Human: We do... and that's precisely why we're taking them with us away from our homeworld.
The Vulcans also destroyed their world pre-spaceflight with nuclear weaponry. Might actually be why they wanted to help humanity. They saw us do the same things they did.

In the interests of being honest, you should mention that nukes look a LOT less amazing in a vacuum.
Also forgot to mention the mountain destroyed in that clip is about the size of Mount McKinley. Edited that into the post.
 
2149: NX Project (Spaceframe: Part One)
[X] Atomic Torpedoes (Prototype)

The prototype atomic torpedoes have substantially higher yields than the spatial torpedoes, utilizing a very compact warhead that nonetheless delivers quite a pop of radiation when it detonates, evaporating armor and hull plating alike. But when you get the notification that the Warp 5 Engine is finished, it's time to go. From what you hear it isn't quite "warp five" and the hope is that later optimisations to injectors and warp coils will get it the rest of the way, and it is entirely possible that a year or two of prolonged use and tweaks will get the rest of the promised velocity out of the design. Unfortunately there is sometimes just no substitute for practical experience.

The Warp 5 Complex in orbit is gearing up for the production of the testbed NX-class vessel, and you have all the resources of United Earth Starfleet at your disposal to make it happen. Your first task is designing the primary hull, where a couple schools of thought quickly emerge. The first is to use a large saucer, completing the partial disk of the Stingray class. This would provide you plenty of internal space along a short vertical axis. While the sublight engines would need to be positioned elsewhere, it would give you plenty of options down the road for auxiliary systems.

Option number two is to keep the Stingray-style half-saucer at a larger scale, utilizing the bisected areas to mount the impulse drive. The disadvantage to this is that you will be left with less utility to play with in the interior by quite a significant margin thanks to the smaller volume and space set aside for the engines.

In either case that's only the primary hull, with the structure of the nacelles and potential hull expansions still undecided. You may be able to offset the disadvantages of either choice later down the line, although there's no denying that the full saucer is the path towards the objectively largest design you could build with its extra mass over the competition. On the other hand, there's nothing saying you can only install engines on the half-saucer, either.

[ ] Full Saucer Primary Hull (More Internal Space) (Industry: 13)
[ ] Half-Saucer Primary Hull (Less Internal Space) (Industry: 11)


Free Industry: 14.4 (Next Year: 17.2)
NX-class Prototype: Subsidised
Stingray-class Production: 20 (Ends 2152)
Merchant-class Production: 24 (Ends 2152)
 
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[X] Full Saucer Primary Hull (More Internal Space) (Industry: 13)

This is our testbed ship and the ship that will be used for exploration. We will need the space.
 
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