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Paths of Civilization

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[X] [WB] Gain a free random value slot
[X] [WB] Randomly upgrade a value

Extremely valuable and rare, best get them when we can.





[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves

Only peer or close to peer powers should be allowed to participate, otherwise it would insult the other participants and lesser the value of the games, this isn't modern Olympics, this is the bronze Age, pride and glory are reasons enough to start wars of annihilation, so don't demean the greater powers by including the lesser ones. Furthermore inviting both the nomads and metal workers would piss off the nomads as they would definitely view it as an insult that thier tributary is comparable to them.



[X] Yes (2 Econ and 2 Econ expansion transferred, Redshore becomes a Free City)

A free free city, why the hell would we not take this? It's beyond perfect especially with the extra policies. It also delegates power, gives liberty and creates initiative in the populace.



[X] [King] Yenyna (Genius Martial, Poor Admin, Awful Diplomacy, Wildcard Mystic; dangerously unpredictable)

The war vote.
 
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maximillian said:
[X] [WB] Gain a free random value slot
[X] [WB] Randomly upgrade a value

Extremely valuable and rare, best get them when we can.





[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves

Only peer or close to peer powers should be allowed to participate, otherwise it would insult the other participants and lesser the value of the games, this isn't modern Olympics, this is the bronze Age, pride and glory are reasons enough to start wars of annihilation, so don't demean the greater powers by including the lesser ones. Furthermore inviting both the nomads and metal workers would piss off the nomads as they would definitely view it as an insult that thier tributary is comparable to them.



[X] Yes (2 Econ and 2 Econ expansion transferred, Redshore becomes a Free City)

A free free city, why the hell would we not take this? It's beyond perfect especially with the extra policies.



[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))

The absolute best choice, for those worrying about him not declaring war, that's unlikely. The update already mentioned the council is calling for war but split on who should lead it.
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At least I can always count on you to be consistent, sheepposter. Maybe I should join the flock.
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance

[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves


[X] Yes (2 Econ and 2 Econ expansion transferred, Redshore becomes a Free City)


[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takescontrol while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
 
NewAgeOfPower said:
Time to find him a nice local girl.
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We seem to have best hookers in the neighbourhood too. :V
Carrnage said:
and then HK decides to be a shit and start shit.
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What do you mean? That they can try backstabbing us during games themselves? Well, if they are that suicidal, sure, but I somehow doubt that.

They started attacking us when we conquered part of the Lowlands. It is pretty clear that they thought they are next and thus attacked first, it follows that being invited would calm them down.
 
Andres110 said:
Restore Order is crackdowns and such. It purges corruption and due to our system, places without corruption stay stable and do not fall back into corruption on their own.
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Pretty sure Enforce Justice also involves a military crackdown

Academia Nut said:
Enforce Justice - The king is a servant of the law, and he can use the army to remind people of that fact [GJ]
* S: 1 Stability, +1-3 Centralization
* M: 1 to 2 Stability, +2-3 Centralization
* the more settlements with walls outside of the capital, particularly large walls, the less effective this action is
*Max Stability: Legitimacy
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On a side note, do we have a stability plan for what to do after our defense policy renders enforce justice obsolete?
 
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veekie said:
A few reasons:
-We needed the Trails to generate enough Diplomacy to use Terrify. Moot now with the Games
-We needed the Centralization to maintain an open buffer for Wildcat.
-We needed the Centralization cap increase to handle Cities.
-Part of the corruption problem was the terrible roads preventing the central administration from getting a good grip on what's going on. Poor roads means local authorities have more leeway.

Though if you want to catch the criminals, it's Restore Order to investigate and purge the problems via an Admin roll.
Enforce Justice tries to solve the problem by legislating it away, but doesn't do anything about eliminating the offenders directly.
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Trails weren't necessary for Terrify and we had enough. The two centralization comments are meaningless, as enforce justice not only raised centralization but is 1 to 3 instead of just 1. The final comment seems frankly just you trying to justify why you choose something afterwards, instead of a reason to do so in the first place. Regardless if corruption is an actual issue, as displayed in Redshore and that should have zero transport issues to the capital, then actually taking an action to crack down on laws being broken should undoubtedly be superior given that's what it's focused on.

Your final paragraph about enforce justice legislating things away is just wrong. The option itself explains what it does. The King is a servant of the law, and so this action is about ensuring that the law is actually being applied by the settlements, if necessary via a show of military force. In the past it's also been done via the King seeing more appeals, which also shows you if the law is being applied properly.
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance

[X] [Inv] Highland Kingdom
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves


[X] Yes (2 Econ and 2 Econ expansion transferred, Redshore becomes a Free City)


[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
 
[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
[X] [Inv] Highland Kingdom
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
[X] No
[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns)
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
[X] No
[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
[X] No
[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takescontrol while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
 
Dunno if we want to Enforce Justice in the midturn.

Two Secondary Mercenary Companies would drastically lower our martial, give us two Main War Actions for beating up the HK the next Mainturn and worst case back up the Heavens Hawks or secure the northern borders
 
Seriously guys, why are you inviting everyone? You think the warriors who are competing as peers would not be furious to see thier civilisational lessers be included? You think that khemtri or the other regional powers would be happy at being considered a peer of the metal workers or trelli? This would at best be seen as a grave insult that results in cutting off relations, and at worst a reason for immediate war. Pride is the supreme trait in this age, and we should be careful with it unless we want to intentionally start wars.
 
maximillian said:
Seriously guys, why are you inviting everyone? You think the warriors who are competing as peers would not be furious to see thier civilisational lessers be included? You think that khemtri or the other regional powers would be happy at being considered a peer of the metal workers or trelli? This would at best be seen as a grave insult that results in cutting off relations, and at worst a reason for immediate war. Pride is the supreme trait in this age, and we should be careful with it unless we want to intentionally start wars.
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Why should they be insulted? It's the perfect chance to rub their superiority into everyones faces.
The larger the audience the better.
 
maximillian said:
Seriously guys, why are you inviting everyone? You think the warriors who are competing as peers would not be furious to see thier civilisational lessers be included? You think that khemtri or the other regional powers would be happy at being considered a peer of the metal workers or trelli? This would at best be seen as a grave insult that results in cutting off relations, and at worst a reason for immediate war. Pride is the supreme trait in this age, and we should be careful with it unless we want to intentionally start wars.
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Look.

What looks better?

Losing to the Ymaryn or losing to the Ymaryn with 5 guys that you still utterly crushed?

The others are partly included to pad out the roster and make the winners more impressive.
 
veekie said:
Anyone who wants to have a go at winning will have to build their own Games to train up dudes. Which will give us free Culture, though it will also remove them from being held hostage by the Games on their martial cap, since their own games would make the drop 1 rather than 3.
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I think they would still be "hostage" by 3 but have 2 on top of that on their own, just like we do. Nothing says these effects don't stack, after all.
 
McLuvin said:
I'm personally a bit wary of giving the Shadow King free reign to take over our trading hub and naval focal point.....
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1: we don't even know if it's a criminal enterprise or a serious of unfortunate events coupled with administrative problems.

2: the city can handle its own crime problem if given the authority to do so.

2.5 as a free city it will be more likely to innovate which is useful on its own, but will depend on local circumstances, so we may see the development of more advanced crime countering apparatus.

3: if a hypothetical crime syndicate ends up taking over redshore somehow, then problem solved. The criminal enterprise is now legal and taxable, furthermore the city has all the knowhow and resources to exterminate all crime and shady businesses, legal mafia is brutally efficient at eliminating crime no matter how well hidden.
 
maximillian said:
You think the warriors who are competing as peers would not be furious to see thier civilisational lessers be included
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Cosmopolitan acceptance says they'd be happy to see people from other lands come to ours.
We as a society don't have this weird cultural arrogance that you seem to prize
 
McLuvin said:
I'm personally a bit wary of giving the Shadow King free reign to take over our trading hub and naval focal point.....
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I still think the 'Shadow King' is mostly a matter of unreliable narrator speculation. I'm confident we do have multiple criminal organizations at this point, along with foreign intrigue and sabotage. The notion of a single Shadow King running everything is quite unlikely, IMO.

Again, everything we've heard about a shadow king since Rulwyna II has been from unreliable narrators.
 
Andres110 said:
This is Enforce Justice:
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Which quite specifically only handles cases which are already detected by the system and mishandled. Basically you add more rules, more oversight, and more appeal levels

The current corruption problem is cases undetected, which is what Restore Order is for, sending people to find the undetected criminals, troublemakers and rioters, and bringing them to justice.
maximillian said:
Only peer or close to peer powers should be allowed to participate, otherwise it would insult the other participants and lesser the value of the games, this isn't modern Olympics, this is the bronze Age, pride and glory are reasons enough to start wars of annihilation, so don't demean the greater powers by including the lesser ones. Furthermore inviting both the nomads and metal workers would piss off the nomads as they would definitely view it as an insult that thier tributary is comparable to them.
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This is contradicted by the mechanics, where the Prestige value and Diplomacy(aka international relations) return power increases per participating country.

The Great powers here are us and the Khemetri, which means we can invite anyone we like. Normally I expect there will be a diplomacy cost to invite people, but in this case between the two Kings they're happy just to be asked..
Because we are King of the Hill. Whoever we invite is already under such a prestige disparity that they are all small fry.
 
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