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Paths of Civilization

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ThrawnCA said:
Do we know if aqueducts not associated with a city affect disease rolls?
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They should, even small towns breed diseases after all.

The typical model of the Nurgle Portal plague sequence is:
1) New disease is introduced via
1.1) Trade introduces disease with no extant resistance
1.2) High lethality rural disease reaches urban center where it's kill rate no longer impedes its spread and it gets its big break.
1.3) Endemic disease finds a new exploit and becomes epidemic

2) Disease spreads along trade lanes to other major cities. Go to 1 for those.

3) Disease spreads along trade lanes into nearby smaller settlements forming backup reinfection reservoirs where it can adapt past people developing immunities.
3.1) But the important part is surviving people catching something new can create a new plague.

So aqueducts in small towns should help with plague a fair chunk by denying reinfection reservoirs and secondary outbreaks.

They also make mills and mill related industries more accessible to medium sized communities, but I don't expect this to be a factor for a while yet.

Umi-san said:
Do we know they're capitalist? Like, they probably are but do we have evidence to support it?
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We asked AN how they paid their armies. He said wealthy individuals just chip in. Which is the Rule of Gold model of army.
 
ExNihilo said:
In approximate order:
Black Soil (At the cost of a forest, which may or may not cost some of it's own)
New Settlement (We can put three mains worth in internal reorg, after that it's expansion)
Build Mills (Expensive)
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Why does black soil use up a forrest slot? Also is there a more advanced LTE that includes all the costs of an action?
For example if black soil requires a forrest then expand forrest is part of the cost.
 
fictionfan said:
Why does black soil use up a forrest slot? Also is there a more advanced LTE that includes all the costs of an action?
For example if black soil requires a forrest then expand forrest is part of the cost.
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A Main black soil requires a forest, because of the char and other forest materials we're putting into the black soil. and the thing about required-we thing the forest gives net +1 LTE, so its even better, but takes twice as many actions.
 
fictionfan said:
Why does black soil use up a forrest slot? Also is there a more advanced LTE that includes all the costs of an action?
For example if black soil requires a forrest then expand forrest is part of the cost.
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Note that only a main black soil does that. I guess if you're making black soil at more reasonable rates, you just use whatever materials are available, but if you really want a big batch, you can use a bunch of tree biomass to help.
 
ExNihilo said:
A Main black soil requires a forest, because of the char and other forest materials we're putting into the black soil. and the thing about required-we thing the forest gives net +1 LTE, so its even better, but takes twice as many actions.
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So Black Soil cancels out Expand Forest, but we will be able to use the new space for growing cash crops, which will allow us to fund more mills and other expensive actions.

What I would really like to do is improve Expand Forest action. This could be done with improving black soil actions through mills and more charcoal kilns or improving our agricultural tools.
 
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ThrawnCA said:
Note that only a main black soil does that. I guess if you're making black soil at more reasonable rates, you just use whatever materials are available, but if you really want a big batch, you can use a bunch of tree biomass to help.
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Is it better LTE for actions to do two secondary black soil? Instead of main black soil and expand forrest.
 
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fictionfan said:
Is it better LTE for actions to do two secondary black soil? Instead of main black soil and expand forrest.
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By far our most efficient LTE/action generator is {S} New Settlement. That currently generates +4 LTE, and if we integrate Txolla there will be land that generates even more.

However, right now, we actually have too much LTE. We had a reasonable amount at the start of the turn but were critically low on econ. We generated +11 econ via Mills, but that meant that we now have too much LTE to keep our cities around. Luckily we can easily solve that problem by just mass overflowing econ and overwhelming our cities' ability to refund that econ into EE.
 
fictionfan said:
Is it better LTE for actions to do two secondary black soil? Instead of main black soil and expand forrest.
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I don't think that we can do two secondaries on the same turn without combining them into a main.

But two secondary black soils on consecutive turns would be approximately equal to Main Black Soil + Main Expand Forest.
 
*S: +2-3 Econ Expansion, -1 Tech
*M: -2 Econ, 1 Forest Slot Consumed, -1 Tech, +6 Econ Expansion, other effects [King]

So two secondaries gives 4-6 EE and -2 tech, both refunded, main gives 6 EE, 2 more ee at the cost of econ, and -1 tech (refunded), an extra forest, and (Other Effects)

Since a forest costs 2 mains, that's four secondaries, is better, but it would have to take place over four turns because two secondaries combine to one main. The forests version also gives interesting effects in both Black Soil and Forests, and the forest can be doubled with Charcoal Kilns, and having more forests is always better.

So in terms of raw EE and LTE, four secondaries gives 8-12, all tech refunded, and the main gives 7(6 from black soil, 1 from forests), however, the secondaries have to be done over four turns (or two and two PSNs, reacts, etc), and the main pair gives a whole lot of (Other effects) and can be done in one turn.
 
Maybe we should have two forestry policies to balance out the effect of Expand Forest, plus it will give us 2 forests and effectively four sustainable forest usage.
 
ExNihilo said:
*S: +2-3 Econ Expansion, -1 Tech
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Note that secondary Forest adds +1 LTE, just as a main does. So you could do secondary black soil + secondary forest each turn, for +3/+4 LTE and +0.5 Forest. Doesn't quite keep up with the -5 LTE from textiles, but in situations like the current one where LTE is uncomfortably high, it seems ideal.
 
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ThrawnCA said:
Note that secondary Forest adds +1 LTE, just as a main does. So you could do secondary black soil + secondary forest each turn, for +3/+4 LTE and +0.5 Forest. Doesn't quite keep up with the -5 LTE from textiles, but in situations like the current one where LTE is uncomfortably high, it seems ideal.
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If we could do those two together as a kings repeated action, along with the main textiles, that would be great. Sadly, I don't think we can do that about repeated actions, and sticking to plans long-term is hard.
 
Next turn we should just do a bunch of improve festivals and see if we can induce a baby boom. Those often happen after wars and it would be a great way to eat all our current EE.
 
ExNihilo said:
If we could do those two together as a kings repeated action, along with the main textiles, that would be great. Sadly, I don't think we can do that about repeated actions, and sticking to plans long-term is hard.
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Great for growing wealth, sure, but not so great for expanding efficiency of our forest actions.

Thing is, we need wealth to fund build mills action.

So maybe it would be sec Black Soil (+2-3 LTE), Plant Cash Crop (7 wealth, -5 LTE), Build Mills(-8 wealth +4 LTE) .

Expected outcome is positive LTE and a slow drain on wealth but the long term goal is to improve the efficiency of black soil production and fund mechanization with cash crop wealth.
 
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