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Dragon Ball: After the End

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Terrabrand said:
Okay, we know for sure that Sight can be blocked-the Dragon, the Enemy, possibly others, but those two at least have done it.
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The Dragon and the Enemy both straddle the line between "merely mortal enemy" and "demigod." Dandeer is pretty firmly in the "merely mortal" category; she's a 'mere mortal' with a hell of a lot of powers, but then again, so are we...

Nevertheless, we have been warned, by Sensei (Carrick Balor) that sorcerors are capable of actions that interfere with the Sight. We were particularly cautioned against using our mind projection abilities where a sorceror might catch us, but that may generalize.

Also, I'm talking about ki sense, not just Sight.
PoptartProdigy said:
If you focus really hard at close range for a few seconds, you can get echoes of a person's max power if they're not actively suppressing.
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Would the target of our attentions know we were focusing on them?
 
Simon_Jester said:
The Dragon and the Enemy both straddle the line between "merely mortal enemy" and "demigod." Dandeer is pretty firmly in the "merely mortal" category; she's a 'mere mortal' with a hell of a lot of powers, but then again, so are we...

Nevertheless, we have been warned, by Sensei (Carrick Balor) that sorcerors are capable of actions that interfere with the Sight. We were particularly cautioned against using our mind projection abilities where a sorceror might catch us, but that may generalize.

Also, I'm talking about ki sense, not just Sight.
Would the target of our attentions know we were focusing on them?
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If you used active pings to speed up the process or improve resolution, yes. That is generally thought to be incredibly rude without a reason of active urgency, though.
 
Terrabrand said:
... I'm pretty sure we'd be committing a fairly huge social mistake, potentially legit reputation hurting even for Kakara, if we pinged her power level just for being rude to us.
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Let's see what pinging her implies
  • We don't trust her. Considering how she has been acting lately plain common sense.
  • We are keeping an eye on her. Considering how she has been acting lately plain common sense.
 
fictionfan said:
Let's see what pinging her implies
  • We don't trust her. Considering how she has been acting lately plain common sense.
  • We are keeping an eye on her. Considering how she has been acting lately plain common sense.
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...

No.

  • We think she is probably an imminent threat, and a ki based one.
Not only is her being rude not a signal of 'I am about to attack you' on it's own, but she's, so far as we know, and in the public eye, low power level, while we are a Scion with a power level she can't match.
 
mithril-blade said:
Hey, I gots a question.

So, I don't know if it's at all going to be relevant, but, since it's been made clear that Vegeta's wish to the super dragon balls, should he win in the Tournament of Power, is to bring back the Saiyan Race, would it be safe to say that he is specifically happy with the current existant state of the Saiyans?
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You have no idea. Possible question for later, though.
fictionfan said:
Let's see what pinging her implies
  • We don't trust her. Considering how she has been acting lately plain common sense.
  • We are keeping an eye on her. Considering how she has been acting lately plain common sense.
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Hm, what's a good metaphor for what pinging her like that implies...

A good one would be grabbing somebody's smart phone out of their hands and starting to read through their text messages.

Pinging somebody like that is considered a very blatant and insensitive intrusion on their privacy and personal space.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
Hm, what's a good metaphor for what pinging her like that implies...

A good one would be grabbing somebody's smart phone out of their hands and starting to read through their text messages.

Pinging somebody like that is considered a very blatant and insensitive intrusion on their privacy and personal space.
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But Maya pings us all the time...
 
Simon_Jester said:
Let me see if I understand your argument. It looks like it's based on three premises with two conclusions:

1) Premise: The Senzu do not have wards that good (therefore private SSJ-capable training rooms cannot exist)
2) Premise: A house that secret trained SSJ did so in the Training Hall (therefore private SSJ-capable training rooms do not exist)
3) Premise: Only the Training Hall has wards that can hide a SSJ (therefore we'd know if she were training herself up)

4) Conclusion: Because of (1) and (2), Dandeer cannot construct her own SSJ-capable training room.
5) Conclusion: Therefore, because of (3), Dandeer cannot become a super-saiyan, nor train up her SSJ powers, in secret.
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Completely and utterly wrong. I had five* pieces of evidence, one extremely shakey hypothesis and one conclusion.

1) Only the Training Hall wards have the ability to hide a SSJ.
2) The Training Hall wards required multiple magic users to create.*
3) The only known House with wards of their own can't hide a SSJ.
4) The Senzu wards were created by a single magic user.*
5) All known SSJ's, legitimate or not, have trained in the Training Hall.

6) Hypothesis: SSJ-level wards requires multiple magic users. It is therefore unlikely that Dandeer has secretly obtained them, but not impossible.
7) Conclusion: We need more evidence.

*These were, I felt, self-evident.
 
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fictionfan said:
But Maya pings us all the time...
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Maya is twelve, utterly outside of the usual social context in which this is considered intrusive, and does not yet need to know. Kakara has taken it in stride because Kakara is slightly strange, and while she understands what an intrusion it technically is, she does not, natively, care.

That said, it does promise to be an entertaining conversation, when it needs to happen.
 
Anyway if we're talking about dandeer, we should probably confirm whether or not she's got multiform, as she could be having a duplicate doing sorcery and prep all the time.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
That said, it does promise to be an entertaining conversation, when it needs to happen.
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"Maya...that thing you just did?"

"Yeah, Karen?"

"Well...you know how there's lots of ki users I was totally going to introduce you to eventually?"

"Yeah?"

"Don't do that to them. It's considered a bit rude, like pulling someone's waistband to see what color their underwear is."

"Oh! Oh...so, wait...?"

"Yes?"

"Soyoudon'tmindmelookingatyourunderwear?"

*Both faint*
 
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Carrnage said:
Or we trick the alien fleet into baiting it into another galactic region.
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When you have a problem, you have a problem. When you have two problems, you have two problems. But when you have LOTS of problems, sometimes you can trick them into eating each other.

fictionfan said:
But Maya pings us all the time...
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Well, the only person who could have taught her it's rude is us, so who but ourselves do we have to blame?

Plus, her ki sense is a lot fuzzier than ours; she may not be able to see us clearly without active pings In which case the difference between being pinged by Maya and being pinged by Kakara is like the difference between having someone look at you, and having someone turn a massive battery of sophisticated sensor arrays and recording devices on you. The former may be socially acceptable in situations where the latter isn't.

Gore17 said:
Completely and utterly wrong. I had five* pieces of evidence, one extremely shakey hypothesis and one conclusion.

1) Only the Training Hall wards have the ability to hide a SSJ.
2) The Training Hall wards required multiple magic users to create.*
3) The only known House with wards of their own can't hide a SSJ.
4) The Senzu wards were created by a single magic user.*
5) All known SSJ's, legitimate or not, have trained in the Training Hall.

6) Hypothesis: SSJ-level wards requires multiple magic users. It is therefore unlikely that Dandeer has secretly obtained them, but not impossible.
7) Conclusion: We need more evidence.

*These were, I felt, self-evident.
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It bears consideration that (6) is at best weakly supported by the combination of (2), (3), and (4), for the same reasons I already outlined. The Training Hall is huge, and huge wards may well be harder or more labor-intensive to create than tiny ones of equal power level. And, as noted, the Senzus have very good reasons to not create a training room capable of hiding a super saiyan, even if they could do so.

So I think (7) is by far the key conclusion: we need more information and evidence. We should make NO assumptions, even if the probability of Dandeer being a ki-using threat is low enough that we shouldn't take overt steps that would raise awkward questions.
 
Simon_Jester said:
It bears consideration that (6) is at best weakly supported by the combination of (2), (3), and (4), for the same reasons I already outlined. The Training Hall is huge, and huge wards may well be harder or more labor-intensive to create than tiny ones of equal power level. And, as noted, the Senzus have very good reasons to not create a training room capable of hiding a super saiyan, even if they could do so.
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Gore17 said:
I had five* pieces of evidence, one extremely shakey hypothesis and one conclusion.
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I outright noted that.
 
My apologies.

When you originally said "theorizing is rather pointless," I somehow got the idea that you were trying to shut down the debate rather than discuss "what do we do if we want to figure out whether this is a realistic threat and/or whether it's happening."

Past that point was... apparently a case of violent agreement?
 
Simon_Jester said:
When you originally said "theorizing is rather pointless," I somehow got the idea that you were trying to shut down the debate rather than discuss "what do we do if we want to figure out whether this is a realistic threat and/or whether it's happening."
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Pretty much. So, the obvious question is: how do we get more info?

Well, besides take the "learn about magic" option.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
Y'all better never change. :lol
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I meant theorizing ways to get a better idea of what the threat is like other then the obvious, shoe-in choice, not "avoid the required reading". :p

I mean, is there ways to spy on her? Do Yammar and Apra have better ideas of what she/magic can do to compensate for our lack of knowledge, or provide specifics we can't find out ourselves?

Seriously, 12 going 13 years old Kakara should not be the one who has to learn what she can do and create countermeasures.
 
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After his destruction of the Talts (noting that the Talt rebellion began with them killing Yammar's father), I suspect that Yammar Vegeta spent more time thinking about how to detect super-saiyan rebels than anyone else in Exile history.

He... might actually be helpful here, terrible person though he is.
 
Simon_Jester said:
After his destruction of the Talts (noting that the Talt rebellion began with them killing Yammar's father), I suspect that Yammar Vegeta spent more time thinking about how to detect super-saiyan rebels than anyone else in Exile history.

He... might actually be helpful here, terrible person though he is.
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I suspect that Yammar and Dandeer have been keeping away from each other. If they come into contact death seems likely.
 
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