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Paths of Civilization

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Abby Normal said:
To clarify, this means we'd have 1 Main, 2 Secondary actions still, and could still double up on secondaries for "effectively" 2 main, 0 secondary if we want, but we'd no longer be able to do double-main, 1 secondary? And we'd effectively get the effect of (at least) one secondary action done for us each turn, as fits the needs of the people chiefs and their personal power base?
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Precisely.

Abby Normal said:
Also, i have to ask, how unlikely was us getting two hero units/chiefs back to back...starting right after we picked up that humility trait that lowered our hero chances? (And is that luck maybe hopefully going to lead to an evolution of said trait?
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Depending on how you want to think about things, either 4/10000 or 1/10000, since I rolled exactly the same result for Diplo (99) several days and dozens of other rolls apart.
 
[X] Twythulmyn (Mediocre Martial, Average Econ, Heroic Diplomacy, probable two turn lifespan)
[X] Yes (Consumes Econ, establishes permanent oversea trade route with Metal Workers)
[X] Large increase to local power (Changes government type to Early Ancient Provincial Kingdom, alters action spread, completes prereqs for Scourge Warding early, miscellaneous effects)

I'm not completely happy with the poor martial, but heroic diplomacy when starting to regularly trade with the metal workers? YES PLEASE!
 
[X] Twythulmyn (Mediocre Martial, Average Econ, Heroic Diplomacy, probable two turn lifespan)
[X] Yes (Consumes Econ, establishes permanent oversea trade route with Metal Workers)
[X] Small increase to local power (Various effects, alters action spread)
not even posted yet: Welp, with the revealed chances of actually getting a hero unit, yeah, large is probably better.
[X] Large increase to local power (Changes government type to Early Ancient Provincial Kingdom (Elected), alters action spread, completes prereqs for Scourge Warding early, miscellaneous effects)

I'm ~50% on going for small instead of large, so I'm voting against the bandwagon for discussion purposes. I'd really like more information about what the "Various effects" are.

First of all, Large increase will cause us to lose our double main option. This is a significant decrease in our ability to focus efforts in something that we want done, particularly our megaprojects. The next time we get a hero unit with a megaproject, getting that 4x boost instead of a 2x boost would be huge. Even ignoring the megaprojects, double main is incredibly useful for things which we want done with extreme effectiveness: New Sacred Warriors, Restoration of Harmony, etc. With the double main we can take advantage of whatever our hero leader specializes in far better than we otherwise could.

Obviously the Large increase has a bunch of nice bonuses attached to it, but I'm not sure they're worth it.
 
Well, all in then.
[X] Twythulmyn (Mediocre Martial, Average Econ, Heroic Diplomacy, probable two turn lifespan)
[X] Yes (Consumes Econ, establishes permanent oversea trade route with Metal Workers)
[X] Large increase to local power (Changes government type to Early Ancient Provincial Kingdom, alters action spread, completes prereqs for Scourge Warding early, miscellaneous effects)
I am once again picking the hero in an attempt to deal with the concept of 'don't stick out' as a trait. Establishing a permanent sea trade route with the metal workers has all kinds of boons, and I really hope that we can get a hierarchy tolerance bonus. Still, we need the effective action econ this will give us.
Umi-san said:
I still think Expand Forest + Trade Mission is good tho. Expand Forest counts as an econ action probably, and Trade Mission consumes, like... art or diplo or something, correct?
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It seems to be taking econ, despite the fact we shouldn't be able to trade manpower and food that much? I am confused myself.
Academia Nut said:
Depending on how you want to think about things, either 4/10000 or 1/10000, since I rolled exactly the same result for Diplo (99) several days and dozens of other rolls apart.
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I really hope we get a trait evolution based off of this.
 
notgreat said:
First of all, Large increase will cause us to lose our double main option.
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no, it loses us our Double Main + Secondary action and trades it for just a double main, with secondary turns being taken every time autonomously.

bluefur87 said:
It seems to be taking econ, despite the fact we shouldn't be able to trade manpower and food that much? I am confused myself.
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That's true... maybe it's because of the food for the crew and the effort spent making a ship? Idk.

Same, r.e. trait evo. Harmony to synchrony or something, whatever it takes to spread harmony worldwide, forcibly.
 
[X] Twythulmyn (Mediocre Martial, Average Econ, Heroic Diplomacy, probable two turn lifespan)
[X] Yes (Consumes Econ, establishes permanent oversea trade route with Metal Workers)
[X] Large increase to local power (Changes government type to Early Ancient Provincial Kingdom, alters action spread, completes prereqs for Scourge Warding early, miscellaneous effects)
 
Academia Nut said:
highs2lows said:
Is beekeeping a possible economic action? @Academia Nut
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Wild honey is already collected, and there are a few experiments in beekeeping, but for the most part its part of the forestry management process.
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@Academia Nut Will the people ever get a chance to integrate beekeeping into the culture? It seems like something that would mesh well with farming and shapers of the land.
The fact that it doesn't spoil means that it could become a staple food and be integrated into every village with managed hives.
 
This votes opposition look like they're in a grim spot. Welp we know whats really likely to win lol.
 
Umi-san said:
Don't listen to him... if the diplo leader wins we won't be able to do expand warriors, which will leave a space open <3 <3 that will then be filled by Survey Lands, Study Forest, and Study Health <3 <3
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They would be replaced by quarry settlement, expand snail cultivation, and more sailboats you goon >.>
Motoko said:
As far as I'm aware:
mediocre = meh
average =normal
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I want to hear that from AN thank you. There must be a reason that they are put seperately, especially since unstated seems to imply normal, or worse, bad.
 
Sivantic said:
They would be replaced by quarry settlement, expand snail cultivation, and more sailboats you goon >.>

I want to hear that from AN thank you. There must be a reason that they are put seperately, especially since unstated seems to imply normal, or worse, bad.
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Why do you want to rely on others for our copper and other metallic resources? Why do you want children to die in the streets of infected cuts? Why do you want us to not gain interesting poisons and new harvestable crops, like cotton? All for the sake of more diplo... *shakes head* </3
 
Academia Nut said:
Depending on how you want to think about things, either 4/10000 or 1/10000, since I rolled exactly the same result for Diplo (99) several days and dozens of other rolls apart.
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Sweet =D So, wait, are hero units generated on a category basis, not a per turn/chief basis? Like, each turn we get a roll for Dip/Econ/Mil/Mysticism/Maybe-art/maybe-centralization-and-hierarchy* that governs how well our civilization does on that front in general that turn, and if the roll is high enough (99+ now, 98+ before humility trait) it (might) spawn a hero unit that does a heroic action in that category for us for free before being available as chief?

(*I guess Centralization and hierachy might be lumped together in that Admin roll you use to determine the order expenditures and gains happen? And then maybe mysticism and art are both part of a culture roll?)
 
[X] Twythulmyn (Mediocre Martial, Average Econ, Heroic Diplomacy, probable two turn lifespan)
[X] Yes (Consumes Econ, establishes permanent oversea trade route with Metal Workers)
[X] Large increase to local power (Changes government type to Early Ancient Provincial Kingdom (Elected), alters action spread, completes prereqs for Scourge Warding early, miscellaneous effects)

Seems reasonable. Wasn't sure how far Ancient Kingdom would take us as scale increases, so this is fine.
 
[X] Twythulmyn (Mediocre Martial, Average Econ, Heroic Diplomacy, probable two turn lifespan)
[X] Yes (Consumes Econ, establishes permanent oversea trade route with Metal Workers)
[X] Large increase to local power (Changes government type to Early Ancient Provincial Kingdom, alters action spread, completes prereqs for Scourge Warding early, miscellaneous effects)

Well going for provincial government can't be helped if we want to avoid feudalism completely. Screw vassal's vassals not my vassals problem!
 
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Whatever happened to those random encounter rolls AN mentioned way back.like Ik about the meteor but has anything else happened relating to that since?
 
[X] Twythulmyn (Mediocre Martial, Average Econ, Heroic Diplomacy, probable two turn lifespan)
[X] Yes (Consumes Econ, establishes permanent oversea trade route with Metal Workers)
[X] Large increase to local power (Changes government type to Early Ancient Provincial Kingdom, alters action spread, completes prereqs for Scourge Warding early, miscellaneous effects)

Odds that the new Hero unlocks a new mega project that needs to be started during his lifespan? :p
 
Umi-san said:
Why do you want to rely on others for our copper and other metallic resources? Why do you want children to die in the streets of infected cuts? Why do you want us to not gain interesting poisons and new harvestable crops, like cotton? All for the sake of more diplo... *shakes head* </3
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You'd rather end up with the debacle of Canton? With us falling into debt due to being unable to pay for the metal?

All for the point of being contrary... *disappointed look*
 
mastigos said:
and??? water shipping is more efficient than land shipping.
Its why we made the canal
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At this age water shipping is unreliable and dangerous; costs are also high as our society have yet developed regular ship building and non-land trading practices. Land routes are at the moment, safer and familiar.
 
highs2lows said:
:cry::cry:
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Umi-san said:
Don't listen to him... if the diplo leader wins we won't be able to do expand warriors, which will leave a space open <3 <3 that will then be filled by Survey Lands, Study Forest, and Study Health <3 <3
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Sivantic said:
No.

We have too many other projects that we need to deal with. Expand Warriors, Build War Carts, Build Wall, New Trails, Sacred Warriors, Expand Black Birds, Trade Missions, Expand Forest. Too much to divert our attention again.
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Pretty much this. I would love to do that megaproject. It's super cool, and I want to read the narrative, but we have too much to do internally. Like, we pretty much need to do all those actions as well as some of our "sciency" actions (or have them done by our subordinates) before we can even possibly consider the Megaprojects again. Of course, if the situation with the Dead Priests changes to our advantage, then we can certainly lay off some of these. In particular, we need to build enough walls to permanently add it to "new settlement," and we need to finish our trail system so it connects to our newer villages.
 
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