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I have no problem sharing FOOM when Hazou is already S-Rank, although thousands of S-Rankers is never going to happen. But I bet we could get dozens, maybe a hundred. The problem is that without overwhelming might first, Hazou is not going to lead these ninja. He will simply be brushed aside by whoever can take him. That's how these things always go. Sharing FOOM like that virtually guarantees someone like Orochimaru will end up outscaling Team Uplift. That would be vastly worse than not sharing it at all.

I agree that preventing malefactors from accessing FOOM is incredibly important once we start teaching others how to FOOM. I am in favor of finding candidates who truly share in and advance Uplift as an ideology and as a life style and then giving them FOOM, like selecting candidates for Captain America.

I'd like to limit it only to our clanmates and ninja we have adopted in our compound, but each candidate has to have the Hokage's approval to learn SC before they can FOOM in the first place. There's no way we can expand our FOOM capable minions without alerting the tower that we are using SC for something, especially if we want to teach it to otherwise unremarkable ninjas who then start to grow more rapidly, even for having SC.

The Nara probably already know about FOOM from Kei anyway. If anyone could run the numbers on FOOM's potential IC it would be them. It would be ironic if we go to all of the trouble of hiding FOOM when Shikamaru has already told Asuma how FOOM could work.

I think it makes sense for villages to commission up to A-Rank missions from each other, at least in the form of "take out a hit on X target not-an-S-Ranker-or-jonin-squad". The goal is to convert money into dead or neutralized enemies somehow, and taking out hits isn't individually necessary to state survival but adds up in the long term - a perfect candidate for monetization.

People aren't this perfectly rational for this to be the complete answer on its own. Given enough bounties eventually grudges will form between villages as clans associate certain foreigners with hunting down their loved ones. Under this system alliances would slowly yet naturally form between villages A and B since they each assign missions to kill village C's operatives. Village C then reaches out to Village D for mutual defense and the pattern continues until there are no greedy unaligned villages left (some villages might choose to stay neutral despite the possible revenue like Isan did).

MfD power dynamics are weird because power does not primarily come from levies, proper military equipment and training, stockpiled provisions, and logistical manpower, but by how fast people can rap in sign language and other esoteric skills. Commerce might be the means by which the villages interact somewhat peaceably with one another, but no amount of cash will save you when an enemy refuses to barter. Villages will put more value on forces that will not abandon them when money can no longer be a factor in dissuading a threat.

The temptation for villages to engage in false flag operations and sabotage against one another seems too high to me for financial A-list mission webs to fully spread across the Elemental Nations. Village A could have a lucrative business relationship with Village B. However, if the reward is high enough and if Village B has become too trusting Village A could very easily make it appear as though Village C and/or D caused harm to Village B as Village A takes all of the spoils for themselves.

Furthermore, how can one village prove to another that a bounty has been successfully carried out for compensation? Bodies are valuable in and of themselves for bloodline secrets (as ick as that sounds) so handing them over means losing out on valuable research. The level of brutality involved in ninja combat also makes it hard to recover enough identifying features for a positive ID. Jiraiya detonated all of his explosive seals at once when he knew he was going to die. Clan ninja especially most likely have measures in place so that their bodies do not fall into enemy hands.

Moreover I stand by my position that we have yet to make FOOM actually look enticing. If you look at our growth we've actually slowed down as we dropped everything to grind FOOM stats, and we have only a hunch in-character that mental fortitude can grow without limit and allow us to reach absurd XP rates.

If we share FOOM now (never mind that it's useless in the timeframe of the current war) odds are Asuma will tell us he'll keep an eye on our progress and recommend it to Leaf's jounin if it turns out well. If we wait until the end of detour 1 we can make a stronger case that it's actually value (we'll only have about broken even at the end of detour 1 so we won't have skyrocketed in growth but we'd be able to assemble a much better pitch) and if we wait until the end of detour 2 it should be clear that FOOM is a game-changer, but if we sold it at the earliest possible opportunity (i.e. right after WWIV ends because, again, FOOM is useless in the timeframe of this war) I don't think we could convince Asuma of anything more than 'sounds impressive if everything goes as you say, keep me in the loop'.

Then we can argue for a case study with Asuma's approval (provided the needs of the war are not too pressing, which they very well might be). We take a selection of (heavily preferably all Uplift aligned, trusted Goketsu) ninja who are barely able to learn SC and are not needed in the field any time soon and then separate them into a control group, SC but no FOOM instruction group, and a FOOM group. If the FOOM groups proves our timetables for accelerating gains we can then argue for the right to teach any Leaf ninja we deem worthy FOOM to better empower Leaf's future forces. We do not necessarily have to explain the inner working of FOOM, only that we believe we have a way to improve SC bonuses. We can probably manage that much of a favor out of Asuma since we temporarily resolved our Oro issues without his explicit help and he still feels remorseful about that.

So, if FOOM!Asuma decides to murder Rock to the last ninja, what are we going to do?

EDIT: Or Cloud too, if he decides to feel extra angry that particular day.

"For the same reason why you couldn't pass judgment on Orochimaru. You would alienate too large of a portion of Leaf's S-rank population."

As @Inferno Vulpix noted we will have some time before FOOM is accepted as valid by Leaf authorities. By the time Asuma himself sees the benefits of FOOM we will already have plenty of Uplift believing S-rankers supporting us.
 
Nothing has changed with regards to selling FOOM. It's still a terrible idea to consider until we are already S-rank and then we are ready to make our play anyways so no huge point
 
Try to talk him into just murdering the jounin and up. Then offering the rest of their ninja passage to the eastern continent. I suspect we could get away with that. Tbh I ain't too sorry about it either. The leaders of Rock deserve it, and the younger ninja didn't choose this war, but we can't trust them not to make trouble later.

That is exactly the problem with giving up FOOM. "Try to talk your Kage out of mass murder" isn't exactly...a good plan. Especially because he's emotionally motivated in killing Rock, and possibly the other villages. Add to that the fact that Asuma is probably among the better ninja in Leaf and we can see the problem with selling FOOM.

I agree that preventing malefactors from accessing FOOM is incredibly important once we start teaching others how to FOOM. I am in favor of finding candidates who truly share in and advance Uplift as an ideology and as a life style and then giving them FOOM, like selecting candidates for Captain America.

I'd like to limit it only to our clanmates and ninja we have adopted in our compound, but each candidate has to have the Hokage's approval to learn SC before they can FOOM in the first place. There's no way we can expand our FOOM capable minions without alerting the tower that we are using SC for something, especially if we want to teach it to otherwise unremarkable ninjas who then start to grow more rapidly, even for having SC.

With what authority exactly? Asuma can just order to help the ninja he selects and no one can refuse the orders of the Hokage, especially if FOOM is not a clan secret, that is not.

"For the same reason why you couldn't pass judgment on Orochimaru. You would alienate too large of a portion of Leaf's S-rank population."

What S-rankers?
Oro would be happy to have that much bodies. Naruto would probably back Asuma after the collapse. Tsunade doesn't care enough to oppose as the War meeting shows. And we are not S-rankers. More importantly, if he has FOOM, he decides who gets to be S-ranker/EJonin.

EDIT: If you mean us, it means we are strong enough to force Leaf to follow our policies and therefore selling FOOM is useless, because we already reached our objective regarding Leaf. It's just selling FOOM for the sake of selling FOOM.
 
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I am in favor of finding candidates who truly share in and advance Uplift as an ideology and as a life style and then giving them FOOM, like selecting candidates for Captain America.

I'd like to limit it only to our clanmates and ninja we have adopted in our compound, but each candidate has to have the Hokage's approval to learn SC before they can FOOM in the first place. There's no way we can expand our FOOM capable minions without alerting the tower that we are using SC for something, especially if we want to teach it to otherwise unremarkable ninjas who then start to grow more rapidly, even for having SC.
The problem is that in a world like MfD these people don't necessarily exist. Uplift-aligned people aren't really a thing outside of Hazou and a few close followers. Closest thing is Rock Lee, which has its own problems........

I don't think we have a single good candidate right now. Look at Haru. He's a strong ninja, but his version of Uplift is not aligned with Hazou's. We can raise academy students to follow Uplift, or we can trust people of dubious utility function. Those are pretty much the options right now.
That is exactly the problem with giving up FOOM. "Try to talk your Kage out of mass murder" isn't exactly...a good plan. Especially because he's emotionally motivated in killing Rock, and possibly the other villages. Add to that the fact that Asuma is probably among the better ninja in Leaf and we can see the problem with selling FOOM.
I actually really think Asuma would listen here. He gets to kill the real culprits, he ends Rock as a threat, and he doesn't need to slaughter of a bunch of basically helpless genin and chunin. Asuma is a good guy at heart, and I think he's going to be a good Hokage, if he was as strong as the 3rd most of our current problems would not exist.
 
Given a few years, I'd be happy to share it with Shika, Ino, and Choji.

Speaking of Choji, we should get more screentime with him. Dude's a bro.
 
I actually really think Asuma would listen here. He gets to kill the real culprits, he ends Rock as a threat, and he doesn't need to slaughter of a bunch of basically helpless genin and chunin. Asuma is a good guy at heart, and I think he's going to be a good Hokage, if he was as strong as the 3rd most of our current problems would not exist.

On one hand, he's a good guy at heart, on the other he lost a lot of friends to Rock, and i mean a lot. Those genins and chunin? In his mind are nits that will become lice with time, killing more Leaf-nin. My model of Asuma is that he's nice, yes, but he still a ninja born in ninja world with the relevant values. If he could kill every single ninja in Cloud and Rock, he probably would.
At the end of the day, nice ninjas are still ninja, unless you are someone like Nagato,Hazou or Akane, that truly understand what Uplift is and what it means. IMHO.
 
In canon Naruto, it is lightweight, extremely tough, and has the unique property of being "unaffected by any and all chakra-based attacks."
Citation needed.

even though the main characters have long since grown too strong for it to threaten them directly….
Citation needed.

Please delete this post. You posted in "Story-Only."
 
narutofanon.fandom.com

Chakra Metal

Chakra Metal (チャクラ金属, Chakura Kinzoku) is a unique ore found in rare deposits in the Land of Shade. It is used by the smiths of the Murakami Clan in the forging of Murakami Swords. Chakra metal is silver in color. Chakra metal is a substance which is lightweight, yet is extremely tough, and as...
"QM had fun" bonus: 0 Sigh. I'm not going to, but I really should put a gazillion-point penalty here for forcing me to admit that writing punching is no fun anymore because you guys have outgrown all the normal threats and it's difficult to justify throwing level-appropriate stuff at you. I guess I'll have to learn to enjoy...*gags*...politics and romance. :sadbird:
There you go!
 
What does Cannai know about Icha Icha
Presumably Kakashi mentioned it at some point, and then you told him about the line here.

Is it possible to learn a Seventh Path Element such as Metal if we meet all the other conditions?
HDK, but he's not aware of any past ninja with those elements.

The Nara probably already know about FOOM from Kei anyway. If anyone could run the numbers on FOOM's potential IC it would be them. It would be ironic if we go to all of the trouble of hiding FOOM when Shikamaru has already told Asuma how FOOM could work.
You declared FOOM a clan secret. She is legally obligated not to share it. EDIT: It's complicated. See subsequent discussion.
 
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There's been some discussion in Discord about how people think it was dumb for the Sage Mode conversation to happen in front of the family instead of only in front of Team Uplift. There was nothing in the plan either way so I made the choice of "they are trying to act like family and include these people" but if that's not actually where the wind blows then I'm happy to retcon that. Quick poll:

  • [SageMode] Keep it to a subset of Team Uplift only. (Hazō, Noburi, Keiko, Mari, Akane)
  • [SageMode] Keep it to full Team Uplift only. (Hazō, Noburi, Keiko, Mari, Akane, Kagome)
  • [SageMode] These people are family. Let's treat them as such. (All Gōketsu ninja including Haru, Atomu, Rei, etc)
  • [SageMode] Write in the names of the Gōketsu you want to have at the table for this conversation.
Voting ends tomorrow (Tuesday) at noon Eastern.
 
[X]: [SageMode] Keep it to full Team Uplift only. (Hazō, Noburi, Keiko, Mari, Akane, Kagome)
 
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I can vote for
  • [SageMode] These people are family. Let's treat them as such. (All Gōketsu ninja including Haru, Atomu, Rei, etc)
With the caveat that anyone who isn't sure if they can maintain infosec voluntarily removes themselves? I imagine this will just be Kagome but still. I'd like to give everyone the *option* of knowing.
 
[X] [SageMode] These people are family. Let's treat them as such. (All Gōketsu ninja including Haru, Atomu, Rei, etc)

Even if y'all don't see them as family, we didn't learn enough that they could use in an actionable way anyways tbh. Like, "nature chakra exists, humans can use it, you need Sannin level chakra reserves to even think about trying" isn't exactly something that most anyone can act upon in any real capacity.
 
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That is the fanon wiki.
Fine.
naruto.fandom.com

Chakra Blade

A chakra blade is a type of weapon that a user can flow their chakra into, giving the weapon additional properties. There have been different types of chakra blades wielded by different ninja. Asuma Sarutobi's style of combat specialises in the use of chakra blades. His are uniquely-designed...
I have never actually read/watched Naruto so I have no idea what's actually canon or a reliable source. I think you made a ranking at one point but I can't find that post for the life of me.
 
[X] [SageMode] Keep it to full Team Uplift only. (Hazō, Noburi, Keiko, Mari, Akane, Kagome)
 
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I can vote for
  • [SageMode] These people are family. Let's treat them as such. (All Gōketsu ninja including Haru, Atomu, Rei, etc)
With the caveat that anyone who isn't sure if they can maintain infosec voluntarily removes themselves? I imagine this will just be Kagome but still. I'd like to give everyone the *option* of knowing.

[SageMode] These people are family. Let's treat them as such. (All Gōketsu ninja including Haru, Atomu, Rei, etc)

Even if y'all don't see them as family, we didn't learn enough that they could use in an actionable way anyways tbh. Like, "nature chakra exists, humans can use it, you need Sannin level chakra reserves to even think about trying" isn't exactly something that most anyone can act upon in any real capacity.

[SageMode] Keep it to full Team Uplift only. (Hazō, Noburi, Keiko, Mari, Akane, Kagome)

[SageMode] Keep it to full Team Uplift only. (Hazō, Noburi, Keiko, Mari, Akane, Kagome)


need to add an [X]: to have your votes show up in the counter
 
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You declared FOOM a clan secret. She is legally obligated not to share it
Broadly, a clan secret is any information unique to your clan that could not be realistically acquired by a third party without stealing it from your clan. This includes Bloodline Limit secrets, and anything developed by your clan (e.g. ninjutsu or seals) that has not been shared outside it. Note that only actual designs are protected, not ideas. Skywalkers were a clan secret before you shared them. "Seals that let you walk on air" wouldn't have been, and anyone inventing their own seal that lets them walk on air would not have been stealing a clan secret. In the event of an accusation, the Hokage would have experts compare the inventors' notes to determine whether any plagiarism had taken place.

As a corollary, FOOM is unlikely to pass muster as a clan secret, because every jōnin in Leaf who knows the Shadow Clone Technique now also knows about spamming powerful ninjutsu with chakra replenishment, and you'd have to convince the Hokage that none of them could have come up with the idea on their own.
Is Kei not aware that FOOM probably doesn't even qualify as a clan secret? It seems to me like she has a way out of her "legal obligation not to share" if she so desired.
 
That's my point. The canon wiki does not contain the specific information I asked for a citation for, and nor do the references it cites. Hence, it is fanon and not even indirectly relevant to MfD.
Huh, you're right. I could have sworn that the information you quoted was there but I was actually thinking of the "can serve as a source for the user's elemental techniques" bit. That's my bad.

It's interesting that I'm much better at finding MfD canon by searching through your rulings than I am at finding actual canon that has dedicated wikis.
 
Is Kei not aware that FOOM probably doesn't even qualify as a clan secret? It seems to me like she has a way out of her "legal obligation not to share" if she so desired.
Note that "Is Kei legally able to share it?", "Would Kei share it?", and "Would Kei get away with sharing it?" are all separate questions conditioned by different factors.
 
The Nara probably already know about FOOM from Kei anyway. If anyone could run the numbers on FOOM's potential IC it would be them. It would be ironic if we go to all of the trouble of hiding FOOM when Shikamaru has already told Asuma how FOOM could work.
The idea that Kei would actively defect this hard from uplift is laughable
 
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