- Location
- Volksstaat Hessen, Deutsches Reich
>>>"We must be realists"
>>>Votes for the dickwaving boondoggle.
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
>>>Votes for the dickwaving boondoggle.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
In the real world dickwaving is a thing.
- Location
- Volksstaat Hessen, Deutsches Reich
Your dam vote.
- Location
- Australia
The biggest dam option is stated by AN to mostly be about dick waving.
Ghostdevil
The Devil of Ghosts
- Location
- United States
It also gives the most benefits, such a large construction with all those additions will likely give side benefits outside the dick waving ones
Huh, didn't notice that. Fixed.
- Location
- Australia
It's also something AN implied to be impossible in one of his posts. We can't afford it if we're doubling costs.
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
Yeah, its the western river that runs from north of Valleyhome south through Valleyguard and the cataracts.So, two questions:
The river we are damming up, is it one the HK are dependant on?
If yes, does the construction process cause issues for their agriculture?
If no, would biggest Dam cause issues?
Just want to make sure we screw them over properly.
No, that was specifically getting in the 10-wealth costing [Main] More Warships.
- Location
- Australia
Ghostdevil
The Devil of Ghosts
- Location
- United States
Well neither he nor I are voting for going Morality boner here, so that's more your problem than mine
with my vote going full dam is possible
- Location
- Hell
Theoretically it would seriously hit them in the Economy department as all the amazing fertilizer that runs off from our farms would suddenly stop once we are finished building it. Would not last forever, but it is a way we could affect them.
Problem is that the increased costs means we cannot do that anytime soon.
If the choice was reform or status quo, many people would probably be onboard with that. But the choice is to reform or to damage some of the strongest pillars on which our society rests.
We got into this mess by valuing expedience over treating people the way they deserve to be treated. I honestly don't believe that choosing the expedient option here won't have us face something even worse down the line.
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
No. That isn't what he said.
Yes, it's a dickwaving symbol. Its a giant behemoth of a construction. That doesn't make the extra size useless. Specifically, larger and more water is the important thing here. More water volume means several things, most importantly, increased shoreline. This means more space for people to live around the lake and get the benefits of it, from more chinampas to more mills. It also means increased drought resistance. The bigger the dam, the better, frankly.
Sorry, the 5-wealth [Main] More Warships. We have 7 Wealth available. -2 from the biggest dam, -5 from Warships.
edit: apparently empty quotes don't work
- Location
- Austria
Light Cavalry or Warships will cost 10 wealth per action. Almost half of our cap. So we, to face the truth, will not have cavalry or navy increase for the foreseeable future. Near steppes. Yes, this is as bad as it sounds.
Main Mills will cost 8 Wealth. Which means 99.9% of siuations we won't be buolding them.
Roads will cost 4 Wealth, which...is affordable, but expensive.
Each Merc company will cost 2 Wealth, which means that current ones will cst 6 wealth/tuen if we remove them from main budget, and that adding more will have to wait for a dozen or two dozens of turns, if not more.
So: it cripples our military, full stop.
It makes it very unlikely we build actual solutions to the slvery - Academies, Mills, oyher things which make skilled workers better than unskilled ones.
It means we must forget abouy Diplomacy or City Support and go full Infrastructure in Passives to have a prayer of a chance of surviving via Markets - and they are very likely to instead build Block Housing 2 Ironworks 3 instead, and otherwise sabotage our razor-thin Forests margin.
Oh, about forests: Main Kilns will cost 6 Welath. We won't be taking them.
Theoretically. It could fail and fuck us and the lowland beneath.
Well, technically, any of our dam we build could fail. Just this one is most likely to fail.
God, that wealth cost. Some part of me wants the first edition vote, where we couldn't risk so much for morality. Well, if it works out, then it's super great and we made a big jump, but I don't think I'll vote for it. Let's hope markets save us, I guess?
[X] [Purity] The Puritans broke (Lose the Purity trait, possible loss of the prohibition on slavery)
[X] [Dam] Move to the bigger but more useful proposal (1 Wealth and 1 Tech per action added to remaining costs, requires an additional 2 actions to complete)
Skullduggery is more needed than CS, I think. We are about to piss off three powerful factions, after all.
[X] [PP] Skullduggery (+1 Intrigue/turn, -2 Diplo)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x2
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x3
[X] [Purity] The Puritans broke (Lose the Purity trait, possible loss of the prohibition on slavery)
[X] [Dam] Move to the bigger but more useful proposal (1 Wealth and 1 Tech per action added to remaining costs, requires an additional 2 actions to complete)
Skullduggery is more needed than CS, I think. We are about to piss off three powerful factions, after all.
[X] [PP] Skullduggery (+1 Intrigue/turn, -2 Diplo)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x2
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x3
- Location
- Australia
I said mostly about, not entirely about. He said "The biggest [reason] is kind of a dick waving symbol". While getting the biggest dam does give good things outside of dick waving, the dick waving is the primary purpose of it.
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- Location
- Somewhere
[X] [Dam] Make it as big and impressive as possible (2 Wealth and 2 Tech per action added to remaining costs, requires an additional 3 actions to complete)
[X] [Purity] If slavery is so bad in comparison, maybe even the half-exiles need to be addressed (-1 Stability, the next Patrician, Guild, and Trader quests are all spite quests, all Wealth costs are doubled going forward)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x2
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x3
[X] [PP] Skullduggery (+1 Intrigue/turn, -2 Diplo)
@Academia Nut would building the most expensive Dam option allow us to build structures we lost when the Mountain mega-project went bye-bye?
[X] [Purity] If slavery is so bad in comparison, maybe even the half-exiles need to be addressed (-1 Stability, the next Patrician, Guild, and Trader quests are all spite quests, all Wealth costs are doubled going forward)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x2
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x3
[X] [PP] Skullduggery (+1 Intrigue/turn, -2 Diplo)
@Academia Nut would building the most expensive Dam option allow us to build structures we lost when the Mountain mega-project went bye-bye?
- Location
- Austria
Why is damaging Purity a problem?
Why do you consider its xenophobia, which explicitly contradicts Acceptance (actual pillar of society), a pillar?
- Location
- United States
I believe that he is talking about the tradition of Anti Slavery in the Ymaryn, which breaking the Puritans has a chance of also breaking.
No one is really crying over poor Purity, people don't want to risk the Ymaryn adopting slavery.
Wiadi
Uncompromising Radical Leftist
- Location
- Something Clever
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Okay, but the current winning Purity option is winning by a 46-vote margin, so it's still irresponsible to vote for something which we'd only be able to afford if we weren't doing the thing we're obviously going to do. The fact that you would rather we didn't is, ultimately, entirely immaterial.
Damaging Purity isn't a problem, damaging the prohibition against slavery is. And yes, that's only a risk, but I don't see why it's a more acceptable one than the risk we take by reforming the system and trying to remain stable. We have no official odds on the former and insufficient information about future turns to calculate the chances on the latter, so the risk evaluation is entirely subjective.