Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
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- Tags
- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
AuraTwilight
The Sorcerer of Smiles
- Location
- The Silver City
The thing about your evidence is that souls are explicitly different from other forms of information we've collected.
Namely, Souls have DRM and are so ineffable there's atleast one Meguca with a powerset dedicated to understanding them.
Namely, Souls have DRM and are so ineffable there's atleast one Meguca with a powerset dedicated to understanding them.
Something something road to hell good intentions something.
What assurance does Oriko have that it's just her memories about the soulguca that we're gonna be looking at? Do you really think she trusts us that much to openly allow us to mess with her memories?
Why can't we just, you know, ask her like a normal person would? Is the knowledge about soulguca so life-threateningly important to get that we have to resort to diving on someone else' memories? When it's all but assured the meguca's gonna be in Mitakihara in the near future anyway?
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
If we absolutely need to get this, then we can give Oriko a griefhax device to improve her artwork skills and have her make pictures to use as reference. It's not something we need to do right now, though, because it goes totally counter to reassuring Oriko that she is more than her powers.
Vebyast
Nascent Transhuman
Eyewitness testimony, particularly for things like faces that people will generally reduce to compact symbolic representations (brown hair, brown eyes, etc), is shit. She's not trained for it, she probably didn't focus on remembering the face at all, and it's been days or weeks since she saw it. Even when you're a forensic art person trained specifically to extract that testimony you're more likely to pollute their memory, overwriting it with imagination and suggestion, than you are to get something useful. It's not a question of her being able to sketch it or anything, that information simply isn't in her any more. Our best bet is mindfuckery combined with outright postcog and that's almost certainly not happening.
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Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
And all for what? To get the information available online? Which amounts to little more of use than her name?
Hypervene
Feelin' Some Sort Of Way
- Location
- Liminal
Mornin!
Samey same! Don't really feel like moving to other threads right now, be a bit overwhelming. Plus It gives me prep time for meeting all the others!
That's like responsibility n'stuff right?
...what do mods do? Higure seems really chill so his BanArm probably isn't very exercised. @ChillMod do you just finish your shift quickly or something and kick your feet up after?
Hehe I got a post as long as a SeregVote but its full of nothing! I gotta step up my game
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Oh dear everything is serious uh
Hey thanks! If I vanish It'll probably be because I lost my password or something eheh
Samey same! Don't really feel like moving to other threads right now, be a bit overwhelming. Plus It gives me prep time for meeting all the others!
None taken! Was askin for a summary but I should probably read it myself anyway. See ya
i dun wanna
That's like responsibility n'stuff right?
...what do mods do? Higure seems really chill so his BanArm probably isn't very exercised. @ChillMod do you just finish your shift quickly or something and kick your feet up after?
kaizuki bully
I sorta remember that!
Hi @entrepreneur You well?
Hehe I got a post as long as a SeregVote but its full of nothing! I gotta step up my game
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Oh dear everything is serious uh
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- Location
- South Africa
Her name, her address, her contact details etc. are important. Meguca may have even mentioned her in the IRC channels Mami mentioned. Maybe she has a criminal record. These are things I'd like to know, if only to reassure Oriko we're helping. Better is to work out how to convince her to help or even track her down and fetch her. Oriko hasn't confirmed that it won't be too late for her to help by the time she gets here.
EDIT: Scanning her mind is not something she will notice, is not confirmed to be as difficult is scanning souls, is more reliable and detailed than a description or drawing will be, should be done before she forgets yet more details, and should be done not only for her power, but to prevent her from experiencing more damage.
EDIT: Scanning her mind is not something she will notice, is not confirmed to be as difficult is scanning souls, is more reliable and detailed than a description or drawing will be, should be done before she forgets yet more details, and should be done not only for her power, but to prevent her from experiencing more damage.
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Forgot to respond to this one earlier. That is not evidence. We have no tangible proof on where the combat enhancer got the skills it imparted on Sabrina.
And why should the conclusion be that it directly got it from somebody else' memories? Like the cement book, why would it not get it from the hundreds of thousands of Martial Arts competition videos, manuals, and documentaries uploaded in the internet? And with a meguca's physical capabilities, shounen anime would even be a valid source.
How will this help? We already got confirmation that soulguca would be arriving in Mitakihara. And we already have a very convincing incentive for her to help us (see: Clear Seeds). What would an overly extensive dossier help with?
- Location
- South Africa
I didn't call it tangible proof, I called it evidence. It's not extensive but its there.Forgot to respond to this one earlier. That is not evidence. We have no tangible proof on where the combat enhancer got the skills it imparted on Sabrina.
And why should the conclusion be that it directly got it from somebody else' memories? Like the cement book, why would it not get it from the hundreds of thousands of Martial Arts competition videos, manuals, and documentaries uploaded in the internet? And with a meguca's physical capabilities, shounen anime would even be a valid source.
How will it help? Let's start. Oriko hasn't conformed that the Soulguca will arrive before she suffers permanent damage. We don't know that actions we've taken afterwards haven't prevented Soulguca from coming. We don't know if the Soulguca is hostile. We don't know that she isn't preparing to brainwash us into her mindslave to become her personal cleanser. We don't know what her needs are (maybe grief seeds aren't as big a concern for her). We don't know that Kyuubey isn't going to poison her against us before she gets here. We don't know that she hasn't been poisoned against Oriko. We don't even know if her abilities will help Oriko at all. We don't know if she has more mundane needs that need taken care of. We don't know that the reason she's coming isn't because she has a team of helpful meguca who are about to get wiped but which convinces her to leave. We know nothing and the idea that learning more about her won't be helpful is ridiculous. Remember, Firn wants us to be proactive and punishes us when we aren't. That suggests that us preparing for her is in line with the kind of thing he likes and would reward us for, while waiting is the kind of thing he has continually punished us for.
As for the citation, what do you want citations on? The mechanics of or grief constructs cannot be detected by us, nevermind someone else. They've never displayed obvious interactions with what they're scanning either. You can't prove a negative, so the burden of proof that scanning minds is the same as scanning souls is on you. Oriko cannot provide more information through a drawing or description or drawing, because otherwise, she would be making stuff up by definition. Memories worsen instead of improving over time. And she was feeling physical pain and her soul was twisting. I want that to stop much more than I want her power.
Oh please. This is pure fearmongering.
DrZiztah
Mumu
- Location
- Europa
That is generally the best way to learn about events in a fictional work if you're interested in them, yes?
Hypervene
Feelin' Some Sort Of Way
- Location
- Liminal
Yeah your right. I was fumbling or something to ask and it was the first thing I thought of sorry
On something I can contribute though, if no one has Irish on the languages Sabrina knows then tally it up!
No one really speaks it over here anyway but I can understand and speak it just fine!
Edit:
eheheh
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Hypervene
Feelin' Some Sort Of Way
- Location
- Liminal
Hey, you guys know so many altogether!
Although it looks like 'Lement hasn't been active in a while so iunno what do now
The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
I've been too busy to bring it up before now, but the logic behind this line has a pretty big hole in it that Oriko might point out: Kirika can choose who is and isn't affected by her anti-magic, and she always chose to specifically exempt Oriko. Whether or not Kirika has anti-magic has no effect on whether Oriko can use her magic.
@Godwinson I don't think bringing this up is going to accomplish what you're hoping. You may want to rethink it
- Location
- Austria
Point is that Kirika's Wish was for something that Oriko needed, so anti-magic is...symbolic in a way, I think.
If choosing was based on "best weapon for Oriko", it would be mind control of some sort, and she would have much, much better chances against Sabrina.
- Location
- South Africa
There are plenty of magical girls who are horrible people. Canon has examples of them. Canon even has examples (multiple examples!) of magical girls using mind control against other magical girls. This is stuff we have proof happens! We are the most important resource in meguca history and have already had less than pleasant teams trying to recruit us who use violence and force to acquire resources. Thinking it is fear-mongering is denying reality.
Sorry. I was mostlygoing off the faith others had in the line.
Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Unless, as has been theorized, mind control gets outvoted.
Going into meeting the soulguca blatantly prepared for hostility and full of paranoia is less sensible caution and more a stupid self-fulfilling prophecy; treat people with hostility and/or suspicison, they return the unkindness. You claim to be the thread's Oriko, you ought to know about such prophecies.
And you'd think Oriko would've told us if soulguca is going to be very hostile...
- Location
- South Africa
I'm not going into meeting Soulguca assuming hostility. I'm checking to see if there's evidence of hostility before meeting her, like a responsible person. (And technically, it was Godwinson who first decided that I was the thread Oriko and I and a few others basically went,"Yeah, that fits", particularly since I tend to agree with her).
Oriko said:
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UbeOne
Daydreaming CPU
- Location
- Philippines
- Pronouns
- She/Her
There are two extremes: being completely unprepared for enemy action, and being blatantly paranoid of everyone.
Take the middle path. It's good to be diplomatic and willing to trust, while taking some level of sensible and discreet precautions.
Take the middle path. It's good to be diplomatic and willing to trust, while taking some level of sensible and discreet precautions.
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- Location
- South Africa
And while I confess to being a paranoid individual, sensible and discreet precautions is all I'm asking for. Besides, the possibility of her being hostile is only one of the issues I mentioned. The rest have not been addressed and are still valid (and the possibility of her hostility is still valid as well). Remember Ono? We know Kyuubey is poisoning others against us.
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The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
Not really? Anti-magic is pretty much the most practical choice. Oriko was planning to piss off three very powerful meguca, and Kirika's anti-magic shutting down Homura's timestop is the only reason that fight lasted longer than a second.
Not pointing a finger at you, you were just the one who'd brought it up most recently and reminded me that I'd meant to say something.
- Location
- Illinois
If she wanted a Homucounter, timeslow could have countered that just as well as antimagic and done a much better job of turning the tables. I'm with Godwinson, here.