But we have to base it on something. Basing it on current potential demand, especially when said current potential demand is incredibly unlikely to materialize (full ironworks would kill us on tech costs), is perfectly valid for a five-ten turn horizon. At five turns, we will either have another true city which will allow us another policy, or we can re-evaluate our policy distribution based on any new developments.
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
A cautionary note, five turns is at least 10 updates possibly more which at current update speed is more than two weeks real time. As is evidenced by the past twenty or so updates we've slipped into a style of play where big things are changing inside of a week so five turns is probably edging really hard on feasible prediction limits.
Nobody wants to use coal because it is very nasty, which is why we're sticking to sustainable forests as much as possible.
PyroTechno
The Procrastination Pokemon
[Main] Expand Economy produces +4 Econ right?
Ten, as of Redshore Ironworks.
PyroTechno
The Procrastination Pokemon
I meant before Redshore Ironworks, I'm trying to give a second opinion on the math and AN said the Expand Econ from this turn doesn't benefit from the Ironworks.
That's fair, but he's planning for the worst case scenario, not best case. While we could gain a new demand for charcoal in the form of a Mega or new project, we could also not be crazy and build every Ironworks possible.
- Location
- Austria
Yeah, but it's not, narratively, government's policy, but city's autonomous one. That's what puzzling. Mafia?
Abby Normal
High Clerk of the Ymaryn
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Edit: Ignore all this, because i am a dumb and read "redshore" as "blackmouth". Scroll down a few more posts to see AN confirm what system we're using (Block housing can make cities higher priority than capital, and block housing penalty is propagated, not cumulative), and a few more from that to see me post the correct current values, which are much simpler than this post)
Now that i'm awake and properly setup at my desk/laptop instead of just on phone, i'll get to the update math soon, to doublecheck the work others (bungie, primal, i think someone else?) has done. But for now, since i saw a lot of discussion on it, imma see if i cant figure out how the block housing affects the city list:
For a reminder, the way thresholds work is that each city "inherits" the threshold of the city above them, but takes a penalty for their position in the list equal to (X+2), where X is their position. The first city on the list has a base of 20, without the penalty (or, i suppose, you could say it has a base of 23, and takes the normal penalty, but it comes out to the same)
Assuming capital is always "first" on the list, even if thresholds say otherwise, and block housing penalty doesn't affect the capital. Also assuming that the "penalty" for not having block housing is applied only once, since inheritance will propagate it anyway.
Also, I found this in AN's post announcing the threshold changes way back when
Assuming @BungieONI 's math is right (as the first one i found in my search just now), we have 6 EE, and so all but LV would be active if this is how it works.
Alternatively, if block housing's penalty is cumulative:
Again assuming Bungie's math is right and we have 6 EE, then stallion pen and up would be active if this is how it works.
Alternatively, if the block housing can push blackmouth to first position over the capital:
Interestingly, this scenario produces the same thresholds for everything but valleyhome and blackmouth. Again, assuming Bungie/6 EE, all but LV active.
This scenario on the other hand is by far the worst for having lots of cities, and is the least likely imo...though once more assuming 6 EE stallion pen and up would be active.
...That was more math than i expected it to be
So...update math will wait until i get a snack and let my brain refresh itself a bit
So... @Academia Nut which of these is accurate? ...And for that matter, are my assumptions on wall status for each city right? I know at some point LV will get walls by our policy, and there was a question recently about if stallion pen might have 2 layers of walls, 1 significant from pre-palace actions and 1 massive from post-palace.
Also, in case anyone is curious, here's the math written out for how things were last update, which i did to make sure i remembered things right:
Now that i'm awake and properly setup at my desk/laptop instead of just on phone, i'll get to the update math soon, to doublecheck the work others (bungie, primal, i think someone else?) has done. But for now, since i saw a lot of discussion on it, imma see if i cant figure out how the block housing affects the city list:
For a reminder, the way thresholds work is that each city "inherits" the threshold of the city above them, but takes a penalty for their position in the list equal to (X+2), where X is their position. The first city on the list has a base of 20, without the penalty (or, i suppose, you could say it has a base of 23, and takes the normal penalty, but it comes out to the same)
Assuming capital is always "first" on the list, even if thresholds say otherwise, and block housing penalty doesn't affect the capital. Also assuming that the "penalty" for not having block housing is applied only once, since inheritance will propagate it anyway.
Also, I found this in AN's post announcing the threshold changes way back when
Which i'd forgotten about. So we know for sure which cities will be active.
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (25 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] [Block Housing] (30 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 30]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (24 EE Threshold)
[30 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 24]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (20 EE Threshold)
[24 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 20]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (15 EE Threshold)
[20 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 15]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (8 EE Threshold)
[15 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 8]
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] [Block Housing] (30 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 30]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (24 EE Threshold)
[30 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 24]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (20 EE Threshold)
[24 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 20]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (15 EE Threshold)
[20 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 15]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (8 EE Threshold)
[15 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 8]
Alternatively, if block housing's penalty is cumulative:
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (25 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] [Block Housing] (30 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 30]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (24 EE Threshold)
[30 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 24]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (16 EE Threshold)
[24 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 16]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (7 EE Threshold)
[16 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 7]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (-4 EE Threshold)
[7 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = -4]
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] [Block Housing] (30 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 30]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (24 EE Threshold)
[30 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 24]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (16 EE Threshold)
[24 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 16]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (7 EE Threshold)
[16 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 7]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (-4 EE Threshold)
[7 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = -4]
Alternatively, if the block housing can push blackmouth to first position over the capital:
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] [Block Housing] (29 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 29]
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (26 EE Threshold)
[29 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 5 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 26]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (24 EE Threshold)
[26 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) = 24]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (20 EE Threshold)
[24 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 20]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (15 EE Threshold)
[20 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 15]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (8 EE Threshold)
[15 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 8]
[20 (Base) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 29]
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (26 EE Threshold)
[29 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 5 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 26]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (24 EE Threshold)
[26 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) = 24]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (20 EE Threshold)
[24 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 20]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (15 EE Threshold)
[20 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 15]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (8 EE Threshold)
[15 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 8]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] [Block Housing] (29 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 29]
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (26 EE Threshold)
[29 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 5 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 26]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (20 EE Threshold)
[26 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 20]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (12 EE Threshold)
[20 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 12]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (3 EE Threshold)
[12 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 3]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (-8 EE Threshold)
[3 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = -8]
[20 (Base) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 29]
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (26 EE Threshold)
[29 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 5 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 26]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (20 EE Threshold)
[26 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 20]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (12 EE Threshold)
[20 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 12]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (3 EE Threshold)
[12 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 3]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (-8 EE Threshold)
[3 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = -8]
...That was more math than i expected it to be
So...update math will wait until i get a snack and let my brain refresh itself a bit So... @Academia Nut which of these is accurate? ...And for that matter, are my assumptions on wall status for each city right? I know at some point LV will get walls by our policy, and there was a question recently about if stallion pen might have 2 layers of walls, 1 significant from pre-palace actions and 1 massive from post-palace.
Also, in case anyone is curious, here's the math written out for how things were last update, which i did to make sure i remembered things right:
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (25 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] (25 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls] (22 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 22]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (18 EE Threshold)
[22 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 18]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (13 EE Threshold)
[18 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 13]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (6 EE Threshold)
[13 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 6]
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] (25 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) = 25]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls] (22 EE Threshold)
[25 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 22]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (18 EE Threshold)
[22 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 18]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (13 EE Threshold)
[18 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 13]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (6 EE Threshold)
[13 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 6]
Last edited:
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
Unless we go full London with mass burning of cheap quality coal, we'll be fine. And honestly, we don't have the industrial capability to make coal an issue.
PyroTechno
The Procrastination Pokemon
*cracks knuckles*
Let's do this.
Here's the stats, last updated before AN requested math.
-----
General
Diplomacy 18 + 4 (base income) - 1 (Freehills Game Invitation) - 2 (Redshore: Skullduggery) = 19 Diplomacy
Intrigue 4 + 1 (Redshore: Skullduggery) = 5 Intrigue
Economy 10 + 4 (Delayed Income) - 1 (net per Turn income) - 2 (Proclaim Glory) - 3 (Redshore Ironworks) - 2 (Efficient Charcoal Kilns) - 2 (Build Porcelain Works) + 8 (Provinces: Expand Economy) + 3 (Provinces: Build Mills) = 15 Economy
Sustainable Forests use 24 - 3 (Efficient Charcoal Kilns) + 1 (Build Porcelain Works) + 1 (Policies: Sacred Forest Baths) = 23 Sustainable Forest use
Sustainable Forest cap 27.5 + 0.5 (Forestry Policy) = 28 Sustainable Forest cap
Econ Expansion 10 + 1 (net per Turn income) + 9 (Econ expenditures) - 8 (Provinces: Expand Economy) = 12 Econ Expansion
Martial 3 + 1 (Delayed Income) = 4. 1x Secondary War Mission = 1x potential loss of Martial
Wealth 10 + 2 (net per Turn income) - 2 (Efficient Charcoal Kilns) + 2 (Build Porcelain Works) - 3 (Provinces: Study Alchemy) - 1 (Provinces: Study Stars) - 3 (Provinces: Build Mills) = 5 Wealth
Cultural
Culture 24 + 4 (net per Turn income) - 6 (Proclaim Glory) + 3 (Build Porcelain Works) = 25 - 1 (Overflow to Mysticism) = 24 Culture
Mysticism 24 - 2 (Provinces: Study Alchemy) + 1 (Provinces: Study Stars) + 1 (Overflow from Culture) = 24 Mysticism
Tech 24 + 2 (Delayed Income) - 3 (Redshore Ironworks) - 1 (Efficient Charcoal Kilns) - 2 (Build Porcelain Works) + 1 (Provinces: Study Alchemy) - 1 (Provinces: Build Mills) = 20 Tech
Stability
Stability 0 + 2 (Proclaim Glory) + 1-2 (Enforce Justice) = 3-4 Stability. Stability is capped without overflow at 3; 3 Stability
Legitimacy 3 - 1 (Crisis: Bring them back in with the fighting) + 1 (Proclaim Glory) = 3 Legitimacy
Organizational
Centralization 7 + 2-3 (Enforce Justice) = 9-10 Centralization
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The number of potential stab hits are split between them.
They do not need to be True Cities to build baths.
Also:
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] [Block Housing] (29 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 4 (Infrastructure) + 5 (Block Housing) = 29]
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (26 EE Threshold)
[29 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 5 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 26]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (24 EE Threshold)
[26 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) = 24]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (20 EE Threshold)
[24 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 20]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (15 EE Threshold)
[20 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 15]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (8 EE Threshold)
[15 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 8]
This is the formula being used, other than the fact that Blackmouth itself doesn't have Block Housing, so all cities right now have that penalty.
@Academia Nut - just to confirm something one more time.
Due to changing our trading post to a colony, we should be counting -1 Wealth, -1 Diplo, and +1 Econ THIS turn, correct?
Because I don't think everyone is counting that...
Due to changing our trading post to a colony, we should be counting -1 Wealth, -1 Diplo, and +1 Econ THIS turn, correct?
Because I don't think everyone is counting that...
Abby Normal
High Clerk of the Ymaryn
- Pronouns
- He/Him
...*looks back at your post with the actions* ...That does say redshore, doesn't it. *facepalm*
Well... i feel somewhat dumb right now X.X
In that case the math is much simpler:
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (21 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 21]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] (21 EE Threshold)
[21 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) = 21]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls] (19 EE Threshold)
[21 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 3 (Infrastructure) = 19]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (1 EE Threshold)
[19 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) 5= 15]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (10 EE Threshold)
[15 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 10]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (3 EE Threshold)
[10 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 3]
And i guess this means math for the update will wait until i have a soda or something else to wake up fully so i dont make a mistake like that again
And yeah, as @PrimalShadow says, bungi and pyro at least don't have the trade post -> colony corrections. Also, @Academia Nut just to be sure, does Econ 10 (+4) count for efficient economy? I assume not?
Edit: I am dumb and forgot to add the new baths
Last edited:
The Census says "whenever Econ is at 10 or greater".
Abby Normal
High Clerk of the Ymaryn
- Pronouns
- He/Him
And the status says "above econ 10", so my question was more "does the (+4) count as above?", but now that you mention that, and now that i check, yeah, the megaproject listing and the status are inconsistent...
- Location
- Austria
Well, there we have it. So, like, there is no reason to stop for them? That's 1 slot per turn forever already.
Abby Normal
High Clerk of the Ymaryn
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Redshore having one actually decreases every other cities threshold, since as a free city its not in the inheritance chain. So we actually need to be rather careful of letting our free cities have too much block housing, since i imagine the penalty (and bonus) both stack...
- Pronouns
- He/Him
This is correct.
...*looks back at your post with the actions* ...That does say redshore, doesn't it. *facepalm*
Well... i feel somewhat dumb right now X.X
In that case the math is much simpler:
-Valleyhome [Aqueduct, Baths, Sig. Walls, Capital, Palace] (21 EE Threshold)
[20 (Base) + 5 (Infrastructure) - 4 (No Block Housing) = 21]
-Blackmouth [Aqueduct, Baths, Governor's Palace, Sig. Walls?] (21 EE Threshold)
[21 (Inherit) - 4 (Penalty) + 4 (Infrastructure) = 21]
-Sacred Forest [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls] (18 EE Threshold)
[21 (Inherit) - 5 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 18]
-Stallion Pen [Aqueduct, Mass. Walls] (14 EE Threshold)
[18 (Inherit) - 6 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 14]
-Valleyguard [Aqueduct, Sig. Walls?] (9 EE Threshold)
[14 (Inherit) - 7 (Penalty) + 2 (Infrastructure) = 9]
-Lower Valleyhome [Aqueduct] (2 EE Threshold)
[9 (Inherit) - 8 (Penalty) + 1 (Infrastructure) = 2]
And i guess this means math for the update will wait until i have a soda or something else to wake up fully so i dont make a mistake like that again
And yeah, as @PrimalShadow says, bungi and pyro at least don't have the trade post -> colony corrections. Also, @Academia Nut just to be sure, does Econ 10 (+4) count for efficient economy? I assume not?
It counts for efficient economy.
Yep, seems you were right here. Can't say I'm not surprised, though I assume there's some reasonable limit based on our number of provinces and tech level. Regions can only support so many cities, after all.
Practically speaking, I'd assume the policies would prioritize aqueducts first since they provide the same benefits for no forest slots, but it still averages out to 1 forest per turn for an unknown period of time in the end. This could be be covered by our current forest passive and a Kiln action every six turns, but we'd cease to increase the gap. If we ever got to this point, I'd certainly be willing to put another passive on forest policy since we'd have an insane number of cities at that point due to all of the infrastructure.
This is a long ways off though, and in pretty uncharted territory (not needing to build more important crap. The dream) so we don't really know how infrastructure passives would behave at this point. We know they can theoretically build roads after all, even if they haven't yet. It could be that this is the point where they do. We may even decide to just switch all infrastructure passives by that point, thus reducing our need for tree drips. Hard to speculate that far.
Legion0047
Retired Shadowrunner.
- Location
- Austria
- Pronouns
- God Emperor
Okay. Gonna try to do the stat calculation.
Starting Stats:
Diplomacy 18 [+3]
Economy 10 (+4) [-6+6]
Martial 3 (+1)
Wealth 10 (+1)[+1]
Culture 24 [+4]
Mysticism 24 [+3-3]
Tech 24 (+2) [+1-1]
Prestige 87
Stability 0
Legitimacy 3
Centralization 7
Hierarchy 7
Religious Authority 8
LTE 24
Intrigue 4
Sustainable Forests 24/27.5
ACTIONS:
Crisis (-1 Legitimacy)
Forest Passive Policy (+.5 Forests, -1 LTE)
Baths Built (+1 Forest Use, +1 LTE)
City Support (+2E)
Skulduggery (+1 Intrigue, -2D)
{M} Proclaim Glory (-6C, -2E, +1 Legitimacy, +2 Stability, +1 Prestige)
{S} Ironworks (-3E, -3T, +2 Forest Use)
{S} Invite (-1D)
{S} EJ (+1 Stability, +1~3 Centralization)
{G} Kilns (-3 Effective Forest used, -2E, -2W, -1T)
{G} Porcelain (+1 Forest Use, -2E, -2T, +2W, +3C)
{M} Expand Economy (+8E)
{S} Study Alchemy (-2M, -3W, +1T)
{S} Study Stars (-1W, +1M)
{S} Build Mills (+3 LTE, -3W, -1T, +3E)
{S} War Mission - Pirate Clans (???) [Note: effect not counted.]
International Games (+? Prestige) [Note: effect not counted.]
Lets take care of special stats first.
Prestige 87 -> 88
Stability 0 -> 3
Legitimacy 3 -> 3
Centralization 7 -> 8~10
Hierarchy 7
Religious Authority 8
LTE 24 -> 27
Intrigue 4 -> 5
Sustainable Forests 24/27.5 -> 28{25}/28
~~~
What about our normal stats?
D = 18 +3 -2 -1 = 18
E = 10 +4 +2 -2 -3 -2 -2 +8 +3 = 18
# = 3 +1 = 4
W = 10 +1 +1 -2 +2 -3 -1 -3 = 5
C = 24 +4 -6 +3 = 25
M = 24 +3 -3 -2 +1 = 23 (+5)
T = 24 +2 +1 -1 -3 -1 -2 +1 -1 = 20 (+5)
Culture overflows to Mysticism, leaving our final stats as:
Diplomacy 18
Econ 18
Martial 4
Wealth 5
Culture 24
Mysticism 24 (+5)
Tech = 20 (+5)
Prestige 88
Stability 3
Legitimacy 3
Centralization 8~10
Hierarchy 7
Religious Authority 8
LTE 27 (Equivalently, EE 27-18=9)
Intrigue 5
Sustainable Forests 28{25}/28
This does NOT include the effects from
{S} War Mission - Pirate Clans (???)
International Games (+? Prestige)
Starting Stats:
Now, due to the Trading Post -> Colony conversion, we have -1W, -1D, and +1E income per turn. We also have an effective (+1) wealth income from Efficient Economy. Taking that into account and extracting the stats we really care about, our current stat block is:
Diplomacy 18 [+3]
Economy 10 (+4) [-6+6]
Martial 3 (+1)
Wealth 10 (+1)[+1]
Culture 24 [+4]
Mysticism 24 [+3-3]
Tech 24 (+2) [+1-1]
Prestige 87
Stability 0
Legitimacy 3
Centralization 7
Hierarchy 7
Religious Authority 8
LTE 24
Intrigue 4
Sustainable Forests 24/27.5
ACTIONS:
In particular, the stat-affecting events are:
Crisis (-1 Legitimacy)
Forest Passive Policy (+.5 Forests, -1 LTE)
Baths Built (+1 Forest Use, +1 LTE)
City Support (+2E)
Skulduggery (+1 Intrigue, -2D)
{M} Proclaim Glory (-6C, -2E, +1 Legitimacy, +2 Stability, +1 Prestige)
{S} Ironworks (-3E, -3T, +2 Forest Use)
{S} Invite (-1D)
{S} EJ (+1 Stability, +1~3 Centralization)
{G} Kilns (-3 Effective Forest used, -2E, -2W, -1T)
{G} Porcelain (+1 Forest Use, -2E, -2T, +2W, +3C)
{M} Expand Economy (+8E)
{S} Study Alchemy (-2M, -3W, +1T)
{S} Study Stars (-1W, +1M)
{S} Build Mills (+3 LTE, -3W, -1T, +3E)
{S} War Mission - Pirate Clans (???) [Note: effect not counted.]
International Games (+? Prestige) [Note: effect not counted.]
Lets take care of special stats first.
Prestige 87 -> 88
Stability 0 -> 3
Legitimacy 3 -> 3
Centralization 7 -> 8~10
Hierarchy 7
Religious Authority 8
LTE 24 -> 27
Intrigue 4 -> 5
Sustainable Forests 24/27.5 -> 28{25}/28
~~~
What about our normal stats?
D = 18 +3 -2 -1 = 18
E = 10 +4 +2 -2 -3 -2 -2 +8 +3 = 18
# = 3 +1 = 4
W = 10 +1 +1 -2 +2 -3 -1 -3 = 5
C = 24 +4 -6 +3 = 25
M = 24 +3 -3 -2 +1 = 23 (+5)
T = 24 +2 +1 -1 -3 -1 -2 +1 -1 = 20 (+5)
Culture overflows to Mysticism, leaving our final stats as:
Diplomacy 18
Econ 18
Martial 4
Wealth 5
Culture 24
Mysticism 24 (+5)
Tech = 20 (+5)
Prestige 88
Stability 3
Legitimacy 3
Centralization 8~10
Hierarchy 7
Religious Authority 8
LTE 27 (Equivalently, EE 27-18=9)
Intrigue 5
Sustainable Forests 28{25}/28
This does NOT include the effects from
{S} War Mission - Pirate Clans (???)
International Games (+? Prestige)