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Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

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Cavalier said:
Oh look we raced right in to a situation we didn't need to, and it backfired. If only someone could have foreseen this blatantly predictable course of events and warned us.

There were three days before anyone was due to die. That mean there were two days in which we could have cornered Homura and got her to cough up what she meant about the Sendai group not being blameless. Two days in which we could have used Mami's familiarity with the University group to establish peaceful contact with the other side. Two days in which the Mitikihara Group could have taken form as a strong unaligned block known to both sides, and approached them as mediators. Two days to set up circumstances by abusing timestop and Oriko's precognition to come up with a real plan. Also I guess two days in which to convince Homura and Orikio that Sabrina has some idea of what the hell she is doing.

Instead herp-derp gotta run right into combat right now and it'll totally be fine because the other side clearly won't take Sabrina leaping in to save the Sendai girls from them as hostility. Except well, Sakura certainly made sure they did. And we still don't know what the war is actually about.

It's also clear some people not only haven't learned anything from this but actively refuse to learn anything from experience.

The only thing left to do is try to recover from this complete Charlie Foxtrot. Getting the hell out of town is very advisable. Consolidating with the rest of the Sendai group and getting answers (if they don't just lie) is rather important before anything else can be done. Finding a means to approach the other side through some kind of neutral channel they trust should also be a priority. On the other hand we have to make sure the Sendai group and their allies actually want to stop the war. Since you know, they have clearly demonstrated that they have agency and will not do whatever the thread wants them to just because our plans rely on them reacting in a certain way.
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at this point I'm just going to say that any plan that was not well though out a " Leroy Jenkins Sayaka plan"
Also
Ugolino said:
You can say "Ugolino", you know. :rolleyes:

Two days in which both sides could call in reinforcements, injure each other, cause hilarious amounts of collateral, and generally burn even more bridges. Unacceptable.

And you're gloating early. It's still a situation in progress. Wait for something to go even vaguely wrong before jumping on the recrimination bandwagon.

Never mind that finding out what's going on is exactly what we're doing. Never mind that the plan is and always has been to get the Sendai group out, get answers, and get them on the same page before dealing with things with the others. No, clearly, every decision we've made in this Quest was a mistake that should never have happened and will cancel Christmas.
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WE COULD HAVE MADE A PLAN IN ONE OR TWO MORE DAYS BEFORE YOU HAD US BULL RUSHING IT AND MADE IT WORSE!
 
@Omegastar
@Cavalier

Instead of whinning, you could use your minds for actually, I don't know, brainstorm for a solution to the current situation. Or actually do something more constructive than opening fire to the thread who's actually voting, and participating.

'Cause you're not helping.

At all.
 
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Xexilf said:
Someone should make a witch-quest were we play an actual evil witch.
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I'll do it, if you guys want.

Also, I have to concur that we kind of fucked this up. I believe it's still salvageable though. The first thing to do is to neutralize the violence going down, including the Sendai girls (SAKURA) if they won't mellow the fuck out.
 
AuraTwilight said:
I'll do it, if you guys want.
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The problem with such a thing would be getting the balance right. People generally dont want to play complete monsters, and have some chances for positive interactons.
Although a witch thats pretty selfish but ina human-ish manner, and has recognized that being completly alone is unhappy, going to far will lead to retaliation, and instead of crush-kill-destroy prefers some things like huma luxury etc., may still leave possibility for nastyness and dicking over others without falling into the depravity pit.

But i dont claim to be that good at planning out quests, so if someone does this they likely should come up with their own ideas. just think somewhat carefully. And im not sure how much interest there would be, but i would play, likely.
 
Tam Lin said:
Speak for yourself. :p
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We murderd another 200 people in a creative way, tricked and ate magical Girl number 14, and ripped the tag of a matress...

You can have fun with such characters in the short term, but if you want htis more then a shrtlived deathorgy there likely needs to be more. Just some theoretical long term plans may not carry it by itself. Protagonits generally have to be admired, even if only by small bits.
 
Xexilf said:
We murderd another 200 people in a creative way, tricked and ate magical Girl number 14, and ripped the tag of a matress...

You can have fun with such characters in the short term, but if you want htis more then a shrtlived deathorgy there likely needs to be more. Just some theoretical long term plans may not carry it by itself. Protagonits generally have to be admired, even if only by small bits.
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In-universe reset button, then. We can be heroes in some timelines, villains in others.
 
I am kind of confused how it came to this, though. I'm honestly kind of curious. A lot of people were agreeing that just rushing wasn't the best idea. In fact, I distinctly remember Muramasa getting annoyed at Ugolino for wanting to run head first into this clusterfuck when Akiko asked Sabrina if she was okay with cleansing them. I think someone even made a joke about Leeroy Jenkins. Then suddenly, everyone changes their minds and now we're here getting angry at Sakura for breaking a clone's spine and ruining our plans for diplomacy.

Edited:

Okay, never mind. It was because no one wanted the Sendai girls to come over here and bring the war to Mitakihara.
 
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Agent Whiskers said:
I am kind of confused how it came to this, though. I'm honestly kind of curious. A lot of people were agreeing that just rushing wasn't the best idea. In fact, I distinctly remember Muramasa getting annoyed at Ugolino for wanting to run head first into this clusterfuck when Akiko asked Sabrina if she was okay with cleansing them. I think someone even made a joke about Leeroy Jenkins. Then suddenly, everyone changes their minds and now we're here getting angry at Sakura for breaking a clone's spine and ruining our plans for diplomacy.
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Welcome to PMAS :V
 
It changed when Oriko said they'll be porting in Mitakihara the next day, and Homura decided she'll be part of the welcoming committee while placing a gun in front of her.
 
Agent Whiskers said:
I am kind of confused how it came to this, though. I'm honestly kind of curious. A lot of people were agreeing that just rushing wasn't the best idea. In fact, I distinctly remember Muramasa getting annoyed at Ugolino for wanting to run head first into this clusterfuck when Akiko asked Sabrina if she was okay with cleansing them. I think someone even made a joke about Leeroy Jenkins. Then suddenly, everyone changes their minds and now we're here getting angry at Sakura for breaking a clone's spine and ruining our plans for diplomacy.
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For me, the "angry at Sakura" bit is purely because I think it's in character for her to do. IC, Sabrina clearly wanted to try diplomacy, and now can't because Sakura KOed someone hardcore. In reality, this is still going Just As Planned for me. I don't think charging was the best idea, but I also don't think waiting was the best idea. There's some sort of optimized middle ground, but we never took the time in debate to come to that conclusion. That's not anybody's fault. That's just the reality of a group of people becoming emotionally invested in something. But ultimately, here we have a situation where we need to make the best with what we have.

Whatever happens, I don't think it's not going to be a clean, pretty bit of story telling, with a clear-cut moral high ground and nicely differentiated good and bad guys. From everything we've seen, this is going to be a messy, brutish, and painful experience. I don't think war and conflict should be written in any other way (despite failing epically at that myself), and this thread is going to contradict itself multiple times before this is over. Who we are and what our goals really mean to us are going to become questions we will need to ask ourselves, and the lengths that we, as people, are willing to go to in order to further what we think is "right" will become ethically problematic.
 
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Crasian01 said:
For me, the "angry at Sakura" bit is purely because I think it's in character for her to do. IC, Sabrina clearly wanted to try diplomacy, and now can't because Sakura KOed someone hardcore. In reality, this is still going Just As Planned for me. I don't think charging was the best idea, but I also don't think waiting was the best idea. There's some sort of optimized middle ground, but we never took the time in debate to come to that conclusion. That's not anybody's fault. That's just the reality of a group of people becoming emotionally invested in something. But ultimately, here we have a situation where we need to make the best with what we have.

Whatever happens, I don't think it's not going to be a clean, pretty bit of story telling, with a clear-cut moral high ground and nicely differentiated good and bad guys. From everything we've seen, this is going to be a messy, brutish, and painful experience. I don't think war and conflict should be written in any other way (despite failing epically at that myself), and this thread is going to contradict itself multiple times before this is over. Who we are and what our goals really mean to us are going to become questions we will need to ask ourselves, and the lengths that we, as people, are willing to go to in order to further what we think is "right" will become ethically problematic.
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I know. I don't really mind. The part about getting angry at Sakura was just me commenting how quickly the situation changed and how any hope of neutrality or peace keeping got trashed. :p

Although, maybe not. We haven't exactly attacked anyone, yet. There still might be a chance to salvage this. But with our luck and previous track record of diplomacy, I kind of doubt it.
 
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...I'm not sure why people are upset that this turned into a clusterfuck? We were walking into the middle of an active gang war between dueling sets of meguca mafias. This was the only option.

Edit: And this is still better than letting it blow up in the middle of Mitakihara, which is why we jumped into this feet-first.
 
All I can really remember about the discussions was that 'don't talk about time loops over the Kyubeyphone' somehow ended up with the original vote standing with slightly different wording instead of, you know, taking Homura aside for five seconds for a quick briefing in time stop so she could actually talk freely. Pretty much everything else over the last several days has been a complete blur though, so I can't really criticize.
 
Silver said:
...I'm not sure why people are upset that this turned into a clusterfuck? We were walking into the middle of an active gang war between dueling sets of meguca mafias. This was the only option.

Edit: And this is still better than letting it blow up in the middle of Mitakihara, which is why we jumped into this feet-first.
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Mami is a known quantity to the University Group. As soon as the other side compares notes, they will know a Magical Girl from Mitakihara intervened on the side of the Sendai group. Whereas if the Sendai Group had just retreated to Mitakihara, the other side would have to successfully track them to the city- which may or may not be possible given that the Sendai Group has a teleporter.
 
TheOneMoiderah said:
Hey guys what's going-




You really need to get a better handle on your userbase, Firn.
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This is contributing, even if unhelpfully condescending:
Cavalier said:
Oh look we raced right in to a situation we didn't need to, and it backfired. If only someone could have foreseen this blatantly predictable course of events and warned us.

There were three days before anyone was due to die. That mean there were two days in which we could have cornered Homura and got her to cough up what she meant about the Sendai group not being blameless. Two days in which we could have used Mami's familiarity with the University group to establish peaceful contact with the other side. Two days in which the Mitikihara Group could have taken form as a strong unaligned block known to both sides, and approached them as mediators. Two days to set up circumstances by abusing timestop and Oriko's precognition to come up with a real plan. Also I guess two days in which to convince Homura and Orikio that Sabrina has some idea of what the hell she is doing.

Instead herp-derp gotta run right into combat right now and it'll totally be fine because the other side clearly won't take Sabrina leaping in to save the Sendai girls from them as hostility. Except well, Sakura certainly made sure they did. And we still don't know what the war is actually about.

It's also clear some people not only haven't learned anything from this but actively refuse to learn anything from experience.

The only thing left to do is try to recover from this complete Charlie Foxtrot. Getting the hell out of town is very advisable. Consolidating with the rest of the Sendai group and getting answers (if they don't just lie) is rather important before anything else can be done. Finding a means to approach the other side through some kind of neutral channel they trust should also be a priority. On the other hand we have to make sure the Sendai group and their allies actually want to stop the war. Since you know, they have clearly demonstrated that they have agency and will not do whatever the thread wants them to just because our plans rely on them reacting in a certain way.
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Ugolino said:
You can say "Ugolino", you know. :rolleyes:

Two days in which both sides could call in reinforcements, injure each other, cause hilarious amounts of collateral, and generally burn even more bridges. Unacceptable.

And you're gloating early. It's still a situation in progress. Wait for something to go even vaguely wrong before jumping on the recrimination bandwagon.

Never mind that finding out what's going on is exactly what we're doing. Never mind that the plan is and always has been to get the Sendai group out, get answers, and get them on the same page before dealing with things with the others. No, clearly, every decision we've made in this Quest was a mistake that should never have happened and will cancel Christmas.
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Because disagreement is not bad. If people disagree with each other, that's fine, and to an extent desirable, because keep in mind - the voteblock isn't always right. (Sometimes because there is no right answer by design.) But also keep in mind - the both of you are being offensively condescending.

This, on the other hand:
Omegastar said:
at this point I'm just going to say that any plan that was not well though out a " Leroy Jenkins Sayaka plan"
Also

WE COULD HAVE MADE A PLAN IN ONE OR TWO MORE DAYS BEFORE YOU HAD US BULL RUSHING IT AND MADE IT WORSE!
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Knock it off, Omegastar - enough with the passive aggressive sniping. Contribute with more than random sniping, like Ugolino or Cavalier.
 
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People getting into arguments during the quests always makes me weird because I have nothing to contribute to it. All I can do is watch as everyone else debates the right course of action. If I had to say, I feel like we made the right decision. Maybe there was a better option, maybe there wasn't. In the end, the votes were cast and the decision was made. Let's move on and talk about what to do no. ... Is that a little too much for me to say, considering my post count is still in the single digits?
 
Uncreative said:
People getting into arguments during the quests always makes me weird because I have nothing to contribute to it. All I can do is watch as everyone else debates the right course of action. If I had to say, I feel like we made the right decision. Maybe there was a better option, maybe there wasn't. In the end, the votes were cast and the decision was made. Let's move on and talk about what to do no. ... Is that a little too much for me to say, considering my post count is still in the single digits?
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Maybe I'm not the right person to say this, but whatever.

Your post count means nothing, really. Hell, my post count is in the hundreds just for this thread and something like 50% include the words 'brain damage'. I think I've had maybe ten posts that actually contained useful discussion. If you have a good idea you're welcome to say something, if not, that's cool too. You're fine in expressing your opinions as you see 'em IMO.
 
Morning guys, what up-

"Five and a half pages of discussion"
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I need to find a way to not sleep ever again.

Kinematics said:
We already know why they were in Ishinomaki (the healing circuit). Asking seems pointless.
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You and I both know that Oriko's Futuresight isn't perfect. Furthermore, if it was merely a healing circuit, Akiko shouldn't be here. Her presence means that there is something more to this little visit than "just" a healing circuit. In anycase, it wouldn't hurt to hear it from the cow's mouth itself, if only to ensure that we aren't making assumptions that will come to bite us in the ass.
Kinematics said:
Not starting off friendly then adding intimidation. Start off at drill sergeant, and tighten the screws from there.
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Right now, we'll have built up some goodwill amongst the Sendai Crew for pulling that rescue. We should use that Goodwill to get them to divulge information, and only move on to tougher measures once it becomes clear that goodwill alone isn't enough to get what we want out of them. Seriously, the hard method is all or nothing. Either we get what we want, or we irreparably drive a wedge between us and and the Sendai crew. Opening with that is a bad idea.

@FlatlineAskari
Keep that "Taking over the Sendai crew" idea in mind for later. Right now, we need more information on what is going on before we start forming a plan to end the war. It could be completely workable, or it could be completely retarded, we can't say for certain with the limited information we have. Also, bear in mind that Sakura is not likely to go for this plan, and we have seen how badly Sakura can completely fuck things up for us, so we'll have to plan for her interference in some manner.

Also, I'm reasonably certain you are reading a little too much into Homura's attitude. She has probably dealt with them in her past timeloops before, and her reluctance to answer could be the Sendai group touching on bad experiences in her previous loops. It could also be her being cautious not to reveal the time loops to Kyubey. Witchbomb related issues are unlikely, given their modus operandi, but even if the causes are witchbomb related, as of right now, there is no way to get Mami to willingly separate from us.
 
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