Dragon Ball: After the End
- Location
- USA
[X] Ranged. Your skill with ki refinement is still limited, and you'll only be able to keep it up when blasting. You'll contribute best this way.
-[X] Do your best to support the fighters on the ground. Knock the dragon about and impede his mobility; use your blasts to limit his options and give Dad and Yammar openings.
-[X] Warn the others about his apparent straight-up mind-reading, and the possibility that he absorbs ki - be on the lookout for him doing so, so we can adapt tactics as necessary.
[X] [Ask] How powerful would be a massed Kamehameha from all the non-royals?
-[X] Do your best to support the fighters on the ground. Knock the dragon about and impede his mobility; use your blasts to limit his options and give Dad and Yammar openings.
-[X] Warn the others about his apparent straight-up mind-reading, and the possibility that he absorbs ki - be on the lookout for him doing so, so we can adapt tactics as necessary.
[X] [Ask] How powerful would be a massed Kamehameha from all the non-royals?
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
Probably not. They aren't allowed to intervene in the mortal world anymore, IIRC.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Plus, Beerus was invoked (metaphorically) specifically because he might object to the hubris of a dragon daring to identify itself as a god.
The deified saiyans wouldn't be reacting to that, they'd be reacting to the threat to their descendants, and if they were going to act on that threat they'd have done it to the Enemy, you'd think. So either they can't act or they won't act, but they're not a credible threat for us to wave under people's noses either way.
Berra, staring blankly at Kakara:
"Yes. You."
Kakara is a bona fide ki prodigy and has better interpersonal insight than almost any Exile. Anyone better equipped than her to do as you describe would have to be Elite-ranked with 'read people's emotions' as an Elite talent of some kind. And unless Poptart has been straight-up lying to us, there is no such person on Garenhuld.
Plus, having Dandeer cast some kind of powerful spell on the dragon is an excellent way to get Dandeer killed, which would solve so many problems. I think.
The deified saiyans wouldn't be reacting to that, they'd be reacting to the threat to their descendants, and if they were going to act on that threat they'd have done it to the Enemy, you'd think. So either they can't act or they won't act, but they're not a credible threat for us to wave under people's noses either way.
The most likely answer is going to be something like:
Berra, staring blankly at Kakara:
"Yes. You."
Kakara is a bona fide ki prodigy and has better interpersonal insight than almost any Exile. Anyone better equipped than her to do as you describe would have to be Elite-ranked with 'read people's emotions' as an Elite talent of some kind. And unless Poptart has been straight-up lying to us, there is no such person on Garenhuld.
We know that the royals have collectively been preparing the sorcerors to do what they can against the dragon. I'm not sure sealing the dragon the way Dandeer sealed Lord Vegeta and Jaffur is viable (since it's not like the dragon has a pre-existing Masqued self to be crammed into). But it's not the worst idea we could come up with.
Plus, having Dandeer cast some kind of powerful spell on the dragon is an excellent way to get Dandeer killed, which would solve so many problems. I think.
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Artanis Prime
Knight of the Fallen Dream
- Location
- Matrix of Leadership
[X] Ranged. Your skill with ki refinement is still limited, and you'll only be able to keep it up when blasting. You'll contribute best this way.
-[X] Do your best to support the fighters on the ground. Knock the dragon about and impede his mobility; use your blasts to limit his options and give Dad and Yammar openings.
-[X] Warn the others about his apparent straight-up mind-reading, and the possibility that he absorbs ki - be on the lookout for him doing so, so we can adapt tactics as necessary.
Hrmm also given what just happened I have to wonder what this looked like to the incoming invasion fleet. I know we were told that the Sorcerer's were practicing area warding, so we can keep the fall out of this battle at least somewhat contained, but the Dragon lit up and them Kara burst out full Golden Ape before porting to the middle of nowhere. So that means that the impending invasion fleet, who are alot closer then whoever the Sayain's are normally worried might be able to pick up FPSS power levels are, and who have probably been keeping as much of an eye on the planet as they can on the off chance any useful information can be gleaned just saw the Dragon's PL and a Golden Ape PL pop up for however long it took for wards to be set up....that's assuming wards are even currently in place and aren't being raised as we speak...which would add another 3 Gold Apes to the mix. Even if in total we talking in the minutes of un-warded time that HAD to give someone a heart attack.
In fact if I had it in me I'd love to write a quick Omake about the invasion fleets equivalent of a comm officer assigned to watching Garenhuld and not expecting to be able see anything so far out freaking out when multiple power levels in the Billion range ping for a minute before vanishing. If anyone can manage feel free.
-[X] Do your best to support the fighters on the ground. Knock the dragon about and impede his mobility; use your blasts to limit his options and give Dad and Yammar openings.
-[X] Warn the others about his apparent straight-up mind-reading, and the possibility that he absorbs ki - be on the lookout for him doing so, so we can adapt tactics as necessary.
Hrmm also given what just happened I have to wonder what this looked like to the incoming invasion fleet. I know we were told that the Sorcerer's were practicing area warding, so we can keep the fall out of this battle at least somewhat contained, but the Dragon lit up and them Kara burst out full Golden Ape before porting to the middle of nowhere. So that means that the impending invasion fleet, who are alot closer then whoever the Sayain's are normally worried might be able to pick up FPSS power levels are, and who have probably been keeping as much of an eye on the planet as they can on the off chance any useful information can be gleaned just saw the Dragon's PL and a Golden Ape PL pop up for however long it took for wards to be set up....that's assuming wards are even currently in place and aren't being raised as we speak...which would add another 3 Gold Apes to the mix. Even if in total we talking in the minutes of un-warded time that HAD to give someone a heart attack.
In fact if I had it in me I'd love to write a quick Omake about the invasion fleets equivalent of a comm officer assigned to watching Garenhuld and not expecting to be able see anything so far out freaking out when multiple power levels in the Billion range ping for a minute before vanishing. If anyone can manage feel free.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Actually, after this fight we should definitely do some scrying on the aliens to make sure they haven't:
1) Turned and run away to chatter about high power levels on Garenhuld
2) Made any particularly important or scary plans based on the fact that their scouts landed and then never reported back, because we stole their ship and presumably their interstellar communications equipment and subsequently captured them all.
1) Turned and run away to chatter about high power levels on Garenhuld
2) Made any particularly important or scary plans based on the fact that their scouts landed and then never reported back, because we stole their ship and presumably their interstellar communications equipment and subsequently captured them all.
Artanis Prime
Knight of the Fallen Dream
- Location
- Matrix of Leadership
Ah but before we captured them they did report back, at least once. The fight Karen and Jaron had with the Scout Leader was recorded/broadcast by his scouter, its why he was trying to force us to kill him to insure his boss came to exact revenge. We even saw a vision of the Leader guy and some of his people mentioning that with Maya's displayed PL in that fight (Something like a Million and a Half if I remember right) the only one who could fight at that level was the Leader (who is presumably like Freezer and ridiculously more powerful then even his best fighters)
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Ahh, gotcha.
Which in turn suggests they were in at least sporadic 'radio' contact with the fleet prior to their capture.
That being said...
I'm very worried about how the fleet may react to the fact that the scout team was all captured/killed, especially if they also somehow detected the massive power surges associated with us fighting the dragon.
...
Also, I really hope that we find some way to train up Maya's power level faster than 1-2 million points per year, because at this rate she's going to be hopelessly far behind us her entire life, even if we never go beyond full power super-saiyan. I'd purely hate for her to spend the rest of her life being Tenshinhan to our Goku, only more so.
Maybe gravity training will become an option for her if we can capture some alien ships and creatively abuse their gravity generators?
Which in turn suggests they were in at least sporadic 'radio' contact with the fleet prior to their capture.
That being said...
I'm very worried about how the fleet may react to the fact that the scout team was all captured/killed, especially if they also somehow detected the massive power surges associated with us fighting the dragon.
...
Also, I really hope that we find some way to train up Maya's power level faster than 1-2 million points per year, because at this rate she's going to be hopelessly far behind us her entire life, even if we never go beyond full power super-saiyan. I'd purely hate for her to spend the rest of her life being Tenshinhan to our Goku, only more so.
Maybe gravity training will become an option for her if we can capture some alien ships and creatively abuse their gravity generators?
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
Before or after Apra decides she needs to sacrifice herself?
- Location
- USA
Yeah, but accelerating her growth fucks with the Royal's monopoly of power. We need to decide how that'll be handled before we accelerate her growth, and I'd hesitate to put a pet project like that ahead of our many far more pressing commitments. Like the next 7 OOC Problems that Poptart will throw at us because interesting things have to happen.
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
Assuming it can eat Ki, if we go by the water tank and hose analogy but reverse the idea of the flow, there should be some sort of limit to how much ki can go in through the hose, and how much ki it can have in the tank at once total.
Also, Jaffur's technique involves sorta solidifying Ki right? that should clog it up a bit.
Also, Jaffur's technique involves sorta solidifying Ki right? that should clog it up a bit.
Artanis Prime
Knight of the Fallen Dream
- Location
- Matrix of Leadership
Well it looks like their desperate with half broken ships that are literally betting everything they have on conquering our planet. And after a quick glance back it seems Tamar, our would be conqueror, plans to walk in and lay waste to Maya and Berra while his men mop up our regulars...though his plan sort of hinges on us only have a handful of people in the Million+ range....which under Masquerade rules might well be true.
Though looking back it seems like there maybe something limiting him. The way he talks doesn't give me the vibe that he thinks he could single-handedly wrap up all resistance, but just doesn't want to be bothered, the way say Frieza might. Maybe he has an injury or is using something Kaio-Ken-esq that gives him a HUGE boost but knocks him out after? Eh Problems for later.
I'm with you there, though it depends on how things go. Its looking to me like our next major story arc, maybe after a time skip post invasion, would be to head out into space. With what the Dragon just said it seems there are Sayian's out there so we'll have to venture our eventually to confirm that. Also depending on how the big fights go we may want to try and find New Namek and undergo the trials to earn the right to use the Dragon Balls...after all we may need some rez's soon. So we might be able to get Maya's hidden potential awakened.
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
Well if it gets to the point where everyone's gonna die to the invaders all we have to do is rescind a law and suddenly there's dozens of super saiyans.
Artanis Prime
Knight of the Fallen Dream
- Location
- Matrix of Leadership
Nah if a 1.5 Million PL means only the boss can fight us then if we use our real Power Level we'll probably ROFL stomp Tamar. Especially just post Dragon Battle, however it pans out, Tamar isn't going to be at that level of power.
However the difficulty with the Invasion fight is going to be maintaining the Masquerade, which means that all of us are going to be fighting as Humans with mostly sub-Maya power levels. Poping Super Sayain means we've lost the War to the win the Battle, so to speak.
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
Tamar ... Tomato
Artanis Prime
Knight of the Fallen Dream
- Location
- Matrix of Leadership
Well with Maya and Jaron, again under the Masquerade, nominally in our Heavy Hitter range at just under 2.5 Million and base Saiyan maximum at 15 Million its entirly possible that Tamar is a Saiyan, but not Super and thinks that being at 10-15 Million is enough to roll us over. After all I think the highest PL the scouts ever saw out of Berra was about 1 Million and Maya willpower pushed to 1.5...oh my god...Tamar says he just needs his people to stay out of the way...his secret technique could be an uncontrolled Oozaru Transformation.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Well, to be fair, tomato-based names seem to be the saiyan equivalent of being named "Steve" or "Chris" in Poptart's settings.
That would, admittedly, be hilarious.
Until Maya just sighs, shrugs, glances at us and with a look of great disappointment says "Karen?"
And we look sheepish and go take out the trash.
We could actually go a lot higher than that while still keeping everyone Masqued. For example, just about every Cap Circuit competitor (e.g. Mitsuba) has a masqued maximum power level in the mid-single-digit millions, with 1.5 million being the LOW end, plus very finely honed combat skills. The high end would be more like twelve million, for any saiyan at cap who's as comfortable in their Masqued state as Kakara is as Karen. Maybe 13.5 million if they've taken it farther than Kakara, which is admittedly going to be unusual.
Well, depending on what he's dealing with, one guy with a power level of, say, five to ten million might be able to wipe out a whole squad of 1-2 million opponents, and NOT able to mop of the possibly huge number of opponents with power levels in the hundreds of thousands. Especially not if he's also dealing with some of them using suicide tactics, or ambushing his minions.
Frieza had a much higher margin of personal superiority, though Tamar MIGHT be a lot stronger than we're expecting. Furthermore, Frieza had a trump card- he could always threaten to blow up the planet if hacking his way through thousands of relatively low-level scrubs started to annoy him. Tamar has no such luz
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Artanis Prime
Knight of the Fallen Dream
- Location
- Matrix of Leadership
True, however we have to remember that one of the lie's we're trying to sell to the wider world is that Maya's power level is super high and unusual. We were hoping to point to her as the planets strongest fighter and be all "See we can't be Saiyan's that's out strongest warrior and shes a freaky Ki-Mutant." So when I'm talking about the Masquerade I'm including the assumption we're still trying to keep that part of it plausible. Of course this all goes out the window if Tamar lands and pop a 100 Million power level or something crazy like that, but I'm assuming our planed win condition is gonna include keeping Maya as the top end of our power spectrum.
Also true but Tamar and his people are pushed to the edge and in the end he might snap and pull an "I refuse to be anyone's slave again!" and try and blow up the planet anyway. I'm sure our fight will bring out his and his people's tragic backstory, complete with our Sight providing the relevant flashback. If he's not a Saiyan himself, or maybe even if he is, I give it good odds that a Saiyan Warlord kicked his people off their original planet anyway.
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- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
I don't disagree, but if Tamar is strong enough to be really confident he can handle Maya and possibly at least a few other champions as strong as she is and potentially much older and more experienced...
Well, frankly, he'd be handling Maya so roughly that we're going to have to display greater power or she might die.
There are some gimmicks we can try (i.e. Multiform abuse), but if Tamar's power level is up around ten million, nothing we try is going to make that much of a difference. Jaron pulling a miracle out of his hat in the form of Jaffur channeling MORE POWER to him is at least a conceivable outcome, but even that has the potential to raise more questions.
I was really hoping Maya could make it up to, say, the upper end of the single digit millions. We'd have a good deal less to worry about in that case.
- Location
- Rockford, USA
- Pronouns
- They/Them
In the car and on my way back home. I can get back to writing and posting soon!
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Yes, but that's the kind of decision that involves "Kakara and Berra (and maybe, at some future time, Jaffur)" sit down and have a quiet chat," not "we need to devote an action budget to this for extended periods of time."
At some point this cynically becomes "the problem never gets solved," and I'm opposed to that pretty strongly. I want Maya's character to be a meaningful participant in the game, and if she spends the rest of her life in a state of being the "strongest human in the galaxy" but never more than 10% as powerful as the saiyans around her, that will never be true.
I got the impression that power growth is at least somewhat exponential, with occasional plateaus and such, and considering the progress the misfits made in ki training and the success in power growth of people like Tien and Krillin, or even how well the misfits are doing, would seem to indicate that the disparity isn't quite that dire, but we do need to have that conversation, and I would like for her to make a real contribution.
Plus, I am reasonably sure that we haven't even given them gravity training or anything, so we might be able to let there power grow more quickly once we get an agreement.
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- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Exponential versus linear power level growth would depend heavily on how Poptart calculates power level growth, and what little I know about how they do it is something I'd have to spoilerize, plus I'm really not sure it'd be enough to participate usefully in a conversation on the subject.
Bakkasama
There is always a greater fool
- Location
- Buenos Aires, Argentina
- Pronouns
- He/his
I am not too worried about Maya not having enough growth. She went from less than a thousand to 100k to 1M to 4M. If anything, she is growing stronger faster every year. If she keeps growing at 3M a year then yeah, she is not catching up but I rather wait to see how much she grows in the following year before deciding if that is the case. She has been gaining more than double her power level each year and we don't know what puberty will do to her growth.
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