Just a bit of shadowrunning here (and it amuses the hell out of me a game that old has entered SV/SBs lexicon... around last summer, I think?).

We know Kyubey this loop somehow became aware of Homura's power/time loops/boosting Madoka's potential by the beginning of April, when the canon Kyubey didn't figure it out until about four weeks later. Barring Oriko shadowruns, of course.

Hypothesis: Clarketech alien figures out what Homura's doing and decides to bug her. Worse, his bugs include a message to himself explaining Homura. One or more of these bugs made it onto one of her weapons, and from there into her shield. After the timeloop restarted, she brought the weapon out, the bug on it reported in to the Incubator network, and Homura's outed.

As a corollary, timestop does absolutely nothing to prevent Kyubey from learning about those conversations. In fact, when one of the bugs' internal chronometers disagrees with the network, that's a red flag to pay extra attention.

Also as another corollary: Rebellion seems to suggest that sometime after Madokami-verse Homura regains her memories of the loops (yeah, some headcanon going on here, admittedly) she also switched back from her Madoka-style bow to her shield. Canon Kyubey pulled the same message-in-a-bottleshield trick; that's why he's so gung ho on causing Homura to witch out/discovering the Law of the Cycles; he has records showing witches are a thing.
 
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Just... Think this: Every bit of damage we do to them will see retaliation. Disproportionally high retaliation, at that. More damage -> More blind retaliation.
But that isn't how retaliation works. People are scaleblind. Cause a major insult, irrespective of damage, and you provoke retaliation. Not a precisely-scaled, proportionate response, a show of force. We're going to do that anyway. We might as well cause more material damage in the process.
 
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Homura told him about witches, actually.
Yeah, but some crazy meguca talking about it is much less likely to be taken seriously than a message from alternate-Kyubey. I mean, sure, it's an explanation. But if it was a serious investment of their resources (and trapping a god might be, even for these guys) you might want a little more to go on. It's not as if they don't have other things to spend it on, especially considering that without witches they've got a much lower budget than pre-Madokami incubators do.

You might have expected Kyubey to mention it in his motive speech at the end, but since the point of that was more despair for Homura, telling her that part of the incubators' triumph wasn't her fault would be counterproductive.
 
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But that isn't how retaliation works. People are scaleblind. Cause a major insult, irrespective of damage, and you provoke retaliation. Not a precisely-scaled, proportionate response, a show of force. We're going to do that anyway. We might as well cause more material damage in the process.
You don't think causing more material damage will cause them to react worse?
 
Homura only had her shield in the dreambow. In the real world he's holding a bow during the whole movie.

Also, just a minor thing; can we check to see if any of these Yakuza people might seem familiar, or outright ask Homura if she knows what Hitomi's parents do for money (or more bluntly ask straight up if she's a yakuza princess)?
 
Homura only had her shield in the dreambow. In the real world he's holding a bow during the whole movie.

Also, just a minor thing; can we check to see if any of these Yakuza people might seem familiar, or outright ask Homura if she knows what Hitomi's parents do for money (or more bluntly ask straight up if she's a yakuza princess)?
Maybe not the best idea right now, plus Hitomi doesn't seem like somebody who would take well to finding out that their parents were Yakuza.
 
Homura only had her shield in the dreambow. In the real world he's holding a bow during the whole movie
Clearly I need to rewatch that movie.

Edit: Wasn't doubting, considering the number of times I've looked up a 'supporting detail' for a reply and found out that I'd misremembered the detail that was supposed to be my point.
 
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You don't think causing more material damage will cause them to react worse?
Honestly, no. I think cleaning out their carefully-hoarded guns from right under their noses is going to extract the worst emotional reaction we could get short of an actual bodies-in-the-streets declaration of war, and a bit more or less property damage is going to be neither here nor there.
 
I imagine the idea of some one sneaking in and taking their guns right from under them is already embarrassing and infuriating enough that loosing some drugs and other misc things is like dropping a bucket in the ocean.
 
Honestly, no. I think cleaning out their carefully-hoarded guns from right under their noses is going to extract the worst emotional reaction we could get short of an actual bodies-in-the-streets declaration of war, and a bit more or less property damage is going to be neither here nor there.
I think the need to move more and more stuff in from outside (to replace the lost equipment) will make things worse.

Taking the guns is insulting, defanging them. Wouldn't losing the hardware be a lot more important?

I keep in mind that the guns are smuggled in from outside, but the data seems far more valuable to me. Not exactly an informed opnion, just what I've got.
 
They're already going to be incredibly pissed off at someone for taking their guns. Might as well take everything so they'll have to prioritize between acquiring more guns and acquiring everything else. Cripple them. Make them wonder who'd have the resources to do this to them, while leaving every single one of their men alive.

Hell, their HQ, assuming they have superiors, is gonna be taking a real hard look at these guys and wondering how the hell someone managed to make away with all their stuff with no one giving a peep. They'll obviously try to find out who did it, but honestly? Starting a random war with anyone/everyone just after some unknown enemy managed to totally loot all your supplies is a good way of getting all your men killed. Also, it is just plain not profitable to start a war with anyone at the moment unless they can positively identify another group as the perpetrators.
 
I don't really have a problem with taking everything. I do have a massive problem with anything turning up later. Drugs was the obvious example, since there was a suggestion to give it to the police. We absolutely can't do that. Anything we take we have to deal with ourselves.

In terms of scale of retaliation, taking more won't really change the scale, but what is taken will change the breadth or narrowness of rather selection. Who takes money and guns but not drugs? I honestly can't think of many potential groups; mercenaries or thief rings, maybe. It would end up being a mysterious theft, and the targets for retaliation would be more likely to be people they have pre-existing hostility with. Who would take all of the above? Competitors, police, vigilantes. You can blame pretty much anyone quite easily.
 
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Homucifer is a conceptual being. You cannot defeat her with any amount of biggatons.
Akuma Homura is some sort of weird combination between a magical girl and a witch, but she has what appears to be a real body and people can talk to her and interact with her like a normal person. She does have an absurd amount of personal power (she is able to assert her witch powers in the real world) and she has an earring that allows her to control the small portion of conceptual power that she stole from Madokami, but she herself is not a conceptual being. If we did manage to separate her from the earring (an admittedly risky and unlikely proposition), then it should be possible to defeat her.

Summoning Madokami to bitchslap her and take back the stolen power might work, but that's not really covered by "biggatons".

"Extra-dimensional entity with black feathers, which can alter timelines, that takes a special interest in Madoka," is decent circumstantial evidence towards Homucifer being involved.
True. She's the most likely candidate in my mind. But (as far as we can tell) it's impossible for her to be Homucifer for the following reasons:
1. Homura's story about the end of the previous loop does not allow for the creation of Homucifer (unless she left out a lot).
2. Canon Homucifer has no reason/ability to appear in this universe.
3. Having two Homuras running around is problematic. Unless they're sharing the same body (which we've seen no sign of).

Edit: the fact that it's impossible for "Feathers" to be Homucifer may not actually prevent it from being true.
 
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Akuma Homura is some sort of weird combination between a magical girl and a witch, but she has what appears to be a real body and people can talk to her and interact with her like a normal person. She does have an absurd amount of personal power (she is able to assert her witch powers in the real world) and she has an earring that allows her to control the small portion of conceptual power that she stole from Madokami, but she herself is not a conceptual being. If we did manage to separate her from the earring (an admittedly risky and unlikely proposition), then it should be possible to defeat her.

Summoning Madokami to bitchslap her and take back the stolen power might work, but that's not really covered by "biggatons".


True. She's the most likely candidate in my mind. But (as far as we can tell) it's impossible for her to be Homucifer for the following reasons:
1. Homura's story about the end of the previous loop does not allow for the creation of Homucifer (unless she left out a lot).
2. Canon Homucifer has no reason/ability to appear in this universe.
3. Having two Homuras running around is problematic. Unless they're sharing the same body (which we've seen no sign of).
Thank you for telling them about why we don't think that Homucifer is feathers.
 
True. She's the most likely candidate in my mind. But (as far as we can tell) it's impossible for her to be Homucifer for the following reasons:
1. Homura's story about the end of the previous loop does not allow for the creation of Homucifer (unless she left out a lot).
2. Canon Homucifer has no reason/ability to appear in this universe.
3. Having two Homuras running around is problematic. Unless they're sharing the same body (which we've seen no sign of).

Wasn't there an idea about anything conceptual existing in some form as long as it's existence is possible (e.x Madokami being able to nudge things just a little because she's still possible) a while ago? Wouldn't that mean that Momucifer could get in on that ability just a little, with her stolen powers? Maybe nudge things to make herself more possible? It's a theory which hasn't been contradicted by anything so far, I don't think...
 
Wasn't there an idea about anything conceptual existing in some form as long as it's existence is possible (e.x Madokami being able to nudge things just a little because she's still possible) a while ago? Wouldn't that mean that Momucifer could get in on that ability just a little, with her stolen powers? Maybe nudge things to make herself more possible? It's a theory which hasn't been contradicted by anything so far, I don't think...
That seems exceedingly silly, though. I mean it's possible that one universe has a concept for anything.
 
You don't think causing more material damage will cause them to react worse?


If by "worse"you mean "more ineffectively", then yes.

I think the need to move more and more stuff in from outside (to replace the lost equipment) will make things worse.

Taking the guns is insulting, defanging them. Wouldn't losing the hardware be a lot more important?

I keep in mind that the guns are smuggled in from outside, but the data seems far more valuable to me. Not exactly an informed opnion, just what I've got.

I disagree with this. Looting someone's weapons cache is already a major insult and threat.
 
Residue Processing pt. 3
"Of course," you say, smiling at Homura. You bite back a touch of disappointment, a sensation that you hadn't done nearly enough. But would an inspiring, hot-blooded speech have had much of an effect on Homura? You're really not completely sure, but you doubt it, a little. She's not really the type.

Homura considers you for a long moment, before dipping her head towards you. She pivots sharply on one heel towards the racks of guns, her long black hair swirling behind her in the still air before settling into the familiar, improbable split tails. You ponder her hair briefly before discarding the thought, for that way madness lies.

She reaches the first rack - pistols by the dozen. Mostly Berettas, sleek, dark L-shapes sitting quietly in row after row, with a few oddities here and there, like the two Desert Eagles. Seems like even here in Japan, there's always someone going for the loud, flashy weapon in complete disregard for cost. None of them are particularly golden, or even gold-ish, you note. You're not sure why that's important, but indeed none of them are.

You watch as Homura simply unlocks the rack with another purple flare of magic -she probably gets quite a lot of use out of that one trick, really- and slides the locking bolts back. She raises her shield bearing over the rack, and passes the shield over the pistols. It's like watching a magic trick, which, technically it is - one moment, they're hanging innocuously on the rack, then they're blocked from sight by the shield, and then... there's an empty spot there.

And another empty spot next to it, and another, and another...

It's over in less than ten seconds, as much time as it takes for Homura to make one pass. The entire rack is denuded of weapons.

You blink, feeling a grin begin to return to your face. You lock your hands behind your back with a rustle of your leather coatsleeves - look, don't touch, just watch the pro at work and everything.

Homura pauses in her tracks and glances back at you curiously, head tilted a hair to the side.

You raise an eyebrow at her.

She blinks slowly, deliberately at you.

A second eyebrow joins the first.

She shrugs, and returns to her weapons gathering - this time unlocking a rack of assault rifles. It does vaguely occur to you to wonder how on earth they get assault rifles in Japan... but then again, organized crime. This time, she needs to pick them up one by one to slide into her shield.

"So um," you say, a thought occurring to you. You glance around at the racks - the yakuza are sensible enough to store the guns unloaded. "Do you need to load these manually, or something?"

"Yes," Homura says, tone mild. "Those cabinets in the back have all the ammunition."

Some part of you cringes at the thought - live ammunition kept in filing cabinets, but you nod. "I suppose that takes a while?"

Homura shrugs minutely, glancing wordlessly around the frozen greys of the timestopped world. Well, to be fair, is the world frozen, or are you going arbitrarily fast? You take a moment to contemplate that as Homura passes over two of the rifles, particularly worn looking specimens. Well, pragmatically speaking it's more or less the same thing, you suppose, except that's not really true. In principle, someone with an antimagic field would be able to move if the wolrd truly were frozen... on the other hand, magic. Like getting electricity despite the timestop.

Magic is such bullshit.

"Those rifles jam," Homura murmurs, indicating those two rifles she'd passed over.

"Ah, gotcha," you say. "May I?"

She shrugs, already moving on to the next rack, picking around a yakuza lounging on a bench. The thug's been caught in a particularly unflattering expression, droopy eyes and droopy mouth. The whole freezeframe issue, really.

You pick up the rifle - it's an AR-15, you recognize. Plastic stock, of course, barely modified. You... sort of wonder how it wound up here. If you had to hesitate a guess, they probably diverted a few for their own use from larger shipments? You've no real idea.

You inspect it, turning it over in your hands before racking the charging handle and checking clear the chamber. Click the safety up, and pop the takedown pin... the lower receiver, butt, trigger, grip and all swing away. You rack the handle again, catching the bolt as it slams backwards out of the way.

A glance up -you can feel eyes on you- and you catch Homura watching you curiously. "The buffer spring's worn," she notes. "No point to it."

"Oh," you say, shrugging, and reassemble the rifle before replacing it. "Umm... do you need a cleanse, Homura?"

Her eyes flick over to you. "Not yet," she says. She hesitates for a moment, before she makes a halting addition. "Thank you."

You smile. "No problem."

She goes through the racks, and you just watch her. Does she ever use those shotguns, you wonder? Probably, you decide - excellent for Familiars, if nothing else, at a bet.

Finally, she pauses at the end of now considerably emptier room, pulling open the cabinets to reveal... rows and rows of neatly filled magazines and clips, as well as boxes of ammunition. You walk up beside Homura, eyeing the considerable quantity of ammo.

"So, um, you need to load... all the guns?" you ask.

"Yes," she says, sweeping her arm over the neatly stacked rows and hoovering them up by the dozen. She lowers herself to the floor, crosslegged, and holds her shield out. With a clatter, dozens of pistols drop to the floor, along with clips. She gives you a look, before picking up a pistol and a clip out of the pile.

You take that as an invitation, and seat yourself comfortably opposite her from the pile as she loads the Beretta and racks the slide, cocking it and flipping on the safety before slipping it into her shield. You squint at the pile for a moment, before a twist of will has spheres of Grief sweeping in. "Here, let me, Homura," you say, smiling.

You reach out with your mind and with your Grief in a dozen grasping tendrils, snatching up pistols and clips from the pile. With a dozen simultaneous clicks, you slam each and every single clip home at once, the sound echoing like, well, a gunshot. Another twist of will, and you cock and safe them all at once.

You grin proudly at Homura, holding out the now loaded pistols to her, grip first.

She blinks at you for a moment before claiming the loaded and readied pistols. Another pass of her shield over the ground, and she dumps a larger pile of guns on the ground. Considerably larger. A few pistols mixed in with assault rifles. She stares at you.

"Oh fine, be that way," you say with a grin. You reach out again, snaking tendrils of Grief snapping out to sieze guns and load them with a metronomic rhythm. Homura accepts the loaded ones, replacing the rapidly depleting pile of firearms with fresh, empty ones.

You work in a companionable silence, Homura shoving the guns into her shield as fast as you pass them to her, and replenishing the pile when she has a moment. "Hey, Homura," you say, raising your voice a little to be heard over the clatter of loading guns.

Violet eyes cut over to you, an inquisitve expression on Homura's face.

"Do you think I could pick up something for myself?" you ask. "I kind of want something to cover my lack of options outside a hundred meters."

Homura shrugs with one shoulder, reversing a rifle -an AR-15- to you before pausing. "How will you keep it?"

[] Write-in

=====​

Did you know that Japan ranks 6th in the total value of things smuggled through? Well, by some rankings, anyway.

Also, this is an armoury; if you want cash, you'll have to make a side trip.
 
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