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RHUNRIKKI STROLLAR (Warhammer Fantasy Golden Age Dwarf Runelord Quest)

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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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BelligerentGnu said:
Also, random lore question for anyone who might know: is there any actual difference in meaning between "Karak", "Karag", and "Kraka"?
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To my best knowledge, I think it could be one or maybe even both of two things.

A. Different terms for mountains, similar to Gold. Which makes sense well enough given how important Mountains are. What they could mean however idk, ask someone like BoneyM.

B. Regional dialect. Which is flimsier given how tradition bound dwarfs are. We know they exist from canonical sources, but the question is whether Golden Age Dawi are old enough to have diverged like that. As of RN in quest I can maybe imagine Zorn and the more southernly Karaks having a dialect/accent or slightly different, archaic word choice, but yeah.

At least IC anyway. OOC, I'm like 90% sure a lot of this is cuz GW writers arent consistent. Then again a language like English isn't either so whatdaya gonna do? :^V
 
[X][Purification]: Weapon
[X][Elgi]: A figure in a fine dress that smells of high summer.

Let's NOT start Snorri off meeting the Smuggest Elves To Ever Smug thank you very much.
 
Going by Grudgelore's Lexicon:

Karak = Enduring
Karag = Barren Mountain / Volcano
Karaz = Mountain

But as I've complained about before, in Khazalid the meaning of words change depending on context and signifiers*. Add that most canon holds either have "Karak" meaning "hold" or have simplified their names for humans, which I admit is also an option.

* And don't even get me started on grammar rules. As much as Snorri complaints about elves, people living in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
 
BelligerentGnu said:
Right, thank you both.
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You're certainly welcome.

Dutch said:
Going by Grudgelore's Lexicon:

Karak = Enduring
Karag = Barren Mountain / Volcano
Karaz = Mountain

But as I've complained about before, in Khazalid the meaning of words change depending on context and signifiers*. Add that most canon holds either have "Karak" meaning "hold" or have simplified their names for humans, which I admit is also an option.
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Which makes Karaz Ankor, the...Mountain Realm? Kingdom? Something like that, makes sense.

* And don't even get me started on grammar rules. As much as Snorri complaints about elves, people living in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
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BAH! As if a dwarf would make a house so shoddy a simple stone would break it, glass or not! :p
 
soulcake said:
To my best knowledge, I think it could be one or maybe even both of two things.

A. Different terms for mountains, similar to Gold. Which makes sense well enough given how important Mountains are. What they could mean however idk, ask someone like BoneyM.

B. Regional dialect. Which is flimsier given how tradition bound dwarfs are. We know they exist from canonical sources, but the question is whether Golden Age Dawi are old enough to have diverged like that. As of RN in quest I can maybe imagine Zorn and the more southernly Karaks having a dialect/accent or slightly different, archaic word choice, but yeah.

At least IC anyway. OOC, I'm like 90% sure a lot of this is cuz GW writers arent consistent. Then again a language like English isn't either so whatdaya gonna do? :^V
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Karag is a mountain; Karak is a proper mountain-hold (including all of its construction). For example, a random mountain on the World's Edge Mountains would be called a Karag, whereas the entirety of the mountain Karak Kadrin is built into, including the city-state constructed inside of it, is a Karak.

So, for example, Karak Eight Peaks, which is rather unique in that it is a Karak comprised of eight mountains and the construction inside and outside of them, has eight Karags (eight mountains) with a bunch of construction in and around them, but when you put that all together, it's a Karak.

A Karak is just as much the city and infrastructure built into the mountain as it is the mountain itself.

And I thought that Kraka meant "hoard". Which would make Kraka Drakk unique in terms of naming (much like Barak Varr is); Kraka Drakk meaning "Dragon's Hoard" makes sense because it was founded literally on a dragon's hoard; using "Kraka" for other holds in Norsca wouldn't really make sense.
 
Canon flips Karaz and Karak around whenever it pleases.

The in-universe explanation given for this is that despite having different signifiers for physical things and abstract things (-az and -ak respectively). However Dwarfs consider some abstract things to be physical things and vice versa.

So in short. Do whatever you like, GW sure does.
 
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DevilsAdvocate said:
So what does Kraka mean?
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Who knows, canon doesn't really give an answer.

Just consider it the northern version of Karak. Chalking it up to linguistic drift is the easy answer.

Deuterium Dawn said:
That...makes sense but is also somewhat confusing. Seems perfectly legit for a language.
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Mate. This is Khazalid. The language that goes subject-verb-object, unless pronunciation says otherwise... Or tradition... or the importance of the word in question, especially if the word is so important that is has to be mentioned twice! Once at the start of the sentence and once in its proper place in the sentence.

And damn the Werit who mixes up his signifiers!
 
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MrHobbit said:
648 B.P. Snorri Klausson born

576 B.P. Oggra Iggunsdottir is born

567 B.P. Bara Kormasdottir is born

565 B.P. Brynna Kargasdottir is born

558 B.P. Sven Hogrisson is born

486 B.P. Vragni Svaltsson is born

480 B.P. Snorri takes Jargrim as his first Apprentice

433 B.P. Skjol and Skegg Borsson are born

383 B.P. Dwalin Hurgarsson is born

378 B.P. Iggun Marasdottir is born

328 B.P. Lorna Dernasdottir is born, Valma Hildasdottir is born
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So, I updated the Timeline! I said that I wouldn't do it until next week, but it seems that I lied! So while I was finishing the timeline, I noticed this. Fifty percent of the North's Runelords are younger than Snorri's first apprentice. It sorta puts into perspective how old Snorri is.

Also, I want opinions if I should leave the timeline in the past tense or change it to present tense. For example, Snorri Klauson was born vs Snorri Klauson is born. I am fairly certain that the timeline isn't completely one or the other, as the quote above indicates.

Edit: I forgot, should I include everything our fellow Runelords do? Like how Bara poked us for Adamant and Dwalin crafted the taunting horn.
 
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Dutch said:
Canon flips Karaz and Karak around whenever it pleases.

The in-universe explanation given for this is that despite having different signifiers for physical things and abstract things (-az and -ak respectively). However Dwarfs consider some abstract things to be physical things and vice versa.

So in short. Do whatever you like, GW sure does.
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Karaz could be used with regards to the policy of a Hold (a state putting into action an ephemeral thing), and Karak could be used with regards to the physical bits, as mentioned previously.
 
Deuterium Dawn said:
BAH! As if a dwarf would make a house so shoddy a simple stone would break it, glass or not! :p
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Glass is, after all, just very homogenous stone cast from a delicately formulated molten state. Fragile stone, transparent or not? A dwarf wouldn't be able to look his children in the eye ever again.

Though you could just use more glass. A brick of the stuff is actually stronger than granite by some metrics. In that case, a glass house would actually be an excellent defensive installation. You probably won't see much more than a dull glow at even high noon at those thicknesses but sacrifices must be made.
 
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MrHobbit said:
So, I updated the Timeline! I said that I wouldn't do it until next week, but it seems that I lied! So while I was finishing the timeline, I noticed this. Fifty percent of the North's Runelords are younger than Snorri's first apprentice. It sorta puts into perspective how old Snorri is.

Also, I want opinions if I should leave the timeline in the past tense or change it to present tense. For example, Snorri Klauson was born vs Snorri Klauson is born. I am fairly certain that the timeline isn't completely one or the other, as the quote above indicates.

Edit: I forgot, should I include everything our fellow Runelords do? Like how Bara poked us for Adamant and Dwalin crafted the taunting horn.
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Personally I prefer present, it gives a feeling of progression as you go along. As for the latter, I'd say yes for major stuff like you listed but I'm not the one doing all the work.
 
MrHobbit said:
So, I updated the Timeline! I said that I wouldn't do it until next week, but it seems that I lied! So while I was finishing the timeline, I noticed this. Fifty percent of the North's Runelords are younger than Snorri's first apprentice. It sorta puts into perspective how old Snorri is.
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I'm fairly sure this is because all the other runesmiths/lords of a similar age to snorri died when chaos invaded and we decided who'd be promoted into their spots
 
I have to wonder just how Valaya will take notice if Snerra manages to actually pull her project idea off. Because that is the sort of epic feat that probably gets the attention of an ancestor.
 
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