[X] Shrooms
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
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- naruto rational rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard open voting
- Location
- UK
- Pronouns
- He/Him
It is not. HDK whether it is a clan secret because he's never heard of it.
- Location
- Texas
[X] Action Plan: Fine, I'll Do It Myself No Answer Key
I kinda think we should research seals that let us move rift to Leaf. That way we can delve at our leisure
- Location
- The Maple Syrup Mountains
That'd certainly be a great solution... if we can do it.
We'd need to either develop rift-moving sealtech and then manually drag the rift over from O'Uzu to Leaf, or develop a way to permanently close the O'Uzu rift after developing a way to make a new rift at a location of our choosing.
Both of these tasks seem only maybe possible with Jounin-tier or even Jiraiya-tier sealmastery. "Move an active rift" could be viable with a bit of veterancy or it could be completely beyond us until we're scraping against the Sage's own works. Same with the seals necessary for making a new rift and permanently sealing up the old one.
(Not to mention, the expected Akatsuki response to "the rift scar is no longer there" probably contains some measure of "interrogate Hazou and Kagome in case they had something to do with it", so we'd need some way to survive that)
I don't say this to shoot the idea down, though. Fundamentally none of our plans are more reliable than 'maybe', and we're gonna have to commit to one with pretty much only the information we have now. We could focus on Pure Lands exploration, developing seals to negate the Path Drain and hoping the first people of note we find are helpful to our cause. (Really, we have no reason to expect to stumble across one person first instead of anyone else: best to look for anyone who might be a help and then see who we find first). We could focus on moving the rift to remove the Akatsuki timer (with provisos listed above). We could try to trap Akatsuki in the Pure Lands or otherwise overpower them (which runs into the main problem of "how exactly do we manage to overpower Akatsuki without compromising our control of the rift?").
None of our options are good, but we're gonna have to pick one and stick with it. If rift-relocation is a 'maybe' when we're focusing our attention on it, it's even worse odds if we do it in our spare time between Pure Lands dives. We don't know how much time we have before Akatsuki waltz up with their own solution, which means we have to assume we don't have enough time to fully explore all our options.
Personally, I'm in favour of Pure Lands exploration. It seems to me to have the fewest variables standing between it and some form of success, and poses the opportunity to snowball in strength as we find allies and loop them into our cause. Untested sealtech projects like warding off the Path Drain would be useful but not strictly necessary for the success of the project, meaning even in worse timelines we still have a shot at success. I personally think that the Pein route is workable, but I also think that if we find Jiraiya first our options expand tremendously.
(Say, wouldn't it be nifty if we rezzed Pein only to put him in a medical coma? Stuck in the Elemental Nations where Akatsuki can't rez him, forcing them to fruitlessly explore the Pure Lands forever? That's the kind of stuff we could probably pull off with Jiraiya backing us.)
I hesitate to make narrative arguments in something as important as this, but I would be remiss to neglect the fact that Pure Lands exploration is also by far the coolest route we could commit to. Instead of re-opening the rift and then going back to Leaf and tinkering with seals again, we're exploring an alien and hostile environment with minimal support structures all while facing a persistent desperation borne of the fact that if we don't succeed hard enough we may just lose everything. Legit, that sounds cooler than the "BotG 2" route even if we could pull that off.
But overall, I just think it has the highest potential as a route. It's not save-or-suck like betting on a research project being viable, and it doesn't put us in the contradiction of needing to raise enough power to openly fight Akatsuki while also keeping secret enough that we can control the rift afterwards. There's a land of infinite possibility out there, a route that can adjust on the fly to take advantage of opportunities as they emerge, and multiple viable routes to success just from what we already know, let alone what we'll discover as we progress. We'll have to commit to a route sooner or later, without knowing much more than we do now, and I know what I'm voting for.
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- He/Him
Except for the part where there's only a single exit, the Akatsuki know exactly where it is, and they can also tell if it's been activated, so they can just camp out and gank us the minute we step back out.
Unless we can create a new exit or move the current one or something I really don't see us avoiding a confrontation with them immediately upon exiting. We don't know how long exploring would take and I really don't believe Ami when she says we can keep all of them distracted for a month, which imo isn't enough time anyways.
Given how good Hazou is at Sealing and hopefully with a pinch more veterancy, I could totally see Hazou developing these seals BEFORE reinflating it. There are other rifts to test on too. From what we know the really hard part is targeting correctly, not doing rift stuff in general.
You said you prefer your route because it isn't save or suck but hoping that Pain is cooperative with us in a way we find acceptable feels very much like a save or suck situation imo. If he isn't cooperative we can't do anything about it anymore, the world is not strong enough to beat a unified Akatsuki with Pain.
I agree this is a pretty big concern. There's not a great way to hide either, even camping on the 7th Path wouldn't necessarily protect us if Kisame and Itachi can beat Cannai. This is part of why we pitched killing just a few Akatsuki to Ami, they travel in pairs so if we could take down just a few that could be enough to stay safe. But that obviously has issues as well, one does not simply assassinate an S ranker. If they escape our trap we've got bigger problems.
Alternatively Hazou sabotage them subtly enough for them not to notice. Make the rift shrink more and more over time until it's gone so it looks like it happened naturally and so on. Sealing is the one field where Hazou might actually pull the wool over an essie's eyes.
Another idea I've just had that we haven't discussed afaik is to rez Pain but on the condition we stab out his eyes before returning him to the world. If his sage powers prevent Naraka from weakening him then this isn't viable but if he is weakened he kinda has to cooperate with us up until he's back in the human world. Akatsuki could still have their glorious leader but without the godlike power. He may even find it reasonable idk.
EDIT: also, we really need to bring all this up with Kagome too. He may have some ideas on which option is the most feasible.
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- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Someone pointed out that this has gone missing and it was so utterly beautiful. The physical painting is something I treasure, and I wonder if you still have the original image files around? If you'd be willing to link it somewhere I'm happy to be responsible for hosting it.
- Location
- The Soviet Republic of Canuckistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Wayback might have something but Imgur is straight up deleting content not associated with an active account.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Wtf... well time to save all the remaining ones to disk ig
- Location
- Texas
Check to see if anyone posted it in the discord? If they posted the image and not the image link, then there should be an alternate saved on Discord's end.
- Location
- The Maple Syrup Mountains
I suppose this is why the Mori sisters recommended the Pein route so much: if we walk out of the rift with Pein in our group, there won't be a fight at all.
But also, I feel there might be some room to open the seal, go in, and then close the rift (as in, return it to a rift scar) so that our presence is undetectable. In that way we can be in and out of the rift site in about an hour, and then come back in a month or two to rez anyone we've brought back to the rift site. We might need to invent a 'deflate a rift' seal first but that feels very likely to be possible since it's something rifts already do by themselves. In this way we can possibly ensure our deadline is only "how long until Sasori finishes his project?" at which point the O'Uzu site will be occupied no matter what we do.
I'll be honest, what I was stressing there wasn't "leave the rift open and go do other things" but "get the means to do necromancy but then stay home and tinker on more seals and just kinda hope we get success faster than Sasori catches up to our 'can do necromancy at all' level". The "sealing route" differs from the "Pure Lands exploration route" in that we turn it all into a big waiting game where we hope certain seals are possible within a reasonable timeframe and hope Sasori's slow enough that we don't find the Akatsuki camping out at O'Uzu by the time we finally think we're ready.
That's what I meant by 'save or suck' earlier, to be clear: we're betting on the seals being possible and easy enough that we can complete them before we lose the race. That's either true or it's not true, and we don't know until we've already committed to that route. If we're wrong? We lose, simple as that.
But that's the thing: we don't have to rez Pein. I mean, mix that with the above point about how having Pein with us completely negates any exit Akatsuki risk and yeah, it's very tempting. But I don't think it's the only way forward here. I outlined a plan for how we might buy enough time to do some exploration and rezzing without being attacked by Akatsuki on the way out if we're fast enough, and in that time we could plausibly gather enough power to enact something like the "BotG 2 route" only with everyone involved being already clued-in about necromancy because we rezzed them ourselves.
Ultimately this route does come down to "if circumstances are unfavourable and we don't get the luck we need we lose" like the others, but it's still the route that I think has the most potential for success. Trying to relocate the rift is either possible or it isn't and in the very plausible world where it isn't we just lose, straight-up, no consolation prize or way to salvage the situation, it's just over. And, yeah, even if we pull it off that doesn't spell out a win condition in and of itself when the Akatsuki have their own agency too.
Yeah, like, this is the kind of reason I think the Pure Lands exploration has the most potential. If things don't fit together quite right we have room to shake out some sort of compromise, adapt our plans to fit the changing circumstances, take advantage of opportunities we didn't expect beforehand. There's a route to success and room to adapt if it doesn't go perfectly, instead of a route to "Akatsuki punching your face in unless you pull a second genius move out of your hat" and room to completely fail with no hope of recourse. Any route is viable if everything goes according to plan, but only the Pure Lands exploration route lets us fix a strategy that isn't going according to plan.
(Also, didn't have a good place to mention this, but if we walk out of the rift and Akatsuki's right there, they might let us go free. They just care about themselves having access to the Pure Lands to get Pein back, after all, so it might be fine to let us go free with our loved ones as long as we don't/can't intrude on their plans. Far from ideal because it means Pein comes back in all his glory, but it's not strictly a lose condition. And hey, with the Nagi Island seal gone there might not even be a second worldwide brainwashing ritual!)
I understand why people are skeptical of the A-day plan. It's the kind of overcomplicated bullshit that could never work. But fellas, it's Ami's overcomplicated bullshit. She's a mary sue, she's favored by the QMs, she can make it work. The Mori have been called the 'voice of the QMs', and if they think something as insane as A-day is a good idea, I'm willing to believe them.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
@Paperclipped spent a minute or six figuring out the amount of time and chakra that is getting put into Gōketsu training. Behold!
WHOOSH Training Schedules
- Hazou goes to the Forest of Death early in the morning with Noburi.
- Hazou tops off from Noburi (+15 CP), and makes 6 Shadow Clones (each with 2 CP, leaving Hazou with 3 CP).
- Noburi tops off each of the 6 Shadow Clones to 240 CP (1428 CP)
- Noburi tops off Hazou to half (147 CP).
- Noburi CP spent: 1590.
- Noburi returns to the Gouketsu estate and fully taps the koi pond (which holds around 1600 CP), leaving Noburi full.
- Kei comes to the Gouketsu estate.
- She drops off Snowflake, leaving her with 63 CP and Snowflake with 62 CP.
- Noburi and Kei go to the Forest of Death.
- Noburi tops off Kei to 315 CP (252 CP).
- Kei creates 6 Shadow Clones (each with 2 CP, leaving Kei with 3 CP).
- Noburi tops off each of the 6 Shadow Clones to 240 CP, except for one which is only topped off to 160 CP (1348 CP).
- Noburi tops off Kei to half (147 CP).
- Noburi CP spent: 1747 CP.
- The team trains together for a bit (Noburi is so low on chakra that he cannot train effectively here), then comes home with their real bodies, leaving the SCs in the Forest of Death to SC train for the rest of the day.
- Noburi hires a mission for a dozen genin to drain, in order to refill his chakra reserves.
- Noburi does his own training, making sure to end with at least 400 CP in his barrel.
- In the early evening, Noburi taps the koi pond again, filling his reserves up.
- Noburi and Mari go out to the Forest of Death.
- Mari makes an unknown number of clones (Noburi is sworn to secrecy) and Noburi fills them up.
- Noburi returns home almost dry.
- Noburi hires a mission for a dozen genin to drain, in order to refill his chakra reserves.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Is there an actual reason for this to be the case beyond Mari and/or the QMs trolling :HazouLook:
Noburi restricts himself to joking complaints.
- Location
- United States
Must. Resist. Sex. Joke.
...why is Noburi sworn to secrecy?
I understand not wanting to give us Mari's charsheet, but "Hazou must never know even the slightest detail of how far Mari is progressing" seems really weird.
I understand not wanting to give us Mari's charsheet, but "Hazou must never know even the slightest detail of how far Mari is progressing" seems really weird.
Stuffing ballots at the 'slept with a kage' club meetings. SC Maris are outliers and should not be counted.
- Location
- London
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They/Them
Plausible deniability? Hazou can say honestly that, to his knowledge, Mari is devoting the full scope of her abilities toward the betterment of Leaf.
The clones only need to spend 80 CP to get the benefit of training so why don't we top them up less to use less chakra?
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80 per training block?
Oh yeah this is right. 240 cp would be the minimum then.