Maybe we could poke on how they found out about the Clear Seed? verify in a roundabout way who was tailing Niko yesterday, when we handed over the seed?
Ahah, thank you for reminding me, I knew there was something I needed to ask about.
Yuuri's going to ask how to got involved in this situation and how we came into contact with Hijiri. How do we explain that? With Hijiri I don't think that we can claim anything other than "She took a potshot at us and we captured her". How much cooperation do we say we're getting from Hijiri? Do we want to try to play them against each other? Do we want to go more like "Hijiri said you were the leader" or "Hijiri threw you under the bus the instant she could"?
If it helps us end this, I'm more than happy to pay extra favors for waking her up at 7 AM.
Ahah, thank you for reminding me, I knew there was something I needed to ask about.
Yuuri's going to ask how to got involved in this situation and how we came into contact with Hijiri. How do we explain that? With Hijiri I don't think that we can claim anything other than "She took a potshot at us and we captured her". How much cooperation do we say we're getting from Hijiri? Do we want to try to play them against each other? Do we want to go more like "Hijiri said you were the leader" or "Hijiri threw you under the bus the instant she could"?
We don't need to commit to a single approach yet. Start with something that can segue either way ("Hijiri claims you were the chief organizer of the break-in, is that correct?") and then continue based on her response.
[x] Simultaneously: Sayaka.
-[x] Support the clone plan.
-[x] Have her copy chibis from Kazumi for multitasking support.
[x] Simultaneously: Hijiri
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Continue conversation/therapy with same principals.
--[x] Keep Hijiri occupied to prevent coordination with Yuuri.
--[x] Get more Yuuri intel. Arguments, plans, powers, objective in Niko's lab, etc.
--[x] Subtly investigate discrepancies.
--[x] Try to nudge a hypothetically hostile Hijiri into making a mistake.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Thank her for connecting you.
--[x] Commiserate about being misled by crazy schemers.
---[x] Let Hijiri believe you have a precog.
--[x] If you get an opening, ask what she wants to do with her life. Good therapy and a distraction.
[x] Simultaneously: Yuuri.
-[x] Move to a new channel minus Hijiri.
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Skip the hunt by getting her to a known location. Meeting, provoke an ambush, Clear Seed inspection, doesn't matter.
--[x] Learn about her motives.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Present yourself as a neutral mediator.
---[x] You want to help everyone.
--[x] Give Clear Seed handling instructions.
[X] Abuse multitasking.
-[X] Emphasis: Keep Hijiri and Yuuri from coordinating stories.
[X] Sayaka:
-[X] Calm her down. Mami, hug her.
-[X] Offer to talk with her parents and make an excuse.
-[X] If clones, copy Kazumi's Chibi for potential multitasking?
-[X] Support her decision either way.
[X] Hijiri:
-[X] Build trust. Amateur therapy:
--[X] Show concern.
--[X] Support her opinions as being valid whenever possible, e.g. agree with Yuuri being deranged.
--[X] Inquire about her actions and motives as appropriate.
--[X] Appeal to rationality.
--[X] Dig carefully; try and get her to admit when there's holes in her story.
-[X] Ask for details about Yuuri.
[X] Yuuri (private; warn friends plus Hijiri about infohazards):
-[X] Goal: Try to arrange a meeting.
-[X] Introductions: be positive. You help Magical Girls.
-[X] Potential details:
--[X] Clear Seeds; handling.
--[X] Disappointment: Clear Seeds are free.
--[X] Theft can't be allowed.
--[X] The Seed she stole is experimental/dangerous.
--[X] Exchanging the stolen Seed for a new one.
I'm going with Onmur because the other (Currently leading) vote currently has us specifically Present our self "as a neutral mediator" I don't believe we can really honestly say that this time considering our (and Mami's) current relationship with the Pleiades, and we should not get in the habit of lying about potential conflicts of interest if we want to be taken seriously as a mediator in the future.
Adhoc vote count started by 4Dname on Nov 14, 2017 at 4:17 PM, finished with 128935 posts and 15 votes.
[x] Simultaneously: Sayaka.
-[x] Support the clone plan.
-[x] Have her copy chibis from Kazumi for multitasking support.
[x] Simultaneously: Hijiri
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Continue conversation/therapy with same principals.
--[x] Keep Hijiri occupied to prevent coordination with Yuuri.
--[x] Get more Yuuri intel. Arguments, plans, powers, objective in Niko's lab, etc.
--[x] Subtly investigate discrepancies.
--[x] Try to nudge a hypothetically hostile Hijiri into making a mistake.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Thank her for connecting you.
--[x] Commiserate about being misled by crazy schemers.
---[x] Let Hijiri believe you have a precog.
--[x] If you get an opening, ask what she wants to do with her life. Good therapy and a distraction.
[x] Simultaneously: Yuuri.
-[x] Move to a new channel minus Hijiri.
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Skip the hunt by getting her to a known location. Meeting, provoke an ambush, Clear Seed inspection, doesn't matter.
--[x] Learn about her motives.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Present yourself as a neutral mediator.
---[x] You want to help everyone.
--[x] Give Clear Seed handling instructions.
[X] Abuse multitasking.
-[X] Emphasis: Keep Hijiri and Yuuri from coordinating stories.
[X] Sayaka:
-[X] Calm her down. Mami, hug her.
-[X] Offer to talk with her parents and make an excuse.
-[X] If clones, copy Kazumi's Chibi for potential multitasking?
-[X] Support her decision either way.
[X] Hijiri:
-[X] Build trust. Amateur therapy:
--[X] Show concern.
--[X] Support her opinions as being valid whenever possible, e.g. agree with Yuuri being deranged.
--[X] Inquire about her actions and motives as appropriate.
--[X] Appeal to rationality.
--[X] Dig carefully; try and get her to admit when there's holes in her story.
-[X] Ask for details about Yuuri.
[X] Yuuri (private; warn friends plus Hijiri about infohazards):
-[X] Goal: Try to arrange a meeting.
-[X] Introductions: be positive. You help Magical Girls.
-[X] Potential details:
--[X] Clear Seeds; handling.
--[X] Disappointment: Clear Seeds are free.
--[X] Theft can't be allowed.
--[X] The Seed she stole is experimental/dangerous.
--[X] Exchanging the stolen Seed for a new one.
[] Simultaneously: Sayaka.
-[] Support the clone plan.
-[] Recommend copying Kazumi's chibis for multitasking.
[] Simultaneously: Kazumi, Mami.
-[] Keep them updated on Yuuri conversation.
-[] Warn of infohazards.
[] Simultaneously: Hijiri
-[] Goals:
--[] Continue conversation/therapy, same principals as before.
--[] Keep Hijiri occupied to prevent coordination with Yuuri.
--[] Subtly investigate discrepancies.
--[] Investigate Yuuri's arguments, plans, objective in Niko's lab, powers, etc.
-[] Potential specifics:
--[] Thank her for connecting you.
--[] Commiserate about being misled by crazy schemers.
--[] If an opening appears, talk about life goals. Good therapy and a distraction.
---[] Mention your amnesia, but nothing further.
[] Simultaneously: Yuuri.
-[] Move to a new channel minus Hijiri.
-[] Goals:
--[] Short-circuit the hunt by engineering an encounter.
---[] A betrayal works as well as a legit meeting - If she tries to set a trap, let her.
--[] Investigate her motives.
-[] Potential specifics:
--[] Introduce yourself as a mediator. Work toward a peaceful resolution - explain your own motives, ask about problems, etc.
--[] You also need to check on the Clear Seed.
156 words. Argh. I feel like it's better? I'm not entirely sure. We barely have anything at all on Yuuri. If I wasn't dispatching such high-level instructions I'd absolutely be advocating a short update. As it is it's still very unbalanced; the Hijiri section is easily two updates worth of material.
I have to agree with 4dname. The I mislike the direction with the Yuuri conversation here. We aren't neutral in this, far from it in fact. Our conflict of interest is massive. Not only are the Saints personal friends of ours but, even setting that aside, the clear seed system is our responsibility and we have a duty to ensure this theft is dealt with properly and, ideally, prevent other people we've given them to from becoming the target of future thefts. What exactly that constitutes is up to us, but we are at odds with Anri for both reasons. (Even if the Saints, reasonably, weigh larger in our mind.)
With that in mind, Presenting ourselves as a neutral party and engineering an encounter on that basis is disingenuous.
We don't need to commit to a single approach yet. Start with something that can segue either way ("Hijiri claims you were the chief organizer of the break-in, is that correct?") and then continue based on her response.
I have to agree with 4dname. The I mislike the direction with the Yuuri conversation here. We aren't neutral in this, far from it in fact. Our conflict of interest is massive. Not only are the Saints personal friends of ours but, even setting that aside, the clear seed system is our responsibility and we have a duty to ensure this theft is dealt with properly and, ideally, prevent other people we've given them to from becoming the target of future thefts. What exactly that constitutes is up to us, but we are at odds with Anri for both reasons. (Even if the Saints, reasonably, weigh larger in our mind.)
With that in mind, Presenting ourselves as a neutral party and engineering an encounter on that basis is disingenuous at best.
We'd really like them to talk it out and we're going to start with that. I'm exactly as sympathetic to the "villains" here as the "good guys"; everyone makes mistakes but that doesn't mean that they "deserve it". At most we evaluate them as being more likely to reoffend in the future and must take steps to prevent that possibility, almost certainly by way of therapy and conflict resolution. If everyone decided to put their weapons down with supporting evidence such that I could decided that they'd live happy, satisfying lives and would not cause any more problems for themselves or others I'd take it in a heartbeat. And what does "neutral" mean? We make our decisions based on what we see. We're already operating in a regime where we have to verify all of our beliefs with concrete observations because we've observed significant divergences from canon; we must find out Yuuri's side of the argument and we must attempt to find out the real sequence of events and the real motivations. We have no use for prejudice. You can argue that the perception of favoritism will cause issues, but I really do believe that we want everyone to come out of this happy and that we're not going to favor one group over another for any reason other than the facts.
If she wants to backstab us, that's her problem. Calling her out on it, or being defensive, would hurt our position. If she wants a fight with the pleiades badly enough that she's willing to start shooting at their friends after agreeing to a polite, peaceful meeting, I'm not going to stop her.
I know Sayaka already has lightning powers from somewhere; was that Saki? If so, shouldn't be too hard for her to ask Saki how to do that trick. I don't know if it's going to be faster than the MOF, though. The MOF is kinda stupid.
Sato Kimiko from Ishinomaki has lightning, but Saki also has lightning. Different flavour. And I've done work on reconciling all the Pleiades' powersets, so yes and no, Saki has the same powers as she does in PMKM - suffice it to say that she has a lightning-themed teleport.
Not quite - Sayaka copied Kazumi's shadow conjuration1 power. Kazumi and Sayaka both used said power to independently copy the MOF.
1In the DnD sense. Kazumi gets to copy nearly any effect, with the caveat that the copy isn't quite as 'real'. For example, Kazumi copied the chibi, and gets to make a chibi of herself, but it's less effective than yours. And on the other hand, copying that chibi doesn't mean that she gets other aspects of your power, like Grief cleansing. If you prefer, you can think of it like this: Sayaka effectively manages multiple virtual machines, each running a different OS, on her Soul Gem, whereas Kazumi sandboxes individual programs.
1In the DnD sense. Kazumi gets to copy nearly any effect, with the caveat that the copy isn't quite as 'real'. For example, Kazumi copied the chibi, and gets to make a chibi of herself, but it's less effective than yours. And on the other hand, copying that chibi doesn't mean that she gets other aspects of your power, like Grief cleansing. If you prefer, you can think of it like this: Sayaka effectively manages multiple virtual machines, each running a different OS, on her Soul Gem, whereas Kazumi sandboxes individual programs.
Okay, but if we've established that degreifing is meguca Crysis, what's Doom? Inquiring minds want to know.
... Inquiring minds can neither confirm nor deny that they wish to know in order to copy a meguca power to things that should not, one would think, be capable of such magic.
So what would happen if Sayaka copied a Chibi Kazumi? Would the Chibi Sayaka be less real than the Chibi Kazumi?
And if Kazumi copied the Chibi Sayaka, and Sayaka that Chibi Kazumi, and so and so on, would the copies of the copies at some point become to immaterial to work?
And if Kazumi copied the Chibi Sayaka, and Sayaka that Chibi Kazumi, and so and so on, would the copies of the copies at some point become to immaterial to work?
[x] Simultaneously: Sayaka.
-[x] Support the clone plan.
-[x] Recommend copying Kazumi's chibis for multitasking.
[x] Simultaneously: Kazumi, Mami.
-[x] Keep them updated on Yuuri conversation and your plans.
-[x] Warn of infohazards.
[x] Simultaneously: Hijiri
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Keep Hijiri occupied to prevent coordination with Yuuri.
--[x] Subtly investigate discrepancies.
--[x] Investigate Yuuri's arguments, plans, objective in Niko's lab, powers, etc.
--[x] Continue conversation/therapy, same as before.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Thanks for connecting you.
--[x] Commiserate about being misled by crazy schemers.
--[x] If an opening appears, discuss life goals. Good therapy and a distraction.
[x] Simultaneously: Yuuri.
-[x] Move to a new channel minus Hijiri.
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Short-circuit the hunt by meeting with her.
---[x] If she wants to set a trap, that works too, let her.
--[x] Investigate her motives.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Introduce yourself as a mediator. Pursue a peaceful resolution - explain your own motives, investigate problems, etc.
--[x] You and Hijiri just resolved a misunderstanding. She claims Yuuri was the leader?
--[x] You need to check on the Clear Seed.
Some tweaks.
Clear up the intent of the conversation with Yuuri.
Add noncommittal bit to Yuuri conversation regarding Hijiri's status.
I considered adding something like "Explain Clear Seed safe handling and your conditions for distribution", but decided it that it'd probably set her solidly against us and wreck our chances of getting her to cooperate.
Take the amnesia bit out of the Hijiri conversation. We can do that next update if the conversation goes in a direction that'd make it easy to work in.
Add a bit to keep Kazumi and Mami updated on the Yuuri conversation. I was thinking that we'd keep this to ourselves, but decided that answering Kazumi's questions afterward would be too hard. Instead, I'm keeping Kazumi in on our plans with respect to Yuuri, but not handing any control over to her; we're on too tight a loop and Yuuri would notice if we were checking with Kazumi for planning. So we're kind of stuck running this particular show.
Conveniently, that gives us an opening to start spreading the word about Yuuri having infohazards.
Let Kazumi continue with the plan to group back up, though it's possible we'll get something out of Yuuri that'll make her change her mind.
Okay, but if we've established that degreifing is meguca Crysis, what's Doom? Inquiring minds want to know.
... Inquiring minds can neither confirm nor deny that they wish to know in order to copy a meguca power to things that should not, one would think, be capable of such magic.
As far as I can tell, those are the minimal necessary instructions for the next words out of our mouth to be effective in each conversation, and we can't give up any of those conversations. :/
Maybe it'd help to examine each chunk individually? Since that's kinda what each is - its own little self-contained mini-vote.
Also, it's still 150 words. Vertical just takes up more screen real estate.
Well, let's not panic this time. You have too many things to do right this instant to panic. On the other hand, you have too many things to do right this instant. On the third, Grief-formed hand, you have your entirely-too-useful multitasking capabilities to lean on.
You need to stop Hijiri and Anri from colluding. Basic interrogation, right? Don't let the suspects communicate with each other. Unless they've agreed to a story beforehand -and you doubt either of them were planning on Hijiri being caught- then you can probe them both for inconsistencies until it falls apart or clicks together.
Luckily, other people aren't you, and can't multitask as well as you can.
And Sayaka needs an answer, of course.
Three conversations to handle at the same time.
"Sayaka, you're sure you can handle that?" you say. "I remember you had coordination troubles with the clones."
You leave Sayaka to mull over that and glance over your shoulder, checking your course quickly before leaning back in your seat and eyeing Hijiri. There are enough meaningful glances going between the Pleiades for you to conclude that there's definitely a telepathic conversation going on between them.
"Thanks for the connection," you say, smiling. "Still, I do need information about her. Also, uh, don't mind if I talk to Yuuri separately?"
And you immediately drop the 'conversation' with Hijiri and Anri, switching smoothly to a new link with just Anri. "Hello, Miss Yuuri," you say. "I'm Sabrina. I'm actually from Mitakihara - I came here because of the conflict."
"I've got a ribbon on Hijiri," Mami murmurs to you. You hide your surprise - but now that she mentions it, you can sense the ribbon winding across the floor of the platform and around the clone's ankle. She'd moved it so slowly and so subtly you hadn't even noticed it.
"Not like I can stop you," Hijiri says sullenly.
"Well, what more can you tell me, other than that she's deranged?" you ask, nodding at her. "I mean... well, for starters, why do you say that?"
"Thanks, Mami," you say to her, trying to send her a warm smile. "You're the best."
Silence from Anri, but she hasn't dropped the connection. Curious. "Hello, Yuuri? Are you there?" you prompt. "Cheesy as it sounds, I'm here to help."
"She's currently screaming at me," Hijiri says with a wince. It doesn't look faked. "Does that count?"
You scratch your head sheepishly, tucking a stray lock of hair behind your ear. "Uh, sorry?"
That's not what you wanted.
"Still, go on?" you say to her, speaking simultaneously to Anri. "Miss Yuuri? I'd like to speak with you."
And another portion of your attention extends to Mami and Kazumi. "Quick update - I've gotten Hijiri to connect me to Yuuri, but she isn't responding to me."
"I can do it," Sayaka says, finally responding to you. "Yeah."
You can feel her magic building already, the flavour changing as she switches powers. "Would copying a chibi help?" you suggest. "It seems like it gave Kazumi extra multitasking capability."
"I'll ask," Sayaka decides.
"She is obsessed," Hijiri says finally. "She's single-mindedly focusing on her vengeance against 'those girls'."
"Uh huh? What was she doing, with the raid on the lab?" you say, making a 'go on' gesture at her. "Hello? Miss Yuuri? I'm someone who wants to help."
"I wanted to- to do something," Hijri says, scowling over your shoulder. "It was her idea. She was looking for something. She didn't tell me what, but I took the opportunity."
"Good luck," Yuuri hisses. And she cuts the connection.
Voting opens
[] Continue pressing Hijiri
- [] How?
[] Call Yuuri again
- [] What do you say?
- [] Keep calling her back -- [] Annoy her into submission
[] You arrive at the museum next update
- [] Discuss...
- [] Start searching
[] Write-in (word count limit: 180 words)
[x] Simultaneously: Hijiri
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Continue conversation/therapy with same principals.
--[x] Keep Hijiri occupied to prevent coordination with Yuuri.
--[x] Get more Yuuri intel. Arguments, plans, powers, objective in Niko's lab, etc.
--[x] Subtly investigate discrepancies.
--[x] Try to nudge a hypothetically hostile Hijiri into making a mistake.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Thank her for connecting you.
--[x] Commiserate about being misled by crazy schemers.
---[x] Let Hijiri believe you have a precog.
--[x] If you get an opening, ask what she wants to do with her life. Good therapy and a distraction. [x] Simultaneously: Yuuri.
-[x] Move to a new channel minus Hijiri.
-[x] Goals:
--[x] Skip the hunt by getting her to a known location. Meeting, provoke an ambush, Clear Seed inspection, doesn't matter.
--[x] Learn about her motives.
-[x] Potential specifics:
--[x] Present yourself as a neutral mediator.
---[x] You want to help everyone.
--[x] Give Clear Seed handling instructions.
=====
Short update - if the vote resolves quickly this round, I'll try and update again on Friday and once more on Sunday.
