Dragon Ball: After the End

[LucidityWaver]

[ ][COUNTER] The dragon's big advantage is that the effect is subtle enough to miss. If you make the others aware of it and coordinate with them, you might be able to work around it.

[ ][COUNTER] Fire with fire. You have the largest gathering of magical might in generations right at hand. You can't stand Dandeer, but you can work with her if it means cursing this filthy lizard.

I'm feeling one of these. I think Gohan might not be allowed to help, although he almost certainly could if allowed. Taking the time to ask seems dangerous though.

[ ][KAIJU] Yes. Dazarel might be rendering your strength irrelevant more than directly contesting it, but monkey firepower is big firepower. If he slips even for a moment, a big damn blast should hurt him just like normal.

I can see this going either way. Bigger / more mass is better? Hitting harder when the opportunity is there sounds good.
I don't think a smaller target is that much harder for them to focus on. I doubt Dazarel is using conventional senses like sight and hearing to track us. I'm guessing that if it wouldn't make much difference to Kakara, I'm guessing it shouldn't make much difference to Dazarel.

Unless we explicitly vote to keep the other royals in the dark, surely we're alerting them and coordinating regardless, right?

I'm assuming Kakara knows how much magical force is available and has some idea how likely it is to be helpful? I don't always keep up with the discussion so I could have easily missed this; especially over the last couple months.

 

[Terrabrand]

[X][COUNTER] The dragon's big advantage is that the effect is subtle enough to miss. If you make the others aware of it and coordinate with them, you might be able to work around it.​

 

[Gore17]

I'm assuming Kakara knows how much magical force is available and has some idea how likely it is to be helpful? I don't always keep up with the discussion so I could have easily missed this; especially over the last couple months.

Click to shrink...

She has no idea, as we've never studied magic.

 

[Blonddude42]

DON'T DO OOZARU! (at least for the moment)

He's using TK to render the power gap useless, but he can probably only apply so much TK force per unit area. Oozaru gives him more to apply that force to, and at least would have more mass subject to it which we'd still have to move around. While it might not work that way, it's still something we need to consider.


We probably want to send a message to them to let them know about the TK, although I don't know if we want to give them their chance for relief when we do so. We also have to get Dandeer up to speed, because she probably has something that can help push things over the edge and we can't let them be compromised by the Dragon.

 

[LucidityWaver]

She has no idea, as we've never studied magic.

Click to shrink...

I meant during tactical planning. Unless you're saying we don't have any idea what assets and resources are available for the fight.

 

[Bakkasama]

While I don't think we have enough information on its TK to make the assumption @Blonddude42 is making, there is something to be said about having the speed advantage on it.

GO has PL 1.5 billon and physical strenght 2.25. However, its speed is 0.75 billon. The Dragon has 0.9 billon PL and while we don't know if it moves that fast due to its size, its perception of time would be at that level at a minimum so it has no issue tracking us. It might be possible that at a speed of 1.125 billon it would have more trouble locking on us.

@PoptartProdigy does it look like the dragon is slower but tougher than its PL suggest or do we believe its TK is what makes it able to withstand the massive firepower we are leveraging?

 

[dragonx99]

I'm on the side of telling everyone what is going on. Even if it might not be a super active counter on our end at the moment it at least makes it so everyone knows what is going on and some of the others in the area can start thinking about plans to deal with it too. Hopefully people who can shield their minds but... Oh yea, do they all know that situation right now or do we need to tell them that too? I figure one of the other super saiyans would have mentioned it by now, but well, you know what they say about assuming.

 

[PoptartProdigy]

No, you haven't. You only told us this (in-game) year.

After we asked.

Click to shrink...

I tried to find that. Nada.

This is the earliest indication I can find:

Click to shrink...

I disclaim being chained down to tongue-in-cheek jokes about how long it took people to ask after a mind delve countermeasure.

[ ][COUNTER] The dragon's big advantage is that the effect is subtle enough to miss. If you make the others aware of it and coordinate with them, you might be able to work around it.

[ ][COUNTER] Fire with fire. You have the largest gathering of magical might in generations right at hand. You can't stand Dandeer, but you can work with her if it means cursing this filthy lizard.

I'm feeling one of these. I think Gohan might not be allowed to help, although he almost certainly could if allowed. Taking the time to ask seems dangerous though.

[ ][KAIJU] Yes. Dazarel might be rendering your strength irrelevant more than directly contesting it, but monkey firepower is big firepower. If he slips even for a moment, a big damn blast should hurt him just like normal.

I can see this going either way. Bigger / more mass is better? Hitting harder when the opportunity is there sounds good.
I don't think a smaller target is that much harder for them to focus on. I doubt Dazarel is using conventional senses like sight and hearing to track us. I'm guessing that if it wouldn't make much difference to Kakara, I'm guessing it shouldn't make much difference to Dazarel.

Unless we explicitly vote to keep the other royals in the dark, surely we're alerting them and coordinating regardless, right?

I'm assuming Kakara knows how much magical force is available and has some idea how likely it is to be helpful? I don't always keep up with the discussion so I could have easily missed this; especially over the last couple months.

Click to shrink...

Kakara doesn't think Gohan can come in as firepower, if that's your concern. In fact, you mention a few things about the options, so...

HEY, EVERYBODY!

Now that I have your attention...

All options involve informing the nobles about the TK. That's a simple matter of, "not wanting them to die." Beyond that, they're a matter of where Kakara pays her focus.

The first option makes coordinating with the nobles to correct for the interference the driving focus of the plan. In that option, Kakara has no other plans; she focuses in full on helping the others to get around the interference, and hopefully manage to take down the dragon that way.

Calling in reinforcements works as described; in order to overwhelm the telekinesis and take down the dragon, Kakara calls in an army of Exiles, and spends her time and efforts coordinating them.

Asking the mages for a magic solution (and Kakara, having never studied even a sentence of magical lore and been exposed only to Dandelor's hyper-specific and completely ungeneralized instructions to Jaffur, has no idea what this might entail) has Kakara working with Dandeer (ugh) and the other mages in formulating and coordinating a response. Again, Kakara knows nothing about what the mages might be able to do; she just knows that more sorcerers are alive now than have ever been in Exile history, that all of them are here, and that that adds up to some serious esoteric firepower.

Calling Gohan for help is not calling him in as fire support; if it did, the option would instead be labeled, "fetch me my winning stick." The Exiles legends are very clear on how much interference gods like him are permitted, and if they weren't, the past three centuries of pure fucking silence from him and the others would have made that clear. Calling Gohan is to leverage him as a resource for his knowledge and experience; what does the god of unspecified things (NO TEASING, MONA ) and the veteran of centuries in the arts of ki combat have to say? If you want an expert opinion on how to fight the dragon, you talk to Gohan. If you want the possibility (you don't know for sure, but it's a possibility) of a, "potential unlocked," moment, you talk to Gohan. For those I've seen pining after a mid-battle Spirit Bomb revelation, I'll let you know that trying is an option if the fight gets bad enough, and for your last chance to stack bonuses on that check, you talk to Gohan. Gohan is a consult and a support character in this context; Pokedex, King Kai, and White Mage in one package. You are not trying to get him to come down from on high, smiting stick in hand.

Willpower pushing is going full shounen and shooting for the mid-battle power up. Simple as that.

While I don't think we have enough information on its TK to make the assumption @Blonddude42 is making, there is something to be said about having the speed advantage on it.

GO has PL 1.5 billon and physical strenght 2.25. However, its speed is 0.75 billon. The Dragon has 0.9 billon PL and while we don't know if it moves that fast due to its size, its perception of time would be at that level at a minimum so it has no issue tracking us. It might be possible that at a speed of 1.125 billon it would have more trouble locking on us.

@PoptartProdigy does it look like the dragon is slower but tougher than its PL suggest or do we believe its TK is what makes it able to withstand the massive firepower we are leveraging?

Click to shrink...

It sure as shit ain't speedy. Then again, thanks to its psi, it hasn't exactly had to strain, so who knows? It might be faster than it's shown.

 

[Gore17]

I disclaim being chained down to tongue-in-cheek jokes about how long it took people to ask after a mind delve countermeasure.

Click to shrink...

Disclaimer not legally valid nor binding, and is thus ignored.

You are not trying to get him to come down from on high, smiting stick in hand.

Click to shrink...

Would be very cool if that did happen though, with him having done all the paper work for a one time exception to intercede upon mortal request.

Second coolest being Gohan calling in a favor with Beerus.

 

[Always Late]

Dazarel looks up at you, eyes rolling as the gout of flame cuts off. Oh, for the love of-! This is going to be no fun if you cripple yourself based on half-baked assumptions, girl. I'm a dragon. How do you think I absorb ki? I eat people.

Click to shrink...

... you know so fucking much about our history, you oversized gecko, you should know we had a damn good reason to think what we did!

"You are weaker than us," snarls your father, shaking himself. "What was that?"

There is more to strength than ki. Reality itself bows to my whims. I do not need to hone my life energy to be mighty.

Click to shrink...

Your eyes narrow. "He's doing something to them. It's...I don't think it's mental. They're not acting confused, really...it just looks like they have weights on. He-" Your eyes widen. "Kais on high, it's telekinesis! How does he have teekay that good?! At 900 million?!"

Click to shrink...

"It is," you say. "It's so inefficient. I only use it to grab things instead of walking over to them, and he's doing this?! He must be psychic or somethi-" You stop, mouth open.

You smack yourself in the forehead. "Psychic. Chiaotzu. Guldo. He's psychic!"

Click to shrink...

Which makes me wonder what else the guy's got up his sleeves.
ZA WARUDO with a big fucking dragon would not be a good thing.

 

[Cariyaga]

[X][COUNTER] Fire with fire. You have the largest gathering of magical might in generations right at hand. You can't stand Dandeer, but you can work with her if it means cursing this filthy lizard.

Going with this one mostly 'cause I want Kakara to get over her tiff with Dandeer.

 

[Gore17]

[X][COUNTER] Phone a friend. Grandpa Gohan, I need some help here! What do I do?! Get some advice. Get a last-minute divine power-up. Get a technique. Get something! He's a god, he'll have SOMETHING!

Toss up between this and "Fire with Fire".

 

[PoptartProdigy]

[X][COUNTER] Fire with fire. You have the largest gathering of magical might in generations right at hand. You can't stand Dandeer, but you can work with her if it means cursing this filthy lizard.

Going with this one mostly 'cause I want Kakara to get over her tiff with Dandeer.

Click to shrink...

Good luck with that — sincerely — but I doubt your chances.

 

[NavySeel]

Did we get a Zenkai from that?

 

[PoptartProdigy]

Did we get a Zenkai from that?

Click to shrink...

At the cap. No zenkais available.

 

[Cariyaga]

Good luck with that — sincerely — but I doubt your chances.

Click to shrink...

I can dream.

 

[LucidityWaver]

[X][COUNTER] Phone a friend. Grandpa Gohan, I need some help here! What do I do?! Get some advice. Get a last-minute divine power-up. Get a technique. Get something! He's a god, he'll have SOMETHING!

Wouldn't it be just hilarious if we get the answering machine?

I recognise that sorcery is powerful, but it's not where our skills lie. I think our history with Dandeer has too high of a chance at hindering us, considering she's likely to have some authority there. Edit: even though it's not likely to matter, it's still a chance I don't like.

Do we know if the general plan calls for the sorcerers to take their own initiative if things are dire or if they see an opportunity or something wrong that the royals don't? (e.g: what Kakara just noticed about the TK). I get that we can't expect random actors to solve all our problems for us; that would kind of break the RP a bit.

 

[Akatsunami]

[X][COUNTER] Phone a friend. Grandpa Gohan, I need some help here! What do I do?! Get some advice. Get a last-minute divine power-up. Get a technique. Get something! He's a god, he'll have SOMETHING!

 

[Quest]

The first option makes coordinating with the nobles to correct for the interference the driving focus of the plan. In that option, Kakara has no other plans; she focuses in full on helping the others to get around the interference, and hopefully manage to take down the dragon that way.

Calling in reinforcements works as described; in order to overwhelm the telekinesis and take down the dragon, Kakara calls in an army of Exiles, and spends her time and efforts coordinating them.

Asking the mages for a magic solution (and Kakara, having never studied even a sentence of magical lore and been exposed only to Dandelor's hyper-specific and completely ungeneralized instructions to Jaffur, has no idea what this might entail) has Kakara working with Dandeer (ugh) and the other mages in formulating and coordinating a response. Again, Kakara knows nothing about what the mages might be able to do; she just knows that more sorcerers are alive now than have ever been in Exile history, that all of them are here, and that that adds up to some serious esoteric firepower.

Calling Gohan for help is not calling him in as fire support; if it did, the option would instead be labeled, "fetch me my winning stick." The Exiles legends are very clear on how much interference gods like him are permitted, and if they weren't, the past three centuries of pure fucking silence from him and the others would have made that clear. Calling Gohan is to leverage him as a resource for his knowledge and experience; what does the god of unspecified things (NO TEASING, MONA ) and the veteran of centuries in the arts of ki combat have to say? If you want an expert opinion on how to fight the dragon, you talk to Gohan. If you want the possibility (you don't know for sure, but it's a possibility) of a, "potential unlocked," moment, you talk to Gohan. For those I've seen pining after a mid-battle Spirit Bomb revelation, I'll let you know that trying is an option if the fight gets bad enough, and for your last chance to stack bonuses on that check, you talk to Gohan. Gohan is a consult and a support character in this context; Pokedex, King Kai, and White Mage in one package. You are not trying to get him to come down from on high, smiting stick in hand.

Click to shrink...

Is there anything stopping us from going Oozaru+Human Multiform and going for all the options? This was kind of the reason we worked on that.

 

[Benwise]

[X][COUNTER] Phone a friend. Grandpa Gohan, I need some help here! What do I do?! Get some advice. Get a last-minute divine power-up. Get a technique. Get something! He's a god, he'll have SOMETHING!

 

[Grigori]

Since we'll be informing others regardless I expect coordination and an attempted magical counter to be doable without us. So gonna pick an option more dependent on us.

[X][COUNTER] Phone a friend. Grandpa Gohan, I need some help here! What do I do?! Get some advice. Get a last-minute divine power-up. Get a technique. Get something! He's a god, he'll have SOMETHING!

 

[Jirachi47]

[X][COUNTER] Phone a friend. Grandpa Gohan, I need some help here! What do I do?! Get some advice. Get a last-minute divine power-up. Get a technique. Get something! He's a god, he'll have SOMETHING!
Our experience with tactical coordination isn`t amazing, and I think we can probably pull of a spirit bomb.
[X][KAIJU] No. The means by which Dazarel is dominating you isn't raw power; more blastiness is not what you need. Speed will serve you better, in exploiting whatever openings he leaves you.
Dazarel is a Dragon, and the telekinetic suppression field effect definitely sounds like a quirk to me, and could definitely work through force per area. His deal is brute force, and it probably won`t help. Anyways, it isn`t like they can`t just put a power ball out on there own initiative.

I disclaim being chained down to tongue-in-cheek jokes about how long it took people to ask after a mind delve countermeasure.

Kakara doesn't think Gohan can come in as firepower, if that's your concern. In fact, you mention a few things about the options, so...

HEY, EVERYBODY!

Now that I have your attention...

All options involve informing the nobles about the TK. That's a simple matter of, "not wanting them to die." Beyond that, they're a matter of where Kakara pays her focus.

The first option makes coordinating with the nobles to correct for the interference the driving focus of the plan. In that option, Kakara has no other plans; she focuses in full on helping the others to get around the interference, and hopefully manage to take down the dragon that way.

Calling in reinforcements works as described; in order to overwhelm the telekinesis and take down the dragon, Kakara calls in an army of Exiles, and spends her time and efforts coordinating them.

Asking the mages for a magic solution (and Kakara, having never studied even a sentence of magical lore and been exposed only to Dandelor's hyper-specific and completely ungeneralized instructions to Jaffur, has no idea what this might entail) has Kakara working with Dandeer (ugh) and the other mages in formulating and coordinating a response. Again, Kakara knows nothing about what the mages might be able to do; she just knows that more sorcerers are alive now than have ever been in Exile history, that all of them are here, and that that adds up to some serious esoteric firepower.

Calling Gohan for help is not calling him in as fire support; if it did, the option would instead be labeled, "fetch me my winning stick." The Exiles legends are very clear on how much interference gods like him are permitted, and if they weren't, the past three centuries of pure fucking silence from him and the others would have made that clear. Calling Gohan is to leverage him as a resource for his knowledge and experience; what does the god of unspecified things (NO TEASING, MONA ) and the veteran of centuries in the arts of ki combat have to say? If you want an expert opinion on how to fight the dragon, you talk to Gohan. If you want the possibility (you don't know for sure, but it's a possibility) of a, "potential unlocked," moment, you talk to Gohan. For those I've seen pining after a mid-battle Spirit Bomb revelation, I'll let you know that trying is an option if the fight gets bad enough, and for your last chance to stack bonuses on that check, you talk to Gohan. Gohan is a consult and a support character in this context; Pokedex, King Kai, and White Mage in one package. You are not trying to get him to come down from on high, smiting stick in hand.

Willpower pushing is going full shounen and shooting for the mid-battle power up. Simple as that.

It sure as shit ain't speedy. Then again, thanks to its psi, it hasn't exactly had to strain, so who knows? It might be faster than it's shown.

Click to shrink...

If we try for the spirit bomb, are we allowed to willpowerr push it?

Spoiler: RP stuff

In the RP, Bassoon used a willpower push to achieve more with the giant namekian form, and Cynthia will power pushed to get one of the bulky forms for SSJ2. Can willpower pushes only be used for transformations and power, or can they be used for something like the spirit bomb?

 

[Lailoken]

From up here it looks like a slow shockwave -- to slow to actually be a shockwave, but otherwise identical. The others are all tumbling along with it.

Before Dazarel can react to your escape, your cup your hands together. "KAMEHAMEHA!"

The blast takes Dazarel on the skull, and he halts the wave, looking up at you with some amusement.

Click to shrink...

As you watch, Dazarel pauses, looking up at the ward. He gazes at it contemplatively, eyes narrowed in thought...

A blast from Grandma, free of the distraction she's suffering, slams into his scalp, and he shriek, offended.

Click to shrink...

We've seen that distracting him and breaking his focus works.

On the other hand, we can't be the first to think of mobbing him with weaklings, and he was not his typical casual self about the magic.

If only we had some large corps of 900 mil monkey artillery to pound away at him from long range...


I wonder how he'll enjoy a solar flare to the snout? Or a thousand Krillin stylists machine gunning them in between discs?

 

[KnightDisciple]

[X][COUNTER] Fire with fire. You have the largest gathering of magical might in generations right at hand. You can't stand Dandeer, but you can work with her if it means cursing this filthy lizard.
[X][KAIJU] No. The means by which Dazarel is dominating you isn't raw power; more blastiness is not what you need. Speed will serve you better, in exploiting whatever openings he leaves you.

 

[KaintukeeBob]

[X][COUNTER] Phone a friend. Grandpa Gohan, I need some help here! What do I do?! Get some advice. Get a last-minute divine power-up. Get a technique. Get something! He's a god, he'll have SOMETHING!

[X][KAIJU] No. The means by which Dazarel is dominating you isn't raw power; more blastiness is not what you need. Speed will serve you better, in exploiting whatever openings he leaves you.
Dazarel is a Dragon, and the telekinetic suppression field effect definitely sounds like a quirk to me, and could definitely work through force per area. His deal is brute force, and it probably won`t help. Anyways, it isn`t like they can`t just put a power ball out on there own initiative.

If we go for magic, we're basically doing the same thing they do on every crime TV show where we expect the computer guy to hack every camera in 30 seconds with a chromebook. We don't know what magic can do, we don't know who among the sorcerers to talk to (because fuck that bitch, she'd set things up to kill us), and if any of the sorcerers knew of something that could help, they would suggest it.

Willpower pushing is going full shounen and shooting for the mid-battle power up. Simple as that.

Click to shrink...

Hahaha, no. We aren't going to try for a simple willpower push - the easiest way for that to happen is to break into SSJ2...and while I'm not opposed to breaking our current caps, I AM opposed to starting the Enemy countdown (assuming Barney here hasn't done it already).

Now, if we can talk to Jaffur in a few years and get some stronger wards around the Hall, possibly in concert with the stealth metal the scouts introduced us to, maybe we can go for SSJ2 in the Hall.

Let's call in some advice from Gohan, stay small because we can still overpower him individually that way, and get our bonuses for the shonen-style emergency Spirit Bomb.