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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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HAZOU: "So, revenge quest against Mizuki?"

MARI: [Bloodthirsty grin]

HARU: [Rushes to get knives]

YUNO: [Sharpens axe]

KAGOME: [Casually tosses a bundle of Kagome's Bliss seals up and down]

NOBURI: [Ready to mummify a motherfucker]

KEIKO: [Pangolins at the ready]

AKANE: "No thanks, guys, I've moved on and grown beyond whatever he could ever possibly conceive of. I'm just going to keep living my best life and leave him where he belongs: forgotten and in the past."

GOKETSU: [Visible disappointment]

REO: "Did... did we join the bad guys?"

MAI: "Uh. I guess they're a little... overeager. But that's to be expected, right? They were raised in Mist, of all places."

ATOMU: "Pffft, who cares?

ATOMU: [rips off his shirt]

ATOMU: "Gooooo GOKETSU!!!!!"
 
Halberdier said:
The price for my vote this round: include something about Hazou following up with those medics. Included Noburi's findings as evidence that the medics didn't do anything. Point out to Asuma that this is why we wanted to go with, if you're feeling particularly brave.
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Have I earned your vote, or is there something else you wanted this update?
 
Shrooms said:
Was there anything more to the debrief [about Hidan with Asuma] than Hazou explaining in detail what happened that night? (IE did Asuma give us a new target for Hidan or ask us to work with someone or anything like that?)
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Hazō went through every moment of the event and relayed every scrap of information they could pull out of him. Asuma is going to think about what to do with the information and get back to you.
 
@Velorien points out that I eyeballed it instead of doing the math and Hazō doesn't have the chakra to armor the entire village with MEW. As such, it was only done for a couple houses today but will be done for all of them tomorrow when Noburi and a bunch of other ninja show up.
 
In all seriousness, we should probably strengthen our estate security against underground infiltrators. If nothing else, dig a deep shaft to check for attempts at another collapse. There is a very real chance information about us siccing Hidan on Rock leadership leaks one way or another, and they *will* retaliate.
 
Rafin said:
Okay. What exactly is going on in Leaf? Why do the peasants here seem more cowed and fearful than villagers in places like Iron where the only ninja are missing-nin and foreigners? Or Tea for that matter? Or even villages near the Swamp of Death, which is further away from Leaf but still in Fire? Did we sell Skywalkers to the wrong nation after all?
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The more contact civilians have with ninja, the more opportunity they have for bad experiences. It only takes one.
Roomba said:
In all seriousness, we should probably strengthen our estate security against underground infiltrators. If nothing else, dig a deep shaft to check for attempts at another collapse. There is a very real chance information about us siccing Hidan on Rock leadership leaks one way or another, and they *will* retaliate.
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Already done:
eaglejarl said:
"By the way, I like yer security system. Those sapper chambers were cool."

"Sapper chambers?" Hazō asked. Hidan opened the door and checked outside before stepping into the hall. Hazō followed obediently.

"Yah. You know, those air pockets ya dug out, with the seal in the center? We stumbled inta one, the seal went off and sucked up all the air. The whole place collapsed. It was cool."

"Ah. Thank you." Apparently Kagome had been active and not talking about it. "If I may ask, sir, how did you survive?"
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Roomba said:
In all seriousness, we should probably strengthen our estate security against underground infiltrators. If nothing else, dig a deep shaft to check for attempts at another collapse. There is a very real chance information about us siccing Hidan on Rock leadership leaks one way or another, and they *will* retaliate.
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Have Hazou and Kagome run around burying Implosion Seal mines throughout an underground tunnel network. Reinforce stuff with 5SB's too where needed, probably.
 
Copying over some discussion from discord last month:

[link to the discussion, with the main points copied out below]

"So basically, I think [Ami's] using abuser tactics on Hazou.

"She crossed a line while fucking with his head, and then when Hazou asked for advice from an adult he trusted, Ami acted like this was a massive betrayal and he'd failed to live up to her expectations by breaking rules (that she secretly made up) of a game (that he only dubiously consented to play). And now she's spiting Snowflake by avoiding a huge moment in her life, seemingly for the single purpose of stonewalling Hazou and making sure that he feels like shit and is uncertain/sad over how their last encounter went. And Ami's a social spec with a huge social power imbalance over him, so all the bad stuff he's feeling over making a very healthy decision is entirely what she intends him to feel.

"Like, imagine if something like this happened IRL. If someone deliberately crossed a line, their victim asked for advice on how to handle it from someone they trusted, and were made to feel all confused and self-doubting, and as if they had destroyed something precious, as punishment. It strikes me as horribly toxic."

[...]

"I think we need to go further than avoiding her. I think (so long as people agree that I'm not distorting things here) we need to get Hazou to understand how toxic Ami is being to him, so that she loses the power to make him feel awful over drawing healthy boundaries."

Given that people mostly seemed to be agreeing with my assessment of the situation, I think we need to deal with this sooner rather than later, and now's as good a time as any.

So, I precommit to vote for any non-ridiculous plans this cycle that have Hazou discussing this with Mari. Ping me at least a few hours before voting closes.
 
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faflec said:
Didn't Mari (IE the person Hazou asked advice from) respond by drowning Ami?
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I mean like, ask advice about the way Ami's been treating Hazou since then.

E: Sorry, parsed that wrong.

Ami knows the only thing Hazou did was ask for advice, and he didn't expect any of the drowning stuff to happen. But she's specifically trying to gaslight Hazou into thinking that that was wrong. If she was just upset about being drowned, I wouldn't have a problem with it.
 
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Apropos of nothing, having more chakra for combat is nice. This isn't me saying we should necessarily shift or slow down FOOM, we have lots of priorities to get to. This is just me seeing that extra chakra is nice, and ours is still pretty mediocre.
 
Unrelated Question, what happened to the mist ninja breeding program? , was that ever a thing or just jiraya's paranoia?

Chapter 211
 
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Shrooms said:
3: Leaf vs. Rock - The beef continues with Hidan killing their leadership, and Leaf harassing their camp in Fire. Start date (tbd). Status: Ongoing
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Shrooms said:
11: Rock Spies in Death Swamp - Rock needs to get out of our swamp! They're on their last legs, though. Start date (tbd). Status: Ongoing
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11 is kind of redundant and again, Rock wants farmland, if there are any ninja in the swamp, they wouldn't be a priority.

Shrooms said:
16: Doom Castle - Another thing from Kagome's past that we know little about, except that it's a sealmaster prison and others know of it. Start date (???, ch. 77). Status: ???
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Shrooms said:
21: Cloud's Seal Factory - Where Kagome was abused for years, under (presumably) the leadership of the 3rd Raikage. Possibly related to the Doom Castle. Start date (tbd). Status: ???
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I think you're getting things mixed up here:

Doom Fortress was Chapter 104:
eaglejarl said:
"Oh, you know," Kagome said. "Big stone fort, seals all over it. Massive central workroom with half a dozen desks, safes, cabinets and cabinets of stuff"—he waved dismissively—"and absolutely everything covered in the most horrific seals you've ever seen. Faces melting into bleeding walls, gibbering horrors that wouldn't stop sniggering from thin air for weeks no matter how many times you squished their stupid stinking faces in your dreams." He hunched in on himself, eyes shifting to the sides as both hands reflexively plucked seal blanks off the piles. Hazō's trained gaze didn't miss the tiny little foxfire flicker of infusion that danced for a split second across the surface of each paper. Kagome-sensei's breathing had accelerated, getting shallower as his shoulders tensed. Hazō shifted, readying himself to do...something, he wasn't sure.
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That was the mission where he went missing-nin. Chapter 77 references some Mist installation/prison we know nothing about. And we don't know if Cloud uses seal factories, Kagome was working in their intelligence service, but they didn't really trust him.
 
ContextBot said:
11 is kind of redundant and again, Rock wants farmland, if there are any ninja in the swamp, they wouldn't be a priority.




I think you're getting things mixed up here:

Doom Fortress was Chapter 104:


That was the mission where he went missing-nin. Chapter 77 references some Mist installation/prison we know nothing about. And we don't know if Cloud uses seal factories, Kagome was working in their intelligence service, but they didn't really trust him.
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Wait, are you saying there was a THIRD facility that had Kagome?

I just read something about Kagome specifically mentioning a seal factory and Hazou asks which village he's from and Kagome changes the subject. Maybe all 3 are separate?

The Rock parts being separate was at someone else's request and the swamp descriptor is just to reference Shrek :p
 
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Shrooms said:
Wait, are you saying there was a THIRD facility that had Kagome?
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No I mean Kagome mentions that prison in Chapter 77:
Velorien said:
"Are you kidding?" Kagome-sensei burst out. "How can you not know the stories of Muri Fortress? A secret offshore prison, hidden deep in the Water Country, where Hidden Mist holds the world's most dangerous sealmasters captive, using their powers…"
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And in 104 he talks about another place that he and other Cloud ninja assulted. Original owner unknown.

From what I can tell Kagome only ever used the Sealing factory as some spook story why every village is actually evil.

If we want to use your list to reference forgotten/old plot hooks we should keep that stuff somewhat accurate. Or Birdduke has to ask falfec all the time. :p
 
ContextBot said:
No I mean Kagome mentions that prison in Chapter 77:


And in 104 he talks about another place that he and other Cloud ninja assulted. Original owner unknown.

From what I can tell Kagome only ever used the Sealing factory as some spook story why every village is actually evil.

If we want to use your list to reference forgotten/old plot hooks we should keep that stuff somewhat accurate. Or Birdduke has to ask falfec all the time. :p
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Oh okay so the Doom fort wasn't something he was actually housed in, I get your meaning.
I'm still like 70% sure he was also in a Cloud installation he considers a "sealing factory" though it could be a way he copes with his past. It's only tangentially relevant though, so I will just roll it under the same entry as the prison.
 
MadScientist said:
Copying over some discussion from discord last month:

[link to the discussion, with the main points copied out below]

"So basically, I think [Ami's] using abuser tactics on Hazou.

"She crossed a line while fucking with his head, and then when Hazou asked for advice from an adult he trusted, Ami acted like this was a massive betrayal and he'd failed to live up to her expectations by breaking rules (that she secretly made up) of a game (that he only dubiously consented to play). And now she's spiting Snowflake by avoiding a huge moment in her life, seemingly for the single purpose of stonewalling Hazou and making sure that he feels like shit and is uncertain/sad over how their last encounter went. And Ami's a social spec with a huge social power imbalance over him, so all the bad stuff he's feeling over making a very healthy decision is entirely what she intends him to feel.

"Like, imagine if something like this happened IRL. If someone deliberately crossed a line, their victim asked for advice on how to handle it from someone they trusted, and were made to feel all confused and self-doubting, and as if they had destroyed something precious, as punishment. It strikes me as horribly toxic."

[...]

"I think we need to go further than avoiding her. I think (so long as people agree that I'm not distorting things here) we need to get Hazou to understand how toxic Ami is being to him, so that she loses the power to make him feel awful over drawing healthy boundaries."

Given that people mostly seemed to be agreeing with my assessment of the situation, I think we need to deal with this sooner rather than later, and now's as good a time as any.

So, I precommit to vote for any non-ridiculous plans this cycle that have Hazou discussing this with Mari. Ping me at least a few hours before voting closes.
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I'd like to register disagreement with this interpretation. Rather than gaslighting, I see this as Ami genuinely being salty at being outplayed, and trying to justify her loss of face and pride. Ami has many flaws, but she does not generally use typical abuser tactics, even against people she sees as her minions.

Eisenhelm said:
Unrelated Question, what happened to the mist ninja breeding program? , was that ever a thing or just jiraya's paranoia?

Chapter 211
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Jiraiya never claimed it happened, just that it *could*. He also claimed that Hiashi would murder us all after becoming Hokage, which was at the very minimum an exaggeration. It's arguable whether this was honest paranoia and misassessment on his part, or a tactic to manipulate us and distract from issues he didn't want discussed. Afaik at least one of these came up when we wanted to renegotiate the Pangolin deal.
 
Roomba said:
iraiya never claimed it happened, just that it *could*. He also claimed that Hiashi would murder us all after becoming Hokage, which was at the very minimum an exaggeration. It's arguable whether this was honest paranoia and misassessment on his part, or a tactic to manipulate us and distract from issues he didn't want discussed. Afaik at least one of these came up when we wanted to renegotiate the Pangolin deal.
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In my opinion is less that and more the fact the Hokage vote was a tie. So murdering one of the clan in the election,without approval from your Jonin Commander just after you won the vote by technicality is a good way to start a civil war, especially when said Jonin commander is stronger than you(Because Enma is OP).
Plus the whole "Almost every S-rank is dead and Cloud and Rock Jonin contigent is intact"
 
Velorien said:
"My point is that this is a joke compared to everything we've been through. Hyūga isn't going to kill us. He won the election by a thread. Half of Leaf is watching him for weakness and he knows it. Yes, he can make our lives a lot harder. Yes, if we take a single wrong step, he'll pounce. But we're not talking Jiraiya and the killbox here. We can defend ourselves, and we will.
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Roomba said:
I'd like to register disagreement with this interpretation. Rather than gaslighting, I see this as Ami genuinely being salty at being outplayed, and trying to justify her loss of face and pride. Ami has many flaws, but she does not generally use typical abuser tactics, even against people she sees as her minions.
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Hey, if you're right, then that's what Mari should say if we ask her about it.
 
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