Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

[Radvic]

I could agree with this. We might even be able to get Jiraiya's backing to perform activities like this within Fire, so we could pay our way that way.

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That would be nice, since it would give us a haven from Zabuza, but I'm not entirely sure how we'd swing that. I suspect that Jiraiya won't want us that near to his home given our track record, and that it would require him to use a fair amount of sway, but maybe it's within the realm of what he'd be willing to offer us in return for a pretty successful mission? It would be a kind of funny reward though:

Jiraiya: Thanks for bringing Akiada back in mostly one piece. Well done. What do you want as a favor?

Team Uplift: We'd really like to make the lives of random Konoha villages better. Could you let us do wall building and irrigation missions in random <500 person civilian towns?

Jiraiya:...

 

[Twofold]

They are (legally) adults and hopefully capable of fixing their own problems .

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I have no words for this part.

I think we have a more solid relationship with Noburi than with Keiko, so if we're going to suggest someone to do something, we're less likely to get an immediate backlash if we suggest Noburi to take actions rather than Keiko.

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I don't see us being that far from Keiko, she is just a very prickly person prone to lashing out in general. Our relationship is not as bad as it might sometimes look. I think we can safely kick both them towards each other without too much risk.

My main social concern right now is preventing our team from breaking apart, which means preventing Keiko from wanting to leave (which I'm unsure how suggesting she transition to diplomacy build would affect) and making Akane like being with us.

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I'm not super worried about Keiko striking out on her own. Her bloodline limits her planning abilities, meaning she needs someone she trusts as the idea guy for whatever long term goals she has. Generating that sort of trust is really hard, and I don't see anyone outdoing us on that department at least in the short term.

The biggest incident that might make Keiko strike on her own would be if something happened to Mari.

I don't think a build suggestion would affect things enough to even break a tie.

On that note, do we have plans for convincing Akane that we're legitimately going to do good in the world?

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That's kinda hard since I'm not even personally convinced that we are going to do good in the world.

Honestly, if Akane chooses to leave us to live a long and happy life in Leaf, I'm all for it. I see no reason to try and convince her otherwise. She got lucky last mission, but the next one will be equally hazardous and we will run out of luck at some point.

This actually goes for all of our other teammates too. If Jiraya proposes a deal for them to stay in Konoha and live a happy life as village based support ninjas they should probably take the deal.

Not that Hazou should take that option. We still have mom to save, and I guess rest of the world too.

I'd suggest something that helps civilians in an easily identifiable manner (e.g. building chakra beast defenses for villages, acting as a traveling healing group, providing irrigation with MEW for villages, providing merchants with storage seals). Ideally something that also helps build a foundation for us to use later on, but with the main goal of just making some people's lives better (somehow without drawing heat ourselves).

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I feel like these are just the sort of feel good nice things that won't actually affect the big picture. Yes, we should do this kind of nice stuff when we have the chance, but gathering power and researching new tech sounds like the better option for us if we actually want to save the world.

Jiraiya: Thanks for bringing Arikada back in mostly one piece. Well done. What do you want as a favor?

Team Uplift: We'd really like to make the lives of random Konoha villages better. Could you let us do wall building and irrigation missions in random <500 person civilian towns?

Jiraiya:...

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...but then again that would be pretty hilarious.

 

[faflec]

RE: Noburi & Keiko ...

Why can't we ask Inoue-sensei? She's the Jonin for a reason.

 

[Twofold]

Why can't we ask Inoue-sensei? She's the Jonin for a reason.

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Because mom is not going to be there to fix Hazou's shit all the time. He is the leader of our genin group and interpersonal things fall under his responsibilities.

Not that I'm against asking advice or help from an expert, but Hazou should be the one to get things rolling.

Besides, Mari is pretty far from infallible.

 

[Radvic]

The biggest incident that might make Keiko strike on her own would be if something happened to Mari.

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This is pretty much what I'm worried about, also what her response will be after we're not in constant fighting for our life. That said, since Hallways and Humans is now cannon, I feel like she might stick around? I just don't remember reading a good resolution to her fleeing the party and abandoning us before, and that concerns me.

That's kinda hard since I'm not even personally convinced that we are going to do good in the world.

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I mean, just because our actions might make the world be destroyed doesn't mean we can't try but we should probs be cautious.

Honestly, if Akane chooses to leave us to live a long and happy life in Leaf, I'm all for it. I see no reason to try and convince her otherwise. She got lucky last mission, but the next one will be equally hazardous and we will run out of luck at some point.

This actually goes for all of our other teammates too. If Jiraya proposes a deal for them to stay in Konoha and live a happy life as village based support ninjas they should probably take the deal.

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Personally, I'd like our group to stick together, even if it means increased chance of their death.

I feel like these are just the sort of feel good nice things that won't actually affect the big picture. Yes, we should do this kind of nice stuff when we have the chance, but gathering power and researching new tech sounds like the better option for us if we actually want to save the world.

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They won't affect the big picture, but they are concrete ways of helping and doing good. More importantly for this quest: Akane feels that we aren't doing good, and doing these things would provide her with a gut feeling that we're "making the world a better place" and thus more likely to want to stick around. At the very least, helping out villages can help us build a network of places we can go to ground in. My point is that the next thing we choose to do should advance our long term goals, but also make our ninja feel happy about making a difference and helping people. Moral is kind of low, and I'd rather take 6-30 days to build up moral, connections, and information than just another month of sealing research. Yes, we need to build power and research new tech, but I think we should prioritize slightly "sub-optimal" routes (if we assumed our ninja had infinite willpower) which involve helping people, since that's the motivation for (at least some of) our teammates.

 

[Jello_Raptor]

Jiraiya: Thanks for bringing Akiada back in mostly one piece. Well done. What do you want as a favor?

Team Uplift: We'd really like to make the lives of random Konoha villages better. Could you let us do wall building and irrigation missions in random <500 person civilian towns?

Jiraiya:...

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*2 years later*

Inoue: On today's episode of "Pimp My Village" we ....

 

[OliWhail]

Putting our two most socially awkward genin in charge of public relations, general talking, and hoodwinking sounds like a beautiful idea to me.

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Ah yes, Team Weaponized Autism. I am heartily in favor of this plan.

Doing it while being spied on in a hostile environment might be tricky

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If anything, being surrounded by ostensible enemies should help group cohesion (if I remember my intro psych classes correctly)

I just don't remember reading a good resolution to her fleeing the party and abandoning us before

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The beginning of Ch 69 doesn't do it for you? There was still some tension between Kei and Nobby, but otherwise I read us as being OK.

 

[Radvic]

The beginning of Ch 69 doesn't do it for you? There was still some tension between Kei and Nobby, but otherwise I read us as being OK.

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Oh, well. Not entirely sure how I missed/forgot that. Yeah, I'm fine on that note. I do have one complaint with that section though:

When you lived in the woods one of the first things you learned was that Your Food Matters.

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As someone who lived in the woods for 5 months and ate a box of poptarts pretty much every morning, and a jar of peanut butter and nuttella in the afternoon/evening, I disagree (though food is so tasty now!)

Keiko's probably not about to run off on us anytime soon though, so I'm pretty ok with both trying to nudge her and Noburi to a resolution (or, at least, finding out if a resolution has been made (though I will admit to not reading the past sections super closely, so I might have missed things)), and trying to get her to take on diplomancing.

 

[Twofold]

Moral is kind of low, and I'd rather take 6-30 days to build up moral, connections, and information than just another month of sealing research. Yes, we need to build power and research new tech, but I think we should prioritize slightly "sub-optimal" routes (if we assumed our ninja had infinite willpower) which involve helping people, since that's the motivation for (at least some of) our teammates.

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I was kinda hoping that our stay in Leaf would provide that morale boost. Nobby gets to do medic things, Akane gets to see her parents (and not die), Hazou and Keiko get to socialize with people of their own age.

Things are going to devolve into a stabbing fest at some point, but I think we can squeeze some morale out of our stay.

I guess we could setup next to some random civilian village after we get out of Leaf and do nice things to them on the side. We do need some time outside Leaf to stock up on seals, plot, and do actual research. It's not like we can do any of that while inside Konoha.

If anything, being surrounded by ostensible enemies should help group cohesion (if I remember my intro psych classes correctly)

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It might be a fertile environment from that perspective, I'm just worried about the logistics of talking about our weaknesses while there are something like three different spy orgs actively listening in on our every word.

Especially if things don't go over well and we make things worse. We do that sometimes.

 

[Radvic]

I guess we could setup next to some random civilian village after we get out of Leaf and do nice things to them on the side. We do need some time outside Leaf to stock up on seals, plot, and do actual research. It's not like we can do any of that while inside Konoha.

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This is pretty similar to what I'd want to do. I will note that we could probably make civilians lives much nicer if we made seals with low level elementary mastery, so they could be warm in the winter and cool in the summer. It'd make people's lives better, make them more likely to like us and trust us (we could also set it up as a device for merchants to sell), and I don't think the militaristic elemantal nations would care.

 

[WheelbarrowWight]

Reinstatement

Hazou paced back and forth, mumbling to himself.

"Will you stop that already! It's been a week and they still haven't let us out of this damn pink apartment, and all you've done is pace back and forth mumbling to yourself. Oh wait, I forgot that wasn't it. At the end of every. Single. Day. You've announced your fucking simultaneously patronizing yet impossibly obfuscated plan and I am sick of it! Stop it! Go take a fucking nap or something!" Noburi shouted, flinging one of a large pile of terrible whittled figurines at Hazou's head. Hazou ducked, and the three legged giraffe flew threw the air, striking Kagome on the head.

"You stinking stinkers! You'll never take me ali-" Kagome cut off as Mari stepped in with her genjutsu, glaring at Noburi and Hazou.

"Noburi. Hazou. Calm down now."

"It's no use sensei," came the muffled voice of Keiko, faceplanted in a pillow, arms and legs akimbo. "Idiots will be idiots."

Hazou looked around the room in panic. He had not flowcharted this possibility. Turning around, he turned around and started muttering to himself about team dynamics as a loud, simultaneous groan filled the room before Hazou was pelted with a miscellany of objects.

"Ow, ow, stop it okay, I get it I'm- blech- really Mari sensei, an open tube of lipstick?"

"Hazou, just sit down, shut up, and be quiet like the rest of us."

A knock at the door interrupted the heavy atmosphere. The door swung open, revealing an almost shy looking Akane, flanked by two ANBU.

"Hey everyone, Hazou-sensei."

"Akane, you're okay!" cried Hazou.

"Mostly. I've come with some good news and bad news. Well, it's really the same news. I'm, um, going to be reinstated as a Konoha ninja."

The room went quiet except for Hazou, who stood there, a painful lump in his throat.

"That's great Akane!" he forced, the pained smile on his face giving way to genuine bittersweet joy. Akane leapt forward and enveloped him in a bone crushing hug.

An ANBU cleared his throat.

"That's not actually the only bad news. The bad news, Akane," the ugly pink walls lit up in a dizzying array of seal work, freezing all but Akane and the ANBU in place "is that there are some loose ends to tie up before everything's official. Kill those missing-nin, Akane, and return to your rightful home in the Leaf."

Akane stared in horror.

 

[Twofold]

This is pretty similar to what I'd want to do. I will note that we could probably make civilians lives much nicer if we made seals with low level elementary mastery, so they could be warm in the winter and cool in the summer. It'd make people's lives better, make them more likely to like us and trust us (we could also set it up as a device for merchants to sell), and I don't think the militaristic elemantal nations would care.

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If they actually have things like scorch squads, they will care. Propagating sealing tech to civilians is also a huge taboo.

There's also the risk of failure that comes from infusing seals. I think that is the main limiting factor why sealing is not used in everything, and we do need to make some risk assessment before we start pumping out massive amounts of Air Conditioner Seals.

But I do like the idea of making seals that make people's lives easier. I was thinking that Everyman Storage Scrolls would be our next project (useful and profitable!), but I guess we could try for Air Conditioner Seals, since we could also use them for hot air balloons. It would be harder though, since we haven't actually tried jutsu-to-seals conversion yet.

 

[notanautomaton]

We really shouldn't try to get Jiraya in on our plan. It's kind of patronizing, and stupid, and stuff.

 

[faflec]

Hazou paced back and forth, mumbling to himself.

"Will you stop that already! It's been a week and they still haven't let us out of this damn pink apartment, and all you've done is pace back and forth mumbling to yourself. Oh wait, I forgot that wasn't it. At the end of every. Single. Day. You've announced your fucking simultaneously patronizing yet impossibly obfuscated plan and I am sick of it! Stop it! Go take a fucking nap or something!" Noburi shouted, flinging one of a large pile of terrible whittled figurines at Hazou's head. Hazou ducked, and the three legged giraffe flew threw the air, striking Kagome on the head.

"You stinking stinkers! You'll never take me ali-" Kagome cut off as Mari stepped in with her genjutsu, glaring at Noburi and Hazou.

"Noburi. Hazou. Calm down now."

"It's no use sensei," came the muffled voice of Keiko, faceplanted in a pillow, arms and legs akimbo. "Idiots will be idiots."

Hazou looked around the room in panic. He had not flowcharted this possibility. Turning around, he turned around and started muttering to himself about team dynamics as a loud, simultaneous groan filled the room before Hazou was pelted with a miscellany of objects.

"Ow, ow, stop it okay, I get it I'm- blech- really Mari sensei, an open tube of lipstick?"

"Hazou, just sit down, shut up, and be quiet like the rest of us."

A knock at the door interrupted the heavy atmosphere. The door swung open, revealing an almost shy looking Akane, flanked by two ANBU.

"Hey everyone, Hazou-sensei."

"Akane, you're okay!" cried Hazou.

"Mostly. I've come with some good news and bad news. Well, it's really the same news. I'm, um, going to be reinstated as a Konoha ninja."

The room went quiet except for Hazou, who stood there, a painful lump in his throat.

"That's great Akane!" he forced, the pained smile on his face giving way to genuine bittersweet joy. Akane leapt forward and enveloped him in a bone crushing hug.

An ANBU cleared his throat.

"That's not actually the only bad news. The bad news, Akane," the ugly pink walls lit up in a dizzying array of seal work, freezing all but Akane and the ANBU in place "is that there are some loose ends to tie up before everything's official. Kill those missing-nin, Akane, and return to your rightful home in the Leaf."

Akane stared in horror.

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I love you.

Edit: Please also add maniacal laughter to the above statement.

 

[Radvic]

If they actually have things like scorch squads, they will care. Propagating sealing tech to civilians is also a huge taboo.

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I believe that will depend on why scorch squads exist (assuming they do). Propagating sealing tech which has a combat application is likely to incur ninja retribution upon civilians. Propagating sealing tech which makes the winter more bearable is unlikely to be cared about by ninjas. If we want to distribute civilian usable storage seals, then we'll need to be careful about scorch squads. If we want to distribute air conditioning, I don't really think ninja will care -- they really don't get anything from just randomly killing people. It's a way to make people's lives better without making them more dangerous.

There's also the risk of failure that comes from infusing seals. I think that is the main limiting factor why sealing is not used in everything, and we do need to make some risk assessment before we start pumping out massive amounts of Air Conditioner Seals.

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Granted, but this is a non-unique problem we will need to solve given our hopes of having a tech/seal based empire.

We really shouldn't try to get Jiraya in on our plan. It's kind of patronizing, and stupid, and stuff.

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He also has better things to do. I'm reasonably confident our move will be to spend 1-3 updates in Leaf, then run back to the woods as missing-nin, and suspect Konoha won't want a group of 6 missing-nin (who caused an international incident) running around their villages making infrastructure changes anyways. But also, I have no idea what the situation is going to be in the town and heartily look forward to throwing every immediate plan out the window and making new ones in 36 hours once we find out tomorrow.

 

[OliWhail]

We really shouldn't try to get Jiraya in on our plan. It's kind of patronizing, and stupid, and stuff.

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I'm definitely nervous about it. However, as far as we are aware Jiraiya is the authority figure most likely to be convinced that in fact simply preserving peace and otherwise allowing business as usual to continue will not be sufficient, and that the world has to fundamentally change if human civilization is going to, like, not eat itself.

 

[HoratioVonBecker]

Well, we need to start somewhere with our Project: Resurrection plans. That somewhere will have to be on rats at first, and probably bandits second.

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I'd prefer civilian volunteers. The Liberator village would imply that there are a number of people willing to test supersoldier treatments on the understanding that success will be used to help their friends and families, and they're much less likely to turn on us if we succeed. Also more likely to cooperate when we ask them questions.

Do you mean "separate seals that can all interact" or...?

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Yes.

 

[notanautomaton]

I'm definitely nervous about it. However, as far as we are aware Jiraiya is the authority figure most likely to be convinced that in fact simply preserving peace and otherwise allowing business as usual to continue will not be sufficient, and that the world has to fundamentally change if human civilization is going to, like, not eat itself.

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Does Kieko even still think that civilization is eating itself after being told that the scorch squads aren't a thing?

 

[Radvic]

So, I was reading through OliWhail's Village Hidden in the Heavens post, and realized, we pretty much have everything we need for it already.

• The creation of a vehicle or vehicles capable of moving to the desired height and returning to the surface (don't have to be the same vehicle)

• The establishment of a structure at the desired height which is capable of maintaining its height for an indefinite period.

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Using 5-barier seals, we put a ninja 300 feet off the ground, and could have maintained it for an indefinite period of time. For our next base we build, I suggest we build it in the sky.

E: Just make a bunch of five barier seals, then make a series of FBS ledges, which let us substitute into the air for fast entry, and then make a couple layers of FBS and fill it with dirt and things. Seems like a fairly safe place to be, though rather exposed.

 

[faflec]

So, I was reading through OliWhail's Village Hidden in the Heavens post, and realized, we pretty much have everything we need for it already.

Using 5-barier seals, we put a ninja 300 feet off the ground, and could have maintained it for an indefinite period of time. For our next base we build, I suggest we build it in the sky.

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We also need a way to get up and down the structure quickly. Which I'm fairly certain we don't have.

 

[Radvic]

We also need a way to get up and down the structure quickly. Which I'm fairly certain we don't have.

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We'd need one FBS for each "ninja jump" we are capable of (I'm forgetting the exact number). Remember that Noburi was able to substitute into the air when there was a stairway of FBS going up to it. Going down can be easily solved with henge (make gliders and practice throwing them down, then henge into gliders instead of blankets, or just use blankets).

 

[WheelbarrowWight]

For down we could make seal based HALO chutes. For up, catapults with IFF?

 

[faflec]

Remember that Noburi was able to substitute into the air when there was a stairway of FBS going up to it.

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I thought air substitution was illegal?

For up, catapults with IFF?

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*SCREAMS IN EVERYBODY*

 

[Radvic]

For down we could make seal based HALO chutes. For up, catapults with IFF?

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There's lots of things we could do for the future. Unfortunately, we don't really have access to good manufacturing right now, though we do have access to Five Barrier Seals, which should be technically sufficient. I'll write up a more detailed proposal in a few hours. My basic estimates right now are that a basic base would take approximately 200-1000 FBS (depending on how high we wanted to go), and take a day or two to set up.

I thought air substitution was illegal?

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Yes, but we have PMYF to solve that problem. Throw a seal up to the next step, substitute, then re-store, throw, and substitute again. Repeat until destination is reached, or just climb and try not to cut your leg off accidentally. Note that to reach 1 mile in height will take approximately 200 CP for most of our characters given current substitution levels.

 

[HoratioVonBecker]

I was kinda hoping that our stay in Leaf would provide that morale boost. Nobby gets to do medic things, Akane gets to see her parents (and not die), Hazou and Keiko get to socialize with people of their own age.

Things are going to devolve into a stabbing fest at some point, but I think we can squeeze some morale out of our stay.

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That's not morale, that's mood. Morale is actually determination, and it's more frequently found among hurt and angry people than among happy and healthy ones.
If we actually want to increase morale, I'd suggest asking Jiraiya for a list of problems that really need solving and some assistance in solving them.