- Location
- Australia
@Academia Nut, just to be clear, what do our advisors think is a higher priority for this turn? Getting food stability or investing in our military?
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
- Location
- Reno Nv
I would think due to the righteous vengeance, it would be military. If cooler heads prevail, they might propose a defensive/ economic plan. like the step farms, and the like, or even fertilizer bombs.
- Location
- Las Islas Filipinas
Finally cought up. You know reading the argumenta here makes me feel like we are the elders and chiefs in the war council
So the punishment is a good choice since it is moderate and serves what it needs but more than that i think the formalize part would generate our Warrior Code.
The ask for help choice is the safest. We did not actively fight the DP when they asked for help, so they do not have any real reason to actively fight in our war
I am torn on the last action. The locked action is essentially to send a dedicated raid party to retaliate. Doing the chariots will make it more successful...bit this is not (technically) a fight for our land, this is a fight for our clients. Of course we still need the party to succeed...but i think the economic risk is too much, ill vote for the farm
[X] Formalize breaking and exposure
[X] Any who are interested may join the fight
[X] [Secondary] Step-Farms
So the punishment is a good choice since it is moderate and serves what it needs but more than that i think the formalize part would generate our Warrior Code.
The ask for help choice is the safest. We did not actively fight the DP when they asked for help, so they do not have any real reason to actively fight in our war
I am torn on the last action. The locked action is essentially to send a dedicated raid party to retaliate. Doing the chariots will make it more successful...bit this is not (technically) a fight for our land, this is a fight for our clients. Of course we still need the party to succeed...but i think the economic risk is too much, ill vote for the farm
[X] Formalize breaking and exposure
[X] Any who are interested may join the fight
[X] [Secondary] Step-Farms
Ghostdevil
The Devil of Ghosts
- Location
- United States
If were the chiefs and elders then what is the Mod that popped in?
A Holy Spirit?
What about the QM? The Earth and Creator Spirit?
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
I think I have a quote for that!
Note that last bit: "even if it will be disruptive". Our Econ advisor basically straight up said that pitching into the war effort is a higher priority than managing our economy. Not sure if he can be any clearer.
2604
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
Dude. He ain't gonna tell you that. You can get clarification on points, and probably get more detail, but he isn't going to tell us what to do. That's for us to decide. Read the update. Make your decision from the info available.
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
But- but we do have a close-ish answer? Am I going insane? Do people just not find the quote convincing? I thought it was a pretty clear indicator of what we could reasonably get away with, do people disagree? Seriously, what?
Do I need to quote the whole thing to get people's attention? Or am I being needy?
I want validation, darn it! Or at least a counter point
2605
- Location
- Australia
I can't believe I'm doing this but...
[X] [Secondary] Build War Carts
If the GM says it's a good idea despite the disruption, then it's a good idea and we should listen to the GM. I just hope the nomads take themselves out with plague from all their head-taking so we don't have to deal with them next turn.
[X] [Secondary] Build War Carts
If the GM says it's a good idea despite the disruption, then it's a good idea and we should listen to the GM. I just hope the nomads take themselves out with plague from all their head-taking so we don't have to deal with them next turn.
Umi-san
Procrastinating.
- Location
- ꙮ
It's also just polite. Suck up and like 100% of all the OP's posts is the path to 140k words.
It's a Need for military war, but not a Needs To Be Done Now!!!! You can just Farm and then do it next turn w/o the major loss. It literally says that in the very post you cited.
But also, I'm moderately persuaded, so if y'all can explain why it is essential to do it now rather than tomorrow....
Is this system of your based solely on posts or something? Cus that sounds like a dumb system >.>[X] Formalize breaking and exposure
[X] Any who are interested may join the fight
[X] [Secondary] Build War Carts
Haha wow, I've been gone for 2 days and thirty pages seasoned slightly with salt pass.
Still managed to stay in second despite that *smug*
@Umi-san you on the other hand managed to jump up by seventy *pokaaan*
Why?
I think this is more or less my viewpoint, as well. Though I just don't want to lose the fluff of being a dour people who are careful even in revenge.
Last edited:
- Location
- Australia
We either need to gear up for war this turn or next turn, and next turn we want to do Expand Shrine and Annual Festival for synergy with the completion of our mega-project.
zamin
The Watcher in the Dark
Sorry I took so long, but I woke up and saw page after page of salt and petty arguments and basically went "Eh, I'll do it later". Now it's after lunchtime here, I should probably get started on this. Fortunately, it's a short update, so this shouldn't take too long.
So to sum up this last turn, I guess I can safely say:
Both in story and in thread.
So last turn we decided to meet Not!Khal Drogo and attempt to do our usual peaceful trader thing. Unfortunately, he decided to respond by going full "Muh HONOR!!!" and start a pointless war out of arrogance and greed.
Fucking nomad raiders. This is why no one likes you anymore.
On the plus side, our people are going to feel fully justified in fighting this war. We offered them peace, but they spat in our faces and started this whole stupid conflict. Eye for an Eye is kicking in hard right now.
In any case, the fighting seems to be mostly taking place around our northern allied villages rather then inside our own territory. Our warriors are roughly on par with them, especially since the nomads can't use their cavalry properly. However, the nomad's habit of taking trophies has really pissed our people off, to the point that some of our guys are doing some nasty shit to them in retaliation.
Problem Number One: On one hand, our warriors are pretty justified in their anger. On the other, some of our people are a bit concerned that these ad-hoc punishments are a bit too far. We need to set up an official punishment in order to maintain order and discipline.
The choices we have are:
The punishment for trophy taking should be...
[] Ad hoc (Current)
No. Telling warriors that they can do whatever they want to captured enemies will just lead into problems in the long run. Best to cut in now and set up some ground rules that our warriors need to adhere to so that our Eye for an Eye trait doesn't come back to bite us in the ass later
[] Formalize breaking and exposure
Formalize what they're doing now, satisfying our Eye for an Eye trait. Possible risk of disease. Will anger the nomads further, but honestly, who gives a fuck what they think at this point? Sure they might decide to keep fighting, but their stupid 'muh honor' culture is going to make this war drag out anyway
[] Burning at the stake
On one hand, less risk of disease and satisfies our Eye41Eye trait. On the other, burning is a nasty way to go and might set some uncomfortable cultural precedents
[] Hanging and display
Possible, but do you really think the nomads will see all the bodies and get scared? They're more likely to get angry and keep fighting
[] Weighting and sea disposal
No. We'd have to haul them all the way down to the coast, get a boat and appropriate weights, then toss them overboard. Takes too much time and effort to be worth it, even without considering the potential pollution (which honestly wouldn't be a big issue unless we were tossing in hundreds of people at once anyway)
[] Skull-smashing and anonymous burial
Quick, simple and efficient. May not satisfy our Eye41Eye trait, but might (I repeat, might) freak out the nomads when they realize that their dead are not going to have any glory. We don't know enough about their culture to confirm either way, but the idea of simply tossing their dead into a pit without any honor or prayers appeals to me.
And here we have Problem Number Two: Some of our people are thinking of calling upon the WC for help. Having more warriors is nice, but there are a couple of problems listed here:
- We'd still need to feed any warriors the WC agrees to send up, which cuts into our Economy even further
- The WC might not want to send us any warriors, and even if they did it would make them more vulnerable to the Dead Priests' raids
- Unless we Improve Trails, they're going to have troubles sending up a lot of people anyway
The choices we have here are:
Asking for aid...
[] No aid is needed
Possible. By doing this we're sending a message that we're strong enough to deal with this ourselves. While having more warriors would be nice, we don't need them right this minute, especially if we're going to try fighting a defensive war
[] Any who are interested may join the fight
A good option, in my opinion. Lets those who want to help us join in while reassuring the WC leaders that we're not planning on dragging them into our fights. If we do well, the warriors they send will return home telling stories about how strong and powerful we are. On the other hand, if we fail, they'll be going home and letting everyone know that we're weak and ripe for the picking.
[] Call upon friendships
Probably not a good idea. We're friendly, but not officially allied, so forcing them to help in our war isn't likely to go over well with the WC chiefs, especially since this is likely to drag on for years due to current technological levels. They're not going to be happy about stripping their defenses like that, especially since the Dead Priests are sniffing around just outside their borders.
In order, I'd rank them as:
Interested>No aid needed>Call upon friendships
Now, onto the STATS!
----------------------------------
No changes here. I'm kinda annoyed because if the nomads had decided to attack at any other time, they would have been a minor problem at best. Now because of our weak Economy, we're going to need to make some hard choices.
Techwise, we now have Groomed Trails. I'm not quite sure what they are since a quick Google search just brought up a bunch of stuff involving skiing and snow boarding. Are we in winter or something?
No changes here, but keep an eye on the military tech. Hopefully we'll see a few things advance as this war drags on.
And now, CHOICES! Or Choice in this case, since we only have one action this turn due to all the FUCKING NOMAD WARMONGERS at our doorstep. God, this is like my Civ 6 games all over again. "Oh, you want to do a peaceful cultural victory? Too bad, you've spawned right next to the Romans and Aztecs! Have fun with that!"
----------------------------
Our main action is locked due to the Mega Project and one of our Secondaries is locked as a War Mission against the Storm Clan (Why?! Why are our people rushing off to fight instead of sticking to a defensive strategy? Understandable, but still frustrating)
So from what I can tell, people are divided into two main groups: those who want to double down on war actions and those who want to grab an Economy action in order to stay afloat.
Military Project (Expand Warriors, Build War Carts, etc.)
Since we're already sending a war party, we need to ensure that they won't just get slaughtered on the plains. Grabbing War Carts will increase our chances to do major damage while possibly unlocking better cavalry/anti-cavalry military techs. While our Economy will drop, our Pioneering Spirit trait will kick in to boost our Economy at the cost of Centralization.
Economy Project (Farms, Fishing, Pasture, Step Farms)
Our Economy is already at the breaking point and we need to increase food production in order to avoid dropping into negatives. While Pioneering Spirit will let us recover, it'll still cost us Centralization which is the stat used for major projects and fighting wars. In addition, Step Farms and Fishing are both on the edge of a breakthrough, so grabbing one of those now might give us some tech upgrades. Pasture is a more 'spread out' option in that it helps with both food production and war (more meat to eat and horses to pull carts). However, in the last turn or two, we've been having problems due to lack of manpower. Once the Mega Project finishes it should be dealt with, but until then labor intensive Economic actions may be difficult.
Before I make a vote either way, I'd just like to point out that the win conditions for our civilizations are different.
The nomads are, well, nomads. We know that they have a warrior culture (muh honor!) and look down on us for growing our food instead of eating meat and being all manly or whatever. Right now, they're united under their Hero who's pointed them our way because:
a) Loot
b) HONOR
There are literally no other reasons. They don't want our lands, they just want our shinys and are greedy enough to fight for them even when we've already offered them a trading deal. They'd rather fight against us because as peaceful farmers we don't fit into their honorable warrior culture and they feel that we're stubborn but weak.
For the nomads, a successful end to the war includes:
a) Much Loot
b) Much Honor/Glory in battle
c) Destroyed enemies
They can't and won't bother taking our lands because our terrain sucks for their nomadic lifestyle and they look down on farmers. They don't give a shit about us raiding them back because they have no vulnerable villages to raid. That's the whole point of being a nomad. Unless our War Party kills their Hero or wipes out an army or steals all their herds or something crazy like that, it's honestly not going to be that effective.
So how do we fight them?
Settle in, fight defensively, and turn their raids into bloody meatgrinders. Force them to spend lives again and again for little to no gain. They want honor and glory? Hide in the trees and shoot them as they ride past. Set traps and ambushes everywhere. Build walls around our villages and laugh in their faces as we pour down arrows. Make their lives fucking miserable. They can whine and stamp their feet all they like, but unless they want to charge their entire army into the hills to get slaughtered, there's not much they can do about it.
Sure, they'll hate us. They'll call us dishonorable cowards and claim that we're too weak to fight them head on. But do we really give a fuck about their opinion at this point?
Eventually, the nomads will have an internal crisis. Whether their Hero dies and triggers a succession issue or the minor chiefs rebel and refuse to throw their men into the meatgrinder, the nomads will eventually collapse. At that point, we can just push them off our border. Eventually, we can settle a village up there with big fuck-off walls around it to secure the border, but that might not be necessary.
Remember, we benefit more from a long war. Our Mega Project will end soon, giving us a massive boost to our Economy. Our food production is currently second to none, and our large population and defensive advantages mean that we can afford to turtle down and weather their attacks.
As such, my votes are:
[X] Formalize breaking and exposure
[X] Any who are interested may join the fight
[X][Secondary] Step-Farms
So to sum up this last turn, I guess I can safely say:
Both in story and in thread.
So last turn we decided to meet Not!Khal Drogo and attempt to do our usual peaceful trader thing. Unfortunately, he decided to respond by going full "Muh HONOR!!!" and start a pointless war out of arrogance and greed.
Fucking nomad raiders. This is why no one likes you anymore.
On the plus side, our people are going to feel fully justified in fighting this war. We offered them peace, but they spat in our faces and started this whole stupid conflict. Eye for an Eye is kicking in hard right now.
In any case, the fighting seems to be mostly taking place around our northern allied villages rather then inside our own territory. Our warriors are roughly on par with them, especially since the nomads can't use their cavalry properly. However, the nomad's habit of taking trophies has really pissed our people off, to the point that some of our guys are doing some nasty shit to them in retaliation.
Problem Number One: On one hand, our warriors are pretty justified in their anger. On the other, some of our people are a bit concerned that these ad-hoc punishments are a bit too far. We need to set up an official punishment in order to maintain order and discipline.
The choices we have are:
The punishment for trophy taking should be...
[] Ad hoc (Current)
No. Telling warriors that they can do whatever they want to captured enemies will just lead into problems in the long run. Best to cut in now and set up some ground rules that our warriors need to adhere to so that our Eye for an Eye trait doesn't come back to bite us in the ass later
[] Formalize breaking and exposure
Formalize what they're doing now, satisfying our Eye for an Eye trait. Possible risk of disease. Will anger the nomads further, but honestly, who gives a fuck what they think at this point? Sure they might decide to keep fighting, but their stupid 'muh honor' culture is going to make this war drag out anyway
[] Burning at the stake
On one hand, less risk of disease and satisfies our Eye41Eye trait. On the other, burning is a nasty way to go and might set some uncomfortable cultural precedents
[] Hanging and display
Possible, but do you really think the nomads will see all the bodies and get scared? They're more likely to get angry and keep fighting
[] Weighting and sea disposal
No. We'd have to haul them all the way down to the coast, get a boat and appropriate weights, then toss them overboard. Takes too much time and effort to be worth it, even without considering the potential pollution (which honestly wouldn't be a big issue unless we were tossing in hundreds of people at once anyway)
[] Skull-smashing and anonymous burial
Quick, simple and efficient. May not satisfy our Eye41Eye trait, but might (I repeat, might) freak out the nomads when they realize that their dead are not going to have any glory. We don't know enough about their culture to confirm either way, but the idea of simply tossing their dead into a pit without any honor or prayers appeals to me.
And here we have Problem Number Two: Some of our people are thinking of calling upon the WC for help. Having more warriors is nice, but there are a couple of problems listed here:
- We'd still need to feed any warriors the WC agrees to send up, which cuts into our Economy even further
- The WC might not want to send us any warriors, and even if they did it would make them more vulnerable to the Dead Priests' raids
- Unless we Improve Trails, they're going to have troubles sending up a lot of people anyway
The choices we have here are:
Asking for aid...
[] No aid is needed
Possible. By doing this we're sending a message that we're strong enough to deal with this ourselves. While having more warriors would be nice, we don't need them right this minute, especially if we're going to try fighting a defensive war
[] Any who are interested may join the fight
A good option, in my opinion. Lets those who want to help us join in while reassuring the WC leaders that we're not planning on dragging them into our fights. If we do well, the warriors they send will return home telling stories about how strong and powerful we are. On the other hand, if we fail, they'll be going home and letting everyone know that we're weak and ripe for the picking.
[] Call upon friendships
Probably not a good idea. We're friendly, but not officially allied, so forcing them to help in our war isn't likely to go over well with the WC chiefs, especially since this is likely to drag on for years due to current technological levels. They're not going to be happy about stripping their defenses like that, especially since the Dead Priests are sniffing around just outside their borders.
In order, I'd rank them as:
Interested>No aid needed>Call upon friendships
Now, onto the STATS!
----------------------------------
General
Diplomacy 6
Economy 1
Martial 5
Organizational
Centralization 5
Hierarchy 4
Cultural
Art 5
Mysticism 3
Diplomacy 6
Economy 1
Martial 5
Organizational
Centralization 5
Hierarchy 4
Cultural
Art 5
Mysticism 3
General
Diplomacy 6
Economy 1
Martial 5
Organizational
Centralization 5
Hierarchy 4
Cultural
Art 5
Mysticism 3
Diplomacy 6
Economy 1
Martial 5
Organizational
Centralization 5
Hierarchy 4
Cultural
Art 5
Mysticism 3
No changes here. I'm kinda annoyed because if the nomads had decided to attack at any other time, they would have been a minor problem at best. Now because of our weak Economy, we're going to need to make some hard choices.
Administration
Memory
Early Writing (Logographic)
Construction
Wood
Masonry
Early City Walls
Energy Production
Muscle Power
Animal Power
Food Production
Fishing
Horse Milling
Mollusc Cultivation
Orchards
Step Farming
Terra Preta
Materials
Stone
Pottery
Science
Ancestral Heroes
Animism
Transportation
Animal Husbandry
Solid Wheel Carts
Watercraft
Great Canoes
Early Sailboats
Memory
Early Writing (Logographic)
Construction
Wood
Masonry
Early City Walls
Energy Production
Muscle Power
Animal Power
Food Production
Fishing
Horse Milling
Mollusc Cultivation
Orchards
Step Farming
Terra Preta
Materials
Stone
Pottery
Science
Ancestral Heroes
Animism
Transportation
Animal Husbandry
Solid Wheel Carts
Watercraft
Great Canoes
Early Sailboats
Administration
Memory
Early Writing (Logographic)
Construction
Wood
Masonry
Early City Walls
Energy Production
Muscle Power
Animal Power
Food Production
Fishing
Horse Milling
Mollusc Cultivation
Orchards
Step Farming
Terra Preta
Materials
Stone
Pottery
Science
Ancestral Heroes
Animism
Transportation
Animal Husbandry
Groomed Trails
Solid Wheel Carts
Watercraft
Great Canoes
Early Sailboats
Memory
Early Writing (Logographic)
Construction
Wood
Masonry
Early City Walls
Energy Production
Muscle Power
Animal Power
Food Production
Fishing
Horse Milling
Mollusc Cultivation
Orchards
Step Farming
Terra Preta
Materials
Stone
Pottery
Science
Ancestral Heroes
Animism
Transportation
Animal Husbandry
Groomed Trails
Solid Wheel Carts
Watercraft
Great Canoes
Early Sailboats
Techwise, we now have Groomed Trails. I'm not quite sure what they are since a quick Google search just brought up a bunch of stuff involving skiing and snow boarding. Are we in winter or something?
Artistry
Self-expressive flourishes
Specialists
Administrators
Specialist advisors
Entertainers
Amateur group activity
Non-caste semi-specialists
Intellectuals
Elders
Leadership
Semi-hereditary specialist
Merchants
Hereditary family
Property
Communal
Warriors
Semi-hereditary specialist
Self-expressive flourishes
Specialists
Administrators
Specialist advisors
Entertainers
Amateur group activity
Non-caste semi-specialists
Intellectuals
Elders
Leadership
Semi-hereditary specialist
Merchants
Hereditary family
Property
Communal
Warriors
Semi-hereditary specialist
Artistry
Self-expressive flourishes
Specialists
Administrators
Specialist advisors
Entertainers
Amateur group activity
Non-caste semi-specialists
Intellectuals
Elders
Leadership
Semi-hereditary specialist
Merchants
Hereditary family
Property
Communal
Warriors
Semi-hereditary specialist
Self-expressive flourishes
Specialists
Administrators
Specialist advisors
Entertainers
Amateur group activity
Non-caste semi-specialists
Intellectuals
Elders
Leadership
Semi-hereditary specialist
Merchants
Hereditary family
Property
Communal
Warriors
Semi-hereditary specialist
Cavalry
War Wagons
Melee
Ceramic Maces
Spears
Two-Handed Clubs
Ranged
Bows
Slings
Spear Throwers
War Wagons
Melee
Ceramic Maces
Spears
Two-Handed Clubs
Ranged
Bows
Slings
Spear Throwers
Cavalry
War Wagons
Melee
Ceramic Maces
Spears
Two-Handed Clubs
Ranged
Bows
Slings
Spear Throwers
War Wagons
Melee
Ceramic Maces
Spears
Two-Handed Clubs
Ranged
Bows
Slings
Spear Throwers
No changes here, but keep an eye on the military tech. Hopefully we'll see a few things advance as this war drags on.
And now, CHOICES! Or Choice in this case, since we only have one action this turn due to all the FUCKING NOMAD WARMONGERS at our doorstep. God, this is like my Civ 6 games all over again. "Oh, you want to do a peaceful cultural victory? Too bad, you've spawned right next to the Romans and Aztecs! Have fun with that!"
----------------------------
Black Soil - Production is now regular and huge amounts of trash are turned to black soil every year, but there's always room for more production [Gardeners] [King]
Build Wall - Long experience with retaining walls has lead to the idea of a settlement wall for protection (Coastal village completed)
Build War Carts - The new, smaller design of the war wagons are significantly more effective than the larger, slower, less maneuverable design. A few are already switching over, but more of these could be most useful on open plains
Establish Annual Festival - People already like to celebrate at certain times of the year, but with the level of control over food distribution a new and particularly lavish festival can be established
Expand Farms - The people have brought an enormous amount of land under cultivation in the valley, but there is more available in more marginal areas, and in the forests around the fishing village
Expand Fishing - There are managed cultivation zones along the shore, and dedicating more people to the tasks can increase the yields of fish and luxuries brought in
Expand Managed Forests - There are many forests throughout the hills about the various forests that could be brought under proper management
Expand Pasture - While the traders mostly just take their animals where there is good grazing, specific areas can be set aside around the settlements that can be made ideal for the protected grazing of herds
Expand Place to Spirits - The current place dedicated to the spirits and wisdom is nice, but it could be bigger and grander...
Expand Snail Cultivation - While now more reliably grown and harvested, the snail domestication has only managed to hold environmental changes at bay rather than increase production. More investment would increase cultivation
Expand Warriors - More men can be inducted into the ranks of the warriors every year and not face major food shortfalls
New Settlement - The land is not particularly good for farming in between the valley and the sea, but there are places where a settlement could be set up, serving as a stop over point along the journey between the two settlements
New Trails - To the south through rough terrain is the Western Confederacy, new trails would better tie your people together in trade
Step-Farms - Step farms have been established and have grown across the valley, but there are still plenty of hills to resculpt [Gardeners][King]
Trade Mission - Sending a major caravan to another large group can bring new opportunities and find out more about the outside world
War Mission - You can send raiding parties against groups that have declared themselves hostile
Mega-Projects - Mega-Projects can require many generations to complete, take an unknown amount of time to do so, and drain Econ while active, but can produce massive benefits once complete. Once chosen, the occupy the Main Focus slot until either completed or stopped early. Early stopping once started does not refund any of the investments and increases social strife. To reduce confusion, mega-projects are not listed as part of the voting project list and must be "written-in".
Fight Forest Blight - Something is going wrong in a number of wild forests, and generations of intervention may be required to stop it [Gardeners][King] (Active)
Grand Canal - The hills between the valley and the sea are rough and the rivers there fast and wild. In one man's dream there is the vision of an artificial river cut through the land, tame and managed [Gardeners][King]
Great Dam - The river can run wild and dangerous when the rains come strong, but could it not be controlled by the same principles by which the water on the hills is channelled and contained, merely on a larger scale? [Gardeners][King]
Build Wall - Long experience with retaining walls has lead to the idea of a settlement wall for protection (Coastal village completed)
Build War Carts - The new, smaller design of the war wagons are significantly more effective than the larger, slower, less maneuverable design. A few are already switching over, but more of these could be most useful on open plains
Establish Annual Festival - People already like to celebrate at certain times of the year, but with the level of control over food distribution a new and particularly lavish festival can be established
Expand Farms - The people have brought an enormous amount of land under cultivation in the valley, but there is more available in more marginal areas, and in the forests around the fishing village
Expand Fishing - There are managed cultivation zones along the shore, and dedicating more people to the tasks can increase the yields of fish and luxuries brought in
Expand Managed Forests - There are many forests throughout the hills about the various forests that could be brought under proper management
Expand Pasture - While the traders mostly just take their animals where there is good grazing, specific areas can be set aside around the settlements that can be made ideal for the protected grazing of herds
Expand Place to Spirits - The current place dedicated to the spirits and wisdom is nice, but it could be bigger and grander...
Expand Snail Cultivation - While now more reliably grown and harvested, the snail domestication has only managed to hold environmental changes at bay rather than increase production. More investment would increase cultivation
Expand Warriors - More men can be inducted into the ranks of the warriors every year and not face major food shortfalls
New Settlement - The land is not particularly good for farming in between the valley and the sea, but there are places where a settlement could be set up, serving as a stop over point along the journey between the two settlements
New Trails - To the south through rough terrain is the Western Confederacy, new trails would better tie your people together in trade
Step-Farms - Step farms have been established and have grown across the valley, but there are still plenty of hills to resculpt [Gardeners][King]
Trade Mission - Sending a major caravan to another large group can bring new opportunities and find out more about the outside world
War Mission - You can send raiding parties against groups that have declared themselves hostile
Mega-Projects - Mega-Projects can require many generations to complete, take an unknown amount of time to do so, and drain Econ while active, but can produce massive benefits once complete. Once chosen, the occupy the Main Focus slot until either completed or stopped early. Early stopping once started does not refund any of the investments and increases social strife. To reduce confusion, mega-projects are not listed as part of the voting project list and must be "written-in".
Fight Forest Blight - Something is going wrong in a number of wild forests, and generations of intervention may be required to stop it [Gardeners][King] (Active)
Grand Canal - The hills between the valley and the sea are rough and the rivers there fast and wild. In one man's dream there is the vision of an artificial river cut through the land, tame and managed [Gardeners][King]
Great Dam - The river can run wild and dangerous when the rains come strong, but could it not be controlled by the same principles by which the water on the hills is channelled and contained, merely on a larger scale? [Gardeners][King]
Our main action is locked due to the Mega Project and one of our Secondaries is locked as a War Mission against the Storm Clan (Why?! Why are our people rushing off to fight instead of sticking to a defensive strategy? Understandable, but still frustrating)
So from what I can tell, people are divided into two main groups: those who want to double down on war actions and those who want to grab an Economy action in order to stay afloat.
Military Project (Expand Warriors, Build War Carts, etc.)
Since we're already sending a war party, we need to ensure that they won't just get slaughtered on the plains. Grabbing War Carts will increase our chances to do major damage while possibly unlocking better cavalry/anti-cavalry military techs. While our Economy will drop, our Pioneering Spirit trait will kick in to boost our Economy at the cost of Centralization.
Economy Project (Farms, Fishing, Pasture, Step Farms)
Our Economy is already at the breaking point and we need to increase food production in order to avoid dropping into negatives. While Pioneering Spirit will let us recover, it'll still cost us Centralization which is the stat used for major projects and fighting wars. In addition, Step Farms and Fishing are both on the edge of a breakthrough, so grabbing one of those now might give us some tech upgrades. Pasture is a more 'spread out' option in that it helps with both food production and war (more meat to eat and horses to pull carts). However, in the last turn or two, we've been having problems due to lack of manpower. Once the Mega Project finishes it should be dealt with, but until then labor intensive Economic actions may be difficult.
Before I make a vote either way, I'd just like to point out that the win conditions for our civilizations are different.
The nomads are, well, nomads. We know that they have a warrior culture (muh honor!) and look down on us for growing our food instead of eating meat and being all manly or whatever. Right now, they're united under their Hero who's pointed them our way because:
a) Loot
b) HONOR
There are literally no other reasons. They don't want our lands, they just want our shinys and are greedy enough to fight for them even when we've already offered them a trading deal. They'd rather fight against us because as peaceful farmers we don't fit into their honorable warrior culture and they feel that we're stubborn but weak.
For the nomads, a successful end to the war includes:
a) Much Loot
b) Much Honor/Glory in battle
c) Destroyed enemies
They can't and won't bother taking our lands because our terrain sucks for their nomadic lifestyle and they look down on farmers. They don't give a shit about us raiding them back because they have no vulnerable villages to raid. That's the whole point of being a nomad. Unless our War Party kills their Hero or wipes out an army or steals all their herds or something crazy like that, it's honestly not going to be that effective.
So how do we fight them?
Settle in, fight defensively, and turn their raids into bloody meatgrinders. Force them to spend lives again and again for little to no gain. They want honor and glory? Hide in the trees and shoot them as they ride past. Set traps and ambushes everywhere. Build walls around our villages and laugh in their faces as we pour down arrows. Make their lives fucking miserable. They can whine and stamp their feet all they like, but unless they want to charge their entire army into the hills to get slaughtered, there's not much they can do about it.
Sure, they'll hate us. They'll call us dishonorable cowards and claim that we're too weak to fight them head on. But do we really give a fuck about their opinion at this point?
Eventually, the nomads will have an internal crisis. Whether their Hero dies and triggers a succession issue or the minor chiefs rebel and refuse to throw their men into the meatgrinder, the nomads will eventually collapse. At that point, we can just push them off our border. Eventually, we can settle a village up there with big fuck-off walls around it to secure the border, but that might not be necessary.
Remember, we benefit more from a long war. Our Mega Project will end soon, giving us a massive boost to our Economy. Our food production is currently second to none, and our large population and defensive advantages mean that we can afford to turtle down and weather their attacks.
As such, my votes are:
[X] Formalize breaking and exposure
[X] Any who are interested may join the fight
[X][Secondary] Step-Farms
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Umi-san
Procrastinating.
- Location
- ꙮ
Okay, but where's the money for those things coming from??
After this turn the black soil project is completely done.
- Location
- Australia
We've had them forever, since back when we connected the Fishers and the Farmers via road. It's just roads, by the way.
The blight project will no longer drain Economy, manpower will be freed up from that, and Black Soil will be completely used for farming which should give us all the food.
Umi-san
Procrastinating.
- Location
- ꙮ
Yeah...and will all of this occur before we start a) establishing a giant annual festival the day the blight is declared over and b) expanding our place of spirits while fighting a war off in the north? Or will we gradually see the implications of this new pool of workers - who have grown up fighting the blight and presumably thus really only have experience in doing so - upon our economy too late to fund a big, show-offy festival, but arguably on time to a) die in the north and b) build up a place of spirits.
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
Since you've been doing this analysis, you probably missed the quote I've been shamelessly bandying about, trying to get more people to vote Military
Basically, it's telling us that although one econ action will definitely keep us from crossing the line, the consequences of not doing so are not bad enough that the military option is unfeasible. I'd even argue that the tone suggests that it is preferable.
Anyway, shameless campaigning done, hopefully until the vote closes. This is just getting silly.
2607
...because we're fighting miles away from them?
Groomed trails is basically Managed Trails. We realized that a good road requires constant and ongoing upkeep to keep it at good quality
Can't. See the compulsory war party. Our people cannot accept sitting here while there is blood to pay.
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
I'm assuming you're referring to the forest Blight project?
Umi-san
Procrastinating.
- Location
- ꙮ
[X] Skull-smashing and anonymous burial
[X] Any who are interested may join the fight
[X] [Secondary] Build War Carts
Okay, since we can't fight a defensive war - aka hunker down in villages - yet AND the trouble that will be caused within our polity will be people working toward a beneficial purpose (aka farming)... I guess that building war carts is sensible... even though it destroys literally everything I want.
[X] Any who are interested may join the fight
[X] [Secondary] Build War Carts
Okay, since we can't fight a defensive war - aka hunker down in villages - yet AND the trouble that will be caused within our polity will be people working toward a beneficial purpose (aka farming)... I guess that building war carts is sensible... even though it destroys literally everything I want.
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
K cause they are not the same. We just made a lot of black soil for the purpose of the megaproject. But yes, #FightBlight is done after this turn. We'll see what happens then.