Kinruush
Who?
- Location
- USA
I think the wording of the vote may have caused some people to believe that it was pulling down the Masquerade for everyone rather than explicitly just for Maya.
Dragon Ball: After the End
I think the wording of the vote may have caused some people to believe that it was pulling down the Masquerade for everyone rather than explicitly just for Maya.
- Location
- Just passing through.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Full disclosure. Surely you can convince Dad to cast away the Masquerade your people have maintained for centuries for not terribly much reason at all, right? Well, once you do, go walk back upstairs without a Masque on, and start explaining.
If is just for Maya...
If is just for Maya...
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
I'm... starting to lean that way, but I'd like to hear a bit more argumentation. The above is, like, a list of the arguments I'm already convinced of.
- Location
- USA
I don't trust our dad to be able to see reason and go along with full disclosure and we'll get stuck with something below broad disclosure.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Maya and 'Karen' socialize regularly and she trains with us in private. If we really think Maya ought to know something Berra doesn't want to tell her, we can ignore him. If his reasons aren't good enough... and frankly, we don't really know his reasons very well yet.
On the other hand, he asked for our opinion, we have good reasons for such a course, lots of traits that help us present our case...
Still, if it'll make you feel better: @PoptartProdigy, if we go Full Disclosure and fail to convince him of it's merits, is he going to automatically go with "Nothing" or "Limited Release"? Or would a compromise for Broad Disclosure be reached?
Kinruush
Who?
- Location
- USA
Well, my main argument is that it is probably not possible to hide a world-spanning conspiracy from Maya forever, particularly as she's rapidly getting better at sensing and there is an invasion which is apt to make it increasingly difficult to hide.
In addition, there just isn't a point in hiding it from her anymore. As you mentioned, she's a potential disruption to any plan if she's just left to her own devices anyway, and if we don't bring her in completely we'll inherently have to leave her out of the plans if not outright work around her. That is incredibly counterproductive. This even includes the Masquerade itself. Berra knows how to manage the clans to maintain the Masquerade, but with the invasion it's significantly harder to do. Maya has been great so far at hiding herself from normals, but there's going to be a great deal going on, and she needs to know not just what to do, but why she's doing it, because we can't very well guide her otherwise.
Also, we would have to bring her into the fold at some point anyway if we want to be able to eventually move forward with Berra's long-term plans to reveal ki-users to the world, because hiding the clans at that point from Maya would be an impossibility. It was always going to happen at some point, and the only question was when.
Finally, Berra may not feel ready to trust Maya yet, but Kakara is. And Kakara is good at understanding and dealing with people. As you mentioned, she wouldn't be the first human brought in, and Kakara may very well be the best person to bring her in.
That's all the more reason to try for Full Disclosure. We should try to show him the Kakara that handled the Cult responsibly, diplomatically, and decisively by standing up for the best choice, even if it's not immediately palatable.
Here's two additional reasons:
1) We're pretty bad at Deceit, so keeping it up around Maya could very well top her off that we're lying to her, and cause further problems, potentially risking the Masquerade overall.
2) If she does discover the deception by herself, the reaction will almost certainly be bad. By breaking the news now, we minimize negative feelings while maximising control over the situation.
- Location
- Rockford, USA
- Pronouns
- They/Them
No. Honestly, I'm stunned that Full Disclosure managed as big a slice as it has (it is, at this point, winning by one). But yeah, if your first suggestion gets shot down Kakara is going to say, "can we at least tell her this and that and the other thing?" Just good bargaining; if you can't get what you want, try one step less.
NegativeJ
LOVE
- Location
- Est
Or you know... Completely ignore him and tell her everything anyway... Teenage rebellion starting early?... Well... Hmm...
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Losing by 1 by my count.
Vote Tally : Sci-Fi - Dragon Ball: After the End | Page 427 | Sufficient Velocity
##### NetTally 1.7.9
[x] Broad disclosure. Give her a filtered version of the events as you know them. You had a Vision a while ago, saying aliens were coming and that they were hostile. Tell her everything through the lens of human ki users being the active parties.
No. of Votes: 14
[X] Full disclosure. Surely you can convince Dad to cast away the Masquerade your people have maintained for centuries for not terribly much reason at all, right? Well, once you do, go walk back upstairs without a Masque on, and start explaining.
No. of Votes: 13
Total No. of Voters: 27
##### NetTally 1.7.9
[x] Broad disclosure. Give her a filtered version of the events as you know them. You had a Vision a while ago, saying aliens were coming and that they were hostile. Tell her everything through the lens of human ki users being the active parties.
No. of Votes: 14
[X] Full disclosure. Surely you can convince Dad to cast away the Masquerade your people have maintained for centuries for not terribly much reason at all, right? Well, once you do, go walk back upstairs without a Masque on, and start explaining.
No. of Votes: 13
Total No. of Voters: 27
- Location
- Rockford, USA
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Ah, whoops. Must be more tired than I thought.
Always an option. *points to custom title*
NegativeJ
LOVE
- Location
- Est
And starting to see things that are not there... Hmm... Akria'ness is cathing up with you...
ElleonXan
Self-Proclaimed King of the Dumpster Fires
- Location
- USA
Could honestly care less one way or the other on this vote, but with it being such a close race at the moment...?
Meh, about to go to sleep, so I guess if the vote isn't over and is still neck and neck tomorrow when I wake up I'll vote then.
To tell you the truth though, I have a feeling that Berra really doesn't care how much we tell her, (save for maybe not breaking the masquerade,) so I get the feeling that how much we tell her really isn't that important... it's more a matter of Kakara's personal preference, and I'm having a hard time caring about one option over another.
Meh, about to go to sleep, so I guess if the vote isn't over and is still neck and neck tomorrow when I wake up I'll vote then.
To tell you the truth though, I have a feeling that Berra really doesn't care how much we tell her, (save for maybe not breaking the masquerade,) so I get the feeling that how much we tell her really isn't that important... it's more a matter of Kakara's personal preference, and I'm having a hard time caring about one option over another.
NegativeJ
LOVE
- Location
- Est
Why not tell the whole truth to her... Less checks, more hugging and more hugging makes for a happy sufficient velocity!
- Location
- USA
Fuck it. I'll flip
[X] Full disclosure. Surely you can convince Dad to cast away the Masquerade your people have maintained for centuries for not terribly much reason at all, right? Well, once you do, go walk back upstairs without a Masque on, and start explaining.
[X] Full disclosure. Surely you can convince Dad to cast away the Masquerade your people have maintained for centuries for not terribly much reason at all, right? Well, once you do, go walk back upstairs without a Masque on, and start explaining.
- Location
- Somewhere other than where I am.
I'm kinda pissed at Berra for how he has mishandled this mess. Blaming Kakara for screwing up when he withheld critical information is a jackass move.
[X] Full Disclosure
[X] Full Disclosure
Bakkasama
There is always a greater fool
- Location
- Buenos Aires, Argentina
- Pronouns
- He/his
Ok. I think I am sick? It feels that way.
Final round of arguments:
Power and martial arts give confidence. Maya is getting better at that. Is she at the point she can handle the revelation? A lot of it comes from her thinking herself special and Berra speaking of her potential and this makes that a lie. Then again, the higher she goes, the greater the fall...
Berra is the one trustworthy authority figure she knows. Nuff' said.
She might believe we are just telling her because she saw the alien and not quite see it as a measure of trust. Actually, this is a pretty stressful situation to learn about it and add on top of it.
Does that feel like an excuse?
Berra seems to want to make her a public figure. Would she be cool with that, knowing it is a lie? She is not like Hercule.
We don't know what his plan is yet. Kind of hard to decide what to tell her
Would telling the truth here act as a "pick me up" for Kakara after this? Even if we fail we can at least say we tried. I was planing on telling Maya as soon as we were Lady anyways so this could make our stance clear on that.
Can we swing our vision of opportunities coming from the scouts arriving to justify this?
Would full disclosure involve Jaron's situation? I doubt so, it is irrelevant.
Which option would cost less actions in the future?
What do we plan to do if she freaks up? Is she likely to do so?
Are we voting this to spite Berra? If so, take a step back.
Finally (for now): "Yo, Maya. Magic is real. Aliens are real. Your best friend was secretly princess of the Monkeymen in the whitehouse. She has fluffy tail"
"Want a hug?"
Also, remember: When in doubt, toss a coin. You will know by the time it hits the ground.
Bakka out! (for now)
Peace!
Final round of arguments:
Power and martial arts give confidence. Maya is getting better at that. Is she at the point she can handle the revelation? A lot of it comes from her thinking herself special and Berra speaking of her potential and this makes that a lie. Then again, the higher she goes, the greater the fall...
Berra is the one trustworthy authority figure she knows. Nuff' said.
She might believe we are just telling her because she saw the alien and not quite see it as a measure of trust. Actually, this is a pretty stressful situation to learn about it and add on top of it.
Does that feel like an excuse?
Berra seems to want to make her a public figure. Would she be cool with that, knowing it is a lie? She is not like Hercule.
We don't know what his plan is yet. Kind of hard to decide what to tell her
Would telling the truth here act as a "pick me up" for Kakara after this? Even if we fail we can at least say we tried. I was planing on telling Maya as soon as we were Lady anyways so this could make our stance clear on that.
Can we swing our vision of opportunities coming from the scouts arriving to justify this?
Would full disclosure involve Jaron's situation? I doubt so, it is irrelevant.
Which option would cost less actions in the future?
What do we plan to do if she freaks up? Is she likely to do so?
Are we voting this to spite Berra? If so, take a step back.
Finally (for now): "Yo, Maya. Magic is real. Aliens are real. Your best friend was secretly princess of the Monkeymen in the whitehouse. She has fluffy tail"
"Want a hug?"
Also, remember: When in doubt, toss a coin. You will know by the time it hits the ground.
Bakka out! (for now)
Peace!
- Location
- Somewhere other than where I am.
There are three interlocking secrets here: Ki, aliens, Saiyans. Maya discovered the first, bringing her into that part of the masquerade. We told here there was more, but that it was secret. She has now discovered aliens. This is the best opportunity we will ever have to fill her in on the rest. Keeping her in the dark is a losing proposition: She will find out one way or the other. The longer we leave it, the worse the backlash is going to be. Yes, it will be hard on her, but not telling her is worse.
Berra kept information from Kakara that she needed to know as a first responder. That is why people are mad at him. He broke Kakara's trust for no good reason, and is now asking her to break her friend's trust. This is unacceptable. He is no longer in a position to make that call. His own judgement is in question.
Maya will probably freak out. She has every right to, at this point. This needs to be handled carefully and in a controlled environment. Her secret training area should qualify, since she should feel safe here. Hugs are very much in order. Cuddle time and tail petting is recommended.
The other matter is that we are out of time. The aliens are here, there is an invasion coming, and Maya needs to be ready for it. This is Maya's home every bit as much as it is Kakara's, and she has the right to be involved in it's defence. And, frankly, there is no way we can keep her out of it once the shooting starts.
Jaron is a sensitive political problem. Getting her involved in that mess is separate from the invasion. Maya will get dragged into it at some point, but we can probably hold off on that one for the time being. It all depends on whether we get her involved in the extraction or not. She should be told once he is freed, at the latest.
- Location
- Rockford, USA
- Pronouns
- They/Them
*cocks head*
What critical information did he withhold? He told you what to do and then told you to do whatever was necessary to achieve it. The fact that the players still decided only to go to 200,000 and got caught out by the transformation had nothing to do with his instructions. I mean, ordinarily I don't like to give input to discussion like this, but I'm honestly confused as to where Berra withholding information appears to have directly contributed to Kakara eating a loss just now.
NOT recommended. I model that as a very intimate gesture by the Exiles, considering how sensitive tails are. To be relatively tasteful with the why: if, when touched wrong, it hurts a whole hell of a lot, then when touched right...
NegativeJ
LOVE
- Location
- Est
Because he didn't explain why he placed restrictions in the first place, meaning the players interpreted things as "he had a very good reason to do it, and mimizing how high we go is important". This is supported, by their PoV, of Berra originally ordering only 20% more then previously shown if we thought she wouldn't sense it, when he was aware we were facing an experienced enemy with a PL of 150,000+.
Basically, if Berra is willing to risk serious injury, or even death of a scout and his daughter, then it's presumably majorly important.
- Location
- Australia
I always thought of it as an eye. If you squeeze someone's eye, it hurts a lot, but just pressing on it doesn't do anything.