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But we can learn new talents if find a teacher, right?


Sorry, but I can't find, where that been mentioned.
And I don't sure it'll be a Talent rather than skill.
I just asked Poptart about Talents on this page - we get two per skill, total.

As a brand new thing that looks like an unusual application of Ki Control, I would expect it to be a Ki Control Talent, though I'd be delighted if it wasn't. If we learnt it from someone else it would probably be its own move. For example, I'm pretty sure Ki Refinement is an Elite Talent of Jaffur's that we're learning as a regular Skill, though I could be misremembering.
 
I just asked Poptart about Talents on this page - we get two per skill, total.
Only two from leveling skills. But @PoptartProdigy said we can learn talents from others:
So... basically, we'd need someone Exceptional going into Elite that doesn't have any such insights of their own, and it'd still take a few AP on our part to do so, correct?

And then once they'd learned the talent, we'd be able to share our respective Elite talents with each other?
That is basically the option available to you, yes, although I wouldn't say it'd take multiple AP. It just wouldn't be terribly efficient as an action.
 
Only two from leveling skills. But @PoptartProdigy said we can learn talents from others:
I think that might be in the sense that we've learnt Jaffur's Elite Talent with training, it just isn't a Talent for us.

I'm mostly just concerned about the possibility of getting to Legendary through Research projects because Ki Control is a very broad skill, wanting to Research another novel Ki Control use and just being flat-out unable to because we can't learn any more about Ki Control. Maybe I'm just being too risk-averse.
 
Yes. But there's a limit on how many times one person can utterly revolutionize the popular understanding of a field. So you can't unlock everything by yourself.
Thanks for answer.
Sorry for bothering you, but @Deathbybunnies to shy :V to ask, so I going to do it instead. [Ki Signature Alteration/Disguise] will be Talent or skill (I mean if we'll manage co figure how to do it)?
To be more specific - if we'll try to get it through Research Project.
 
Nope. You have a talent or do not. Balance concern.
Is it possible to mimic the in-universe effects with a research project? Essentially, to turn certain things-that-could-be-Talents into Techniques instead, or some similar hack that allows the innovation in-universe without the mechanical problem.
I mainly ask because 'actually, there is a meta-level limit on how many amazing innovations you can finish making in this field, no matter how many you unlock' really bothers me from a story perspective - what's the point of letting us hit the highest possible achievement in our specialty so far from the end of the Quest?
 
Is it possible to mimic the in-universe effects with a research project? Essentially, to turn certain things-that-could-be-Talents into Techniques instead, or some similar hack that allows the innovation in-universe without the mechanical problem.
I mainly ask because 'actually, there is a meta-level limit on how many amazing innovations you can finish making in this field, no matter how many you unlock' really bothers me from a story perspective - what's the point of letting us hit the highest possible achievement in our specialty so far from the end of the Quest?
Practically speaking, you needn't worry about that.
 
I mainly ask because 'actually, there is a meta-level limit on how many amazing innovations you can finish making in this field, no matter how many you unlock' really bothers me from a story perspective - what's the point of letting us hit the highest possible achievement in our specialty so far from the end of the Quest?
to be fair, it wouldn't be the "highest possible achievement". It's an elite talent for the the elite level skill.

Highest would be legendary, and we're REALLY far from that.

I can't really think of that many "Legendary" skills.

I mean, Legendary would probably be Goku with the Kamehameha (he can basically do everything with it!), or Krilin with the Kienzan and/or the solar flare, and maybe Tien with the kikoho. MAAAAYBE Vegeta with his final flash.

Ah, and obviously Goku/Vegeta and hand to hand dueling at the very least
 
There is one thing I'm curious about @PoptartProdigy

I get that we can only develop two elite talents.

We can, obviously, learn what other developed as their own elite talents as skills, like we did with ki refinement. This would probably apply to Tabe's trick as well.

Shin Kikoho would be an example of something that in the past was an elite talent for Tien, flight was probably an elite talent for the crane hermit, kamehameha was one for Muten and so on.

How would that work with Papata Fren's communication elite talent? The one that, If I remember correctly, allowed you to get more information out of someone you're talking with.

To her it's a communication elite talent. Would it become a separate skill to us if she taught us? Something like a soft interrogation/extract information skill maybe?


Edit: also, on second thought, I find it weird that Spirit Saiyan isn't either an elite talent (though i suppose it would be one for Goku... or maybe not, he never actually managed to control it after all) or its own skill, being instead folded into the Genkidama.
 
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Edit: also, on second thought, I find it weird that Spirit Saiyan isn't either an elite talent (though i suppose it would be one for Goku... or maybe not, he never actually managed to control it after all) or its own skill, being instead folded into the Genkidama.
It's not on our character sheet. I think it would probably be an Ability though, since that's where all the other transformations went.
 
Is Full Metal Alchemist a cognitohazard with respect to All is One? You know, if they brought over anime to Garenhuld :p
 
There is one thing I'm curious about @PoptartProdigy

I get that we can only develop two elite talents.

We can, obviously, learn what other developed as their own elite talents as skills, like we did with ki refinement. This would probably apply to Tabe's trick as well.

Shin Kikoho would be an example of something that in the past was an elite talent for Tien, flight was probably an elite talent for the crane hermit, kamehameha was one for Muten and so on.

How would that work with Papata Fren's communication elite talent? The one that, If I remember correctly, allowed you to get more information out of someone you're talking with.

To her it's a communication elite talent. Would it become a separate skill to us if she taught us? Something like a soft interrogation/extract information skill maybe?


Edit: also, on second thought, I find it weird that Spirit Saiyan isn't either an elite talent (though i suppose it would be one for Goku... or maybe not, he never actually managed to control it after all) or its own skill, being instead folded into the Genkidama.
Given this system's slant towards fine-grained combat skills over other fields, Fren's talent would fold into the Communication skill. I just decided to render the Genki Dama's spirit saiyan version as a part of the skill.
 
Given this system's slant towards fine-grained combat skills over other fields, Fren's talent would fold into the Communication skill. I just decided to render the Genki Dama's spirit saiyan version as a part of the skill.
without consuming the elite slot then, or as an elite talent? Sorry if I ask for clarification, but I don't want to misunderstand this.

Also what does a higher genkidama rank actually mean?

By this I mean that an higher ranked kamehameha is probably more focused, charged more quickly and such. An higher ranked kikoho probably consumes less life force and hits harder. higher ranked dueling or communication are self-explanatory.

An higher ranked Genkidama/Spirit Saiyan would be.. what? charged more quickly? absorbed more quickly? Maybe it allows us to take an higher percentage of the energy of the donors (willing or unwilling)? Would it let us keep the boost for longer?
 
without consuming the elite slot then, or as an elite talent? Sorry if I ask for clarification, but I don't want to misunderstand this.

Also what does a higher genkidama rank actually mean?

By this I mean that an higher ranked kamehameha is probably more focused, charged more quickly and such. An higher ranked kikoho probably consumes less life force and hits harder. higher ranked dueling or communication are self-explanatory.

An higher ranked Genkidama/Spirit Saiyan would be.. what? charged more quickly? absorbed more quickly? Maybe it allows us to take an higher percentage of the energy of the donors (willing or unwilling)? Would it let us keep the boost for longer?
Spirit saiyan is just an application of the skill, as implemented.

In order to learn about the legendary technique which Kakara reinvented on minimal outside instruction, please improve the skill more.
 
@Koraan, please do not be mean to me.
If you really don't want to work on Tien Style, might I suggest starting on a "Kakara Style"? We already know most of the techniques we've been interested in for it, and apparently we can seamlessly integrate any new techniques and insights we want to later on.
Thinking this over a bit, yeah okay. I'll switch in the next draft.
Jaffur only taught us his Ki Refinement technique because Dazarel was coming - if we go and steal the rest of his techniques, he's going to be pissed, and I wouldn't blame him.
I think you might be underestimating him. He probably wouldn't be thrilled about it, but it'd be very low on his list of concerns compared to, say, getting freed.
(Speaking of which, we almost certainly need to fight him specifically when we return, presuming we don't manage to cheat with a wish. Spending an AP or two on at least making sure his style won't have horrible surprises would seem very worthwhile, even if we don't manage to use the Saiyan psuedo-sharingan thing to copy the useful bits.)
Nope. You have a talent or do not. Balance concern.
On a fairly tangential note, I'm curious as to the rules at play here. Do you happen to have a doc handy? Failing that, could you maybe give an overview of what Talents mean, in game terms? I've been basing my evaluations on "you can sense machines now", since All Is One's function isn't obvious, so I've been thinking of Talents as "new tool (which you happen to invent as part of leveling up)".
Based on this conversation, though, I'm thinking maybe they're supposed to be unique trumpcard secret techniques. Is that accurate?
 
On a fairly tangential note, I'm curious as to the rules at play here. Do you happen to have a doc handy? Failing that, could you maybe give an overview of what Talents mean, in game terms? I've been basing my evaluations on "you can sense machines now", since All Is One's function isn't obvious, so I've been thinking of Talents as "new tool (which you happen to invent as part of leveling up)".
Based on this conversation, though, I'm thinking maybe they're supposed to be unique trumpcard secret techniques. Is that accurate?
From what I understood until now talents are innovations and revolutions that change the understanding of what was commonly believed to be possible.

Let us look to past examples, confirmed and presumed: To Roshi, the Kamehameha was a completely new way to use ki. Up to that point I think there were maybe only TWO known and named external ki attacks in Earth's martial arts history: the kikoho (which uses life energy and I think was implied to be older, possibly created by Mutaito or even someone before his time) and the Mafuba (which would likely be some kind of elite talent as well for him)

Going more recently, the Shin Kikoho was a completely new evolution of the Kikoho: you could now use it for multiple quick attacks, while consuming far less life energy.

Machine Sense is something completely new as well: you're discovering a way to sense a type of energy that was though by all to be impossible to sense through ki.

the solar flare x100 of krillin works even when the opponents closes their eyes. He can control the direction of his kienzan and split it in multiple ones. Goku can use the Kaioken while ssj blue, and Berra can sort-of-use it while ssj. Jaffur created a way to strenghten your ki by making it denser WITHOUT being sensed as stronger. We're about to create a multiform that doesn't split our power in four.

The one constant is that an elite talent makes you capable of doing something previously believed to be impossible. Once you know it IS possible, then you can teach it to other and have it become the new normal.

Nowadays nearly every exile knows the kamehameha. Flight is a basic skill. The shin kikoho still requires the kikoho to be learnt, but it's its own technique. Jaffur taught us Ki refinement, and so on.


also there's this bit from the rule threadmark

Skills are a measure of how, well, skilled your character is at certain actions. Skills are rated on an eleven-point scale [Lethal, Calamitous, Incompetent, Poor, Unpromising, Unlearned, Competent, Talented, Exceptional, Elite, Legendary]. On this scale, Unlearned is the neutral level offering neither penalties nor bonuses (+/-0). Each level to either side of Unlearned either adds or subtracts 10 from that modifier. Thus, a Poor skill penalizes checks in that skill by -20, while an Exceptional skill improves all rolls within that skill by +30.

The last two levels at either end of the scale represent the extreme ends of the bell curve: levels of excellence or failure unattainable by mere training or grinding, accessible by only the greatest feats or moments of self-realization. In addition, delving into the far ends of the bell curve allows your character to dig into special talents above and beyond the accepted state of the art in that skill. I call these Elite+ Talents, which attach to skills. Being Exceptional in a skill is already expert-tier, in other words; pushing farther is where one enters the level of innovation and mastery. An example of an Elite+ Talent would be the ability to sense machine energy with ki sense, something ordinarily held to be impossible.
 
I wonder, how far can Kakara keep control of her ki? That is to say, I'm envisioning a technique where she saturates the surrounding area in her ki and uses the disruption of her own ki as means to detect enemies' movement rather than relying on sensing the enemy's ki. Would this have sufficient range to be useful? And has it already been created by some name?

On another note, @PoptartProdigy, do your quests have a discord server or anything?
 
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