- Location
- The Great Beyond
- Pronouns
- He/She/They
It was, but not anymore.
Dragon Ball: After the End
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
Would have really been useful given how we pretty much predicted a lot of this but never put it into a vote.
Was this. It got nixed. I no longer have a back door into the darkest parts of her psychology
- Location
- usa
Hang on, if great ape/and or other power ups push us past were the wards are safe, but multiform halves. Could we not just push past whats safe, split, push again then split. So we have 4 high powered bodies?
Dono little late here maybe in missremembering something
Dono little late here maybe in missremembering something
Screw the wards, and if there's anything that will shake them out of this fugue it's a nice dose of ragemonkey.
- Location
- Here and there
- Pronouns
- He/Him
At the moment, my immediate impulse is to call in backup.
Dandeloor and the Seers are all in on our scheme to break Jaron out. And Dandeer doesn't know that.
Bringing in people to disrupt her attention. Maybe even bring in the Goku sorcerers to disrupt Dandeer's work.
And if we can get someone in to heal Granny Apra, we can tilt the balance of power a bit more.
Dandeloor and the Seers are all in on our scheme to break Jaron out. And Dandeer doesn't know that.
Bringing in people to disrupt her attention. Maybe even bring in the Goku sorcerers to disrupt Dandeer's work.
And if we can get someone in to heal Granny Apra, we can tilt the balance of power a bit more.
Okibruez
(Verified Mid-Boss)
- Location
- Dreams
Perhaps you meant 'sleep' instead of slip?
Also: Dang it. First contact, plan, enemy. Perfect example. I'm excited to see how you lot figure this out because I have exactly no idea how to handle this.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Calling for help would likely be effective. It would be very hard for the protectorators to protect Dandeer from a horde of people. Blasts from all angles.
Against Super-Saiyans? It might get bloody real quick.
Especially since they don't want to kill their lords.
Thanatos4134
Overpowered is the best kind of powered
- Location
- arizona usa
Iam going to throw this out there because someone has to she is at the very edge of super sayian 1 and can go super sayian 2 at any time and honestly this seems like the only time she will be able to get away with it
And don't trust your grandma there is probably a spell on her to.
And don't trust your grandma there is probably a spell on her to.
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Wiadi
Uncompromising Radical Leftist
- Location
- Something Clever
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Define "get away with it." The Enemy isn't going to be mysteriously looking away on just this one particular day.
(of course, it's possible the Enemy may not be looking at all, but you don't stake the fate of your entire species on a blind gamble like that)
Thanatos4134
Overpowered is the best kind of powered
- Location
- arizona usa
I was talking more about the law against going super sayian 2 this seems like one of the only times an exception would be made fighting two super sayian's with a possible third being mind controlled, to take on what has to be the strongest sorcerer since the time of goku.and as to the enemy he didn't notice goku till he was a sayian god.
- Location
- Actually pretty lost
We split off a Multiform with a negligible PL, and send it off to go Oozaru. A single 800k PL would make keeping her intact much harder for them, as the fight is currently even.
Then go to town blasting at Dandeer. The SSJs have to block, and we might end up in a beam war, at which point the oozaru and/or everyone else can attack Dandeer.
But... if she has SSJs mind controlled... I don"t think we can keep her contained and alive.
Then go to town blasting at Dandeer. The SSJs have to block, and we might end up in a beam war, at which point the oozaru and/or everyone else can attack Dandeer.
But... if she has SSJs mind controlled... I don"t think we can keep her contained and alive.
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Hey, y'know how four golden great apes went all out against a dragon without any wards and it didn't start the doom timer? Maybe containing every last surge is not why they're there.
- Location
- Actually pretty lost
Can Jaffur attempt to free the enemy combatants by overloading them with his magic? There's no extra personality he needs to avoid destroying.
Actually... we can't IT onto an enemy of any real strength because they'll react quickly enough to defend themselves, and they generally don't give us the time in hand-to-hand. But if we drop on top of Dandeer, I don't think they can block for her in time. We might leave ourself open to a big blow, but we can take those, and Dandeer emphatically cannot. If we can kill or KO her we're no longer on a time limit to deal with the mind-controlled SSJs.
Actually... we can't IT onto an enemy of any real strength because they'll react quickly enough to defend themselves, and they generally don't give us the time in hand-to-hand. But if we drop on top of Dandeer, I don't think they can block for her in time. We might leave ourself open to a big blow, but we can take those, and Dandeer emphatically cannot. If we can kill or KO her we're no longer on a time limit to deal with the mind-controlled SSJs.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
I'd rather risk deadman switches than lose any more chances through inaction. Abruptly and violently sniping her would have avoided her being able to issue orders to at least some of the super-saiyans she now has under her control.
I mean, I know that events unfolded without us getting an option to snipe her because of Kakara's personality and because OF COURSE we get rushed into confrontation with her after talking to Berra, before getting a vote on how to proceed. But seriously, the completely hypothetical hazard of dead man's switches should no longer be our main concern, her ability to casually mind-control super-saiyans and work unknown planetwide mind-wiping spells should be.
Because stacking Kaio-Ken with a super-saiyan's raw power level is extremely dangerous. Jaffur was gravely endangering his life by using it the way he did, and Berra would have been just as endangered to do the same to match him. Berra may have thought he could outfight Jaffur or just hang on long enough for Jaffur to have to drop the Kaio-Ken or die, and the latter was probably averted only by JAFFUR WILLPOWER STRONK.
Also, Berra would have had to blow the wards out of the Hall to go any more powerful than Jaffur already did.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
[ ][FIGHT] Kais on high you wish you'd fired up Spirit Saiyan in advance now. You need it, right now. Jaffur doesn't have to beat both Vegeta and Berra -- frankly, you doubt he can under these conditions. But he should hopefully be able to give you five minutes to charge.
[ ][OTHER] This is a bad situation, but you need to handle something.
-[ ][OTHER] You need to rally some of your people. You're in a numerically even fight, and need every advantage you can get. Get in contact with the Heads in on the conspiracy and direct them to provide massed fire support and counterspell work to the fight. Every little bit counts right now.
-[ ][OTHER] Find somebody who can get out a message and get Dandelor in here now! There's other sorcerer in the world who you'd bet even stands a chance against the woman who soloed fifty sorcerers at full power.
Spirit saiyan telepathy will help with the "get somebody" part of the plan, and the massively-parallel ability to contact people PLUS the ability to send individuals custom messages (as we did with Jaffur when we used Spirit Saiyan against Dazarel) will help too. We're in the Hall so we can contact just saiyans in the Hall and assemble more than enough power, without even drawing from outside our focused telepathy range.
Conversely, if this were Jaffur Quest, this would SO be our glory moment holding off both hated Dad AND annoying bastard Berra long enough for Kakara to charge up.
EDIT:
Alternatively,
[ ][FIGHT] Write-in: The mind-controlled super-saiyans don't seem to attack until there's a clear and immediate threat. That gives you the initiative. Use instant transmission to bypass them and land a single, overwhelmingly powerful, blow on Dandeer.
Let the FIRST expensive skill we took pains to acquire handle this.
The downside is that this is high-risk, and Berra knows instant transmission and will immediately recognize the danger to Dandeer from us getting ready to 'vip.'
[ ][OTHER] This is a bad situation, but you need to handle something.
-[ ][OTHER] You need to rally some of your people. You're in a numerically even fight, and need every advantage you can get. Get in contact with the Heads in on the conspiracy and direct them to provide massed fire support and counterspell work to the fight. Every little bit counts right now.
-[ ][OTHER] Find somebody who can get out a message and get Dandelor in here now! There's other sorcerer in the world who you'd bet even stands a chance against the woman who soloed fifty sorcerers at full power.
Spirit saiyan telepathy will help with the "get somebody" part of the plan, and the massively-parallel ability to contact people PLUS the ability to send individuals custom messages (as we did with Jaffur when we used Spirit Saiyan against Dazarel) will help too. We're in the Hall so we can contact just saiyans in the Hall and assemble more than enough power, without even drawing from outside our focused telepathy range.
Conversely, if this were Jaffur Quest, this would SO be our glory moment holding off both hated Dad AND annoying bastard Berra long enough for Kakara to charge up.
EDIT:
Alternatively,
[ ][FIGHT] Write-in: The mind-controlled super-saiyans don't seem to attack until there's a clear and immediate threat. That gives you the initiative. Use instant transmission to bypass them and land a single, overwhelmingly powerful, blow on Dandeer.
Let the FIRST expensive skill we took pains to acquire handle this.
The downside is that this is high-risk, and Berra knows instant transmission and will immediately recognize the danger to Dandeer from us getting ready to 'vip.'
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We don't have to kill her to stop her from casting, you know.
Also, even if you discard the risk of a deadman switch, remember what happened when people voted to attack the Scout? And how Kakara has started doing/refusing things automatically?
Do you want to risk Kakara having a breakdown, or going off the rails now?
- Location
- Italy
I did! i also wanted to contact Gohan Jii-chan for advice and an external point of view, but i can understand not wanting to do that.
I'm actually surprised she managed to control Yammar, but we DID leave him mostly alone with her and Jaron. It could very well be that she put a mind control switch on him this last week.
so, we could
1)solar flare + IT to Dandeer. If we try this we should have Jaffur distract Berra, as he is the only enemy who knows IT as well. Coordinate it with Jaffur Kaioken for maximum distraction.
2)IT somewhere else, hide power level, wait an arbitrary number of seconds, IT stealth attack. If all enemy ssj are distracted it should work.
3)multiform, have a full power golden oozaru fight while normal not transformed Kakara hides to form the Genkidama (the Golden Oozaru would be full power). We do not need to reach the power we had against Dazarel (it was about 300 billions i think). Just 3-5 times our power would be enough, and should make it quicker (of course if the difference is just a few seconds of charging time, we can go for more energy anyway).
Do remember that Dandeer was discovered examining the place we used the Genkidama the first time. Maybe she developed (or at least she was trying to develop) a counter to it.
4)call reinforcement (i'd avoid this, except for maybe Dandelor. Normal Saiyans would die like flies)
5)multiform, only two bodies: first goes Golden Oozarus. the second fakes hiding for a genkidama, while it actually goes for the stealth IT attack.
6)multiform, golden oozaru, normal Kakara hides and goes to see Gohan: maybe he knows how to break mind control? It happened to "Majin" Vegeta after all.
7)contact any saiyans we know that knows how to use multiform, have them clone themselves and try to stealth attack and/or rush Dandeer, while leaving at least one of their bodies safe, so that they are in no real risk. Our mom at the very least knows multiform, and NOBODY will expect that!! If we are keeping all the ssj distracted, it might just work!
8) various mix-and-match of the plans above
can't think of anything else, but we do have a lot of options.
@PoptartProdigy Do we have senzu beans with us? Do Yammar And Berra have them as well?
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- Location
- Actually pretty lost
We can just punch her hard enough to KO her, you know. Given the existence of Senzu beans, we can even err on the side of "too hard" pretty safely.
We KO her, see if that frees the others, and if it doesn't we go Spirit Saiyan and hold them down while our sorcerors fix them.
EDIT: Wait, how intelligent are they while mind-controlled? Can we just shout (at FPSSJ speeds) "Dandeer's trying to kill herself! Quick, you have to knock her out to protect her!"?
EDIT: Given that Dandeer is operating at regular Saiyan speeds, we have time to discuss and plan with Jaffur at FPSSJ speeds with negligible impact on the time limit.
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- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Oh, really? I never would have guessed. Tell me more!
[sigh]
Look, the fundamental point here is not about killing Dandeer.
The fundamental point is about the wisdom of attacking her quickly, as opposed to slowly. And the risks of being scrupulous about preserving her life as opposed to trying to put her down on the ground ASAP and letting her safety be a secondary concern.
Killing her is not necessarily the only way to achieve this, but as we just saw demonstrated very well, monologuing at her or giving her time to react is exactly how NOT to confront her successfully.
That is my real point here.
...
Also, I'd submit that Kakara is angry enough at Dandeer, and aware enough of the magnitude both of her crimes and of the threat she presents, to be willing to kill her. Her previous resolution to never kill was made in (as far as she knew) a world without massive instant mind control powers. Her revisiting this decision under the circumstances is, to me, plausible.
But you're free not to believe me, and I really don't want to argue this point.
The problem is that contacting Gohan takes time, and we're in a hurry.
Dandeer has been avoiding Yammar with very good reason; remember that Yammar threatened to kill her at Second Garenhuld.
I think this was a field expedient- Dandeer cast this on the fly. Yammar's colossal mistake here was getting physically close enough for Dandeer to touch him, or even so much as raise her hand without getting blasted. Like seriously, Yammar, the one thing I respected you for was your tactical judgment, combining good tactical judgment with extreme, horrifying ruthlessness is your hat. You had one job, which was to be the ruthless guy who wouldn't let Dandeer so much as blink without your leave, and you fucked it up.
[facepalm]
Without that, we'd be four-on-two instead of three-on-three and this situation would look a lot better.
Oh hey, Solar Flare! That used to be, like, one of our signature tactics! That would work GREAT; it's area-effect, it's nonlethal, and it'll incapacitate at least some of our opponents.
Complication one: that leaves Jaffur and Apra fighting two-to-three odds.
Complication two: we can't sense the energy of people inside the Hall, we're inside the Hall, so we may not be able to teleport straight to Dandeer.
This is a distinct hazard.
Yeah, but massed sorcerors might still be worth something.
Firstly, the massed sorcerors might be able to depower the mind-controlled super-saiyans. Secondly, they might collectively be able to block Dandeer's actions if they're all counterspelling her, which is important because the REAL bad end condition here is "Dandeer finishes casting another planet-wide mind control spell." Thirdly, it looks like the mind-controlled super-saiyans are only attacking people who directly threaten Dandeer right now, and that means the sorcerors can stand back and act in relative safety.
Oooh, that's clever.
Vegeta blew through that mind control by sheer force of will: "You may have invaded my mind and my body, but there's one thing a saiyan always keeps, HIS PRIDE!" is like the textbook thing to say while doing with a willpower push that which would normally be impossible. I doubt Gohan has useful tactical advice to give us that justifies the opportunity cost of time consumed.
Hey, that's clever. I like that.
We're working with the Senzus, the guys who grow senzu beans, to the point where they are literally named after senzu beans. Who Poptart has told us LITERALLY have more senzu beans in the fridge than they know what to do with, to the point where they're running out of fridge space.
If we don't have senzu beans with us as a basic, common-sense preparation under the circumstances, I am giving up here and now, because that is just taking the Idiot Ball too far.
...
[ ][FIGHT] Kais on high you wish you'd fired up Spirit Saiyan in advance now. You need it, right now. Jaffur doesn't have to beat both Vegeta and Berra -- frankly, you doubt he can under these conditions. But he should hopefully be able to give you five minutes to charge.
[ ][OTHER] This is a bad situation, but you need to handle something.
-[ ][OTHER] You need to rally some of your people. You're in a numerically even fight, and need every advantage you can get. Get in contact with the Heads in on the conspiracy and direct them to provide massed fire support and counterspell work to the fight. Every little bit counts right now.
-[ ][OTHER] Find somebody who can get out a message and get Dandelor in here now! There's other sorcerer in the world who you'd bet even stands a chance against the woman who soloed fifty sorcerers at full power.
OR
[ ][FIGHT] Write-in: The mind-controlled super-saiyans don't seem to attack until there's a clear and immediate threat. That gives you the initiative. Use Solar Flare and Instant Transmission to bypass them and land an overwhelmingly powerful, blow on Dandeer.
...
Hm.
Possible desperation ploy: Tabe Stauber has the Overdrive ability to temporarily boost his power level. And he's skillful enough as a young hotshot to win a planetary tournament WITHOUT using Overdrive. Which puts him on the same tier in terms of talent as Jaffur or Berra (the only fighter on the planet we know of who has an Elite-ranked skill)
Tabe's the only other person on the planet who has a realistic chance of staying in the ring with a super-saiyan for at least a few moments. If we could bring him in to very briefly tie up one of our opponents, it'd give us a temporary advantage.
The problem is that if the fight dragged out for any length of time the poor kid would probably run out of juice and get his head torn off. I don't really think it's worth the risk, but I wanted to mention it.
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