As I just mentioned, check your timeline. That happened while the crisis was technically ongoing. It was during the crisis resolution turn where one of our options was "one more turn". Thus, the crisis was ongoing, the task was literacy, and we weren't allowed to policy switch.
Immediately following that the crisis was over and the literacy requirement was removed. Thus, no task, automatic policy switch allowed. This does not mean we succeeded at completing the task.
 
Hmm, didn't consider slate, but it's possible, as slate is a pretty durable rock as well. Very hard to work though, compared to basalt. So I didn't think of it.
N.B. slate wasn't my suggestion, I was just affirming it as a good choice.
If you factor n that their priests are their noble caste, yeah.
So you see the decor:
-Elaborate hand tattoos on healers point to a shaman level of skill to reliably make those tattoos without risking a crippling hand infection. Estimated a few days of labor from highest caste.
-Earrings and piercings of polished rock. Recall that cutting fine discs of rock and then polishing them is days of skilled labor with metal tools, and that piercings cost healer time and also metal tools.
-Cotton robes. Each robe is at hundreds of man-days of labor on a crop that produces sparsely.

And then you have the tablets, which are EACH years of labor to collect and collate their medical lore, then you have shamans(again, highest caste labor) painstakingly scribe the artwork and words, then to melt and it with gold for illustration...then transporting it unmarred and unrobbed.

Years of labor would be fairly accurate yeah.
Preventing a hand infection needn't necessarily take a lot of work, especially since the coal that would be rubbed into it is likely to kill some bacteria by absorbing the surrounding nutrients. Rubbing honey on afterward isn't hard, and is a widespread treatment. The fact that it's done on the healers decreases the likelihood that they possess a general high level of skill, as the healer in question can take care of their own hands. Hand-pricked tattoos of any complexity at all take like... idk probably 5 days or more, however. It would be interesting if the healers did it to themselves.

Cutting fine disks of rock isn't necessary when you can just flake them into shape or find a small rock of a suitable size and then grind them into the appropriate shape and smoothness. Definitely takes a day or more of skilled labor, however. Less if they've figured out how to make a person-powered rotating mill though. Piercings can be done w/ sharp pointed rocks, e.g. obsidian, or bone needles. Honey, again. The earrings are likely to be steadily expanded over time, possibly turning into a marker of status; skill if healer-specific. Which costs a lot. Maybe they're passed down as an inheritance?

Sincerely: Why would a robe take hundreds of man-days of labor? Depending on the weight, the amount of cotton needed for a robe could probably be gained from a single season on an acre, and thus is unlikely to consume a hundred days. W/o a cotton gin cleaning all the balls probably takes a week per robe, generously. Carding, spinning, weaving fibers takes the normal amount of labor for cloth. It doesn't produce sparsely if it's been cultivated over generations and is grown in satisfactory land.

Agreed w/ the tablets, tho idk why you'd include the decades of sacrifice needed to collect and collate medical lore when it's probable that people scribed and then copied it into different volumes. These tablets are probably just the fancy, premium edition of the normal text. Getting nice unmarred stone and carving out appropriate details w/o shattering the blocks though.. *whistles.* Transporting it unmarred isn't hard: they're on poles, providing a steady support. Stack the poles on top of each other, tie them together, and you have a rather sturdy protection. Anti-thievery was gotten by buying transportation from TH.
 
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As I just mentioned, check your timeline. That happened while the crisis was technically ongoing. It was during the crisis resolution turn where one of our options was "one more turn". Thus, the crisis was ongoing, the task was literacy, and we weren't allowed to policy switch.
Immediately following that the crisis was over and the literacy requirement was removed. Thus, no task, automatic policy switch allowed. This does not mean we succeeded at completing the task.
Crisis was over at the time already.
 
Crisis was over at the time already.
Objectively false. The crisis was ending, but had not ended. One of the explicit options was "One more turn", which would have extended the crisis. It would not have restarted the crisis. Thus, the crisis had not ended at that point in time.

This is also why he had the world "technically" in there.
 
Copper makes it take less work replacing the tools to do your job, so it frees up Economy from increasing availability. It's probably like Black Soil, we can invest into it X times before the Economy gains cap out.

AN explicitly pointed out that this was mostly due to the Shamans NOT getting much expansion, so they don't really have spare time to get involved with politics. If we expand their power they'd become as political as everyone else.

It seemed that we expand the shaman's assistants instead, so they can do more "magic" stuff.
 
Copper makes it take less work replacing the tools to do your job, so it frees up Economy from increasing availability. It's probably like Black Soil, we can invest into it X times before the Economy gains cap out.

AN explicitly pointed out that this was mostly due to the Shamans NOT getting much expansion, so they don't really have spare time to get involved with politics. If we expand their power they'd become as political as everyone else.
Or we're just saving labor from having to create and transport goods to buy copper from the Metal Workers. Or both.

Please sauce the explicit pointing out, thx.

I agree that we probably haven't hit literacy, let's @Academia Nut What's our literacy status? And, if you have the time, our literacy status, population status, and physical characteristics in comparison to our neighbors?

Also, thx for de-demonizing the DP.
 
Objectively false. The crisis was ending, but had not ended. One of the explicit options was "One more turn", which would have extended the crisis. It would not have restarted the crisis. Thus, the crisis had not ended at that point in time.

This is also why he had the world "technically" in there.
The literacy requirement was:
-Every Province must have one upgraded Holy Site
--Valleyhome
---Rainbow Trail - Upgraded twice
--RedShore
---Holy Sea - Upgraded once
--Stonepen
---Horse Valley - Upgraded once
--Sacred Forest
---Sacred Forest - Upgraded twice
--Northshore
---White Circle - Upgraded once
---Warriors' Rest - Not upgraded
--Stallion Tribes
---Unknown Holy Site - Upgraded once

Could outright hunt down the references, but that can be after the update. Don't want to miss it doing an archive crawl
It seemed that we expand the shaman's assistants instead, so they can do more "magic" stuff.

After the Policy completed we had a Priest(Theory, politics, spirits) and Shaman(Practical, healing, advising) split, so yeah. The more we invest into them the more they have free time to get into political trouble. Shamans are useful, but they are still people. Give people power and they raise hell
 
On possible consequences of expanding Shaman power as a solution for social inequalities.

The more realistic one would be to somehow create gender roles where female have equal, but different, power. Like, say, making shamans a gender bias job for females, would be a good starting point.
And then someone decides that consolidating spiritual power under their purview is a good idea and goes after a nicely pre-labelled and isolated group.

that's a bit of a jump to make. Consolidating spiritual power under their purview isn't necessarily a result of increased power so much as it is of the natural distinction of shamans, and the somewhat outcast status that having them be largely female/non-standard would result in.
It also doesn't match your original statement in that one is a politicizing internally whereas the other seems to be an external power collecting spiritual power. Though I think that this is just me picking at points that are likely invisible.

After the Policy completed we had a Priest(Theory, politics, spirits) and Shaman(Practical, healing, advising) split,
No offense, but sauce? This doesn't match with what I've read, though it is of course quite likely I've missed something.
 
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Sauce searching is mentally exhausting on a level beyond any other debate so far.
Or maybe it's because researching the development process of tattooing, cotton and various engineering things is actually fun...

Your priests are considered odd in that most of them are very practical people, even if they also study esoteric subjects. Your shamans are less mysterious and more approachable, although they also maintain a very tight grip on anything they legitimately consider dangerous.
@Academia Nut

What's the difference between Priest and Shaman here?
Priests tend to be much more detached from practical issues, acting more of an interface between the spiritual/divine and other people, while your shamans are very much more in the mould of witch doctors. They have lots of strange knowledge, much of it very dangerous if misused, but they frequently use it for practical things just as often as abstract/social ones.

On what happens when you give the priest caste a lot of power...human nature takes over. They are currently very fair and impartial because we pick all the natural outcastes and weirdos. As we expand more 'normal' people will enter the power structure and they will bring their own politics.
 
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Sauce searching is mentally exhausting on a level beyond any other debate so far.
Or maybe it's because researching the development process of tattooing, cotton and various engineering things is actually fun...



On what happens when you give the priest caste a lot of power...human nature takes over. They are currently very fair and impartial because we pick all the natural outcastes and weirdos. As we expand more 'normal' people will enter the power structure and they will bring their own politics.
Ah so it wasn't in one of the core posts, that explains it.
 
So much salt
[X] Dead Priests (One compatible value: The Greater Good)
[X] [Main] Saltern
[X][Secondary] Study Health
[X][Secondary] Study Health x2
[X] [Kick] Saltern

Provinces - Megaproject x2

Stallion Tribes [Main] Chariots, [Sec] Expand Econ x2

With the new potion developed requiring salt, and salt being required for so many things anyway, the king carefully listened to his council and then authorized that significant resources be directed towards the construction of a new major project along the coast in Northshore. There was a place along the coast where what appeared to be an old riverbed had once run, producing an area where the tide came up unusually high but where a plausible wall could be built as a sort of dam. The biggest trick would be how to create a gate that could let the sea in when the structure needed to be filled, but keep it out when they wanted the water collected to disappear beneath the sun. They surveyed the land and got to work planning things out, sending workers to the location even as they started to fill wagons with cut stone and fired bricks and food for those who would actually do the job. It was massively disruptive to internal trade and supplies and actually getting the usual work done...

And yet, somehow, everything just came together all at once and a frenzy came over those working at the project. Something that was projected to take generations to get working properly instead only took years, and while there were setbacks and delays, the first walls built were better able to withstand the sea than any might have expected, and the crumbling of the gates gave quicker insight. Bricks and glazed tiles to make the collection of salt simpler came in faster than initially expected as the People threw personal effort into getting the project done. By the time the first children born after the announcement of the project were taking their rites of adulthood, the first batches of salt were already being scraped up.

Megaproject Completed!
Ancient Saltern
Gives an initial bonus to Econ, +1 Diplomacy every turn until the invention of currency, grants access to the Salt Gift action, and the Saltern extended project action, when acceptable sites for construction or expansion can be found

Legacy Gained!
Rush Builders: Extended projects cost more per turn but complete faster

New Concept: Extended projects are somewhat like megaprojects in that they require a commitment of actions beyond what one could usually develop in a single turn, but are less involved than megaprojects so they can be done with secondary actions and do not cause social disruption to stop part way through. Some may, however, suffer loss of progress is ignored

Perhaps some of the frenzy was the fact that the gift from the Xohyssiri was paying off quite well, the lessons and knowledge of their healers and Book of the Living, while gruesome, were also incredibly valuable for dealing with injury. Many shamans could set bones, and some of the Carrion Eaters knew the secrets of releasing the demons from the skull of a man suffering a head wound, but when given a sharp knife and fire the butcher priests could amputate a limb faster and more cleanly than any of the People. If a woman perished in childbirth then they could even sometimes cut the babe from her belly so that both would not be lost. It was unclean, spiritually dangerous work, but it was exactly the sort of thing the Carrion Eaters were for, and with the reduced number of workers being outright killed in accidents or dying from disease, the projections of the chiefs were perhaps overly pessimistic, hence why things completed so quickly.

The healers also told of a rare flower that the People might be able to trade with the Highlanders for that made dealing with painful sickness and injury. It came from somewhere in the south-west, but there were traders who occasionally wandered up from that direction who might be able to be contacted through intermediaries. The Xohyssiri had routes even further to the south that the People had never heard about that bypassed the Highlanders and the Southern Hill Folk, but one of those two would probably have to be a go between for the People if they were interested. A mission to the Highlanders might also be useful as the civil war had ended swiftly and decisively, with a new king rising to prominence and apparently beginning a project of consolidation and inscription of the law inspired by tales from the People.

Then again there was a rumour along their trade routes that the Metal Workers had discovered something interesting, or perhaps more ties with the Thunder Horse - who were apparently starting to refer to their term for 'king' of Thunder Speaker for their whole people - would give further insights into their conflicts with their eastern cousins. Or maybe they might take the relative peace of the western lowlands to send a mission to the Xohyssiri, who as far as anyone could tell the People had never actually fought and most stories were just ancient tales of monsters in the south-east. While they did things that the People disapproved of, so did basically all of their trade partners in one way or another, and maybe going to their homelands would give actual insights instead of fourth-hand stories and ancient campfire tales to scare small children.

Choose an Econ action
[] Expand Carrion Eaters (-1 Econ, -1 Mysticism, +1 Martial, many more Carrion Eaters, additional effects)
[] Study Stars (continues chain) + Survey Lands
[] Begin work on the Garden (-1 Econ, +1 Stability, starts megaproject)

Choose a trade mission target (-1 Diplo)
[] Highland Kingdom
[] Metal Workers
[] Thunder Horse
[] Xohyssiri
[] No one (No cost)
 
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Megaproject Completed!
Ancient Saltern
Gives an initial bonus to Econ, +1 Diplomacy every turn until the invention of currency, grants access to the Salt Gift action, and the Saltern extended project action, when acceptable sites for construction or expansion can be found

Holy shit, a single turn and we completed a mega project. :D
 
[X] Expand Carrion Eaters (-1 Econ, -1 Mysticism, +1 Martial, many more Carrion Eaters, additional effects)
Eat their eyes and tell me what they saw!

[X] Thunder Horse
Because I like them more.
 
The fact that the faction titled metal workers discovered something interesting makes me intensely curious because it is possible if unlikely that it's bronze.
 
Definitely want more carrion eaters to further cement the need for medical specialists in our society. Also-we need to grab Southshore now, no ifs ands or buts. It's not like there isn't decent odds of one turning the Gardens anyways.

[X] Expand Carrion Eaters (-1 Econ, -1 Mysticism, +1 Martial, many more Carrion Eaters, additional effects)
[X] Metal Workers
 
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Choose an Econ action
[X] Begin work on the Garden (-1 Econ, starts megaproject)
Choose a trade mission target (-1 Diplo)
[X] Metal Workers
 
[x] Expand Carrion Eaters (-1 Econ, -1 Mysticism, +1 Martial, many more Carrion Eaters, additional effects)

More doctors is always good.

[] Metal Workers
[X] Xohyssiri

I am curious what these new insights are... On second though the dead priests have a lot of resources and we do not really hate them IC
 
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