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[X] Take these last moments to do something before proceeding to the plan as established.
-[X] Get a feel for Jaffur's present state of mind.
-[X] "Wait, where's Jaron?"
-[x] Start forming the Genki Dama. Just do passive drawing and contacting those within the Senzu's wards for now.
 
[X] Take these last moments to do something before proceeding to the plan as established.
-[X] Get a feel for Jaffur's present state of mind.
-[X] "Wait, where's Jaron?"
 
Is there a reason most people aren't voting for gathering energy?
If sensed, it's pretty much a clear signal that we expect a fight with someone, so it might decrease the chances of us talking Berra down if he senses the energy in us.

[X] Take these last moments to do something before proceeding to the plan as established.
-[X] Get a feel for Jaffur's present state of mind.
-[X] "Wait, where's Jaron?"
-[x] Start forming the Genki Dama. Just do passive drawing and contacting those within the Senzu's wards for now.

[X] Take these last moments to do something before proceeding to the plan as established.
-[X] "Wait, where's Jaron?"
 
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It would take too long, and we can't just leave a clone doing it due to distance concerns.
How long do you think it's going to take? Because the big one we used against Dazarel took, what, a few minutes, at most? This one would be smaller and faster.
If sensed, it's pretty much a clear signal that we expect a fight with someone, so it might decrease the chances of us talking Berra down if he senses the energy in us.
We're currently under a ward, the gathered energy won't break said ward, and super saiyan sends the same message.
 
How long do you think it's going to take? Because the big one we used against Dazarel took, what, a few minutes, at most? This one would be smaller and faster.
Given Jaffur's just broken his seal and probably just set off all of Dandeer's alarms, I'm inclined to consider that few minutes to be too long - we have to get to Berra before she can work last-minute-mind-whammies on him. You might be able to convince other people though.
 
Given Jaffur's just broken his seal and probably just set off all of Dandeer's alarms, I'm inclined to consider that few minutes to be too long - we have to get to Berra before she can work last-minute-mind-whammies on him. You might be able to convince other people though.
The other options are also going to take time, and "minutes" is me being very generous. During the update where we first formed one, a time frame of seconds was mentioned.
 
Can we please NOT bring the holy relic technique of our planet into this. Considering its sole use within a thousand years was to help seal the dragon, turning up to Berra with it as if we intended to use it will almost certainly cause a fight to the death.
 
Given Jaffur's just broken his seal and probably just set off all of Dandeer's alarms, I'm inclined to consider that few minutes to be too long - we have to get to Berra before she can work last-minute-mind-whammies on him. You might be able to convince other people though.
We don't know if there are alarms to begin with in this case, I doubt she can mind whammy him in short notice and it would take her time to get him alone to do so and the seers saw nothing go wrong.

For me, it's because I feel anything that wastes time from finding out where Jaron is, is irresponsible.
I think we would ask where Jaron is first.

For me it feels like needless escalation. I don't want to fight Dad or even take out our armor for a fight.
When Dandeer resists 4 Super Saiyans should be enough.
They shouldn't be able to sense it and it is being formed mostly so that if Berra opposes us for x reason we can subdue him quickly and without hurting him.

Can we please NOT bring the holy relic technique of our planet into this. Considering its sole use within a thousand years was to help seal the dragon, turning up to Berra with it as if we intended to use it will almost certainly cause a fight to the death.
I very much doubt that either Berra, Kakara or Apra would fight to kill here since they love each other and as shown with Dazarel you don't need to kill with it. Dad knows that.
 
Is there a reason most people aren't voting for gathering energy?
1.) I view it as a bit of a time waste that the one-sentence question of Jaron's whereabouts (which I am not assuming we'll know without asking) and the 1-2 sentence inquiry into Jaffur's current mental state (critical information considering the delicate nature of what's to happen) are not.
2.) It locks us down in place; I don't recall any indication we can gather energy and move at the same time.
3.) The optics are terrible; using the Genki Dama (which most all Saiyans on the planet will be able to sense as soon as we're not at House Senzu) against our father? And having it is as good as using it when it comes to perception. Perception is going to be crucial in the coming days->months.
4.) The reaction from our father, who we are hoping to talk down, won't be great either. "Hi dad here's the move that only works against evil-hearted villains, I'm holding it just in case you don't agree with us!"
 
See me, I just figured that if it's not in the base plan, it's because we (the IC planners) determined it wasn't necessary.

Making sure Jaron isn't about to create rain? That's necessary.
 
1.) I view it as a bit of a time waste that the one-sentence question of Jaron's whereabouts (which I am not assuming we'll know without asking) and the 1-2 sentence inquiry into Jaffur's current mental state (critical information considering the delicate nature of what's to happen) are not.
2.) It locks us down in place; I don't recall any indication we can gather energy and move at the same time.
3.) The optics are terrible; using the Genki Dama (which most all Saiyans on the planet will be able to sense as soon as we're not at House Senzu) against our father? And having it is as good as using it when it comes to perception. Perception is going to be crucial in the coming days->months.
4.) The reaction from our father, who we are hoping to talk down, won't be great either. "Hi dad here's the move that only works against evil-hearted villains, I'm holding it just in case you don't agree with us!"
About point 4, that is not really the case? Making a Genki dama means going Spirit Saiyan so charge for five minutes, absorb, then go do our thing with a power up for the next hour or so. It also feels like there is a bunch of people rather than a single strong entity so it is not immediately obvious we are using it until people see us andthink "Wait a minute... that is just Kakara instead of a crowd" and it could always be because we were training it or because we want to make an impression and awe people (which is something most wouldn't consider but as the guy who taught us politics dad would at least know it is a possibility).
 
[X] Take these last moments to do something before proceeding to the plan as established.
-[X] Get a feel for Jaffur's present state of mind.
-[X] "Wait, where's Jaron?"

I'm hoping it's just a Coin Flip scenario and not a "yeah, you reduced your brother to dust, he's dead now" situation.
 
About point 4, that is not really the case? Making a Genki dama means going Spirit Saiyan so charge for five minutes, absorb, then go do our thing with a power up for the next hour or so. It also feels like there is a bunch of people rather than a single strong entity so it is not immediately obvious we are using it until people see us andthink "Wait a minute... that is just Kakara instead of a crowd" and it could always be because we were training it or because we want to make an impression and awe people (which is something most wouldn't consider but as the guy who taught us politics dad would at least know it is a possibility).
"Hi Dad you're as big of a threat in my mind as that giant psychic dragon we just finished beating down!"
 
[X] Take these last moments to do something before proceeding to the plan as established.
-[X] Get a feel for Jaffur's present state of mind.
-[X] "Wait, where's Jaron?"
 
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We're currently under a ward, the gathered energy won't break said ward, and super saiyan sends the same message.
Oh, yeah, but if we appear in front of Berra with Genki Dama energy, he might take it as a show of hostility and thus take this whole thing even worse than he already will.
'Its not Berra I'm worried about.
I think Berra really is the most important problem here.

Without Berra, Dandeer is the most unpopular Saiyan on the planet and has absolutely no political support from anyone, and while she might be the best living sorcerer, that's not going to protect her from four Super Saiyans + every single Vegetan.

If Berra stands by her, on the other hand, we're essentially making a coup against House Goku, which will likely not be good for royal authority and might lead to resentment against all members of the conspiracy (as Berra seems to be rather well-liked, Kakara might end up being more popular with the Vegetans than the Gokun).
 
I think Berra really is the most important problem here.

Without Berra, Dandeer is the most unpopular Saiyan on the planet and has absolutely no political support from anyone, and while she might be the best living sorcerer, that's not going to protect her from four Super Saiyans + every single Vegetan.

If Berra stands by her, on the other hand, we're essentially making a coup against House Goku, which will likely not be good for royal authority and might lead to resentment against all members of the conspiracy (as Berra seems to be rather well-liked, Kakara might end up being more popular with the Vegetans than the Gokun).
I think they're worried about Dandeer Doing something similar to what she did to the Sorcerers.

Which, granted, I think she could do something.

But frankly given that 80% of the Saiyan population hate her, the remaining 19.9% personally dislike her enough to not aid her, and that most aren't a group who trust her implicitly enough to be dragged to the middle of nowhere to have their skills sealed so they have no combat ability whatsoever, Dear god, it's not going to be anywhere near those levels of bad.

At worst, like 75%, and that's being extremely generous to Dandeer, something I'd never thought myself capable of until right now.

Now could she do something tricky... Yes, potentially, but only in the scenario of what she can prepare for. She's a powerful foe, but she's hardly omniscient.
 
If Berra stands by her, on the other hand, we're essentially making a coup against House Goku, which will likely not be good for royal authority and might lead to resentment against all members of the conspiracy (as Berra seems to be rather well-liked, Kakara might end up being more popular with the Vegetans than the Gokun).
you're making it sound like Kakara (The Gold, The Mighty, The Spirit Saiyan, The People's Princess) is less well liked than Berra :rofl:.

Honestly, IF we made a coup i think we'd have at least 3/4 of all Saiyan behind us, and probably more.

The Vegetan love us. The Gokun love us. The church WORSHIPS us (and i think that's at least a full fifth of the population by itself).

Really, the only one who currently do not like us are those few Vegetan who believe that we were for the sealing (and it won't be for long) and Dandeer (and whoever she has under her control. Like those Saiyans who attacked the prison some time ago and that i am SURE were mind controlled by her)

And really, a passive Genkidama (+ those we can reach without risk of interception, mostly the Senzu) gives us pretty much a free kaioken worth of boost, for no cost, no strain, no risk of being sensed from the rest of the galaxy, and makes a powerfull impression

And really, i don't think Berra would ever try to kill us, even if WE went for the kill (which we aren't).
Even if he would, he would try EVERYTHING POSSIBLE before going that far.

tl dr:
1)If Berra is somehow mind controlled/manipulated against us, the power boost might make the difference in stopping him without hurting him too much.
2)If he is open to hear us out, it might still be usefull against Dandeer.
3)Better to have it and don't need it, that need it and don't have it.
4)It's much more likely that he'll ask us why we're using it that attacking us for it anyway. The only thing we're making clear by using the Spirit Saiyan is how important this is to us, which would be clear anyway when we told him.


On a completely different note, a couple things i really want to do after the unsealing:
1) I REALLY want to go visit Gohan Jii-chan. I was waiting for us to have the vision to spare, and we have it now.
We should also consider training our sight more, just for what he (and all the other z-fighterz) can offer us if we can visit them more often. For one, they can tell us what's the problem with the fusion dance (Goku showed it to the kids ONCE and it was enough!), how to cope with the "feeling everything die" issue, advices for how to deal with 17 and 18, and maybe tell us about the other lost techniques (The Mafuuba/evil cointainment wave could be really usefull, for example. It would have been a decent (though worse) alternative to the Genkidama against Dazarel, now that i think about it).

I also want to know why they can't simply contact us with telepathy.

2)we might want to train the Genkidama after we get perfect multiform (and by the way, tienshinhan might have some advice if we can contact him through sight...). Imagine being able to charge the enrgy for spirit saiyan while moving and fighting (probably legendary talent, but one can hope...)

3)..we do need to complete transcendence and style training...

4)of course we'll now have to socialize with Jaffur and Jaron, but that's a given

EDIT: little side note: i'm slowly catching up to Marked for Death... so many pages!:o
 
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