If we want to be a healer on a semi-regular basis we can do that without charging our patients. Unlike the doctors you like bringing up, this would not in any way affect our healing operations. Like the doctors you like bringing up, we'd need to heal a crapload of people to make a good sum of money if we're charging a reasonable price, and since we aren't a recognized provider we won't get any insurance payments, so actually we'll need to either charge more than three times what people are used to paying or heal more than three times as many people to make a given amount of money. This will be very hard to do with Kyuubey enforcing the masquerade on unrelated civilians.
We could be a healer on a semi-regular basis, but people are not going to vote for it unless there's some tangible benefit (even if it is 1/3rd of what a normal doctor would get paid for the same service due to insurance). And one of my personal goals is to blow the masquerade wide open. Which would allow magical healing to be officially recognized as a branch of medicine and would allow meguca to greatly improve the quality and length of human lives around the world.

We don't legally exist. Any money we make is going to have to go to Mami anyway, or our ability to earn, store, and spend money will be severely limited.

We're not charging Mami for cleansing any more than a housewife charges her husband for sex. Sometimes when people like each other very much one of them will spend money that the other can't independently repay.
My original point was that we appear to be vehemently against the idea of accepting money from anyone for any reason. Except for Mami, for some reason. Or if we steal it or scam it from people that we don't know. Which is extraordinarily odd. Money ought to be just be one tool among many, but people tend to respond weirdly when it is involved.

But Kyousuke won't be healed in return. We're healing him no matter what. Any money he gives us will provide him no additional services, in other words, taking money from someone else and giving them nothing in return... Ask for front row seats to his next concert if reciprocation becomes an issue.
As Jackercracks said, the issue is reciprocity (whether or not we explicitly ask for anything before or after). Our healing invokes an obligation in him to reciprocate in some way. But since we're treating this a friendship, it would not be socially acceptable to accept money (which is, incidentally, why asking for money would be an effective way of preventing romantic attachment). Concert tickets, on the other hand, might be a socially valid thing to ask for in terms of reciprocity, but it's not the kind of reciprocity which would prevent romantic attachment.

Additionally, I figured out why I'm against using precog to win the lottery: People buy lottery tickets because they hope to win it (obviously). If you measured the value of that hope, then you would generally say that it is proportional to the size of the jackpot. But if we win the lottery using precog, then we would be reducing the value of that hope (i.e. the actual value of winning a jackpot would be half of what people expect because they would have to split the value with us). So everyone who bought a lottery ticket would lose half of its value if we use precog to win the lottery. That might not be much value to any one person and the victims of the crime would probably never know, but it still counts as stealing to me.
 
Sabrina: I will do this thing for you. However. Some day I will call upon you to repay this debt. Perhaps tomorrow, perhaps never. But when I call upon you, then you will be obliged to return my favor, whatsoever I demand. Do you understand?

Violin-Boy: I understand.

Sabrina: *Heals violin boy*
Sabrina: *Leaves*

Sabrina: *Never calls upon Violin-Boy to repay the debt. The Godfather routine was purely to prevent romantic attachment.*
 
I'm beginning to wonder if just doing it pro bono and saying outright we're doing it at Sayaka's request would solve the problems of keeping the Kyousuke from becoming attached to Sabrina-and-friends in the way the majority of us are worrying he will.

This might be my tiredness talking, though, as it's also trying to work something funny into this post and failing miserably.
 
If you really, really want to charge Kyouske for healing his hand to, as you say, keep it business-like, then we charge him 100 Yen. With a receipt and all.
While I'm amused at the idea of charging Kyousuke a dollar for healing, nominal fees like that are usually used in contexts where the transaction actually is social in nature, but there are laws that require it to look like a business transaction. That doesn't really apply here. Asking for 100 Yen might confuse Kyousuke, but it wouldn't transform the situation from a social one to a business one. And asking for a value that's actually large enough to change the situation from personal to business would provoke a reaction from Sayaka and Hitomi and many of the voters.

What if we sell the concert tickets?
That would be a direct insult. It would be less problematic to just ask for money in the first place.

@boonerunner
Breaking the Masquerade? Laudable, but are you prepared for the bunnycat to oppose that effort?
Honestly? I don't understand Kyuubey well enough to predict how he would respond. He was amenable to allow us to break the masquerade to our friends and family, and that is actually really odd. We need more information about what his motivations are and what the "rules" are that constrain his actions. But in the long term? Yes, I totally want us to break the masquerade regardless of the bunnycat's opposition.
 
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Additionally, I figured out why I'm against using precog to win the lottery: People buy lottery tickets because they hope to win it (obviously). If you measured the value of that hope, then you would generally say that it is proportional to the size of the jackpot. But if we win the lottery using precog, then we would be reducing the value of that hope (i.e. the actual value of winning a jackpot would be half of what people expect because they would have to split the value with us). So everyone who bought a lottery ticket would lose half of its value if we use precog to win the lottery. That might not be much value to any one person and the victims of the crime would probably never know, but it still counts as stealing to me.
Unless they somehow know we're going to win their hope remains the same. When they lose the disappointment remains the same. The lottery is all about the money people expect to win based on their incomplete understanding of the future. Even if we do treat it as the money that they will in fact win the only people affected are the ones with a winning number, and they're still getting a boatload of money. And it's only cut in half if exactly one other person won. If that bothers you so much we could see about winning a lottery that nobody else will.
As Jackercracks said, the issue is reciprocity (whether or not we explicitly ask for anything before or after). Our healing invokes an obligation in him to reciprocate in some way.
Only if he feels that way. It's entirely possible that he could just develop a crush on the healer. And don't say it's there even if he doesn't know it, that's not how obligation works.
We could be a healer on a semi-regular basis, but people are not going to vote for it unless there's some tangible benefit (even if it is 1/3rd of what a normal doctor would get paid for the same service due to insurance).
Clearly people aren't going to vote for it if that tangible benefit is money. And we'll still need to find another way to make money if we want to do anything that Mami can't already trivially afford, because 1/3rd of what a normal doctor makes adds up slowly.
My original point was that we appear to be vehemently against the idea of accepting money from anyone for any reason. Except for Mami, for some reason.
We have never once charged Mami for a service. Had she not offered for us to stay with her we would've gone with Homura, and even then the deciding factor was that she needed a roommate more than Homura does. The only time we've actually asked her for money was to fund something we're doing for her that we couldn't do for free, and we made no profit from that. Jackercracks and the post that this was responding to should have already explained why that's different.
 
We could be a healer on a semi-regular basis, but people are not going to vote for it unless there's some tangible benefit (even if it is 1/3rd of what a normal doctor would get paid for the same service due to insurance). And one of my personal goals is to blow the masquerade wide open. Which would allow magical healing to be officially recognized as a branch of medicine and would allow meguca to greatly improve the quality and length of human lives around the world.
In the absence of ethics your ethical concerns, I think the issue is that this approach isn't particularly good at either healing people or making us rich. We aren't a dedicated healer, and money correlates very poorly with suffering.
We'd be better off making a concerted effort to get rich (without inflicting egregious disutility on anyone [who we don't dislike]), and then paying actual healers to heal people.
 
Interloper pt. 22
... Stocking up for Walpurgisnacht. Which means going... shopping.

"... Can I join you for that?" you ask, mental voice breathlessly eager.

An air of faint surprise permeates the telepathic link.

"You... may?" Homura replies, sounding puzzled. "That would make it more convenient...?"

"Great!" you say, grinning to yourself as you bound across another gap between buildings. "Let me know when!"

"OK?" Homura says.

"Look, I'm looking forward to it, OK?" you say.

"... OK?" Homura repeats.

You snort. "Ah, whatever. See you soon, Homura," you say.

"See you," Homura echoes.

You land smoothly, with a small pulse of magic and legs bending slightly under your weight. To your delight, the concrete flagstones don't shatter under your weight. "I think I'm starting to get the hang of it, Mami!" you say happily as you sprint across the rooftop, hard on Kirika's heels. "Roofhopping, I mean."

"That's great, Sabrina!" Mami turns to give you a warm smile.

Your next leap slips slightly, the timing off by the barest sliver of a second, and your flight through the air is accompanied by the crunch of breaking concrete flagstones. "Whoops," you chuckle.

"Ah, well... you're still picking it up quite quickly!" Mami says, warm approval in her voice as she turns her head slightly to meet your eyes. "I... still have a few tricks I could show you some time? We were in a bit of a hurry last time..."

"That sounds great, Mami," you say, giving her a broad smile. "Sometime soon?"

"Whenever you have the time," Mami agrees.

"Oh, that reminds me!" you say as you swerve around a protruding vent, shifting back to run next to Mami again as soon as you clear it, "Enchantment."

"Hmm, Sabrina?" Mami asks.

"Well, I never really made much progess with it, but I'm curious," you say. "What kind of things can we make with enchantment? Any limits or anything?"

"Eh?" Mami says. "I've... never really found any limits, no. It's just... each effect needs to be figured out on its own, so it takes time and Grief Seeds."

That piques your interest. "Oh? What've you managed to figure out?" you ask, turning to grin at Mami.

"Um," Mami says, thinking. "Durability, magic shields, space expansion, colour, um. Transforming normal objects into similar ones, though that's sort of tricky, keeping my tea warm, uhh, my hair. A few little animated toys, but they don't do much." Towards the end of the sentence, her mental voice shades towards melancholy.

"Oh, that's neat," you say, injecting cheer to your voice, giving her a worried look. She feels her eyes on you, turning midjump to give you a little smile, one tinged with old pain. "Mami, I'm here."

A pause. "Thank you, Sabrina," she says, smiling becoming more natural, more content.

"Almost there," Kirika calls happily, disappearing over the edge of the roof. You follow her down into the alley, where the black haired girl's already detransformed and is bouncing impatiently on her feet, eager to return to Oriko. You shake your head, rolling your eyes at her, and she gives you an unrepentant smirk.

Mami watches the byplay neutrally.

"She's kinda grown on me," you tell Mami as you detransform. You'd been meaning to try and... rehabilitate Oriko and Kirika anyway, so... "And really, she's not that bad."

"I'll take your word for it, Sabrina," she says, glancing sidelong at Kirika as she detransforms you. Kirika's already bounced to the mouth of the alley, peering in the direction of Oriko's mansion.

The three of you head out, merging into the sparse mid afternoon crowds, Kirika ranging ahead of you like an eager puppy.

"Hey Oriko, we're returning Kirika to you now," you inform the seer telepathically.

"I know," Oriko replies.

Seers.

"Yeah, yeah," you say.

Oriko's waiting at the front door when you round the dense hedges surrounding the Mikuni residence. Kirika bounces up and sweeps the seer up in a hug. "Orikooooooooooo."

You glance at Mami. "Anything you need to do here?"

Mami shakes her head. "No, I just wanted to go with you, Sabrina," she says, giving you a warm smile.

"Ah, fair enough," you say, then turn to Oriko and Kirika. "Anyway, see you, and thanks for the help!" you call, raising your voice and a hand to wave them good bye.

"Bye Sabrina!" Kirika chirps.

"Goodbye," Oriko says.

Mami gives them a nod, the barest incline of her head, before turning back to you.

Your smile's a touch rueful. Baby steps, you suppose. "Shall we head back to the others?"

"Yes, let's," she says.

A few minutes later, you're bounding over the rooftops again, wincing at the faint cracks underfoot when you miss the timing. "So Mami," you call over the rushing wind.

"Yes, Sabrina?" she calls back, drills streaming out in the wind rushing by.

"Do you think it's possible to enchant an item with something like, 'cleanses Soul Gems'?" you ask, neatly avoiding an antenna with a bob and weave.

"I... wouldn't think so," Mami says, herself avoiding the same antenna. "I've... never tried, though," she admits. "I... wouldn't have thought powers like yours were possible, either. Maybe you could do it?"

"Well, it's worth a shot, right?" you say. "It's not like it costs much but time."

"Right," Mami agrees with a smile.

"Say, how do you think magic works anyway?" you ask as you crest the next building.

Mami chuckles warmly. "You never go for the easy questions, do you?" she says fondly.

"Sometimes I do," you protest. "Like, um, what should we have for dinner?"

"Hmm," Mami says, giving you a quick smile without breaking stride. "That's not an easy question, either! We need to cook, quickly, for six people, you know."

You waggle your hand at her, snatching it back to avoid clipping an air conditioning compressor. "Ehhhhhh." A stray thought strikes you just then. "By the way, do you know where Homura and the others are right now?"

"Somewhere on the way to the hospital?" she says.

"... Right, I'm checking with Homura," you say with some asperity. Hmmm, hospitals.

Mami giggles.

"Homura?" you ask. "We're on our way, but where are you right now?" You know, now that you think about it, healing Kyousuke... Well, while him crushing on Homura would be -was, is, time travel messes with the tenses something fierce- absolutely hilarious, you'd rather not get tangled up in that mess.

"Block 379-12," the time traveller answers promptly.

"Right, thanks," you say to her. Out loud, you repeat, "Block 379-12."

"Ah, I know where that is," Mami says, "This way." She changes direction slightly, swinging to the left a hair.

"Buuuuuut back on topic," you say, continuing to muse internally on Kyousuke. Maybe charge him for the healing? That's what doctors do, right? "Magic?"

Mami frowns in consideration, looking back at you. "I think... it works on what you want. There's some limits, like how much time and how much corruption we can afford to spend, but..."

"Hm," you say. You do have better ways of getting money, admittedly, and it feels rather... mercenary to charge Kyousuke for healing. It doesn't really sit right with you, for most part. "I've found my range seems to be restricted to a hundred meters out."

Mami gives you a surprised look, avoiding a protruding duct without even looking. "That's... unusual."

"It is?" you ask in surprise, shelving the thoughts of what you'll call the Kyousuke problem for now.

"Um... there are magical girls with a hundred meter range," she says. "Not too many, though."

"Huh," you say. "Oh hey, we're almost there." You can sense Homura and Madoka and Sayaka, on the far edges of your senses.

[] Write-in

=====​

Do suggest something for dinner too, by the by. I could think of something, but indulge me this, yeah?
 
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Wait... aside from making sure Kyosuke isn't obligated to us, why do we want money? I have yet to actually see a lack of money have a noticeable relevance to the plot. Do we just want it just to have it?
 
Actually, I'm curious whether our range is exactly 100 meters (from what, our soul gem?), since that's kind of an arbitrary restriction, implying some kind of underlying intelligence behind power limits.
 
Firnagzen said:
"Um," Mami says, thinking. "Durability, magic shields, space expansion, colour, um. Transforming normal objects into similar ones, though that's sort of tricky, keeping my tea warm, uhh, my hair. A few little animated toys, but they don't do much." Towards the end of the sentence, her mental voice shades towards melancholy.
Oomph! Ouch! Do you have to?

Firnagzen said:
"Um... there are magical girls with a hundred meter range," she says. "Not too many, though."
WHO? This i'd like to know. We should ask.
 
Unless they somehow know we're going to win their hope remains the same. When they lose the disappointment remains the same. The lottery is all about the money people expect to win based on their incomplete understanding of the future. Even if we do treat it as the money that they will in fact win the only people affected are the ones with a winning number, and they're still getting a boatload of money. And it's only cut in half if exactly one other person won. If that bothers you so much we could see about winning a lottery that nobody else will.

As Jackercracks said, the issue is reciprocity (whether or not we explicitly ask for anything before or after). Our healing invokes an obligation in him to reciprocate in some way.
Only if he feels that way. It's entirely possible that he could just develop a crush on the healer. And don't say it's there even if he doesn't know it, that's not how obligation works.
All gifts invoke some sort of obligation in the recipient. This is part of human nature. Ungrateful recipients can choose not to act on that obligation, but that is generally considered to be bad form. On the other hand, it is acceptable for the gift giver to decline to accept anything from the recipient and redirect that obligation so that it focuses on others instead. If we healed Kyousuke in secret, he would still have an obligation and he would know that he has an obligation; the problem in this case would be that he wouldn't know who the target of that obligation should be.

Clearly people aren't going to vote for it if that tangible benefit is money.
If we need money (because we need raw materials for manufacturing or because we're starting a Global Cleansing Empire), then people will vote on ways to make money. Professional healing would be one way of obtaining the money that we need to cleanse people (whether people would vote for it or not is a different question).

And we'll still need to find another way to make money if we want to do anything that Mami can't already trivially afford, because 1/3rd of what a normal doctor makes adds up slowly.
1/3rd of what a normal doctor would make for a given procedure. The time required, however, would be much less than a doctor would require (especially for cases that doctors cannot handle), so it's still a significant source of income.

We have never once charged Mami for a service. Had she not offered for us to stay with her we would've gone with Homura, and even then the deciding factor was that she needed a roommate more than Homura does. The only time we've actually asked her for money was to fund something we're doing for her that we couldn't do for free, and we made no profit from that. Jackercracks and the post that this was responding to should have already explained why that's different.
I'm not saying that accepting help from Mami is wrong in any way. I'm totally fine with that. What I am saying is that rejecting the idea of accepting help from other people (like Kyousuke) is strange in light of the fact that we are currently accepting help from Mami.
 
"Hm," you say. You do have better ways of getting money, admittedly, and it feels rather... mercenary to charge Kyousuke for healing. It doesn't really sit right with you, for most part. "I've found my range seems to be restricted to a hundred meters out."

Mami gives you a surprised look, avoiding a protruding duct without even looking. "That's... unusual."

"It is?" you ask in surprise, shelving the thoughts of what you'll call the Kyousuke problem for now.

"Um... there are magical girls with a hundred meter range," she says. "Not too many, though."

What? What?

We need a proper explanation about this. Completely in full. What the normal restrictions are, what the other 100m girls' powers are like, everything.
 
Do suggest something for dinner too, by the by. I could think of something, but indulge me this, yeah?
Pasta scales up well with minimal additional effort. Likewise stir fry and fried rice, or pretty much anything else that's just an amorphous blob of food. Soups, stews, chowders, gumbo, etc. Sandwiches, sushi. Bangers and mash, shepherd's pie. A homemade pizza party for six takes somewhere between an hour and two, but the dough's better if made in the morning and we're too late to make the dough properly today.
Wait... aside from making sure Kyosuke isn't obligated to us, why do we want money? I have yet to actually see a lack of money have a noticeable relevance to the plot. Do we just want it just to have it?
We will probably need to fund the Best Exotic Mamigold Hotel, but that's not something we can do on a doctor's salary anyway.
I'm not saying that accepting help from Mami is wrong in any way. I'm totally fine with that. What I am saying is that rejecting the idea of accepting help from other people (like Kyousuke) is strange in light of the fact that we are currently accepting help from Mami.
Nobody is rejecting the idea of accepting help from anyone. If Kyousuke wants to help us do something that's fine. We're rejecting the idea of charging him for a service, which is not the same thing as accepting help when someone offers.
Oomph! Ouch! Do you have to?
I assume this is a reference to something I haven't read.
 
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