We shouldn't want the other factions happy with the decision to Distribute Land. We should want them apoplectic with rage and determined to fight further attempts to exploit it with (literal) knives.
Last edited:
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
We shouldn't want the other factions happy with the decision to Distribute Land. We should want them apoplectic with rage and determined to fight further attempts to exploit it with (literal) knives.
- Location
- Canada
He never said might, he said eventually it will. The "possibly" was for increasing land administration efficiency.
The way I see it, the potential problem with Patricians driving down Cent is not a new class of problem.
As it stands, Yeomen can take Black Soil actions or the like for a good 6 EE per action. If they spend their policies on Expansion instead of Forestry, they can get that EE total up even higher. They only ways to burn EE rely on overflowing Econ or having Econ to spend on planting crops, which means that unless someone is regularly taking Expand Economy actions, we can't do anything about the Yeomen. So, unless we personally dedicate energy to aggressively Expanding Economy, we can't combat the Yeomen as they kill more and more of our cities.
As it stands, Priests can take Build Temple actions to get as much as a full point of RA per secondary action. We have no way to lower RA, and trying to combat this by raising RA tolerance is much too slow.
As it stands, Guilds can significantly worsen the tech crunch by building Ironwork after Ironwork. A couple of lvl1 Ironworks and the Expand Economy action will be basically unusable.
As it stands, Urban Poor can screw us by building more and higher level Block Housing. Since more of those give them more actions, it would be rather easy for the Urban Poor to make us face unsustainable expenses to ensure proper hygiene. At least this one is a problem that solves itself; if the UP are too short-cited to properly build health infrastructure, they will be the first to die in the resulting plague.
Point is, a lot of our factions can screw us, and do so in ways that we might not be able to contest, counter, or reverse. The DL option for Patricians is no different.
As it stands, Yeomen can take Black Soil actions or the like for a good 6 EE per action. If they spend their policies on Expansion instead of Forestry, they can get that EE total up even higher. They only ways to burn EE rely on overflowing Econ or having Econ to spend on planting crops, which means that unless someone is regularly taking Expand Economy actions, we can't do anything about the Yeomen. So, unless we personally dedicate energy to aggressively Expanding Economy, we can't combat the Yeomen as they kill more and more of our cities.
As it stands, Priests can take Build Temple actions to get as much as a full point of RA per secondary action. We have no way to lower RA, and trying to combat this by raising RA tolerance is much too slow.
As it stands, Guilds can significantly worsen the tech crunch by building Ironwork after Ironwork. A couple of lvl1 Ironworks and the Expand Economy action will be basically unusable.
As it stands, Urban Poor can screw us by building more and higher level Block Housing. Since more of those give them more actions, it would be rather easy for the Urban Poor to make us face unsustainable expenses to ensure proper hygiene. At least this one is a problem that solves itself; if the UP are too short-cited to properly build health infrastructure, they will be the first to die in the resulting plague.
Point is, a lot of our factions can screw us, and do so in ways that we might not be able to contest, counter, or reverse. The DL option for Patricians is no different.
- Location
- Austria
Sorry, missed the alert and post.
Own action? Definitely Proclaim for 4 Legitimacy. Guild action? Well, we cannot go wrong with Kilns; otherwise, either Harbour, Warships or more Cement. Just to make sure. Patricians might be too pissy to follow Agenda even though the DL should calm them down.
*Looks at the last couple of updates*
Wow, you really love to self-sabotage like motherfuckers, don'tcha?
Wow, you really love to self-sabotage like motherfuckers, don'tcha?
maximillian
Civilised Sheep
- Location
- Ranch
Bloody pissed I am, people acting as if privitisation is literally Hitler and how this is the fall of Ymar.
On the bright side, this I'll finally push this abominable thread into picking slots and culture actions.
DevilsAdvocate
Always follow the golden rule.
[X] [Merc] Yes
[X] [Secondary] Distribute Land
[X] [Secondary] Distribute Land x2
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X] [Secondary] Found Free City Lower Valleyhome
[X] [Secondary] Found Free City Blackmouth
[X] [Secondary] More Warships
[X] Build Gymnasium
[X] [Guild Secondary] Build Harbour Redshore
[X] [King's Agenda] Balanced
[X] [Secondary] Distribute Land
[X] [Secondary] Distribute Land x2
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X] [Secondary] Found Free City Lower Valleyhome
[X] [Secondary] Found Free City Blackmouth
[X] [Secondary] More Warships
[X] Build Gymnasium
[X] [Guild Secondary] Build Harbour Redshore
[X] [King's Agenda] Balanced
- Location
- Austria
I am not annoyed by DL....however, I am pissed as all fuck by trait evolution.
Arete traitline is a cancer on society; there is healthy individualism, it would have been merging Arete line into Symphony or PiA and making a healthy combo of "Strength in Diversity" or something.
As is, it is explicitly a trait of social stratification and Great Manning bullshit.
If we had an option to take Civil War with outcome of "Arete traitline is purged and will never taint us with its presence", I would gladly take it. There is healthy individualism aka "Society of individuals". Arete line is not it, it is antisocial "Individual above society" cancer.
So... no-one up to supporting the urban poor to get more time for their quest and the value slot?
Since we're completing that quest right now, no.
- Location
- Austria
Like, look at bolded parts. It is explicitly "a man above society" cancerous shitstain of a trait. What did we do to deserve this crap?
edit: And yes, a man. Do y'all really think that social stratification would not cause effect of calcifying gender roles?
This is our fucking Moloch Calls.
Don't need to. Will succeed in quest anyway.
maximillian
Civilised Sheep
- Location
- Ranch
The trait is rather vital for the best forms of feudalism. An aristocracy with a fundamental drive for betterment is a blessing.
We are too successful.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Personally I'm not really interested in criminations by anyone who didn't publicly predict that the Lesson choice would directly affect stratification or the faction system.
- Location
- Austria
Feudalism is crappy form of government which we, frankly, do not even need: it is subpar as long as there is long-distance communication good enough to ensure bulk trade on not-only-local scale. Which we have.
It is no coincidence that it died off when longer distance travel started becoming easier and faster.
The precondition for feudalism, economically, is "lack of bigger-than-small-province infrastructure and large-scale production"; since we have Ironworks, okayish communications and the like, feudalism would be, economics-wise, downgrade for us. There is no point going for it, our economical system in this regard is better already.
Again, I would not mind it that much if it was not explicitly anti-bigger society and pro-stratification. "Unsuppressible most powerful faction" is a sign of very stupid mentality of "these guys are too good and are thus above the king's word as a faction". This is abominable trait; nobody should be above what king mandates.
maximillian
Civilised Sheep
- Location
- Ranch
Man is subservient to society is hardly individualsm though.
- Location
- Volksstaat Hessen, Deutsches Reich
I agree. But that is the cultural norm now...
...except of course if we fight back. Literally. Have the Patricians lose in battle and see what remains of that trait.
- Location
- Austria
Not subservient; a part of society; important, but not more equal than others.
The problem I have is that the trait explicitly says "the most powerful faction are people more equal than others"; they are above reproach and above king.
Healthy individualism would be evolution of Humility or Symphony lines: individual as a worthy part of community. This is toxic perversion of the good, worthwhile, individualism.
Like I said it is the consequence of succeeding too hard. The current elites have managed to magically pull a rabbit out of the hat to make things continue to run smoothly though all manner of calamities so people naturally believe they are blessed by the gods (nascent divine right by the back door).
Wiadi
Uncompromising Radical Leftist
- Location
- Something Clever
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Source?
- Location
- Austria
Can we? It's a normal part of monkeybrain to think in stupid terms of "this gorilla has a big stick and knows how to use it so it is beyond the law"; it takes painful repressions and the like to force people to realize that it is wrong.
I think we are too unevolved as society to understand the concept of "nobody is above the law, no matter how great"; we need another Ashryn for people to remember that nobody is above community and start thinking in such terms.
In the meanwhile, all we can do to develop as much as we can factions that oppose patricians and are more egalitarian; which is, in our case, basically Priests and later on will be Traders since capital, for all its faults, does not care about your bloodline and status.
So....develop Symphony, Justice and Division of Power lines to counterbalance this. It is too late, we've lost this battle.
Wasn't even in the thread at the time.
- Location
- Volksstaat Hessen, Deutsches Reich
So we show the population that this specific monkey is not all that strong with his big stick. Sure, that is a short term solution, but it will fix that "It is too late" problem - it will reign in the current acute problem, giving us time to develop societal counter-measures.
LoserThree
Finds writing poorly easy
- Location
- Greater Seattle Area
- Pronouns
- he/him
Holy fucking moly!
I missed a day and a half, and a vote, and apparently I missed godsdamned cowardice taking the fuck over!
Civil War is preferable to Land Distribution!
The people are not threatened from without! The Islanders can't effectively reach them, they can only pick at their edges!
Stand firm, dammit!
[X] [Merc] Yes
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers x2
[X] [Secondary] Found Free City Lower Valleyhome
[X] [Secondary] Launch Intrigue Mission (Patricians)
[X] [Secondary] Launch Intrigue Mission (Patricians) x2
[X] [Secondary] Proclaim Glory
[X] [Secondary] More Warships
[X] [Guild Secondary] More Warships
Come one, you sons of bitches! Do you want to live forever?!
I missed a day and a half, and a vote, and apparently I missed godsdamned cowardice taking the fuck over!
Civil War is preferable to Land Distribution!
The people are not threatened from without! The Islanders can't effectively reach them, they can only pick at their edges!
Stand firm, dammit!
[X] [Merc] Yes
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers x2
[X] [Secondary] Found Free City Lower Valleyhome
[X] [Secondary] Launch Intrigue Mission (Patricians)
[X] [Secondary] Launch Intrigue Mission (Patricians) x2
[X] [Secondary] Proclaim Glory
[X] [Secondary] More Warships
[X] [Guild Secondary] More Warships
Come one, you sons of bitches! Do you want to live forever?!